A few questions for atheists...

[Nithavela]

Thanks to everyone for your replies. As promised, here's question 2. I've also included Google's definition of homeostasis to ensure we're all talking about the same thing...

homeostasis -- the tendency toward a relatively stable equilibrium between interdependent elements, especially as maintained by physiological processes. (Google)

Question 2: Do you believe in the existence of some form of intelligence that controls homeostasis in organisms?

No.

 

[Gene2memE]

Question 2: Do you believe in the existence of some form of intelligence that controls homeostasis in organisms?

No. I have no evidence of such, nor anything that would point to such an inference, so I have no belief in the existence of any such intelligence(s).

A couple of counter questions:
1: Are you referring to genetic or physiological homeostasis (or one of the other uses)?
2A: What do you mean by "some form of intelligence?"
2B: All intelligences that we have evidence for are tied to physical substrates. Is you question implying the existence of a non physical or disembodied intelligence?

 

[Veera Chase]

Question 2: Do you believe in the existence of some form of intelligence that controls homeostasis in organisms?

Of course not, why should anyone believe in such a thing? does anyone have a reason? even if there was how would we know?

 

[dysert]

I'm not sure you've worded your question very clearly, what is "some form of intelligence"? Is a thermostat on my central heating at home one?

What homeostatic functions are you referring to?

Why would anyone "need to believe" how they function anyway, just name one (e.g regulation of body temperature) and I'm sure someone can explain to you how it works.

I'm not being deliberately evasive here, your question really isn't that clear to me.

Sorry it's not clear. C# is my primary language.

A thermostat is not a form of intelligence imo. It's a man-made device programmed by people.

An example of a homeostatic function I'm referring to is the tendency of warm-blooded creatures (say humans) to maintain a fairly constant internal temperature.

I'm not asking about a "need" to believe. Just simply if you believe something is true. (You may want to substitute "think" for "believe" if that helps.) And I'm not interested in the physiology behind how our homeostatic functions work. The point is that I'm trying to see if you believe/think there's any intelligence behind them.

Thanks.

 

[Hieronymus]

I'd like to ask the atheists here a few questions, one at a time, and get your responses to them. I have no "agenda" or big buildup to a "gotcha" at the end, I would just like your responses to each of the questions in this thread if you don't mind. I won't be arguing/debating what you say; they're just questions. Ok? Let's start...

Question 1: Do you believe that there was a chance merging of organic materials necessary at just the right time, circumstance, and environment to produce a living entity?

Not even possible because various circumstances would have been needed simultaneously for various molecules.

 

[dysert]

No. I have no evidence of such, nor anything that would point to such an inference, so I have no belief in the existence of any such intelligence(s).

A couple of counter questions:
1: Are you referring to genetic or physiological homeostasis (or one of the other uses)?
2A: What do you mean by "some form of intelligence?"
2B: All intelligences that we have evidence for are tied to physical substrates. Is you question implying the existence of a non physical or disembodied intelligence?

1: Physiological.
2A: You can define that in your answer.
2B: I'm trying to *not* imply anything. Instead I'm trying to ask questions in a vanilla fashion, without biasing them by my Christian worldview. (Not easy, I recognize.)

 

[[serious]]

Thanks to everyone for your replies. As promised, here's question 2. I've also included Google's definition of homeostasis to ensure we're all talking about the same thing...

homeostasis -- the tendency toward a relatively stable equilibrium between interdependent elements, especially as maintained by physiological processes. (Google)

Question 2: Do you believe in the existence of some form of intelligence that controls homeostasis in organisms?

No.

 

[VirOptimus]

Question 2; no. Sounds like you are asking if we belive in god(s) which is a silly question to atheists.

 

[Ophiolite]

There is no such suggestion..

There is assuredly such a suggestion. You may not have intended it, but it is there, nevertheless.

I am just posing benign questions. I have no agenda except to better learn what atheists believe about some things.

I fully accept your statement, but be aware that the approach you have used unfortunately mirrors one often used by individuals asking loaded questions and with a very definite agenda.

To call my position foolish because you *assume* what I do or do not believe is rude.

I have assumed nothing, but deduced a probable belief based upon comparison with many previously known instances. I acknowledged the doubts associated with that deduction through the use of the word "suggest" rather than "demonstrate", or "prove". Would you agree that if my deduction had been correct then my characterisation of your position would have been accurate?

 

[dysert]

There is assuredly such a suggestion. You may not have intended it, but it is there, nevertheless.

I fully accept your statement, but be aware that the approach you have used unfortunately mirrors one often used by individuals asking loaded questions and with a very definite agenda.

I have assumed nothing, but deduced a probable belief based upon comparison with many previously known instances. I acknowledged the doubts associated with that deduction through the use of the word "suggest" rather than "demonstrate", or "prove". Would you agree that if my deduction had been correct then my characterisation of your position would have been accurate?

Personally, I think it's a bit strong to use the word "deduction", but as I said at the outset, I'm not here to argue -- just asking questions. I'm trying to not ask loaded questions, and I have no agenda. You'll see at the end (there are only 4 questions) that the conclusion of this thread will be quite anti-climactic.

