yeshuasavedme
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But when did Hitler rule Jerusalem?interpreter said:
It is Jerusalem, only, that the thrones of the eight count in, and they are nations, not individual kings, as you say.
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But when did Hitler rule Jerusalem?interpreter said:You have hit upon the truth. However, not just the Ottoman Turks, but all the Islamic conquerors who ruled over Jerusalem are the 7th head of the beast. Islam has now trampled Jersualem and the Holy Spot underfoot for about 1260 years now, fulfilling prophecy. (see Rev. 11:2-3).
As for the 8th head of the beast, IMO, it is Hitler, with his Third Reich (of Rome) being the third six of the 6-6-6 trilogy.
Barry
I already have. We have Nerwn attested as his name in the Dead Sea Scrolls. Not to mention the church fathers see Nero as the antichrist over and over again.When people try to make Nero equal to the number 666 they add an extra 'n'. When you add an extra 'n' you are making the name Nero into Neron. There is nothing to suggest that Nero was called Neron (correct me if i'm wrong).
Which I have already addressed very briefly.And when people add an extra n so they can make Nero's name equal 666 they fall into the problem of final values.
If you could read Greek, you'd understand the Bible says both.So because of this you then say about the 616 thing. You may think its 616 but im going to believe the Bible when it says 666.
Irenaeus who lived A.D. 120-202 already knew of the 616 variation and discounted it as an error (the dead sea scoll which says 616 dates to after Irenaeus died):
Such, then, being the state of the case, and this number being found in all the most approved and ancient copies [of the Apocalypse], and those men who saw John face to face bearing their testimony [to it]; while reason also leads us to conclude that the number of the name of the beast, [if reckoned] according to the Greek mode of calculation by the [value of] the letters contained in it, will amount to six hundred and sixty and six; that is, the number of tens shall be equal to that of the hundreds, and the number of hundreds equal to that of the units (for that number which [expresses] the digit six being adhered to throughout, indicates the recapitulations of that apostasy, taken in its full extent, which occurred at the beginning, during the intermediate periods, and which shall take place at the end), I do not know how it is that some have erred following the ordinary mode of speech, and have vitiated the middle number in the name, deducting the amount of fifty from it, so that instead of six decads they will have it that there is but one. Adv. haer. 5.30
Ruling Jerusalem was definitely in Hitler's plans. One of his biggest allies was Yasser Arafat's uncle, the Grand Mufti, the Islamic ruler-in-exile of Jerusalem whom Hitler wanted to reinstate. (But those days were cut short for the sake of the elect).yeshuasavedme said:But when did Hitler rule Jerusalem?
It is Jerusalem, only, that the thrones of the eight count in, and they are nations, not individual kings, as you say.
Yes, I do think so.interpreter said:Ruling Jerusalem was definitely in Hitler's plans. One of his biggest allies was Yasser Arafat's uncle, the Grand Mufti, the Islamic ruler-in-exile of Jerusalem whom Hitler wanted to reinstate. (But those days were cut short for the sake of the elect).
The main proof as i noted is that the name of Hitler's (one man) reign is the Third Reich (of Rome) or Third Six of the 6-6-6 trilogy .
At least we are in agreement about head # 7 being the Islamic rulers of Jerusalem?
Barry
ForeverEndeavor said:You can make anyone the antichrist if you stretch enough. I think it's david hasselhoff:
http://www.esquilax.com/baywatch/index.shtml
OttawaUk said:Okay, how can 666 be Nero when Nero died before John wrote Revelation?
Where was the False Prophet? Where was the mark? Where was everyone who was required to take the mark but refused, killed? Where was the whole world worshipping Nero? Where was he GIVEN power over all nations of the world? Where were the 10 kings who had power under Nero? Where was the destruction of Babylon by the 10 kings?
None of this is historical!?
I don't understand how anyone can possibly make that connection.
666 is not Nero, 666 is still coming.
Okay, how can 666 be Nero when Nero died before John wrote Revelation?
Where was the False Prophet? Where was the mark? Where was everyone who was required to take the mark but refused, killed? Where was the whole world worshipping Nero? Where was he GIVEN power over all nations of the world? Where were the 10 kings who had power under Nero? Where was the destruction of Babylon by the 10 kings?
None of this is historical!?
I don't understand how anyone can possibly make that connection.
666 is not Nero, 666 is still coming.
You can make anyone the antichrist if you stretch enough. I think it's david hasselhoff:
http://www.esquilax.com/baywatch/index.shtml
If it's that complicated a process, then as far as I'm concerned, it's no better a theory than David Haselhoff.
justified said:I can answer all of these if you work with me. But it's a process. We start with this question:
--> What is the genre and intention of Revelation?
This is fundamental. If we do not agree on this, how could we possibly agree on anything else?
Are you saying that any prophecy that was fulfilled before our time wasn't a prophecy at all? Wow, that's handy.OttawaUk said:Which already negates Nero. Why would God give John a prophecy which already took place?
justified said:[/i]
yea, why should we actually have to study?
Nero died over 20 years before John returned from the Isle of patmos with the Revelation in 96 AD.Jipsah said:He didn't.
If u agree that the Islamic rulers of Jerusalem are head # 7, then u hold the historicist view, that the Revelation has been unfolding for quite sometime, and began unfolding "with speed" (as we are told in Rev.1:1,3).yeshuasavedme said:Yes, I do think so.
The times Jerusalem has been truly self ruled don't count, though.
I don't think they are truly self ruled at this time -as their strings are pulled and they move according to the marionet's tug; but from God's point of view, they may be counted as self ruled at this time????? I'm not really dogmatic on this part and willing to see it differently, if truly shown.
I do not believe that any Believer who is watching and praying that they be counted worthy to escape all these tings coming on the inhabitants of the whole world will be on earth to see the final man of sin, however, as I believe the Church must be removed, taken out of the way, gathered to Him in the air -"laqach" pre-trib and pre-wrath, for the darkness to cover the whole earth -after the light is gone, i.e., the Church in which dwells the glory of God in the measure of promise...
Figure it out from this -if possible.
http://www.centuryone.com/hstjrslm.html
interpreter said:If u agree that the Islamic rulers of Jerusalem are head # 7, then u hold the historicist view, that the Revelation has been unfolding for quite sometime, and began unfolding "with speed" (as we are told in Rev.1:1,3).
So that means the futurist view is wrong, and it possible (or probable) that head # 8 has already come and gone also. l sincerely believe it was Hitler and his Third Reich. That would mean Christians have already gone through the 3 1/2 years of great tribulation, which is exactly how long WW II lasted (starting with the bombing of Pearl Harbor when it truly became a world war).
There cannot be a pre-trib rapture because in the last days it is to be just as in the days of Noah -- the bad guys will be taken away and the good guys left.
We are now in ch. 16 of the Revelation and experiencing the 7 last plagues, which includes global warming (plague #4, now upon us). Next to come is the Battle of Ar Mageddon. Those left on earth after the bad guys are gone will take part in a glorious thousand year reign of the Church.
Barry
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