Why you can't debate unbelievers into the Kingdom of God

I’ve never understood the logic behind arguing about the Lord or how pressure reveals His heart for us and it comes across otherwise. During my time in missionary prep I encountered people with that mindset. Winning souls was akin to a sport and they had similar qualities to those rooting for a team. There was little said about prayer in relation to their discourse. Every conversation was a slam dunk or treated as such.

But one day I asked a question about their methods and wanted to know how they were certain He wanted them to say the things they did and they never asked. We’re all at different points and few come to faith immediately. It’s usually a process and knowing where they are makes a difference. What helps me in my ministry to the lost is remembering how I felt. I don’t argue or debate and listen more than I talk and provide a human touch.

I’ve found it more effective to share my experiences with the Lord without ulterior motives. Only He can soften hearts. Whether I’m the one who helps them cross the finish line or not. We play a part through our presence and that’s enough. I don’t have to be “the one.“

~bella

Michie said:

A great piece on how we go about conducting ourselves as Christians.
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In an age addicted to argument, Christians have become remarkably good at talking — and remarkably poor at listening. Scroll through social media or walk past a campus debate table, and you’ll see believers armed with microphones, cameras, and carefully memorized rebuttals. The object is not conversion but conquest. The applause line has replaced the altar call.

Somewhere along the way, we began to confuse winning debates with winning souls. Yet Scripture presents a very different picture of how truth changes hearts. The Gospel was never designed to be wielded like a sword in a duel of intellects; it was meant to be offered like bread to the hungry.

The problem with the debate mindset

Apologetics has its place. Reasoned defense of the faith can clarify misunderstandings and expose falsehoods. But when the believer’s primary instinct is to defeat rather than to disciple, something sacred is lost. Too many of today’s “discussions” look more like verbal brawls—complete with highlight reels and hashtags — than like Gospel witness.

Paul warned Timothy, “Have nothing to do with foolish, ignorant controversies; you know that they breed quarrels. And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness” (2 Tim. 2:23–25). Those words are as necessary in the digital age as they were in the first century. Debate can inform minds, but only the Spirit can transform hearts.

Why argument alone fails

Continued below.

Why you can't debate unbelievers into the Kingdom of God

In an age addicted to argument, Christians have become remarkably good at talking

www.christianpost.com

Click to expand...

I've never tried to argue a non-believer "into the Kingdom" with apologetics. But I will defend my beliefs to a certain degree as we're encouraged by Scripture to do (ala 1 Peter 3:15) in line with my main intention of encouraging other people, no matter who they are, to find Christ as their Lord and Savior.

However, existentially speaking, and as a critical Philosophy, I'm not going to put up with ridiculous misrepresentations of the Christian faith or with ill-reasoned evaluations of my own Christian understanding, no matter what quadrant of humanity those evaluations may come from.

Michie said:

A great piece on how we go about conducting ourselves as Christians.
***************
In an age addicted to argument, Christians have become remarkably good at talking — and remarkably poor at listening. Scroll through social media or walk past a campus debate table, and you’ll see believers armed with microphones, cameras, and carefully memorized rebuttals. The object is not conversion but conquest. The applause line has replaced the altar call.

Somewhere along the way, we began to confuse winning debates with winning souls. Yet Scripture presents a very different picture of how truth changes hearts. The Gospel was never designed to be wielded like a sword in a duel of intellects; it was meant to be offered like bread to the hungry.

The problem with the debate mindset

Apologetics has its place. Reasoned defense of the faith can clarify misunderstandings and expose falsehoods. But when the believer’s primary instinct is to defeat rather than to disciple, something sacred is lost. Too many of today’s “discussions” look more like verbal brawls—complete with highlight reels and hashtags — than like Gospel witness.

Paul warned Timothy, “Have nothing to do with foolish, ignorant controversies; you know that they breed quarrels. And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness” (2 Tim. 2:23–25). Those words are as necessary in the digital age as they were in the first century. Debate can inform minds, but only the Spirit can transform hearts.

Why argument alone fails

Continued below.

Why you can't debate unbelievers into the Kingdom of God

In an age addicted to argument, Christians have become remarkably good at talking

www.christianpost.com

Click to expand...

Another thing I've noticed, too, is that there seem to be a number of Christians who think it's their God-given mandate to coral every other Christian into conformity with the specific teachings of their favored denomination, and you can't argue them into ceasing.

bèlla said:

I’ve never understood the logic behind arguing about the Lord or how pressure reveals His heart for us and it comes across otherwise. During my time in missionary prep I encountered people with that mindset. Winning souls was akin to a sport and they had similar qualities to those rooting for a team. There was little said about prayer in relation to their discourse. Every conversation was a slam dunk or treated as such.

