A curious thought about Katrina .....

[breatheprayer]

I always thought America was an ally of Israel. So then if we are not, would we have to suffer God's wrath?

 

[Jesus Is Real]

First I found out most people who say Hurricanes are judgement, never been through one. Hurricanes are awful, I went through some of Rita and I'm still having nightmares. And I'm wondering how can people say this is GOD'S judgement? Because of hurricanes people die, children lose love ones, people starve, lose their homes. And if that is GOD'S judgement then maybe he isn't such a nice guy. New Orleans isn't the only place that has sin. Texas, Mass, New York, Florida, Jamica, Japan, England, Asia and all the other countries have sin. Some countries don't even believe in GOD. I will agree that New Orleans was pretty bad though, but if Wilma stays on the path she is heading she will be going to New Orleans. But if she takes a different path she could hit Texas, which would make me and other southerns suffer. Hurricanes aren't judgement of GOD but things that just happen. Sinners aren't the only ones who suffer because of hurricanes. Thousands of christians do. I find it sad that people want others to suffer so they can have their rapture. Tons of hurricanes and earthquakes would be totally awful, not just for the sinners but the christians. And if the earth is destory so will animals, plants and nature who don't hurt anyone. This has been a very hard year, and another massive hurricane can hit Texas or Lousianna soon. If that happens, will I believe in GOD? I really don't know, I would think he would give people a rest.

Marmaladegirl22,

God's Tribuation is to work patience in you to Wait upon the Lord and to turn from your own flesh nature through God's Spirit.

But it's a walk.

I hope your dreams go away soon. But if God uses them to put you more in The Fear of the Lord, then God is trying to Settle you or Save you IN HIM.

jsisrl-Connie

 

[pjalford]

Regardless, I think the end times are upon us or certainly very near. Whether Katrina was God's judgement on New Orleans isn't for me to say. I'm not a fan of the Big Easy even though I am a native Louisianian.

 

[Everlastinglife]

Deuteronomy 8
10 When you have eaten and are satisfied, praise the LORD your God for the good land he has given you. 11 Be careful that you do not forget the LORD your God, failing to observe his commands, his laws and his decrees that I am giving you this day. 12 Otherwise, when you eat and are satisfied, when you build fine houses and settle down, 13 and when your herds and flocks grow large and your silver and gold increase and all you have is multiplied, 14 then your heart will become proud and you will forget the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 15 He led you through the vast and dreadful desert, that thirsty and waterless land, with its venomous snakes and scorpions. He brought you water out of hard rock. 16 He gave you manna to eat in the desert, something your fathers had never known, to humble and to test you so that in the end it might go well with you. 17 You may say to yourself, "My power and the strength of my hands have produced this wealth for me." 18 But remember the LORD your God, for it is he who gives you the ability to produce wealth, and so confirms his covenant, which he swore to your forefathers, as it is today. 19 If you ever forget the LORD your God and follow other gods and worship and bow down to them, I testify against you today that you will surely be destroyed. 20 Like the nations the LORD destroyed before you, so you will be destroyed for not obeying the LORD your God.

God is mercy and Love. God is patient aswell, but I think it would be foolish to think God does not set crooked paths straight. Ignore His words and live in the things of the flesh, and we do not expect punishment?

God Bless.

 

[soblessed53]

Many christians believe that we are in the last days of the church age and that Christs return is not far off . Many have been watching the signs given by Christ and watching the labor pains grow more intense and closer together . (weird weather , earthquakes , signs in the heavens etcc.. ) Many are also watching events in Israel and the recent push by Americas President and Secretary of State to force Sharon to give up control of Gaza and force its residents to leave their homes in the name of "peace " .

Many believers are also familiar with Gods promises in the bible that all those bless Israel will be blessed and all those who curse them will be cursed , and that those nations who seek to divide His land will suffer His wrath and also those nations who burden themselves with Jerusalem will be " cut to pieces" . ( I will post relevant verses about these after the posting at the end of the writing)Anyway ....

A Friend sent me an email written by a Rabbi that I thought was interesting concering the recent events in Israel and the Hurricane that hit Americas southern coastline . Just wondering what you all think about it and the verses concerning Israel and wondering if you see a connection . Just a thought .

The email I received :Rebbe Nachman of Breslev teaches that we must constantly search for the Divine message in all the events of our lives, since Hashem speaks to us by way of our environment.

At the time of this writing, hurricane Katrina has been declared a national emergency in the USA; her winds now exceed 175 mph (nearly 300 km/hour). She's a mere one hundred miles from the US coast, and approaching at a foreboding 13 miles per hour. Authorities in Louisiana have ordered hundreds of thousands of people to flee from their homes.

