Using the term "rapture" incorrectly

Douggg · Jul 2, 2026

I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

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For example. Not pre-trib rapture. But pre-trib resurrection/rapture event.

Spiritual Jew · Jul 2, 2026

Douggg said:
I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

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For example. Not pre-trib rapture. But pre-trib resurrection/rapture event.

I see you posted this on the other forum we both post on, so I will repeat here what I said there.

No one is going to do this because it's completely unnecessary. Everyone knows that the resurrection of the dead in Christ happens first and then the rapture (catching up to meet the Lord in the air) of the resurrected dead in Christ together with those who are alive and remain happens immediately afterwards. So, if someone refers to the rapture, then anyone who knows what is written in 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17, which is a vast majority of us, will know that it occurs at the time of the resurrection of the dead in Christ. So, there is no need to refer to it as the "resurrection/rapture event" as if anyone doesn't know that the resurrection of the dead in Christ happens just before the rapture occurs.

Have you seen anyone on this forum try to claim that the rapture occurs at a different time than the resurrection of the dead in Christ?

Douggg · Jul 2, 2026

Spiritual Jew said:
I see you posted this on the other forum we both post on, so I will repeat here what I said there.

No one is going to do this because it's completely unnecessary. Everyone knows that the resurrection of the dead in Christ happens first and then the rapture (catching up to meet the Lord in the air) of the resurrected dead in Christ together with those who are alive and remain happens immediately afterwards. So, if someone refers to the rapture, then anyone who knows what is written in 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17, which is a vast majority of us, will know that it occurs at the time of the resurrection of the dead in Christ. So, there is no need to refer to it as the "resurrection/rapture event" as if anyone doesn't know that the resurrection of the dead in Christ happens just before the rapture occurs.

Have you seen anyone on this forum try to claim that the rapture occurs at a different time than the resurrection of the dead in Christ?

Using the correct term "resurrection/rapture" not only is respectful for the dead in Christ, but also cancels some timing views of the resurrection/rapture event. Such as the view that Matthew 24:31 is speaking about the event.

Also the resurrection/rapture event is not just a resurrection alone. So it important when speaking about the event to use the correct term, the resurrection/rapture event.

Spiritual Jew · Jul 2, 2026

Douggg said:
Using the correct term "resurrection/rapture" not only is respectful for the dead in Christ, but also cancels some timing views of the resurrection/rapture event.

Everyone who has read 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17 knows that the resurrected dead in Christ are part of the rapture.

Douggg said:
Such as the view that Matthew 24:31 is speaking about the event.

It is. When will you ever learn that not all passages that relate to the second coming of Christ contain all of the same details regarding that event? Just because Matthew 24:31 does not specifically mention a resurrection does not mean that the resurrection of the dead in Christ doesn't occur at that time. This is not how to interpret scripture, Douggg. There is no mention of any gathering being done by angels in Revelation 19:11-21, so does that mean Matthew 24:30-31 and Revelation 19:11-21 are not referring to the same event, namely the return of Christ?

Douggg said:
Also the resurrection/rapture event is not just a resurrection alone.

No one says that a resurrection doesn't occur when the rapture occurs, so this is just silly.

Douggg said:
So it important when speaking about the event to use the correct term, the resurrection/rapture event.

No, it is not. It's only important to you in order to make people think that 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17 is a different event from Matthew 24:30-31. Your arguments from silence are not going to convince anyone who actually knows what the scriptures teach.

Douggg, think about how badly you misinterpreted Zechariah 13:7 before I corrected you and showed you how Jesus applied it. Consider what other scripture you might be completely mistaken about besides that one. As long as you keep interpreting scripture based on doctrinal bias, you will never discover the truth of end times scriptures.

tranquil · Jul 2, 2026

Douggg said:
I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

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For example. Not pre-trib rapture. But pre-trib resurrection/rapture event.

There is no 'whisked away' rapture event. And there most certainly is not a 'pre-trib resurrection/ rapture event'

1 Cor 15:52 in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.

the 'last trumpet' is the 7th Trumpet which is

Matt 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days: ‘The sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.