But one day I asked a question about their methods and wanted to know how they were certain He wanted them to say the things they did and they never asked. We’re all at different points and few come to faith immediately. It’s usually a process and knowing where they are makes a difference. What helps me in my ministry to the lost is remembering how I felt. I don’t argue or debate and listen more than I talk and provide a human touch.

I’ve found it more effective to share my experiences with the Lord without ulterior motives. Only He can soften hearts. Whether I’m the one who helps them cross the finish line or not. We play a part through our presence and that’s enough. I don’t have to be “the one.“

~bella

Click to expand...

"Slam dunk" analogies is one of the clearest evidences of the wrong attitude toward evangelism. Instead of seeing it as a competition, we need to see it as a sincere attempt to love other people, and lead them TO Love... which ultimately is God. Such a mindset has virtually nothing to do with the competitive, point-scoring attitude we see in so much religion nowadays. And it's important that believers recognize this to avoid falling into the same trap!

2PhiloVoid said:

Another thing I've noticed, too, is that there seem to be a number of Christians who think it's their God-given mandate to coral every other Christian into conformity with the specific teachings of their favored denomination, and you can't argue them into ceasing.

Click to expand...

Denominationalism is one of the biggest diseases of modern Christianity, and a limiting factor for its growth, I would argue. The facts are, there are far more than enough "Christian" churches around in the world today. We don't need more sermons; we need more samples. And until more believers can actually start showing with their lives that they believe what they claim to, the world is going to by and large remain indifferent.

joechristianwarrior said:

Denominationalism is one of the biggest diseases of modern Christianity, and a limiting factor for its growth, I would argue. The facts are, there are far more than enough "Christian" churches around in the world today. We don't need more sermons; we need more samples. And until more believers can actually start showing with their lives that they believe what they claim to, the world is going to by and large remain indifferent.

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That's a good point. It's just as important for us to make the effort to live righteously as it is for us to attempt to 'be right' doctrinally.

Debate is a good "front" tool for presenting the word. People are saved by faith. Faith comes by revelation, and revelation comes by Christ speaking to a heart. So I keep delivering the word repeatedly, not really caring what they have to say. Every response is just another opportunity to present the word. The word is all that matters. The word is the only thing that works.

From the article: "Jesus modeled that perfectly. He could dismantle the Pharisees’ logic with a single question, yet with sinners, He was tender."

On CF, we also have two audiences. In the "Christians Only" forum, the latter attitude and disposition obtains. In the open forums, as the Church Militant, the former attitude and dispositions obtains in opposing the unbelievers who "prowl about the world seeking the ruin of souls". Many more read than post and some readers may be questioning their faith.

Because the way God has setup His way to Eternal Life and eventually the Kingdom of God (the eternal state).

Is based off of evidence and belief of the evidence. A believer simply can not force another person to believe something they do not perceive is true. They can present what The Bible states, but the person will have to weigh what The Bible states and come to believe or stay in unbelief.

Because faith comes by hearing and hearing by a word spoken by Christ.
Faith does not come by being convinced in your mind. Debating can be the vehicle of the Word. You can suspend logic and allow your mind to mentally agree with what the gospel says, but that is not faith. Faith is of the heart, not the mind.

My mindset when debating non-believers isn't to argue them into the kingdom, but to expose the paucity that their position entails. To strip down the false promises of knowledge offered by the secular world, or the false promises of finding good-without-God, or whatever other false promise the atheist is leaning on. Though that is in part because my view is we must first come to the point where we have no where else to turn before we truly begin to accept Christ...or at least be brought to a crisis point in order to be receptive of the gospel.

“No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day" (John 6:44)

Michie said:

A great piece on how we go about conducting ourselves as Christians.
***************
In an age addicted to argument, Christians have become remarkably good at talking — and remarkably poor at listening. Scroll through social media or walk past a campus debate table, and you’ll see believers armed with microphones, cameras, and carefully memorized rebuttals. The object is not conversion but conquest. The applause line has replaced the altar call.

Click to expand...

Or 'Likes'. As opposed to at least on campus persuit of truth, fact and critical thinking. Being open to different ideas. Which speaks more about the 'fashion of debating' rather than the art or epistemics of debating.

Michie said:

Somewhere along the way, we began to confuse winning debates with winning souls. Yet Scripture presents a very different picture of how truth changes hearts. The Gospel was never designed to be wielded like a sword in a duel of intellects; it was meant to be offered like bread to the hungry.

