20 major reasons to reject the Premillennial doctrine

[Guojing]

It would be better if you would not talk on behalf of Covenant Theology and let speak on behalf of themselves. You do not seem to understand what they believe.

You cannot control what others choose to say but you can offer your own clarifications.

 

[sovereigngrace]

You cannot control what others choose to say but you can offer your own clarifications.

Let me sum up some of the rules by which Covenant Theologians interpret Scripture:

1. Have a good overall knowledge of scriptural truth.
2. Let the Bible speak for itself. The Word of God is the ultimate and final authority.
3. Pray for the Holy Spirit’s help in understanding God's truth. Ephesians 1:17: “That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him: The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints.”
4. Do not add unto the scriptural text.
5. Use Bible terms instead of man-made terms.
6. Scripture is its own best interpreter; we must therefore support Scripture with Scripture. Explore the full gamut of Scripture on a matter. See what other similar Scripture says.
7. Let clear and explicit Scripture interpret obscure and symbolic Scripture, not the other way around.
8. He who alleges must prove! If you claim something as truth – prove it.
9. When studying a given subject, it is always helpful to trace it back to its origin in Scripture. This is called: the law of first mention. This gives us an insight into its roots and development.
10. Note the setting, genre and context of the truth/verse you are studying and establish what the Holy Spirit is actually saying in the overall passage. Context is crucial in biblical interpretation. We need to establish whether it is literal, symbolic or parabolic, and who, what and when it relates to. Is it speaking of the past, present or future? Is it principally speaking to the people receiving it or is it speaking prophetically of an approaching event? Is the sentence a command, a statement of fact or a question? We should always be sensitive to its setting, style of writing, and the respective subject under discussion.
11. The New Testament is the fuller revelation. What is concealed in the Old Testament is revealed in the New Testament. We should interpret Scripture progressively. We all know that the Old Testament prophets looked through a glass darkly. They gave what was revealed to them. The fuller revelation came with Christ. What the Old Testament seers received was often veiled and incomplete. The New Testament is the fuller revelation and sheds light on the Old Testament. New revelation builds upon older revelation, never (at any stage) contradicting it. As Vern Poythress explains: “The significance of a type is not fully discernible until the time of fulfillment … In other words, one must compare later Scripture to earlier Scripture to understand everything.”
12. Check out the practical outworking of the doctrine in Scripture. See how God’s people lived it out.
13. What has this to do with Jesus? Jesus said in John 5:39: “Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.”
14. In disputed texts, examine the usage of key words/phrase elsewhere in Scripture. This can be done by examining the meaning of these in the original language.
15. While we are not led by Church tradition or bound by historic views of a given truth, we should carefully consider what the great Bible scholars over the years have gleaned from their thorough in-depth studies.

 

[Guojing]

Let me sum up some of the rules by which Covenant Theologians interpret Scripture:

1. Have a good overall knowledge of scriptural truth.
2. Let the Bible speak for itself. The Word of God is the ultimate and final authority.
3. Pray for the Holy Spirit’s help in understanding God's truth. Ephesians 1:17: “That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him: The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints.”
4. Do not add unto the scriptural text.
5. Use Bible terms instead of man-made terms.
6. Scripture is its own best interpreter; we must therefore support Scripture with Scripture. Explore the full gamut of Scripture on a matter. See what other similar Scripture says.
7. Let clear and explicit Scripture interpret obscure and symbolic Scripture, not the other way around.
8. He who alleges must prove! If you claim something as truth – prove it.
9. When studying a given subject, it is always helpful to trace it back to its origin in Scripture. This is called: the law of first mention. This gives us an insight into its roots and development.
10. Note the setting, genre and context of the truth/verse you are studying and establish what the Holy Spirit is actually saying in the overall passage. Context is crucial in biblical interpretation. We need to establish whether it is literal, symbolic or parabolic, and who, what and when it relates to. Is it speaking of the past, present or future? Is it principally speaking to the people receiving it or is it speaking prophetically of an approaching event? Is the sentence a command, a statement of fact or a question? We should always be sensitive to its setting, style of writing, and the respective subject under discussion.
11. The New Testament is the fuller revelation. What is concealed in the Old Testament is revealed in the New Testament. We should interpret Scripture progressively. We all know that the Old Testament prophets looked through a glass darkly. They gave what was revealed to them. The fuller revelation came with Christ. What the Old Testament seers received was often veiled and incomplete. The New Testament is the fuller revelation and sheds light on the Old Testament. New revelation builds upon older revelation, never (at any stage) contradicting it. As Vern Poythress explains: “The significance of a type is not fully discernible until the time of fulfillment … In other words, one must compare later Scripture to earlier Scripture to understand everything.”
12. Check out the practical outworking of the doctrine in Scripture. See how God’s people lived it out.
13. What has this to do with Jesus? Jesus said in John 5:39: “Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.”
14. In disputed texts, examine the usage of key words/phrase elsewhere in Scripture. This can be done by examining the meaning of these in the original language.
15. While we are not led by Church tradition or bound by historic views of a given truth, we should carefully consider what the great Bible scholars over the years have gleaned from their thorough in-depth studies.

