Are you a Christian Nationalist?

LizaMarie said:

I'm not a pre-tribulationist, but otherwise I very much agree with your post most especially the first sentence.

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Yes, no one can be sure of the rapture timing versus the tribulation and some believe in other models for the end times.

I asked google ai if most Christian nationalists were of the "latter rain" or kingdom now" persuasion for end time beliefs. Here is the reply.
"Yes, a significant segment of modern Christian nationalism is heavily influenced by, or directly aligns with, "Latter Rain" and "Kingdom Now" (or Dominionist) theology
. While not all Christian nationalists hold these specific charismatic views, these movements provide the theological framework for the "dominion" aspect of Christian nationalism—the belief that Christians should take control of government and societal institutions before the return of Jesus."

It is those beliefs that contrast with the "love of many will grow cold." Some these Christian nationalists think the tribulation period already occurred. That they will take dominion and then Jesus will return. I personally do not agree with that. I still hope for Christian influence in a national government, but believe that America or any nation or world system is not going to have Christian control, which is rather frightening because I am not sure what type of Christianity would be allowed under such a system. I prefer the free exercise of religion even if that means some beliefs are errant. To me that is the only way it insures my own religious freedom will not be encroached upon by others.
One of google ai cites Postmillennialism - Wikipedia

tobelieveinHim said:

As for inequality being at an all time high, I agree but we have raised an entire generation who gets a trophy for participating..

Singers and musicians have disproportionate amounts of support, and followings and it has nothing to do with their talent.. Many of them will lose followers if their twitter gets leaked, or anything else.
This band who was Orthodox Christian lost over 30,000k followers because the drummer's conservative views got leaked..
Meanwhile Taylor Swift is still sitting there with 80mill followers and her whole thing with Scooter Braun was all a lie, according to him..


We already tax the rich. In a free society, there's not going to be equality of finances ever.. I agree it's gotten to a point of irreparable but, I blame more than taxing the rich, which we already do...

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i agree and I do not think there should ever be equality in wealth. Most suggest America is based on the the equality of opportunity and not on the equality of outcome. But even equality of opportunity is hard to achieve. Public school districts and learning opportunities vary greatly. I think too that a one trillion dollar CEO pay package is absurd. These excesses seem to be ripe for change. It does not escape many that the last time the inequality was so high (1929) the Great Depression changed that.

Richard T said:

Given the mixed economic system of capitalism/socialism that has a pretty intense labor specialization, the economy has moved beyond free gleaning in the fields to requiring a safety net for some who have serious lack. Ideally the church would respond to take care of these needs, but that level of spending is far outside what Westerners give. So the government responds.

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Not quite. Tocqueville wrote about the associations in the US at the time that accomplished all sorts of things, and churches and Christian organizations still do things government does not. Post Helene, it was churches and church groups serving meals, and the Salvation Army provided meals as well. State and Federal government didn't.

The reason we have these social programs is that Christians considered it the right thing for government to do and supported it. Most of that was Christian compassion. Some of it was weaponized compassion. Either way, it wasn't government stepping in and filling the gap; it was Christians who thought this was something government should do. And now, with government providing assistance, the imperative to give does not seem to be as strong.

SavedByGrace3 said:

You can be done here all you want.
It most certainly is possible both medically and legally!
Medically, an abortion can be committed right up to the moment of birth. They can kill the baby as it is exiting the birth canal.
Legally:
As of early 2026, nine states and the District of Columbia have no specific gestational limits on when an abortion can be performed, allowing the procedure throughout all nine months of pregnancy: Alaska, Colorado, Maryland, Michigan, Minnesota, New Jersey, New Mexico, Oregon, and Vermont.

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AI Generated

Killing a baby during or after birth is illegal in every U.S. state. Federal law, specifically the Born-Alive Infants Protection Act, mandates that any infant born alive at any stage of development is a person with full legal rights.
The scenario you described—terminating a healthy, full-term pregnancy during delivery—is not a medical practice and would be prosecuted as homicide.

SavedByGrace3 said:

It is illegal, but it is medically possible. I was responding to your assertion that it is "impossible:"
"Listen to me, 9 months is full term! Abortion is impossible."
Of course, abortion is "possible."
Thankfully good men made it illegal... otherwise they most certainly would be doing it on a daily basis. The fact is, until Congress made laws against it, "partial birth abortion" was practiced regularly and legally up to 2003, before Bush and the Republicans outlawed it. So yes, it is medically possible, and was practiced up until 2003. According to CDC data from 2021, approximately 1% of abortions in the US (roughly 4,100 reported) occur at or after 21 weeks of gestation, though this excludes data from some states.

