Warden_of_the_Storm
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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
God did not create from nothing
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Platte
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Don't get angry - I'm not angry.
historiographical, epistemological or ontological are all humanistic studies.
No there is not - that's why I mentioned it to you.
This is important statement you just made. Very Important.
I know how much thought and discernment I've put in to the topics we are discussing...and I have NO doubt that you've put just as much thought and discerment into these topics as well. I think the main difference is that my starting point is that the Bible is the Word of God - given to us directly by God to lead us to Salvation. I don't have to put much thought and discerment into that starting point - I've already come to that realization. So my thoughts and discernment are....Ok God if this is your Word and the Truth - then how do all the things we see and hear consolidate to your Word. What is the logic and understanding of what you are tellling us in your Word.
Creation 6000 years ago....wow that's a radical position...how can that Truth be possible? Thats where my thoughts and discernment lead me.
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- Jun 18, 2006
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It wouldn't surprise me at all if scientists denied Jesus walked on water because He didn't leave any footprints behind.
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Warden_of_the_Storm
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... kind of hard to leave footprints ON water during a storm, mate.
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Isn't it ironic that someone who scrubs their bathtub to make it spotless would complain there's no water marks all over the earth re the Flood?
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Warden_of_the_Storm
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But they're not the same thing, and when someone says they have evidence that the Flood occurred, why is it wrong when we complain there's no evidence that it happened?
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(Watch this, Platte, his reply to this will be solid gold.)
Marine fossils found atop mountains.
(Cue plate tectonics.)
Marine fossils found atop mountains.
(Cue plate tectonics.)
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Oh, cut the crap!
No one has to adopt take the specific set of assumptions that are a part of your own chosen (but unrevealed) epistemological position on the Bible.
I know you've asserted that you've attended Bible College, and it's probably safe to assume you have your favored bible teachers by whom you've derived your own noetic postion on the use and nature of the Bible. But those ideas you think are axiomatic aren't self-evident.
That is correct------you hold to the bible WITHOUT DISCERNMENT. On my part, I wouldn't be able to believe the Bible if it wasn't for Critical Thinking and research.
What needs to happen now is that you be a little more transparent and divulge who your own gurus are. Otherwise, it's safe for us to assume that you merely contrive your own theological position via a solipsistic modus operandi.
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Warden_of_the_Storm
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It's actually kind of sad that, looking it up, the kinds of fossils found on mountains are from things like bivalves, trilobites, nautoloids and sea lillies. It's never stuff like bigger and later sea animals.
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That rule applies only to the academically-minded, who experience thaumatophobia.
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Warden_of_the_Storm
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No, it doesn't only apply to academically-minded, but it MASSIVELY applies to claims such as there being evidence for the Flood.
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BINGO!
But why let that stop you from demanding it?
You KNOW it can't be provided.
That's why you (plural)* demand it.
It makes you look like you're making a point.
* Notice I have to differentiate between singular and plural? In that respect, the King James is superior to modern English.
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Warden_of_the_Storm
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Excuse me? I think the evidence for my belief of the Bible, in the way that I believe it, precedes me. And you don't have the privilege or the authority to say otherwise.
Notice, too, that I haven't implied anything in the way about questioning your own Christian faith, but that is exactly what you're doing to me. I'm done with you. You had your chance(s), but you've blown it.
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Johnny: Dad, I cleaned my room up.
Dad: Was it a mess?
Johnny: Yes.
Dad: I'm going to look in there, and if I don't see it a mess, then it was never messed up!
That's how you guys sound.
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Warden_of_the_Storm
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Once again, this falls back to the simple bit of logic of "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence". If you cannot present the extraordinary evidence that shows said extraordinary event took place, then it never happened. Very simple logic. I know that's a problem with you, AV, but trust me when I say it makes sense.
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