do they include “if you are convinced you have followed all the above steps, your personal interpretation of scripture becomes a fact?”

 

[sovereigngrace]

do they include “if you are convinced you have followed all the above steps, your personal interpretation of scripture becomes a fact?”

I believe the above rules forbid Pretrib and Dispensationalism. From my in-depth studies I don't believe Pretrib has any proof-texts. That is why I abandoned it. I will put it to the test:

Where anywhere in Scripture does it mention a rapture of the church, followed by a 7 years trib followed by a 3rd coming?

 

[jgr]

One key and well known distinction between dispensationalists and Covenant theologians is one uses literal and the other do not.

Dispensationalism is based upon the golden rule of interpretation: “When the plain sense of Scripture makes common sense, seek no other sense; therefore, take every word at its primary, ordinary, usual meaning unless the facts of the immediate context, studied in light of related passages and axiomatic and fundamental truths, indicate clearly otherwise.”

In contrast, Covenant Theology uses the allegorical approach to passages of scripture that they find difficult to fit into their theological box.

If a person holds to the plain, normal principle of interpretation then they are probably a dispensationalist.

Covenant Theology Versus Dispensationalism

You being CT would naturally think its the wrong approach. The good thing about using spiritual discernment instead of literal, is that you can make scripture mean anything you want it to mean.

1 Corinthians 2
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

So you must think that Paul should instead have said:

1 Corinthians 2
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing literal things with literal.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are literally discerned.

 

[jgr]

One key and well known distinction between dispensationalists and Covenant theologians is one uses literal and the other do not.

Dispensationalism is based upon the golden rule of interpretation: “When the plain sense of Scripture makes common sense, seek no other sense; therefore, take every word at its primary, ordinary, usual meaning unless the facts of the immediate context, studied in light of related passages and axiomatic and fundamental truths, indicate clearly otherwise.”

In contrast, Covenant Theology uses the allegorical approach to passages of scripture that they find difficult to fit into their theological box.

If a person holds to the plain, normal principle of interpretation then they are probably a dispensationalist.

Covenant Theology Versus Dispensationalism

You being CT would naturally think its the wrong approach. The good thing about using spiritual discernment instead of literal, is that you can make scripture mean anything you want it to mean.

Is this, Scripture's first prophecy, literal or spiritual?

Genesis 3
15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

 

[sovereigngrace]

Its a rare protestant, anywhere in the world, that does not have a doctrine similar to "OT saints were saved by looking forward to the cross, and we are saved looking back at the cross".

I wonder why? That is what the Book reveals. I showed you that and you dismissed multiple passages that prove that.

 

[Guojing]

I wonder why? That is what the Book reveals. I showed you that and you dismissed multiple passages that prove that.

As I said to Keras, covenant theology's doctrine is very widespread throughout the world.

If nothing else, I am glad all of you here have confirmed that your underlying doctrine is covenant theology. I can now understand why you believe what you believe.