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Its not an abortion! Its murder.

SavedByGrace3 said:

Do you realize that as a Christian and:
1. If you are Anti-abortion and seek laws that promote that ideal...
or,
2. You are anti-LGBTQ, and want your values reflected in what schools teach...
or,
3. You are pro-family and pro-Christian and want those values reflected in our culture and law...
or.
4. You are anti-illegal immigration and are against un-documentented immigration...
or,
5 You believe that our nation was founded upon Christian values, and want those values to continue to be reflected in our culture...
Then you are considered to be a Christian Nationalist, and there are many people who equate you with the National Socialism (NAZIism) of WW2 germany.
Do you think this is a fair and equal assessment?

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I believe that real Christians are those who have let the Gospel of Jesus penetrate their mind, heart, and spirit, and that this is reflecte in their behavior, in their recognition that every human being is a temple of the Holy Spirit and a Child of God. In my experience, those who preach Christian nationalism and those who follow that philosophy are sorely lacking in their love and respect for other human beings--in their cities, states, country, and across the world. In my experience, they see Christianity as an opportunity to criticize and judge the morality of others and are quick to condemn immigrants, refugees, the hungry, the poor here and elsewhere--usually without ever having walked a mile--or even a few hundred feet--in their shoes.

So is it a fair assessment? Well, they're nationalists, willing to ignore and outsource the needs of our world--environmental, social, economic. Are they Christian? I don't see much evidence of that.

Fantine said:

In my experience, those who preach Christian nationalism and those who follow that philosophy are sorely lacking in their love and respect for other human beings--in their cities, states, country, and across the world. In my experience, they see Christianity as an opportunity to criticize and judge the morality of others and are quick to condemn immigrants, refugees, the hungry, the poor here and elsewhere--usually without ever having walked a mile--or even a few hundred feet--in their shoes.

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Well, I'm still not even entirely sure what a Christian nationalist is, but that seems like a pretty sweeping condemnation. If you define a Christian nationalist as the OP does, I would ask would the following be more to your liking?


1. If you are pro abortion and seek laws that promote that ideal...
or,
2. You are pro LGBTQ, and want your values reflected in what schools teach...
or,
3. You are anti-family and anti-Christian and want anti-family and anti-Christian values reflected in our culture and law...
or.
4. You are pro illegal immigration and are in favor of un-documented immigration...
or,
5 You believe that our nation was not founded upon Christian values, and do not want Christian values to be reflected in our culture...

I don't define Christian nationalism as the OP does.

I think that Christian nationalism is a political construct that tries to twist Christianity into a mold that "appears" to validate their ideas. #1. Progressives are not "pro" abortion. They strongly believe that if we acted on our Christian command to love our neighbor as ourselves that far fewer women would get abortions. There would still be abortions, just as there are still abortions when states like Tennessee try to pass legislation to enact the death penalty against women who had abortions. #2. Progressives are not "pro" LGBTQ. Once again, they don't feel that punishment is the answer. They recognize that each person faces different challenges in his/her life and they choose to gently companion that person with understanding and compassion. They also recognize that there are "disorders" with far greater moral consequences--greed, selfishness, judgmentalism--the kinds of disorders that are praised by many in Christian nationalsim. #3 Progressives are not anti-family and anti-Christian. Even secular humanists recognize that, in their construct, Jesus was a transcendent wisdom figure, and they hate the way his real gospel is minimized and distorted by Christian nationalists. They are pro-family--supporting ways to help families such as maternity/paternity leave, affordable day care, health care, quality education, compassionately dealing with hunger, homelessness, opposing war and genocide. We want to protect families from threats to their very survival--not protect them by LGBTQ restrictions, etc. #4 They support comprehensive immigration reform, opening legal channels for people and families who are almost universally hardworking and honest to go through background checks and a waiting period to become citizens.They are opposed to the cruel and inhumane treatment of immigrants, the broad sweep that acts on the premise "if there are 100 criminal immigrants in this town, and we round up all 1000 immigrants and throw them into jail, chances are we'll get the 100." #5 I believe that the drafters of our Constitution were heavily influenced by the Enlightenment, and, just as there are today, there were many Christian sects, all with different ideas--from William Penn's peace-loving Quakers to the strict rigidity of the Puritans. When the drafters came together, they had to reach a consensus. Tragically, they were not able to end slavery--and, since slavery is an intrinsic evil, if we were really founded as a "Christian" nation the Emancipation Proclamation would have been written in.
Don't try to pigeonhole those who disagree with you on what the "Christian" part of Christian nationalism means. Go to your Bible and examine your conscience,

SavedByGrace3 said:

The whole point is I know nobody who preaches "Christian nationalism." I see a lot of people who oppose Christianity trying to frame Evangelicals as Christian nationalists. As long as you stay in your church and do not speak up on issues of the day, they will leave you alone... but recent events in St Paul have shown us that even that is no longer a rule. You can go to your church on a Sunday Morning, and apparently, it is A-Okay to barge into the service, marching around, screaming at people, and proclaiming that they are not Christians. I hope we are not suggesting that "real" Christians should not speak up on current issues like abortion, LGBTQ, and other social issues. That is simply not so.

