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At Pentagon Christmas Service, Franklin Graham Praises ‘God of War’ “We know that God loves. But did you know that God also hates?"

essentialsaltes

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rjs330

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The Apostles, at every opportunity where they could retaliate with violence chose not to.

The Apostles suffered for Christ. Christ suffered for us to save us. He fave his life for all of us. He wasnt murdered on the road to Damascus because someone wanted his cloak.

Big difference.
Early Christian leaders when speaking to those in power poignantly say: We aren't arming ourselves against you, none of us have taken up arms to hurt you, when you hate us we instead choose to love you, when you curse us we choose to bless you, we forgive you, we pray for you, we show you kindness even as you threaten to kill us and hurt our friends and families. Not even the anti-Christian powers of the ancient world could argue against that.

Once again its based upon persecution for our faith. No one is talking about tgat. We are talking about some criminal breaking into our homes to race our daughters and murder our sons for perversion and homicidal sake. There us no way that you are showing love for your family and neighbor if you fail to act and protect them. You are putting the life of the evil doer ahead of them. As I have said before if someone truly believes in their heart that being a pacifist to the point of letting someone murder rape, or torture an innocent is what God wants of them, then okay. That is between them and God. But please do not try and push that on another that believes the command to love others means they should protect others from the attacks of the evil doer.
At times the Christian refusal to participate in acts of violence were actually used as part of the accusations against them.

I have no issues with a conscientious objector. Once again that is their own conscience.
 
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Robban

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Typical Christmas sermon, I suppose.

Speaking at a “Christmas Worship Service” at the Pentagon on Wednesday (Dec. 17), evangelist Franklin Graham celebrated that God is not just a God of love but also of hate and war.

“We know that God loves. But did you know that God also hates? Do you know that God also is a God of war? Many people don’t want to think about that, or forget that,” he declared as he stood on stage near two Christmas trees with a nativity scene and a Hanukkah Menorah in front of them.

Graham briefly recounted a story in Exodus 17, where Joshua led the ancient Israelites in battle against the Amalekites as Moses stood on a mountain holding up his arms. Graham said that not only did they win the battle, but God remembered how the Amalekites had attacked the Israelites. So Graham then turned to 1 Samuel 15, where the prophet Samuel told King Saul to kill all the Amalekites.

"Don’t spare them, but kill them, both man and woman, infant, nursing child, ox, sheep, camel, and donkey.’ So Samuel gave the instructions for the mission. Now, people will say, ‘But, Franklin, that is so hard; that’s not the God I believe in.’ Well, you had better believe in him.”

As Graham notes, some Christians find the story of the genocide of the Amalekites a little difficult to wrestle with; but it seems the new breed of masculine Christianity that has arisen has elevated the story, proclaiming it openly as an example for the troops.

The Amalekites have long since been dispersed but their spirit is alive and well,

"Remember what Amalek did to you on your way out of Egypt" applies today just as much as then.

What did Amalekites do, they attacked those who were lagging behind, elderly, weak.

The spirit of Amalek is skepticism, the skeptic more than any other challenger,

wears out the believer and causes him to despair.
 
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essentialsaltes

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The Amalekites have long since been dispersed but their spirit is alive and well,
The spirit of Amalek is skepticism, the skeptic more than any other challenger,
Well, that's not threatening at all.
 
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Hans Blaster

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The Amalekites have long since been dispersed but their spirit is alive and well,
If they were even real.
"Remember what Amalek did to you on your way out of Egypt" applies today just as much as then.
Apparently attacked them when the Israelites passed through their territory. It's hard to tell from the text.
What did Amalekites do, they attacked those who were lagging behind, elderly, weak.
Where does the text say that?
The spirit of Amalek is skepticism, the skeptic more than any other challenger,

wears out the believer and causes him to despair.
Well that's lovely. Are you so bothered that we don't care for your book?
 
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Robban

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If they were even real.

Apparently attacked them when the Israelites passed through their territory. It's hard to tell from the text.

Where does the text say that?

Well that's lovely. Are you so bothered that we don't care for your book?