 

[ShineyDays2]

...your underlying doctrine is covenant theology. I can now understand why you believe what you believe.

If you now understand WHY we believe that the New Covenant was declared by Jesus in Matthew 26:27 and of which became an ordinance for all believers in Christ after he arose from the dead (as in 1 Cor. 11:23-26), then WHY do you come here an keep on ignoring the truths of Matthew 26 and 1 Corinthians and the many other truths that others have posted also?

Do you observe this OT promised revision of the New Covenant that was fulfilled in Jeremiah 31:31?
But just WHY was this OT promise of a New Covenant made to begin with? It was because God says in Jeremiah 11:10....

"They have gone after other gods to serve them; the house of Israel and the house of Judah have broken my covenant which I made with their fathers."​

 

[sovereigngrace]

Is this, Scripture's first prophecy, literal or spiritual?

Genesis 3
15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Exactly? How did Christ mainly depict the truth in the gospels?

 

[Guojing]

If you now understand WHY we believe that the New Covenant was declared by Jesus in Matthew 26:27 and of which became an ordinance for all believers in Christ after he arose from the dead (as in 1 Cor. 11:23-26), then WHY do you come here an keep on ignoring the truths of Matthew 26 and 1 Corinthians and the many other truths that others have posted also?

Do you observe this OT promised revision of the New Covenant that was fulfilled in Jeremiah 31:31?
But just WHY was this OT promise of a New Covenant made to begin with? It was because God says in Jeremiah 11:10....

"They have gone after other gods to serve them; the house of Israel and the house of Judah have broken my covenant which I made with their fathers."​

You can understand why someone believe what they believe, without agreeing with it.

 

[sovereigngrace]

As I said to Keras, covenant theology's doctrine is very widespread throughout the world.

If nothing else, I am glad all of you here have confirmed that your underlying doctrine is covenant theology. I can now understand why you believe what you believe.

Have you ever taken the time to study this subject for yourself and see why most born again Christians actually believe that salvation has existed under both covenants. Or have you just accepted the Dispy teaching without questioning it?

Here is more evidence:

Exo 15:2 The LORD is my strength and song, and he is become my salvation: he is my God, and I will prepare him an habitation; my father's God, and I will exalt him.

1Sa 2:1 And Hannah prayed, and said, My heart rejoiceth in the LORD, mine horn is exalted in the LORD: my mouth is enlarged over mine enemies; because I rejoice in thy salvation.

2Sa 22:3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he is my shield, and the horn of my salvation, my high tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence...
2Sa 22:36 Thou hast also given me the shield of thy salvation: and thy gentleness hath made me great...
2Sa 22:47 The LORD liveth; and blessed be my rock; and exalted be the God of the rock of my salvation...
2Sa 22:51 He is the tower of salvation for his king: and sheweth mercy to his anointed, unto David, and to his seed for evermore.

2Sa 23:5 Although my house be not so with God; yet he hath made with me an everlasting covenant, ordered in all things, and sure: for this is all my salvation, and all my desire, although he make it not to grow.

1Ch 16:23 Sing unto the LORD, all the earth; shew forth from day to day his salvation.

2Ch 6:41 Now therefore arise, O LORD God, into thy resting place, thou, and the ark of thy strength: let thy priests, O LORD God, be clothed with salvation, and let thy saints rejoice in goodness.

Job 13:16 He also shall be my salvation: for an hypocrite shall not come before him.

Psa 3:8 Salvation belongeth unto the LORD: thy blessing is upon thy people. Selah.

Psa 9:14 That I may shew forth all thy praise in the gates of the daughter of Zion: I will rejoice in thy salvation.

Psa 13:5 But I have trusted in thy mercy; my heart shall rejoice in thy salvation.

Psa 18:2 The LORD is my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer; my God, my strength, in whom I will trust; my buckler, and the horn of my salvation, and my high tower...
Psa 18:35 Thou hast also given me the shield of thy salvation: and thy right hand hath holden me up, and thy gentleness hath made me great...
Psa 18:46 The LORD liveth; and blessed be my rock; and let the God of my salvation be exalted.