 

[Ophiolite]

Personally, I think it's a bit strong to use the word "deduction", but as I said at the outset, I'm not here to argue -- just asking questions. I'm trying to not ask loaded questions, and I have no agenda. You'll see at the end (there are only 4 questions) that the conclusion of this thread will be quite anti-climactic.

Thank you for your reply. As noted earlier I fully accept your explained motives for the thread and apologise for any rudeness that came across in my first response.

 

[Jimmy D]

Not even possible because various circumstances would have been needed simultaneously for various molecules.

I don't believe Dysert was asking you. However, as you are unaware of the circumstances present and molecules involved in such a process your assertions can be dismissed.

 

[Jimmy D]

Sorry it's not clear. C# is my primary language.

A thermostat is not a form of intelligence imo. It's a man-made device programmed by people.

An example of a homeostatic function I'm referring to is the tendency of warm-blooded creatures (say humans) to maintain a fairly constant internal temperature.

I'm not asking about a "need" to believe. Just simply if you believe something is true. (You may want to substitute "think" for "believe" if that helps.) And I'm not interested in the physiology behind how our homeostatic functions work. The point is that I'm trying to see if you believe/think there's any intelligence behind them.

Thanks.

No problem Dysert. It's a difficult question to answer though.

I would describe the processes that maintain a constant body temperature as an automatic, like the aforementioned thermostat so I suppose the answer would be a no. (I hope I'm not too wrong, I'm trying to remember this stuff from school!)

I still think your question is too vague and subjective though, "any intelligence behind them" could mean anything, so my answer might change accordingly.

 

[Shemjaza]

Thanks to everyone for your replies. As promised, here's question 2. I've also included Google's definition of homeostasis to ensure we're all talking about the same thing...

homeostasis -- the tendency toward a relatively stable equilibrium between interdependent elements, especially as maintained by physiological processes. (Google)

Question 2: Do you believe in the existence of some form of intelligence that controls homeostasis in organisms?

I don't believe there is an intelligence governing homeostasis in organisms.

I do believe there are a complicated, mindless set of interconnected biological processes that maintain us (and other organisms).

 

[Gene2memE]

2A: You can define that in your answer.

I cannot. Without more information, I am unable to form a specific response.

"Some form of intelligence" is a statement virtually without context.

If by "intelligence" you mean conscious action by a living agent, then no
If by "intelligence" you mean sub-conscious/autonomic actions by a living agent, then its a highly qualified yes. This is the only example of adjustment of the systems of a body that we have (apart from infectious agents and cancer and the like). It's not a conscious, wilful process though. My last two partners were doctors - and the amount of time they spent trying to figure out why their patient's systems were out of balance was staggering.
If by "intelligence" you mean a non physical controlling agent, then no. There's noting to support this.

2B: I'm trying to *not* imply anything. Instead I'm trying to ask questions in a vanilla fashion, without biasing them by my Christian worldview. (Not easy, I recognize.)

Well, its JAqing and I think you've failed. By skirting around the issue, all you've done is trace a big line around it.

Using loaded terms like "believe in" "chance merging" "some form of intelligence" and the like don't help you claims to neutrality.

 

[Oafman]

Question 1: Do you believe that there was a chance merging of organic materials necessary at just the right time, circumstance, and environment to produce a living entity?

Well, I'm sure you're hugely oversimplifying this, but I think I know what you mean, and the answer is yes.

I'll go further, and state than anyone who answers 'no' to that question is demonstrably wrong, because of the way you phrased it. "a chance". Anyone who says there is not 'a chance' of this being the case is saying it absolutely definitely did not happen. How are they going to support such an assertion? How can they prove it did not happen? The only reasonable answer is 'yes'

Question 2: Do you believe in the existence of some form of intelligence that controls homeostasis in organisms?

Intelligence? No.

 

[Jimmy D]

"Some form of intelligence" is a statement virtually without context.

If by "intelligence" you mean conscious action by a living agent, then no
If by "intelligence" you mean sub-conscious/autonomic actions by a living agent, then its a highly qualified yes. This is the only example of adjustment of the systems of a body that we have (apart from infectious agents and cancer and the like). It's not a conscious, wilful process though. My last two partners were doctors - and the amount of time they spent trying to figure out why their patient's systems were out of balance was staggering.
If by "intelligence" you mean a non physical controlling agent, then no. There's noting to support this.

Yeah, this is was I was trying to get across, I couldn't express it with out rambling so I deleted it.

 

[HitchSlap]

#1. Yes.
#2. No.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Question 1: Do you believe that there was a chance merging of organic materials necessary at just the right time, circumstance, and environment to produce a living entity?

I might strike out the 'just the right time' part. If it had happened 100 million years earlier, or 1 billion years later, life would have followed a different course, but it would still be life. And that's speaking just of earth.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Question 2: Do you believe in the existence of some form of intelligence that controls homeostasis in organisms?

Nope. These functions are carried out by biochemical processes. Not intelligent agents.