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I can understand why social justice activists would want to protest against a preacher who was in collusion with a hostile force tearing their city apart murdering innocents in cold blood.
What surprises me is that the preacher would have any followers.

SavedByGrace3 said:

1. If you are Anti-abortion and seek laws that promote that ideal...

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One can be anti-abortion because it infringes on the civil rights of a heretofore marginalized class of individuals, a.k.a. Fetal Rights. It is comparable to advocacy for Abolition in the 19th Century.

The OP's view only allows that anti-abortion = imposing Christian values on atheists.
That is a false dichotomy.

Fantine said:

Don't try to pigeonhole those who disagree with you on what the "Christian" part of Christian nationalism means. Go to your Bible and examine your conscience,

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I'm not trying to pigeonhole anyone, I'm just asking questions. As I said, I'm not even sure exactly what a Christian Nationalist is, I don't think I've ever heard anyone claim to be a Christian Nationalist, although I'm sure some are out there. Mostly I've heard it as a term that someone else is accusing them of being.

But since you seemed to think that a Christian Nationalist is something so bad to be, I just put up the list of opposites of what the OP said. I am not saying all Progressives, or leftists, or whatever, follow those beliefs. While I am fuzzy on exactly what a Christian Nationalist is, I agree with the OP in that if you believe as was posted, you are likely to get called a Christian Nationalist. Which seems to be one step away from calling you a Nazi.

iarwain said:

But since you seemed to think that a Christian Nationalist is something so bad to be,...

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The accused "Christian Nationalism," carried to its logical extreme, becomes a theocracy. And most mature Christians get why that would be a bad idea.

But it was our collective "Christian" consciences that motivated Abolitionism in the 19th Century. Secular politics took a little longer to see that such civil rights were more consistent with secular law as have been prescribed.

That is where we are on Fetal Rights, today.

Chattel slavery has been abolished!

Sabertooth said:

The accused "Christian Nationalism," carried to its logical extreme, becomes a theocracy. And most mature Christians get why that would be a bad idea.

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I would think a theocracy would be against the Constitution, for one thing. Because a theocracy would have to adopt its own specific set of religious beliefs, essentially its own state approved denomination. And while I have little doubt that the people who throw around the term "Christian Nationalists" probably don't like Christians, I get the impression it's the "Nationalist" part that is the big implied problem.

iarwain said:

...I get the impression it's the "Nationalist" part that is the big implied problem.

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What does "Nationalist" mean in that context?

Sabertooth said:

What does "Nationalist" mean in that context?

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Your guess is as good as mine, as I've said from the beginning I'm not even sure what a Christian Nationalist is. I guess they object to Christians who are also patriots. and they certainly don't want Christians to impose their values as law. Of course, if a Christian is going to vote, I don't see how they can just totally leave their values sitting on the side of the road while they go vote either.

iarwain said:

Your guess is as good as mine, as I've said from the beginning I'm not even sure what a Christian Nationalist is. I guess they object to Christians who are also patriots. and they certainly don't want Christians to impose their values as law. Of course, if a Christian is going to vote, I don't see how they can just totally leave their values sitting on the side of the road while they go vote either.

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As I have said, I believe we see "Christian nationalism" as partisan politics of the worst sort, promoting policies which are tearing apart our cities and terrorizing immigrants, most of whom are Christians and Catholics working hard and raising well-behaved children; policies which slash food, healthcare, and daycare benefits for the neediest among us, including millions of innocent children; policies which emphasize fossil fuels over energy that protects our planet from the worldwide tragedies caused by climate change; and much more.

The "Christian" part is designed to infer that these policies, widely condemned by Catholic and a number of Protestant denominations, are Biblical--as preached by preachers who have the worst, most self-serving reading comprehension skills of any people I've ever seen.

I do know people who call themselves Christian nationalists. They meet weekly in a group that purports to be the "guardians of the gates." They manipulate elections, run candidates, storm meetings with ridiculous demands--including giving a $15 million Biden grant back to the federal government because a part had to be used for the poor! Imagine! BTW, I've never heard them mention the unborn once, but they sure have a vendetta against Hispanic families and children.