Psa 20:5 We will rejoice in thy salvation, and in the name of our God we will set up our banners: the LORD fulfil all thy petitions.

Psa 21:1 The king shall joy in thy strength, O LORD; and in thy salvation how greatly shall he rejoice!

Psa 24:3 Who shall ascend into the hill of the LORD? or who shall stand in his holy place?
Psa 24:4 He that hath clean hands, and a pure heart; who hath not lifted up his soul unto vanity, nor sworn deceitfully.
Psa 24:5 He shall receive the blessing from the LORD, and righteousness from the God of his salvation.

Psa 25:5 Lead me in thy truth, and teach me: for thou art the God of my salvation; on thee do I wait all the day.

Psa 27:1 The LORD is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the LORD is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid? ...
Psa 27:9 Hide not thy face far from me; put not thy servant away in anger: thou hast been my help; leave me not, neither forsake me, O God of my salvation.

Psa 35:3 Draw out also the spear, and stop the way against them that persecute me: say unto my soul, I am thy salvation...
Psa 35:9 And my soul shall be joyful in the LORD: it shall rejoice in his salvation.

Psa 37:39 But the salvation of the righteous is of the LORD: he is their strength in the time of trouble.

Psa 38:22 Make haste to help me, O Lord my salvation.

Psa 40:10 I have not hid thy righteousness within my heart; I have declared thy faithfulness and thy salvation: I have not concealed thy lovingkindness and thy truth from the great congregation.

Psa 40:16 Let all those that seek thee rejoice and be glad in thee: let such as love thy salvation say continually, The LORD be magnified.

Psa 50:23 Whoso offereth praise glorifieth me: and to him that ordereth his conversation aright will I shew the salvation of God.

Psa 51:14 Deliver me from bloodguiltiness, O God, thou God of my salvation: and my tongue shall sing aloud of thy righteousness.

Psa 53:6 Oh that the salvation of Israel were come out of Zion! When God bringeth back the captivity of his people, Jacob shall rejoice, and Israel shall be glad.

Psa 62:1 To the chief Musician, to Jeduthun, A Psalm of David.Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation.
Psa 62:2 He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved…
Psa 62:6 He only is my rock and my salvation: he is my defence; I shall not be moved.
Psa 62:7 In God is my salvation and my glory: the rock of my strength, and my refuge, is in God.

Psa 65:5 By terrible things in righteousness wilt thou answer us, O God of our salvation; who art the confidence of all the ends of the earth, and of them that are afar off upon the sea:

Psa 68:19 Blessed be the Lord, who daily loadeth us with benefits, even the God of our salvation. Selah.
Psa 68:20 He that is our God is the God of salvation; and unto GOD the Lord belong the issues from death.

Psa 69:13 But as for me, my prayer is unto thee, O LORD, in an acceptable time: O God, in the multitude of thy mercy hear me, in the truth of thy salvation...
Psa 69:29 But I am poor and sorrowful: let thy salvation, O God, set me up on high.

Psa 70:4 Let all those that seek thee rejoice and be glad in thee: and let such as love thy salvation say continually, Let God be magnified.

Psa 71:15 My mouth shall shew forth thy righteousness and thy salvation all the day; for I know not the numbers thereof.

Psa 74:12 For God is my King of old, working salvation in the midst of the earth.

Psa 78:22 Because they believed not in God, and trusted not in his salvation:

Psa 79:9 Help us, O God of our salvation, for the glory of thy name: and deliver us, and purge away our sins, for thy name's sake.

Psa 85:4 Turn us, O God of our salvation, and cause thine anger toward us to cease...
Psa 85:7 Shew us thy mercy, O LORD, and grant us thy salvation…
Psa 85:9 Surely his salvation is nigh them that fear him; that glory may dwell in our land.

Psa 88:1 O LORD God of my salvation, I have cried day andnight before thee:

Psa 89:26 He shall cry unto me, Thou art my father, my God, and the rock of my salvation.

Psa 91:16 With long life will I satisfy him, and shew him my salvation.

Psa 95:1 O come, let us sing unto the LORD: let us make a joyful noise to the rock of our salvation.