Click to expand...

This is a good point. I think the Christian message or Good News has been lost in the culture war. There are many identifying groups in the culture war. So when Christians participate in that social realm of the culture war they become another group within that culture war.

Rather than something different. That is not the same or takes the same position and approach. Otherwise its a worldly approach. Fighting within the same parameters of what the world is immersed in.

Whereas I think Christs church and Christians were always seperate from this. The seperation of church and State which really is good for Christianity in some ways. It keeps it out of politics and the public square. I think the early church was insula to the wider goings on in secular society. Meeting in secret, and creating a seperate community within the wider society.

Then they could go into the world and spread the message. Paul often did stop and debate. But I think of the truth of Christ and also to the Jews who needed explaining to lol. Sometimes he professed a new way which was revolutionary. Which in todays world if we truely followed Christ it is revolutionary.

Michie said:

The problem with the debate mindset

Apologetics has its place. Reasoned defense of the faith can clarify misunderstandings and expose falsehoods. But when the believer’s primary instinct is to defeat rather than to disciple, something sacred is lost. Too many of today’s “discussions” look more like verbal brawls—complete with highlight reels and hashtags — than like Gospel witness.

Click to expand...

I think social media has a lot to do with people voicing their opinion more. Its easier behind a keyboard. But I also think we live in a postmodern era where thought has progressed into being skeptical about everything. As opposed to the past where we were more sure or united in mind on certain truths and worldviews.

Now its a relative world where theres all sorts of claims and counter claims and even objective science is questioned as just one way of seeing the world and truth. Personal experiences outweight reality, fake news and morality can be subjective. We can rationalise the bible to fit what we believe is truth. Todays truth is more true than yesterdays truth.

No wonder its confusing and hard to know whats going on or to be easily fooled even as Christians.

Therefore I think something comepletly different is needed. Perhaps as radical as saying nothing at all on these issues and just like Christs example. Then the little words you may say have so much more worth. Because we have lived the example we are arguing over.

I noticed when reading the early church Fathers and Christians that it seemed the disposition of quietness and humility was well respected as a Christian and leadership quality. The Bishops said little and quietly examples Christ even to their executions for Christ. This is powerful.

Michie said:

Paul warned Timothy, “Have nothing to do with foolish, ignorant controversies; you know that they breed quarrels. And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness” (2 Tim. 2:23–25). Those words are as necessary in the digital age as they were in the first century. Debate can inform minds, but only the Spirit can transform hearts.

Click to expand...

Peter mentions that we must obey rulers and be a good obedient example. He mentions even that Christian slaves should be good and obedient and show a Christlike example even if the master is unjust sometimes. Even as Christians to be obedient even if it seems unjust and not fight fire with fire.

Because just the humble and obedient example can expose the evil and turn unjust people towards God without a word spoken.

Michie said:

Why argument alone fails

Continued below.

Why you can't debate unbelievers into the Kingdom of God

In an age addicted to argument, Christians have become remarkably good at talking

www.christianpost.com

Click to expand...

Just explain to them the truth in Genesis 1 & they'll soon come round.

I always thought just explaining how something comes from nothing. Or life from no life. Whenever you ask most people what happens after death many say some sort of other dimension. We intuitively know there is more to life than what we see.

The resistance does not come in the arena of logic and the mind. It comes in the arena of the heart. People do not want to forsake godless ways. They love the free sex, abortion as a solution, hating parents, and an endless stream of evil and darkness. They use mental arguments as excuses to continue their sinfulness and rebellion. You are not going to beat them in the mind, which is their stronghold. You can only overcome this barrier with the Word. Present them with the scriptures about sin, repentance, faith, and surrender. Allowing them to continue in their stronghold will establish them, not dislodge them.

stevevw said:

This is a good point. I think the Christian message or Good News has been lost in the culture war. There are many identifying groups in the culture war. So when Christians participate in that social realm of the culture war they become another group within that culture war.

Click to expand...

That is often true. The church is made up of people from all social backgrounds, all ages, together as one, a new family in Christ. We had some what of a culture war in this country in the 90s, people were more or less expected to be middle class tories to be Christians and that this would bring revival. Instead the number of people attending churches fell off a cliff, as people were pushed into being something they could not be. Someone from a single parent family cannot be a middle class tory anymore than fly to the moon. It can be good for a church to speak out on clear Biblical distinctives, like speaking against abortion, or greed, but aligning to a political movement is to step into a morass.

The Kingdom of God is not of this world as Jesus himself said.

God Bless You