Deuteronomy 25:17-18
 
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BCP1928

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If they were even real.

Apparently attacked them when the Israelites passed through their territory. It's hard to tell from the text.

Where does the text say that?

Well that's lovely. Are you so bothered that we don't care for your book?
It's important that we care for the book! Otherwise how would we know that killing those two smugglers clinging to the wreckage of their boat was a righteous act?
 
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camille70

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According to what I looked up.

Here’s the background on why Pete Hegseth was able to hold a voluntary prayer event at the Pentagon and what legal/constitutional issues people are debating:

Why the event happened

  1. He’s the Secretary of Defense — As a senior Cabinet official, Hegseth has authority over activities in the Department of Defense and can organize voluntary events in Pentagon spaces. He chose to host a Christian prayer and worship service in the Pentagon auditorium and broadcast it internally, and said it would be a recurring monthly event. AOL
  2. Attendance was framed as “voluntary” — Pentagon officials have repeatedly said that the prayer service is voluntary and that no one is required to attend. That’s the key argument used to justify why the event is allowed: people are free not to participate. Spokesman-Review+1
  3. Religious services for service members already exist — The Pentagon already provides space for worship (chapel services, chaplain-led events) for many faiths as part of accommodating religious practice. Supporters say Hegseth’s gathering was just another voluntary religious option. Washington Examiner

Why some people argue it’s legally permissible

  • Voluntary participation matters legally: Under current U.S. law, government employees and military personnel may choose to take part in religious activities on federal property as long as participation isn’t coerced. Courts have generally upheld voluntary prayer or worship gatherings when they don’t impose government-mandated participation.
  • Tradition argument: Hegseth and supporters argue that prayer and appeals to religion have long been part of American military tradition (e.g., prayers led by chaplains) and that voluntary events continue that tradition. Washington Examiner

I don't see anyone being coerced so that's moot. In what I posted earlier it says at events like graduations or in classrooms. Meaning during event or in a classroom the principal can't say "I invite you all to pray" - as in right then and there. That's a big difference from a prayer meeting being held in a certain room two weeks from now if anyone wants to show up for it. In other words, in the latter situation, no one is being put on the spot.

So I'm still not seeing anything to be upset or worried over. But this is really about wanting to take down Hegseth, isn't it?

This one event didn't happen in a vacuum. The issue with Hegseth is that he does not have respect for anyone who believes differently than him. It's part of a pattern because he wants Christian faith to dominate. (IMO this will eventually lead to a purge of non Christians or at the least, they become targeted in some way.)

He's welcome to personally believe that all other faiths and spiritual practices are trash, but its not his place to force his beliefs on others, require that the men under him comply with his vision of religion or make policy to promote his faith and diminish others.



_______


Hegseth said the Pentagon is working on a new program, which could curtail what qualifies as a faith or belief recognized in the military.

_______


The announcement comes amid a broader dispute after the Army canceled a sweeping number of on-base religious education coordinators’ chapel contracts

_______




Archbishop Timothy Broglio of the Archdiocese of Military Services (AMS) issued an Oct. 17 letter denouncing the Army’s cancellation of a sweeping number of on-base religious education coordinators’ chapel contracts as an intolerable infringement of free exercise of religion for Catholics in the United States Army.

“In canceling these contracts, the Army over-burdens Catholic chaplains, harms chapel communities, and impedes the constitutional guarantee of the free exercise of religion especially for Catholics,” Archbishop Broglio wrote in a letter to the faithful in the AMS. “The cancellation of chapel contracts may appear to be a neutral elimination of chapel support which itself affects the free exercise of religion for all soldiers.”

“However, this action disproportionately harms Catholics,” he continued, “first, because Catholic chaplains are already so low density and in such high demand, and second because the Catholic faith requires continuing religious education and sacramental preparation that can only be accomplished through competent support.”
 
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Servus

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This one event didn't happen in a vacuum. The issue with Hegseth is that he does not have respect for anyone who believes differently than him. It's part of a pattern because he wants Christian faith to dominate. (IMO this will eventually lead to a purge of non Christians or at the least, they become targeted in some way.)