Psa 98:2 The LORD hath made known his salvation: his righteousness hath he openly shewed in the sight of the heathen...
Psa 98:3 He hath remembered his mercy and his truth toward the house of Israel: all the ends of the earth have seen the salvationof our God.

Psa 106:4 Remember me, O LORD, with the favour that thou bearest unto thy people: O visit me with thy salvation;

Psa 116:13 I will take the cup of salvation, and call upon the name of the LORD.

Psa 118:14 The LORD is my strength and song, and is become my salvation.
Psa 118:15 The voice of rejoicing and salvation is in the tabernacles of the righteous: the right hand of the LORD doeth valiantly…
Psa 118:21 I will praise thee: for thou hast heard me, and art become my salvation.

Psa 119:41 Let thy mercies come also unto me, O LORD, even thy salvation, according to thy word…
Psa 119:81 My soul fainteth for thy salvation: but I hope in thy word…
Psa 119:123 Mine eyes fail for thy salvation, and for the word of thy righteousness…
Psa 119:155 Salvation is far from the wicked: for they seek not thy statutes…
Psa 119:166 LORD, I have hoped for thy salvation, and done thy commandments…
Psa 119:174 I have longed for thy salvation, O LORD; and thy law is my delight.

Psa 132:16 I will also clothe her priests with salvation: and her saints shall shout aloud for joy.

Psa 140:7 O GOD the Lord, the strength of my salvation, thou hast covered my head in the day of battle.

Psa 144:10 It is he that giveth salvation unto kings: who delivereth David his servant from the hurtful sword.

Psa 149:4 For the LORD taketh pleasure in his people: he will beautify the meek with salvation.

 

[sovereigngrace]

As I said to Keras, covenant theology's doctrine is very widespread throughout the world.

If nothing else, I am glad all of you here have confirmed that your underlying doctrine is covenant theology. I can now understand why you believe what you believe.

Isa 12:2 Behold, God is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for the LORD JEHOVAH is my strength and my song; he also is become my salvation.
Isa 12:3 Therefore with joy shall ye draw water out of the wells of salvation.

Isa 17:10 Because thou hast forgotten the God of thy salvation, and hast not been mindful of the rock of thy strength, therefore shalt thou plant pleasant plants, and shalt set it with strange slips:

Isa 25:9 And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.

Isa 26:1 In that day shall this song be sung in the land of Judah; We have a strong city; salvation will God appoint for walls and bulwarks.

Isa 33:2 O LORD, be gracious unto us; we have waited for thee: be thou their arm every morning, our salvation also in the time of trouble…
Isa 33:6 And wisdom and knowledge shall be the stability of thy times, and strength of salvation: the fear of the LORD is his treasure.

Isa 45:8 Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it…
Isa 45:17 But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.

Isa 46:13 I bring near my righteousness; it shall not be far off, and my salvation shall not tarry: and I will place salvation in Zion for Israel my glory.

Isa 49:8 Thus saith the LORD, In an acceptable time have I heard thee, and in a day of salvation have I helped thee: and I will preserve thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, to establish the earth, to cause to inherit the desolate heritages;

Isa 51:5 My righteousness is near; my salvation is gone forth, and mine arms shall judge the people; the isles shall wait upon me, and on mine arm shall they trust.

Jon 2:9 But I will sacrifice unto thee with the voice of thanksgiving; I will pay that that I have vowed. Salvation is of the LORD.

Mic 7:7 Therefore I will look unto the LORD; I will wait for the God of my salvation: my God will hear me.

Hab 3:18 Yet I will rejoice in the LORD, I will joy in the God of my salvation.

 

[Guojing]

Have you ever taken the time to study this subject for yourself and see why most born again Christians actually believe that salvation has existed under both covenants. Or have you just accepted the Dispy teaching without questioning it?

Here is more evidence:

Exo 15:2 The LORD is my strength and song, and he is become my salvation: he is my God, and I will prepare him an habitation; my father's God, and I will exalt him.