30At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

Literally the same thing going on here in Deut 30

1“And when all these things come upon you, the blessing and the curse, which I have set before you, and you call them to mind among all the nations where the Lord your God has driven you, 2and return to the Lord your God, you and your children, and obey his voice in all that I command you today, with all your heart and with all your soul, 3then the Lord your God will restore your fortunes and have mercy on you, and he will gather you again from all the peoples where the Lord your God has scattered you. 4If your outcasts are in the uttermost parts of heaven, from there the Lord your God will gather you, and from there he will take you. 5And the Lord your God will bring you into the land that your fathers possessed, that you may possess it. And he will make you more prosperous and numerous than your fathers.

And the 'sign of the son of man' in Matt 24:30 is the Rev 12 sign occurring at... the 7th Trumpet.

Douggg · Jul 2, 2026

tranquil said:
Literally the same thing going on here in Deut 30

That is correct. Matthew 24:31 is talking about the gathering of elect, the children of Israel, from around the world to the land of their forefathers - Israel.

keras · Jul 4, 2026

Spiritual Jew said:
Have you seen anyone on this forum try to claim that the rapture occurs at a different time than the resurrection of the dead in Christ?

Does the fact that I reject any 'rapture to heaven', and a general resurrection of the Christian dead when Jesus Returns, apply your statement to me?
A 'rapture to heaven' and a general resurrection of the dead in Christ, at His Return, is nowhere to be found in scripture.

Humans never go to live in heaven - after the Millennium, God and heaven come to us. Revelation 21:1-7.
ONLY the martyrs killed during the 3 1/2 year period of world Satanic control, will be resurrected when Jesus Returns. 'the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years was finished.' Revelation 20:5

Douggg · Jul 4, 2026

keras said:
Humans never go to live in heaven - after the Millennium, God and heaven come to us. Revelation 21:1-7.

keras, the 24 elders in Revelation sitting around the throne of God are humans there.

keras · Jul 5, 2026

Douggg said:
keras, the 24 elders in Revelation sitting around the throne of God are humans there.

So? That does not prove anything you want it to, it only shows your severe lack of scriptural support for the incredible idea of people going to live in heaven and how it will be only after the Millennium, that all the dead will rise to the Judgment.

I looked up 'presbuteros'- Greek, translated as 'elders'. Strongs 2425. It just means a senior or older being. A member of the Celestial Council.
Thinking they are humans, constitutes a major contradiction to many scriptures.

Douggg · Jul 5, 2026

keras said:
So? That does not prove anything you want it to, it only shows your severe lack of scriptural support for the incredible idea of people going to live in heaven and how it will be only after the Millennium, that all the dead will rise to the Judgment.

I looked up 'presbuteros'- Greek, translated as 'elders'. Strongs 2425. It just means a senior or older being. A member of the Celestial Council.
Thinking they are humans, constitutes a major contradiction to many scriptures.

They are humans.

Genesis 5:
23 And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years:
24 And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.

2 Kings 2:11 And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.

keras · Jul 5, 2026

Douggg said:
They are humans.

The 24 Elders certainly are not physical humans.
They must be Spiritual beings, they live in heaven, where Jesus said: No man can go to. John 3:13

Your 2 examples totally fail to support your beliefs.

Douggg · Jul 5, 2026

keras said:
The 24 Elders certainly are not physical humans.
They must be Spiritual beings, they live in heaven, where Jesus said: No man can go to. John 3:13

Your 2 examples totally fail to support your beliefs.

keras, you are taking John 3:13 out of context.

In context, Jesus was saying that no man had ascended to heaven and come back to earth to tell them that dwell upon earth about heavenly things.

John 3:
12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

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The 24 elders in Revelation are human beings, but not in earthly bodies

MForbes · Jul 5, 2026

Why not just make up your own word and tell people if they don't agree with you and use it they're not real believers?

How about "rapturection"? Or "resurrecture"?

By the way......don't really do that. I'm being facetious. Don't get your panties in a wad about things that just don't matter.

