The Return of My Ex Nihilo Challenge

jacks · Apr 17, 2025

What physical evidence would convince you this happened?

Reading this other current Thread.
Scientists find strongest evidence yet of life on an alien planet; Webb sees 3-sigma evidence for dimethyl sulfide

The physical evidence of "God creates Earth ex nihilo" that convinces some people, might be something as mundane as a new dating method or the discovery of an amino acid that couldn't possibly have evolved over long periods of time. If science is really ready and willing to reevaluate itself on new evidence, then perhaps something "scientific" that we don't yet know, may come along and change everyone's perceptions. It wouldn't have to be dramatic, non contraversial or even easily understood. Just enough to raise doubt.

AV1611VET · Apr 17, 2025

jacks said:
What physical evidence would convince you this happened?

Reading this other current Thread.
Scientists find strongest evidence yet of life on an alien planet; Webb sees 3-sigma evidence for dimethyl sulfide

The physical evidence of "God creates Earth ex nihilo" that convinces some people, might be something as mundane as a new dating method or the discovery of an amino acid that couldn't possibly have evolved over long periods of time. If science is really ready and willing to reevaluate itself on new evidence, then perhaps something "scientific" that we don't yet know, may come along and change everyone's perceptions. It wouldn't have to be dramatic, non contraversial or even easily understood. Just enough to raise doubt.

I understand that.

Discovering an amino acid that couldn't possibly have evolved is one thing.

But the earth -- now there's something that's going to be tough to explain!

According to AI Overview:

The Earth's mass is approximately 5.9722 x 10²⁴ kilograms.

An amino acid is nothing compared to that.

jacks · Apr 17, 2025

This might not be directly related to your challenge, but...

Amino acid was just something I pulled out of the hat. (I'm not even sure what they are...). What I meant to say was that something obscure or mundane may turn out to be a catalyst for a new way of viewing the universe and it's origins. . The other thread mentions "3-sigma evidence for dimethyl sulfide", which is Greek to me, but seems to something only related to biological activities. So the scientific community is now considering that as possible evidence of extra terrestrial life. I was just pointing out that it doesn't take much to tip the scales as far as theories go. I believe all methods of inquiry followed to their extreme eventually lead to God. Where else is there to go?

AV1611VET · Apr 17, 2025

jacks said:
This might not be directly related to your challenge, but...

Amino acid was just something I pulled out of the hat. (I'm not even sure what they are...). What I meant to say was that something obscure or mundane may turn out to be a catalyst for a new way of viewing the universe and it's origins. . The other thread mentions "3-sigma evidence for dimethyl sulfide", which is Greek to me, but seems to something only related to biological activities. So the scientific community is now considering that as possible evidence of extra terrestrial life. I was just pointing out that it doesn't take much to tip the scales as far as theories go. I believe all methods of inquiry followed to their extreme eventually lead to God. Where else is there to go?

Good point, jacks!

An amino acid suddenly showing up on radar that couldn't be explained would certainly send the academic world back to the drawing board, wouldn't it?

Shemjaza · Apr 18, 2025

AV1611VET said:
What specific evidence is being trumped?

It's evidence for an old Earth that is being trumped by the acceptance of omnipotence and belief in a recent creation.

AV1611VET said:
If you can answer that, it will answer my challenge.

What evidence was hanging around the day God spoke the earth into existence and trumped that evidence?

In that narrative, none.

The evidence was presumably mostly miracled into the Earth during the flood clean up.

Belk · Apr 22, 2025

AV1611VET said:
It is Day One of the Creation Week and God creates Earth ex nihilo (from nothing) by speaking it into existence.

Heretofore the level of mass/energy in the physical universe is zero; since the physical universe didn't exist yet.

Afterwards, the level of mass/energy in the physical universe is now equal to the earth.

Here's my question:

What physical evidence would convince you this happened?

I submit there isn't any.

What say you?

I see you are still trying to demonstrate your imagination is imaginary.

AV1611VET · Apr 23, 2025

Belk said:
I see you are still trying to demonstrate your imagination is imaginary.

Either that, or I'm trying to rescue academia from having nightmares begging for evidence of the creation events.

Belk · Apr 23, 2025

AV1611VET said:
Either that, or I'm trying to rescue academia from having nightmares begging for evidence of the creation events.

Academia can't be "rescued" by imaginary scenarios you make up in your head. That is on par with disproving God by imaging rocks so big God can't lift them I'm afraid.

AV1611VET · Apr 23, 2025

Belk said:
Academia can't be "rescued" by imaginary scenarios you make up in your head. That is on par with disproving God by imaging rocks so big God can't lift them I'm afraid.

Teacher: Okay, students, in today's lesson, there will be no numbers involved at all.
Student: I need to see numbers, or I'll assume your lesson is going to be imaginary.
Teacher: Why?
Student: Because I only deal in math.
Teacher: Then you're in the wrong class.
Student: No, you're being imaginative.
Teacher: Why do you say that?
Student: Because anything that can't be reduced down to numbers doesn't exist. I have absolutely GOT to see numbers, or your lessons are just make believe legends, fairy tales, or lies.
Teacher: Then you're dismissed.
Student: No, I'm putting you on IGNORE, before you give me a faith crisis.
Teacher: Fine. Now, class. Back to our lesson. Get out your paint brushes and easels.