1Sa 2:1 And Hannah prayed, and said, My heart rejoiceth in the LORD, mine horn is exalted in the LORD: my mouth is enlarged over mine enemies; because I rejoice in thy salvation.

2Sa 22:3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he is my shield, and the horn of my salvation, my high tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence...
2Sa 22:36 Thou hast also given me the shield of thy salvation: and thy gentleness hath made me great...
2Sa 22:47 The LORD liveth; and blessed be my rock; and exalted be the God of the rock of my salvation...
2Sa 22:51 He is the tower of salvation for his king: and sheweth mercy to his anointed, unto David, and to his seed for evermore.

2Sa 23:5 Although my house be not so with God; yet he hath made with me an everlasting covenant, ordered in all things, and sure: for this is all my salvation, and all my desire, although he make it not to grow.

1Ch 16:23 Sing unto the LORD, all the earth; shew forth from day to day his salvation.

2Ch 6:41 Now therefore arise, O LORD God, into thy resting place, thou, and the ark of thy strength: let thy priests, O LORD God, be clothed with salvation, and let thy saints rejoice in goodness.

Job 13:16 He also shall be my salvation: for an hypocrite shall not come before him.

Psa 3:8 Salvation belongeth unto the LORD: thy blessing is upon thy people. Selah.

Psa 9:14 That I may shew forth all thy praise in the gates of the daughter of Zion: I will rejoice in thy salvation.

Psa 13:5 But I have trusted in thy mercy; my heart shall rejoice in thy salvation.

Psa 18:2 The LORD is my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer; my God, my strength, in whom I will trust; my buckler, and the horn of my salvation, and my high tower...
Psa 18:35 Thou hast also given me the shield of thy salvation: and thy right hand hath holden me up, and thy gentleness hath made me great...
Psa 18:46 The LORD liveth; and blessed be my rock; and let the God of my salvation be exalted.

Psa 20:5 We will rejoice in thy salvation, and in the name of our God we will set up our banners: the LORD fulfil all thy petitions.

Psa 21:1 The king shall joy in thy strength, O LORD; and in thy salvation how greatly shall he rejoice!

Psa 24:3 Who shall ascend into the hill of the LORD? or who shall stand in his holy place?
Psa 24:4 He that hath clean hands, and a pure heart; who hath not lifted up his soul unto vanity, nor sworn deceitfully.
Psa 24:5 He shall receive the blessing from the LORD, and righteousness from the God of his salvation.

Psa 25:5 Lead me in thy truth, and teach me: for thou art the God of my salvation; on thee do I wait all the day.

Psa 27:1 The LORD is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the LORD is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid? ...
Psa 27:9 Hide not thy face far from me; put not thy servant away in anger: thou hast been my help; leave me not, neither forsake me, O God of my salvation.

Psa 35:3 Draw out also the spear, and stop the way against them that persecute me: say unto my soul, I am thy salvation...
Psa 35:9 And my soul shall be joyful in the LORD: it shall rejoice in his salvation.

Psa 37:39 But the salvation of the righteous is of the LORD: he is their strength in the time of trouble.

Psa 38:22 Make haste to help me, O Lord my salvation.

Psa 40:10 I have not hid thy righteousness within my heart; I have declared thy faithfulness and thy salvation: I have not concealed thy lovingkindness and thy truth from the great congregation.

Psa 40:16 Let all those that seek thee rejoice and be glad in thee: let such as love thy salvation say continually, The LORD be magnified.

Psa 50:23 Whoso offereth praise glorifieth me: and to him that ordereth his conversation aright will I shew the salvation of God.

Psa 51:14 Deliver me from bloodguiltiness, O God, thou God of my salvation: and my tongue shall sing aloud of thy righteousness.

Psa 53:6 Oh that the salvation of Israel were come out of Zion! When God bringeth back the captivity of his people, Jacob shall rejoice, and Israel shall be glad.

Psa 62:1 To the chief Musician, to Jeduthun, A Psalm of David.Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation.
Psa 62:2 He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved…
Psa 62:6 He only is my rock and my salvation: he is my defence; I shall not be moved.
Psa 62:7 In God is my salvation and my glory: the rock of my strength, and my refuge, is in God.

