1 Cor 11 "this is my body" in communion vs Literal historic accounts

[BobRyan]

Literally "what He said"

John 10: 7 So Jesus said to them again, “Truly, truly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep

John 15: 5 "I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing.

can you say metaphor?

Swag365 said: ↑
No actually that is literally what he said. Let me recite it for you again:

"This is my body".

He also said I am the door. what kind of wood he is made of? Or is he a metal door?

excellent point.

metaphors are funny that way..

That's pretty weak.
He is neither wood, nor is he metal. But he is the door,

yep - metaphors are funny that way..

Which is why we don't take them literally

 

[Swag365]

Literally "what He said"



can you say metaphor?





excellent point.

metaphors are funny that way..



yep - metaphors are funny that way..

Which is why we don't take them literally

I'll stick with believing that what our Lord said is true.

Have a nice day.

 

[BobRyan]

Literally "what He said"

John 10: 7 So Jesus said to them again, “Truly, truly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep

John 15: 5 "I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing.

can you say metaphor?

I'll stick with with believing that what our Lord said is true.

same here --

And pay attention to figures of speech - like metaphors so when I go to church I don't address everyone as "branches"

Nonsense. .

you are free to go that direction if you wish - you have free will

 

[Swag365]

same here --

Nonsense. This is what our Lord said:

"This is my body".

This is what you believe:

"This is not his body".

Thus, you call our Lord a liar.

Have a nice day.

 

[Jipsah]

can you say metaphor?

Can you say anything else? <Laugh> Oh, but wait... as Christians wwe must believe that the grand poetic language of the Creation story must be taken as literal, empirical, scientific fact, lest we face the ghastly charge of "not believing the Bible". Funny how that works out, innit? It's almost like you literalize one thing in Scripture and metaphorize (I just made that word up, clever, don't you think?) another to make sure the Scripture doesn't damage your denomination's doctrines. BUt that wouldn't be at all honest, would it? That would be like the JWs sticking an indefinate article before the second word "God" in their "translation" of John 1:1. It would be like ignoring entire verses in John and Acts for purely dogmatic reasons. Y'all would never do that, would you? And surely would wouldn't arbitrarily change the meaning of our Lord's wors because it's just too difficult to believe He could have really meant it. I mean, anyone credulous enough to believe that would probably believe a virgin gave birth or that someone rose from the dead. None of that for you! THis is the 21st Century!

But help me, here. When our Lord said that He was The Way, The Truth, and The Life, that was purely metaphorical, wasn't it? No one was driving across Jesus, or riding horses over Him were they? He wasn't giving piggy back rides. Y'all can't possibly take that literally. And how can a physical man be THe Truth? He could tell the truth, or believe the truth, or acknowlege the truth, but can't be The Truth. Mere metaphor. And The Life? He could give life, or take life, or enjoy life, value life or any number of other things, but be life? Nah. makes no sense. Gotta be a metaphor, right?

Dang, mate, this metaphor thing is terrific! You can take any Scripture that troubles you and in the blink of an eye make it mundane and easy to digest. That makes interpreting the Bible a snap!

 

[Jipsah]

Nonsense. This is what our Lord said:

"This is my body".

This is what you believe:

"This is not his body".

Thus, you call our Lord a liar.

Have a nice day.

But Swag, metaphor. That's the key to getting around any Scripture that doesn't say what you want it to.

 

[Swag365]

But Swag, metaphor. That's the key to getting around any Scripture that doesn't say what you want it to.

True true, but can you say metaphor?

 

[BobRyan]

Literally "what He said"

John 10: 7 So Jesus said to them again, “Truly, truly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep

John 15: 5 "I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing.

can you say metaphor?

I'll stick with with believing that what our Lord said is true.

same here --

And pay attention to figures of speech - like metaphors so when I go to church I don't address everyone as "branches"

Can you say anything else? <Laugh> Oh, but wait...

Yep I can see texts that are not metaphor and instead historic accounts of incarnation, resurrection, 7 day creation week etc.

as Christians wwe must believe that the grand poetic language of the Creation story

grand poetic story?? try "historic account summarized in pure legal code as in Ex 20:11" ... so that would be "the OP" somewhere --

But needless to say -- historic accounts cannot be downsized to " myth or maybe allegory or something of that sort" -- to quote me on another thread.

====================

ahhh yes -- the "kind of literature that it is"

James Barr has an interesting statement on the "kind of literature" that Genesis is given that Moses was no Darwinist.

========================================
Professor James Barr, Regius Professor of Hebrew at the University of Oxford, has written:

"Probably, so far as I know, there is no professor of Hebrew or Old Testament at any world-class university who does not believe that the writer(s) of Genesis 1–11 intended to convey to their readers the ideas that:

• (a) creation took place in a series of six days which were the same as the days of 24 hours we now experience
  
• (b) the figures contained in the Genesis genealogies provided by simple addition a chronology from the beginning of the world up to later stages in the biblical story
  
• (c) Noah’s flood was understood to be world-wide and extinguish all human and animal life except for those in the ark.

"Or, to put it negatively, the apologetic arguments which suppose the "days" of creation to be long eras of time, the figures of years not to be chronological, and the flood to be a merely local Mesopotamian flood, are not taken seriously by any such professors, as far as I know."

=========== end quote

Note Barr does not claim that he or any of the scholars he refers to - take the Bible seriously when it makes its statements - he only claims that they know "the kind of literature that it is" - - a historic account.

that was -- details posted

but then we get --

"But when ye post, use not lame repetitions lest thou be thought a nincompoop." -- Brother Buford's Pensees

details ignored

Looks like the SDAs are keen on demonstrating how to throw away the Scriptural cornflakes

I am sure there is a universe where that sort of thing contributes to the thread...

 

[Jipsah]

can you say metaphor?

"But when ye post, use not lame repetitions lest thou be thought a nincompoop." -- Brother Buford's Pensees

And speaking of old Brother Buford, thanks for proving, once again, how frighteningly accurate he could be:

"Every Christian sect or denomination has doctrines so dearly held that the Bible cannot be allowed to damage them." -- Brother Buford

Looks like the SDAs are keen on demonstrating how to throw away the Scriptural cornflakes and eat the doctrinal box. But at least you can say "metaphor", and probably some other irrelevant words as well.

 

[BobRyan]

There have been wars bec of this and people burned to death. And Christians who do not have communion with others and divisions and quarrels and all sorts of ugliness.
.

ok that is true - history reports lots of bad things in the past - that is for sure