Katrina is hitting just as the bulldozers are completing the destruction of Gush Katif. The Talmud teaches that Hashem administers the world according to the "ATFAT" principle, in other words, "a turn for a turn" (for an elaboration of the ATFAT principle, see Chapter Six of The Trail to Tranquility). My heart tells me that there's a link between the forced expulsion of 8500 people from their blood, sweat, and tear-soaked homes in Israeli Gaza and between the nearly 850,000 people who are forced to flee from their homes in Louisiana. Sharon, at the prodding of the American government, has destroyed hallowed centers of prayer, Torah learning, and settlement in the Land of Israel. Hashem isn't wasting much time in showing His wrath. In fact, Katrina has chosen Ms. Rice's home state as a target; I humbly believe that the unfortunate people of Louisiana can blame Mr. Bush and Ms. Rice for their misfortune. This is a classic ATFAT situation: He who creates exiles in the Holy Land, will have a hundred-fold exiles in his own land.

A bizarre turn of events - for weeks, the media was savoring over the confrontations between Jewish settlers and Jewish soldiers; now, similar pictures are pouring over the wire from New Orleans. In the above photo, courtesy of Reuters, a National Guardsman holds back people seeking refuge in the Louisiana Superdome, Sunday afternoon.A coincidence? I don't believe in coincidences.

Katrina, written ÷èøéðä in Hebrew, has a numerical equivalent of 374. Two relevant passages in Torah share the exact numerical equivalent of 374 also: øòä âîìåê, or "They have done you evil" (see Gen. 50:17), and éí áéáùä, or "The sea upon land" (see Exodus 14:15). The former passage may be an indication as to the spiritual cause of Katrina, while the latter passage describes the physical manifestation.

Mr. Bush and Ms. Rice, I implore you to repent, to ask Hashem's forgiveness for destroying a flourishing part of Israel. Cancel all your demands for further territorial concessions in Israel. If by your initiative more Jews are rendered homeless, G-d forbid, I shudder to think of what could happen. Please take Katrina very seriously, for she is a no-nonsense messenger from The Almighty. ~~~~

Relevant bible verses :

Genesis 12:3
I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you."

The Signs of the Times and the End of the Age
Matthew 24
3 Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”
4 And Jesus answered and said to them: “Take heed that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many. 6 And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all[a]these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. 7 For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
9 “Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. 10 And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. 11 Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. 12 And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. 13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.

The Parable of the Fig Tree

Matthew 24:32 “Now learn this parable from the fig tree: When its branch has already become tender and puts forth leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 So you also, when you see all these things, know that it[d] is near—at the doors! 34 Assuredly, I say to you, this generation will by no means pass away till all these things take place. 35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will by no means pass away.


Note: Throughout scripture , Israel is pictured as the fig tree , untill there was a fig tree (Israel) again , it couldnt become "tender" or sprout untill the jews returned to their promised land from all over the world .

Also note contextually , Christ is speaking throughout this chapter of events that show the end , so "this" generation would clearly be the one who sees all these things coming to pass , and never before this generation was the world close to hearing the gospel all over the world but thanks to missionaries in the 20th century , this is almost complete. So THIS generation today is who sees all these things , not possible before this one .

No One Knows the Day or Hour

36 “But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven,[e] but My Father only. 37 But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. 38 For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, 39 and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. 40 Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left. 42 Watch therefore, for you do not know what hour[f] your Lord is coming. 43 But know this, that if the master of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched and not allowed his house to be broken into. 44 Therefore you also be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect.


The verses about Israel and nations who divide it :

Ezekiel 37:22
and I will make them one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king over them all; they shall no longer be two nations, nor shall they ever be divided into two kingdoms again.

Daniel 11:39
Thus he shall act against the strongest fortresses with a foreign god, which he shall acknowledge, and advance its glory; and he shall cause them to rule over many, and divide the land for gain.


Joel 3
God Judges the Nations
1 “For behold, in those days and at that time,
When I bring back the captives of Judah and Jerusalem,
2 I will also gather all nations,
And bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat;
And I will enter into judgment with them there
On account of My people, My heritage Israel,
Whom they have scattered among the nations;
They have also divided up My land.

Zechariah 12:3 And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it.

I believe it is a very good possibility.

 

[jande2211]

Does God ever punish nations and cities? Certainly, the bible is filled with stories like that. Sodom anyone? However, sometimes things just happen. Jesus seemed to think so in Luke 13:1-5 . . .

Now there were some present at that time who told Jesus about the Galilieans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices. Jesus answered, "Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans because they suffered this way? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish. Or those eighteen who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them -- do you think they were more guilty than all of the others living in Jerusalem? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish."

He's saying that just because these people died didn't mean they were being punished by God or all of the people in those areas would've died. Bad things happen. Tragic, but that's the way it is.

Was Katrina from God specifically for something? I think not. When God wants to wipe out a place, He's more thorough than that. As someone here already mentioned, the French Quarter would've been the place for some serious Sodom and Gomorah-izing.

Peace.

 

[Jesus Is Real]

Many times we blame things on GOD and he is not amused no....

BondGirl,

Hello there.

Who hinders or allows the Destroyer to break in because of strife and
debates and the like?
Do a word study.