Psa 65:5 By terrible things in righteousness wilt thou answer us, O God of our salvation; who art the confidence of all the ends of the earth, and of them that are afar off upon the sea:

Psa 68:19 Blessed be the Lord, who daily loadeth us with benefits, even the God of our salvation. Selah.
Psa 68:20 He that is our God is the God of salvation; and unto GOD the Lord belong the issues from death.

Psa 69:13 But as for me, my prayer is unto thee, O LORD, in an acceptable time: O God, in the multitude of thy mercy hear me, in the truth of thy salvation...
Psa 69:29 But I am poor and sorrowful: let thy salvation, O God, set me up on high.

Psa 70:4 Let all those that seek thee rejoice and be glad in thee: and let such as love thy salvation say continually, Let God be magnified.

Psa 71:15 My mouth shall shew forth thy righteousness and thy salvation all the day; for I know not the numbers thereof.

Psa 74:12 For God is my King of old, working salvation in the midst of the earth.

Psa 78:22 Because they believed not in God, and trusted not in his salvation:

Psa 79:9 Help us, O God of our salvation, for the glory of thy name: and deliver us, and purge away our sins, for thy name's sake.

Psa 85:4 Turn us, O God of our salvation, and cause thine anger toward us to cease...
Psa 85:7 Shew us thy mercy, O LORD, and grant us thy salvation…
Psa 85:9 Surely his salvation is nigh them that fear him; that glory may dwell in our land.

Psa 88:1 O LORD God of my salvation, I have cried day andnight before thee:

Psa 89:26 He shall cry unto me, Thou art my father, my God, and the rock of my salvation.

Psa 91:16 With long life will I satisfy him, and shew him my salvation.

Psa 95:1 O come, let us sing unto the LORD: let us make a joyful noise to the rock of our salvation.

Psa 98:2 The LORD hath made known his salvation: his righteousness hath he openly shewed in the sight of the heathen...
Psa 98:3 He hath remembered his mercy and his truth toward the house of Israel: all the ends of the earth have seen the salvationof our God.

Psa 106:4 Remember me, O LORD, with the favour that thou bearest unto thy people: O visit me with thy salvation;

Psa 116:13 I will take the cup of salvation, and call upon the name of the LORD.

Psa 118:14 The LORD is my strength and song, and is become my salvation.
Psa 118:15 The voice of rejoicing and salvation is in the tabernacles of the righteous: the right hand of the LORD doeth valiantly…
Psa 118:21 I will praise thee: for thou hast heard me, and art become my salvation.

Psa 119:41 Let thy mercies come also unto me, O LORD, even thy salvation, according to thy word…
Psa 119:81 My soul fainteth for thy salvation: but I hope in thy word…
Psa 119:123 Mine eyes fail for thy salvation, and for the word of thy righteousness…
Psa 119:155 Salvation is far from the wicked: for they seek not thy statutes…
Psa 119:166 LORD, I have hoped for thy salvation, and done thy commandments…
Psa 119:174 I have longed for thy salvation, O LORD; and thy law is my delight.

Psa 132:16 I will also clothe her priests with salvation: and her saints shall shout aloud for joy.

Psa 140:7 O GOD the Lord, the strength of my salvation, thou hast covered my head in the day of battle.

Psa 144:10 It is he that giveth salvation unto kings: who delivereth David his servant from the hurtful sword.

Psa 149:4 For the LORD taketh pleasure in his people: he will beautify the meek with salvation.

Do you mean present salvation was also available before the mystery revealed to Paul?

 

[sovereigngrace]

Do you mean present salvation was also available before the mystery revealed to Paul?

Read the text and let the Scriptures speak for themselves.

 

[Guojing]

Read the text and let the Scriptures speak for themselves.

Its a simple yes or no question.

 

[ShineyDays2]

You can understand why someone believe what they believe, without agreeing with it.

I know you don't agree with it but you ignored the rest of my post which was....

