Unfortunately as I point out, the Lord says those who believe in Him will never perish.
What's so unfortunate about what Jesus said?
What IS unfortunate is that you think what Jesus said was unfortunate, and you don't believe what He said.
You add that He means those who "believe" (without specifics) even for a milli second are given entry into life eternal, without conditions or the ability to lose such a privelege or be lost.
If you have evidence that one's faith is measured in milliseconds, hrs, days, wks, months, yrs, or decades in order to guarantee entrance into heaven, please share.
However, I've already shown from Scripture that "whoever believes" actually possesses eternal life. That means, absent any further clarifications, that the very MOMENT one believes, they have eternal life.
John 5:24, 6:47, 1 John 5:11, 13 all indicate that eternal life is possessed by those who believe in Christ.
Now, your snide comment about my leaving out "specific" of what 'believing' means, let me clarify for you, so there will be no more error on your part.
Saving faith requires 2 things; an object in which to believe, and a goal or purpose in believing. This is true for faith in general as well. There is no such thing as "having faith in faith".
So, the object of saving faith is the Lord Jesus Christ. These 3 words indicate His Deity (Lord), humanity (Jesus) and Christ (suffering servant who died for humanity's sins). One must believe that He is all 3. Those who believe that He was a good teacher, but deny that He is the Son of God (Deity) do not have saving faith.
Second, the goal or purpose in saving faith is salvation. That means being saved from the lake of fire, where EVERY unbeliever will be cast, along with the devil and all his army of fallen angels.
Any questions?
No where is this belief part of salvation, security, as a condition of salvation, and by itself, once it is a condition of salvation, denies itself that there are no conditions.
Do you honestly not have any idea just how confused this statement is? I have no idea what your pont may be.
Jesus said to the Father that He had lost no one except the son of pedition.
Do you have a point here?
In the seed and sower parable, people are lost.
Only the first soil were unbelievers, per Luke 8:12.
In Hebrews people come to faith and then fall away.
I've already agreed that believers may cease to believe. But there are no Scriptures that say that those who cease to believe cease to be saved. That is your own opinion and it is against Scripture.
Paul described believers who fall into sin and follow satan, false teachers arise though they appeared part of the body, show themselves not to have been.
What you misunderstand is that it was John who made reference to some who had left, because they "were not of us".
1 John 2:19 - They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.
However, those who have read and are familiar with Acts 15:1-6 understand what John was referring to; believers who held to false doctrines, just as the believers in the Pharisee group did (must be circumcised to be saved).
1 Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.”
5 Then
some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
{I rather think that if you lived at that time frame, you'd have been one of those "some".
And in the same spirit, to argue with me as not being saved because I do not hold security in Christ the way you do, suggests you are actually a false teacher attempting to deny the work Christ has done in my life.
How come you keep claiming that my view is that you are not saved? I've NEVER even suggested that. I have said that you don't believe what Jesus teaches in John 10:28, but that's a far cry from suggesting that you aren't saved.
I have no idea what your understanding of saving faith even is. Until you explain it, I couldn't make such a judgment.
If we listen to Jesus and hear all His words, we find apparent contradictions until we start to see the whole.
To claim that "all of Jesus' words" include "apparent contradictions" is delusional. But it's the only defense you've got, since you know that you don't accept John 10:28 as true.
God who created the universe with its balances, nuances, forces one way and another, who gave us example after example of people finding Him and still having struggles and trials, it is obvious this is not simple. So I thank you, for bearing with me, and teaching me, I have a long way to go, and the Lord uses everything.
Teaching you???!! Have you been learning anything about eternal security? No.