Jer 30:12-14
12 For thus saith the LORD, Thy bruise is incurable, and thy wound is grievous.

13 There is none to plead thy cause, that thou mayest be bound up: thou hast no healing medicines.

14 All thy lovers have forgotten thee; they seek thee not; for I have wounded thee with the wound of an enemy, with the chastisement of a cruel one, for the multitude of thine iniquity; because thy sins were increased.

1 Cor 10:10
10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
KJV

Ex 12:23
23 For the LORD will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the LORD will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you.

That's why it's so important to CARRY OUT CROSS AND STAY ON IT....so that we won't carry out the lusts of the flesh nature of Satan which is:
1. murmur ye
2. iniquity
3. sins were increased

Ever wonder and see, in your quite time that the New testament is talking about what the Old Testament has already warned us about?
If we don't murmur against the Lord with others or about others,
Jer 30:12-14 will be taken care of by Loving God with all your heart
who doesn't want us to murmur against Him and sin to increase to your
sorrows! If you love God with all you have you can with confidence say that
it's fulfilled in how I LOVE GOD AND LOVE MY NEIGHBOR. If you murmur against God, but to you you believe it's someone else causing you grief God
sees it as your NOT LOVING HIM....but only murmuring against Him and accusing your neighbor.

And, what kind of LOVE IS THAT?

 

[BondGirl]

Does God ever punish nations and cities? Certainly, the bible is filled with stories like that. Sodom anyone? However, sometimes things just happen. Jesus seemed to think so in Luke 13:1-5 . . .

Was Katrina from God specifically for something? I think not. When God wants to wipe out a place, He's more thorough than that. As someone here already mentioned, the French Quarter would've been the place for some serious Sodom and Gomorah-izing.

Peace.

ITA! ...and I still say that we place "blame" on GOD far too often. Many times it is the devil.... GOD "allows" things to happen sometime...but does this in turn make it "his fault"?

 

[Jesus Is Real]

ITA! ...and I still say that we place "blame" on GOD far too often. Many times it is the devil.... GOD "allows" things to happen sometime...but does this in turn make it "his fault"?

BondGirl,

If we ever lose the Sov'ty of God we lose Our Savior in His Love.

I like your signature line, it's a pondering thought! So thanks!

 

[artybloke]

If we ever lose the Sov'ty of God we lose Our Savior in His Love.

If we lose the love of God in a bid to preserve his sovereignty then we might as well just admit that the difference between God and Hitler is moot. I'd rather have a God who isn't sovereign that an unloving God who goes around sending hurricanes to people he doesn't like. That's a God worth resisting, frankly.

I don't believe in a God who controls everything; I believe in a God who gives us the freedom to choose. If you put your hand in a fire it burns; so don't put your hand in a fire. God's not going to come and stop you getting burned. If you live in Hurricane Alley, hurricanes are likely. If you don't maintain the levees, they will burst. If you ruin your own environment with too much carbon emissions, don't expect God to come and save you.

 

[Jesus Is Real]

If we lose the love of God in a bid to preserve his sovereignty then we might as well just admit that the difference between God and Hitler is moot. I'd rather have a God who isn't sovereign that an unloving God who goes around sending hurricanes to people he doesn't like. That's a God worth resisting, frankly.

I don't believe in a God who controls everything; I believe in a God who gives us the freedom to choose. If you put your hand in a fire it burns; so don't put your hand in a fire. God's not going to come and stop you getting burned. If you live in Hurricane Alley, hurricanes are likely. If you don't maintain the levees, they will burst. If you ruin your own environment with too much carbon emissions, don't expect God to come and save you.

artybloke,

Well I didn't say the whole Bible in that one sentence now did I?,...chuckles.
You should read my BLOG it's called "Warning".......it will help!

You got the Love of God, but your leaning a bit against "the Sov'ty" of God in Judging God. God knows and is compassionate with our trying to balance it all.........he knows our weaknesses when we are trying to understand!

Read what I wrote!
http://www.christianforums.com/t2279604
Post #6: "Warning"

 

[knownbeforetime]

I think its labor pains. This world is getting old and falling apart at the seems. That said, we could still have a year or a 100 years but the world is falling apart.

 

[artybloke]

You got the Love of God, but your leaning a bit against "the Sov'ty" of God in Judging God.

The thing about "Sovereignty" is that in most human minds, it's about power. God can do anything he likes because he's bigger than everyone else. Not unlike the US Government who thinks because it's got the biggest army, it can invade any country it likes and tell the rest of the world what to do while doing nothing to solve its own problems of pollution & poverty.

God as a kind of rampant capitalist, in other words.

But a God of love is not interested in showing us how powerful he is. A God of love is even prepared to give up that power, to come to earth as a little vulnerable baby that grew to be a man who died a horrible and shameful death on the cross in order that we might be able to encounter him in love, not out of fear.

That's the God I follow. Not George Bush on a cloud.