AV1611VET · Apr 23, 2025

Belk said:
Academia can't be "rescued" by imaginary scenarios you make up in your head. That is on par with disproving God by imaging rocks so big God can't lift them I'm afraid.

The claim that science wasn't involved in a series of events absolutely short-circuits people, doesn't it?

Science is to some people like air is to lungs.

Belk · Apr 23, 2025

AV1611VET said:
The claim that science wasn't involved in a series of events absolutely short-circuits people, doesn't it?

Science is to some people like air is to lungs.

Ah yes, I had forgotten your inability to respond to what was written and need to retreat to pat phrases. Ah well. plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

Kylie · May 17, 2025

AV1611VET said:
It is Day One of the Creation Week and God creates Earth ex nihilo (from nothing) by speaking it into existence.

Heretofore the level of mass/energy in the physical universe is zero; since the physical universe didn't exist yet.

Afterwards, the level of mass/energy in the physical universe is now equal to the earth.

Here's my question:

What physical evidence would convince you this happened?

I submit there isn't any.

What say you?

I think I heard somewhere that the mass and energy cancel out, and the net is zero.

And what do you mean by measuring energy in "earths"?

AV1611VET · May 17, 2025

Kylie said:
I think I heard somewhere that the mass and energy cancel out, and the net is zero.

According to Wikipedia, the observable universe is estimated to have a total energy density of about 9.9 × 10-27 kg/m3, and a total volume of about 3.566 × 1080 m3, which would give it a total energy of about 3.5 × 1054 kg (in units of mass).

Kylie said:
And what do you mean by measuring energy in "earths"?

From AI Overview:

The mass of Earth is approximately 5.9722 × 10²⁴ kg. The energy equivalent of this mass, according to E=mc², is about 5.375 × 10⁴¹ joules. This is a massive amount of energy, but it's important to remember that this represents the total mass-energy content of the Earth, not the energy being actively used or released.

The earth was the first object in the universe containing mass/energy.

Kylie · May 18, 2025

AV1611VET said:
According to Wikipedia, the observable universe is estimated to have a total energy density of about 9.9 × 10-27 kg/m3, and a total volume of about 3.566 × 1080 m3, which would give it a total energy of about 3.5 × 1054 kg (in units of mass).

I think you missed my point: gravity cancels that out.

AV1611VET said:
From AI Overview:

The mass of Earth is approximately 5.9722 × 10²⁴ kg. The energy equivalent of this mass, according to E=mc², is about 5.375 × 10⁴¹ joules. This is a massive amount of energy, but it's important to remember that this represents the total mass-energy content of the Earth, not the energy being actively used or released.

The earth was the first object in the universe containing mass/energy.

As the Earth also has gravity, that would cancel out as well.

AV1611VET · May 18, 2025

Kylie said:
I think you missed my point: gravity cancels that out.

As the Earth also has gravity, that would cancel out as well.

Fine.

If you're trying so hard to make it look like it doesn't make sense, how's this:

God raised the amount of mass/energy in the universe from zero to zero over a six day period.

Better?

Kylie · May 20, 2025

AV1611VET said:
Fine.

If you're trying so hard to make it look like it doesn't make sense, how's this:

God raised the amount of mass/energy in the universe from zero to zero over a six day period.

Better?

lol, even I can do that!

AV1611VET · May 20, 2025

Kylie said:
lol, even I can do that!

Do you know the difference between gross and net?

notyourenemy · May 30, 2025

Kylie said:
I think I heard somewhere that the mass and energy cancel out, and the net is zero.

The net energy really doesn't matter. The universe has a level of positive energy and a level of negative energy and, since they're equal, zero is the *difference* between them (there's no surplus or deficit on either side). So "net zero" energy doesn't mean *no* energy.

Kylie · May 31, 2025

notyourenemy said:
The net energy really doesn't matter. The universe has a level of positive energy and a level of negative energy and, since they're equal, zero is the *difference* between them (there's no surplus or deficit on either side). So "net zero" energy doesn't mean *no* energy.

Perhaps, but what about from an outside perspective? If we have an atom that has electrons with a negative charge and protons with a positive charge, they can be in balance, and the atom has an overall neutral charge. The atom behaves electrically neutrally.

2PhiloVoid · May 31, 2025

AV1611VET said:
It is Day One of the Creation Week and God creates Earth ex nihilo (from nothing) by speaking it into existence.

Heretofore the level of mass/energy in the physical universe is zero; since the physical universe didn't exist yet.

Afterwards, the level of mass/energy in the physical universe is now equal to the earth.

Here's my question:

What physical evidence would convince you this happened?

I submit there isn't any.

What say you?

Sorry AV, but this doesn't even make sense. I can't see how modern day physics applies to an ancient cosmogony.

The Return of My Ex Nihilo Challenge

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