Israel-Hamas Thread II

Benaiah468 said:

Unfortunate, a very distant word for someone who lost everything in the Shoah, does not even begin to convey the gravity of this fate for me. When the suffering of others is categorized in this way, we lack a common basis for conversation.

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Oh no.

Desk trauma said:

Oh no.

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Oh yes.

US President Trump's team is pushing ahead with the second phase of its dangerous Gaza plan. So far, apart from the release of the remaining hostages, both living and dead, this agreement has tended to hinder peace.

Trump's "peace council" is dangerous for Israel; no country has yet pledged money for the reconstruction of Gaza, and this will remain the case until Hamas is disarmed; no country except Israel is willing to disarm Hamas, which Israel did when Trump announced another of his completely unrealistic ceasefires for the Middle East!

The foreign ministers of Germany and France are calling for the resignation of Albanese, the UN Special Rapporteur for the Palestinian territories. I am pleased that Germany has joined them in this call. It would be a disastrous signal from the UN to allow this anti-Israel and anti-Jewish woman to remain in office.

Benaiah468 said:

Oh yes.

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Wait, thought there was no basis for conversation but you're still conversing?

Desk trauma said:

Wait, thought there was no basis for conversation but you're still conversing?

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That's right, there isn't one in this matter.

Benaiah468 said:

That's right, there isn't one in this matter.

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But you're still conversing.

Desk trauma said:

But you're still conversing.

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Should I take that as a question or an accusation?

Benaiah468 said:

Should I take that as a question or an accusation?

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You said we have no basis for conversation yet you persist in conversing with me.

Anyway back to the Israel being the bestist thing ever.

The pressure is enormous, but the UN Special Rapporteur for the "Palestinian" Territories, Albanese, who hates Israel, refuses to resign from the UN and strongly opposes calls for her departure. On Italian television channel La7, the Italian spoke of an unprecedented attack against a UN expert. And the UN Special Rapporteur added: "Everything that has been said about me is false and therefore defamatory."

The case is developing into a showdown that goes beyond the limits of Albanese's mandate.

In an interview with Norwegian public broadcaster NRK, Hamas spokesman Osama Hamdan stated that his organization had never attacked civilians, hospitals, schools, or mosques. He claimed that all allegations were lies. According to him, Israel bears responsibility for the events of Oct 7.

x.com

Israel came under criticism in 2016 when it arrested World Vision's Gaza director, Mohammed El Halabi, for collaborating with Hamas. European diplomats, United Nations representatives, and so-called “humanitarian” NGOs accused Israel of convicting an innocent man.

Three documents from the Hamas Ministry of Interior and National Security (MoINS) prove that Halabi, who served as director of World Vision's Gaza operations, was a Hamas activist and diverted aid funds to the terrorist organization.

x.com

Trump announces billions in funding and international force for Gaza.

In addition, concrete steps for deploying an internationally mandated stabilization force are to be presented. This was confirmed by two high-ranking US government officials.

The meeting is scheduled for Feb 19 in Washington. Delegations from at least 20 countries are expected to attend, including several heads of state and government. The establishment of the Board of Peace was signed in Davos in Jan and supported by a resolution of the United Nations Security Council. The goal is the political and economic reorganization of Gaza after the war.

President Trump will make the amounts pledged so far public.

In addition to Israel, regional players such as Turkey, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, and Qatar, as well as countries from Southeast Asia, are participating in the committee. Traditional Western allies of the US, on the other hand, are more cautious.

According to the US government, the upcoming meeting will focus exclusively on Gaza.

From Israel's perspective, however, one key condition remains unchanged: lasting stabilization in Gaza is only possible if Hamas is disarmed.

The security situation remains sensitive. A fragile ceasefire has been established, hostages have been released, and Israel has freed imprisoned Palestinians. The Rafah border crossing has been reopened to civilian traffic. However, the issue of disarming Hamas remains unresolved. According to the US plan, Hamas members who lay down their weapons and commit to peaceful coexistence will be granted amnesty. Fighters who want to leave Gaza could depart under international supervision.

Israel has made it clear that a complete withdrawal of the army and a comprehensive release of reconstruction funds can only take place once Hamas' military infrastructure has been dismantled. This stance remains a source of tension between Jerusalem and Washington, which is pushing for rapid implementation of the second phase of the plan.

Another focus of the meeting will be the planned ISF. Several countries have signaled their willingness to provide several thousand soldiers. The force is to be stationed in Gaza in the coming months and will secure the transition to a new civilian administration.

In addition to financial commitments and military stabilization, reports from the newly appointed NCAG will also be presented at the meeting. This committee is tasked with taking over civil administration from Hamas and establishing initial organizational structures.

Several European governments are distancing themselves from Francesca Albanese. Italy, Austria, and France have made their concerns public in an unusually clear manner.


Fake landmark Francesca Albanese

Italy's Deputy Prime Minister Antonio Tajani made it clear that Albanese's statements did not reflect the position of the Italian government and were inappropriate for a representative of the United Nations. Austria's Foreign Minister Beate Meinl-Reisinger spoke of language that undermined the necessary impartiality. France announced that it would officially raise the issue at the United Nations Human Rights Council.

The criticism is not limited to a single statement. In several European capitals, Albanese has long been accused of systematically portraying Israel in a way that no longer distinguishes between political analysis and moral accusation. Terms such as “common enemy of humanity” are understood as collective attributions, not as precise legal assessments.