~ Do you observe this OT promised revision of the New Covenant that was fulfilled in Jeremiah 31:31?
As you said above - speaking of the institution of communion...

Quote: "It's a simple question, yes or no?​

But just WHY was this OT promise of a New Covenant made to begin with? It was because God says in Jeremiah 11:10....
"They have gone after other gods to serve them; the house of Israel and the house of Judah have broken my covenant which I made with their fathers."

"

 

[Guojing]

I know you don't agree with it but you ignored the rest of my post which was....

~ Do you observe this OT promised revision of the New Covenant that was fulfilled in Jeremiah 31:31?
As you said above - speaking of the institution of communion...

Quote: "It's a simple question, yes or no?​

But just WHY was this OT promise of a New Covenant made to begin with? It was because God says in Jeremiah 11:10....
"They have gone after other gods to serve them; the house of Israel and the house of Judah have broken my covenant which I made with their fathers."

"

I don't even agree with you that we are the House of Israel and Judah, so why ask whether I observe promises given to them?

 

[ShineyDays2]

Typical of you Quojing to focus on something not directly related to the question that was asked....

I know you don't agree with it but you ignored the rest of my post which was....

~ Do you observe this OT promised revision of the New Covenant that was fulfilled in Jeremiah 31:31? As you said above (speaking of the institution of communion)

Quote: "It's a simple question, yes or no?​

But just WHY was this OT promise of a New Covenant made to begin with? I answered the question for you by referring to the reason that Jesus revised the Jeremiah 31 broken covenant. So back to the REAL question you avoided.

It was because God says in Jeremiah 11:10....
"They have gone after other gods to serve them; the house of Israel and the house of Judah have broken my covenant which I made with their fathers."

 

[sovereigngrace]

Its a simple yes or no question.

Romans 16:25-26: “Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith.”

Ephesians 3:1-9: “For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles, If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to youward: How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ) Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel: Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power. Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ; And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ.”

The Church itself was not a mystery (or secret) prior to Paul, neither was the Gospel, neither was God's great eternal plan of redemption, neither was the ingathering of the Gentiles. Passage after passage in the Old Testament predicted these events. What was a mystery was the Gentiles being “fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel.”

Dispensationalists typically present the New Testament Church as a brand-new spiritual innovation, which had no existence prior to Pentecost. They teach that the Church itself is “the mystery” and that it is a completely separate entity to God’s people in the Old Testament. They say that because the New Testament Church is expressly called ‘the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God’ that it is a brand new construction started at the Upper Room. They contend that the Apostle Paul was specifically and specially tasked with revealing this great mystery.

What they miss is that the Church is not a New Testament novelty introduced by Christ but an ongoing spiritual organism that has contained the elect of God from the very beginning. The Church is not something entirely unique in God's plan and purposes but is an extension of Old Testament believing Israel. Whilst the Church has taken on a different form under the new covenant, in the same way as the development / change occurs between the caterpillar and the butterfly, the elect in the Old Testament and the elect in the New Testament are part of the same spiritual body.

Paul never says that the Church wasn’t about before Pentecost. In fact, he teaches the opposite. He identifies the mystery in a clear and unambiguous way in verse 6, namely: “That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel.” The Dispensational interpretation is the exact opposite to what the inspired text is actually saying. Paul is in fact talking about the joining of the old and new covenant saints together in Christ. The mystery is the mystical union of the people of God of all time in one spiritual body. He is talking about the parity that resulted from this merger in regard to the promises of God.

Thomas Croskery explains on this subject in his classic work from 1879 Plymouth-Brethrenism, a refutation of its principles and doctrines: “Though the prophets foretold that the Gentiles were to be blessed in Abraham, it was not made known to them in what manner the blessing was to be realized. This was the special revelation to which the apostle alludes when he speaks of the dispensation committed to himself as the apostle to the Gentiles.”

He adds: “we, of this dispensation, were to be incorporated into the ‘one commonwealth’, from which we were alienated, into the ‘one body’, the ‘one household’, the ‘one building fitly framed together’. The mystery was the admission of Gentiles to share on equal terms with the Jews all the blessings purchased by Christ.”