He's welcome to personally believe that all other faiths and spiritual practices are trash, but its not his place to force his beliefs on others, require that the men under him comply with his vision of religion or make policy to promote his faith and diminish others.



_______


Hegseth said the Pentagon is working on a new program, which could curtail what qualifies as a faith or belief recognized in the military.

_______


The announcement comes amid a broader dispute after the Army canceled a sweeping number of on-base religious education coordinators’ chapel contracts

_______




Archbishop Timothy Broglio of the Archdiocese of Military Services (AMS) issued an Oct. 17 letter denouncing the Army’s cancellation of a sweeping number of on-base religious education coordinators’ chapel contracts as an intolerable infringement of free exercise of religion for Catholics in the United States Army.

“In canceling these contracts, the Army over-burdens Catholic chaplains, harms chapel communities, and impedes the constitutional guarantee of the free exercise of religion especially for Catholics,” Archbishop Broglio wrote in a letter to the faithful in the AMS. “The cancellation of chapel contracts may appear to be a neutral elimination of chapel support which itself affects the free exercise of religion for all soldiers.”

“However, this action disproportionately harms Catholics,” he continued, “first, because Catholic chaplains are already so low density and in such high demand, and second because the Catholic faith requires continuing religious education and sacramental preparation that can only be accomplished through competent support.”
The whole point of Christianity is for it to flourish and be dominant over secularism, humanism, and false religion. That's what we're supposed to be striving for. That all surrender themselves to the Lordship of Christ. That every knee shall bend and every tongue proclaim that Jesus Christ is Lord.
 
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BCP1928

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The whole point of Christianity is for it to flourish and be dominant over secularism, humanism, and false religion. That's what we're supposed to be striving for. That all surrender themselves to the Lordship of Christ. That every knee shall bend and every tongue proclaim that Jesus Christ is Lord.
That might be OK, depending on who gets to decide what constitutes "secularism, humanism, and false religion."
 
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essentialsaltes

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The whole point of Christianity is for it to flourish and be dominant over secularism, humanism, and false religion. That's what we're supposed to be striving for. That all surrender themselves to the Lordship of Christ. That every knee shall bend and every tongue proclaim that Jesus Christ is Lord.
The whole point of the Constitution is to prevent the government from striving to do any of that.
 
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camille70

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The whole point of Christianity is for it to flourish and be dominant over secularism, humanism, and false religion. That's what we're supposed to be striving for. That all surrender themselves to the Lordship of Christ. That every knee shall bend and every tongue proclaim that Jesus Christ is Lord.

The whole point of Christianity is to provide salvation and reconcile man with God.

The United States government is not a theocracy. It should not be in the position of promoting or denouncing any religion. The government is of the people, by the people, for the people, not just Christian people.
 
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Servus

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The whole point of the Constitution is to prevent the government from striving to do any of that.
Christians are supposed to put the will of God above all else.
 
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Servus

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The whole point of Christianity is to provide salvation and reconcile man with God.

The United States government is not a theocracy. It should not be in the position of promoting or denouncing any religion. The government is of the people, by the people, for the people, not just Christian people.
Christ should be at the center of and the foundation of all. Christians should rejoice at politicians that are not ashamed of the Gospel and not afraid to proclaim that Jesus is Lord.
 
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essentialsaltes

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Christians are supposed to put the will of God above all else.
Christians who feel that way should stay out of public office, where they will have to swear to "bear true faith and allegiance" to the Constitution. Wouldn't want them to forswear themselves.
 
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Christians who feel that way should stay out of public office, where they will have to swear to "bear true faith and allegiance" to the Constitution. Wouldn't want them to forswear themselves.
Christ superceseds the Constitution. But really all this fuss is over politicians simply acknowledging Christ.

Let me know when the US theocracy actually starts taking form. I mean for real.
 
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essentialsaltes

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Christ superceseds the Constitution. But really all this fuss is over politicians simply acknowledging Christ.
No the fuss is about Christian nationalists who think Christ supersedes the Constitution. Making the fundamental law of the United States subordinate to religion. That's what we keep hearing is the danger of sharia in the US.
 
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