This development is of particular significance for Israel. Jerusalem has been criticizing structural bias in the Human Rights Council for years. The fact that European democracies are now also openly questioning the suitability of an elected representative shifts the balance of power within the debate.

Bradskii said:

I often struggle to remind myself that I'm on a Christian forum.

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Perhaps there are atheist forums that would be more suitable?

Oompa Loompa said:

Perhaps there are atheist forums that would be more suitable?

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I think I'd find a greater empathy. More compassion. More humanity. More...humility.

Back in the day, when someone did something untoward, something that showed a lack of compassion, my old mum used to say 'Well, that wasn't very Christian'. I think she'd be horrified at some of the things she'd read here.

In the heart of NY, the PA is confronted head-on: a huge billboard denounces the continued payments to terrorist families. The timing is politically explosive, coming shortly after the publication of a new draft constitution.

The image shows Mahmoud Abbas, President of the PA and Chairman of the PLO. The central message reads: "PA still pays for killing Jews END PAY FOR SLAY."

The move coincides with the publication of a new draft constitution for a future "Palestinian" state. Among other things, this draft stipulates that the state should guarantee "protection and care" for the families of "martyrs, wounded and prisoners." It also refers to comprehensive support for the preservation of their "national dignity."

From an Israeli perspective, this appears to be an institutional codification of these payments to terrorists. Abbas had already declared by decree in Feb 2025 that he would end such payments. Critics doubt, however, that this announcement has been fully implemented in practice.

Furthermore, the draft makes no explicit mention of Jewish historical or religious connections to Jerusalem and defines "Palestine" as "part of the Arab homeland." These passages are seen in Israel as a political signal that does not bring reconciliation any closer.

The new message against the PA shifts the focus from Hamas to the leadership in Ramallah. While international attention is often directed toward Gaza and military developments, the billboard draws attention to financial and political structures in Judea and Samaria.

In the heart of Manhattan, an internal "Palestinian" financial system is becoming a globally visible point of contention. The debate over responsibility, incentives, and terrorist financing is thus not only a regional issue, but an international one.

In Cairo, Hamas speaks of “demilitarization.” But what sounds like disarmament on paper turns out to be a tactical maneuver: handing over heavy weapons, keeping light ones, securing power. For Israel, it is clear that what is really being negotiated here is not peace, but the continuation of terror.

The starting point alone makes it clear: Hamas is not seeking a genuine break with violence, but rather a way to preserve it politically and organizationally.

According to the source, Hamas intends to present Egyptian mediators with several models for its future military role in the Gaza Strip. One of these envisages “laying down” all weapons until Israeli forces have completely withdrawn from the Gaza Strip. Another, particularly controversial model goes even further: Hamas would be prepared to hand over heavy weapons such as rockets and remaining long-range weapons, as well as maps of its extensive tunnel system. In return, however, it demands the right to keep light weapons such as rifles.

From Israel's perspective, this proposal is nothing more than semantic deception. A terrorist organization that retains armed fighters remains an armed terrorist organization. Experience from Gaza, Lebanon, and other conflicts shows that light weapons are sufficient to exercise power, intimidate opponents, and rearm at any time. Demilitarization worthy of the name knows no armed exceptions.

The centerpiece of US President Donald Trump's plan for Gaza is the creation of the NCAG, a technocratic body that will take over civil administration and oversee the disarmament of armed groups. This is precisely where Hamas' resistance comes in.

According to the report, Hamas not only wants to influence the work of the NCAG, but is also openly demanding the integration of its own fighters into the future administration of Gaza. This would mean that the very organization that turned the Gaza Strip into a terrorist stronghold would once again become part of the power structure. The risk is obvious: formal disarmament while retaining de facto control.

This is particularly evident in the rejection of Sami Nasman, who is to be responsible for security issues under the NCAG. Nasman, a former general in the PA from Gaza, is considered an opponent of Hamas. From the terrorist organization's point of view, his appointment is “provocative” and could trigger “retaliatory reactions.” Translated, this means that he stands in the way of Hamas.

The fact that Hamas is willing to surrender heavy weapons while retaining light ones follows a familiar pattern. Rockets and tunnels are difficult to justify internationally and easy to brand as instruments of war. Armed fighters with guns, on the other hand, can be relabeled as “local security forces” or “resistance.” It is precisely this gray area that Hamas is now trying to exploit.

For Israel, this is a red line. Every armed Hamas fighter represents a continuing threat to Israeli civilians and an invitation to the next escalation.

For Israel, the question is not how much terror is acceptable, but whether terror is acceptable at all. Demilitarization that leaves Hamas armed and secures its political influence would not be a step toward stability, but a recipe for the next war.

The talks in Cairo show one thing above all: Hamas is willing to talk about form, not substance. It wants to buy time, simulate international acceptance, and save its power base. Israel knows this game. And that is precisely why any agreement will have to be measured by whether it actually ends terror or merely pours it into a new mold.

Hoping one’s own side is a bit less genocidal than “the other side” is a rather low bar to set for oneself.

Pommer said:

Hoping one’s own side is a bit less genocidal than “the other side” is a rather low bar to set for oneself.

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The misuse of the term genocide carries the risk that we will ultimately become blind to genuine genocides when they occur.