JulieB67 · Jul 5, 2026

Spiritual Jew said:
It is. When will you ever learn that not all passages that relate to the second coming of Christ contain all of the same details regarding that event? Just because Matthew 24:31 does not specifically mention a resurrection does not mean that the resurrection of the dead in Christ doesn't occur at that time.

Exactly

JulieB67 · Jul 5, 2026

tranquil said:
1 Cor 15:52 in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.

the 'last trumpet' is the 7th Trumpet which is

It amazes me that many people don't believe the last trumpet is the 7th. The 7th, last and the trump of God are all the same trumpet.

I think it's always good for people to remember as well that we aren't privy to every teaching that has been taught on this subject. We have a few letters/epistles. Which is enough but we are talking years of teaching, etc.

Paul for instance, states this-

II Thessalonians 2:5 "Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?"

So I'm sure these were taught about the last trump, etc more than once and what must happen.

And of course Christ through John reveals a more in depth picture of that time as well. But connecting the dots it's easy to see the last trump is the 7th. We know there are no more trumps after the 7th.

SabbathBlessings · Jul 5, 2026

JulieB67 said:
It amazes me that many people don't believe the last trumpet is the 7th. The 7th, last and the trump of God are all the same trumpet.

I think it's always good for people to remember as well that we aren't privy to every teaching that has been taught on this subject. We have a few letters/epistles. Which is enough but we are talking years of teaching, etc.

Paul for instance, states this-

II Thessalonians 2:5 "Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?"

So I'm sure these were taught about the last trump, etc more than once and what must happen.

And of course Christ through John reveals a more in depth picture of that time as well. But connecting the dots it's easy to see the last trump is the 7th. We know there are know more trumps after the 7th.

Agreed. Its Judgement Day- Jesus said that's the last day or 7th Trumpet

John 12:48 He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him—the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.

James 2:11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

Seventh Trumpet: The Kingdom Proclaimed

15 Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The [f]kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!” 16 And the twenty-four elders who sat before God on their thrones fell on their faces and worshiped God, 17 saying:

“We give You thanks, O Lord God Almighty,
The One who is and who was and who is to come,
Because You have taken Your great power and reigned.
18 The nations were angry, and Your wrath has come,
And the time of the dead, that they should be judged,
And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints,
And those who fear Your name (Exo20:20, Ecc3:14-15 Rev14:6-12) small and great,
And should destroy those who destroy the earth.”
19 Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail.

Ed Parenteau · Jul 5, 2026

Douggg said:
I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For example. Not pre-trib rapture. But pre-trib resurrection/rapture event.

Can you define rapture as you're using it?
Here Jesus prays that no believer ever be taken out of the world.
John 17:
15I am not asking that You take them out of the world, but that You keep them from the evil one. 16They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 17Sanctify them by the truth; Your word is truth. 18As You sent Me into the world, I have also sent them into the world. 19For them I sanctify Myself, so that they too may be sanctified by the truth.

Prayer for All Believers

20I am not asking on behalf of them alone, but also on behalf of those who will believe in Me through their message, 21that all of them may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I am in You. May they also be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me.

Douggg · Jul 5, 2026

Ed Parenteau said:
Can you define rapture as you're using it?

The rapture is about the sudden change, transformation, of our bodies into eternal life bodies, and being caught up to meet the Lord in the air, and taken to heaven. A sudden disappearance from this earth.

1Corinthians15:
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

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1Thessalonians 4:
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

JulieB67 · Jul 5, 2026

Douggg said:
and taken to heaven. A sudden disappearance from this earth.

Scripture?

keras · Jul 5, 2026

Douggg said:
keras, you are taking John 3:13 out of context.

In context, Jesus was saying that no man had ascended to heaven and come back to earth to tell them that dwell upon earth about heavenly things.

John 3:
12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

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The 24 elders in Revelation are human beings, but not in earthly bodies

Jesus' statement is simple; No one [human] can go to heaven. THAT is what He told us about heaven; we cannot go there; John 8:21b

Purely your opinion about the 24 Elders. A desperate - and failed attempt to support a false theory.

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