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The U.S. Economy Reaches Superstar Status

The Barbarian

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Right now America’s economic-growth rate is the envy of the world. From the end of 2019 to the end of 2023, U.S. GDP grew by 8.2 percent—nearly twice as fast as Canada’s, three times as fast as the European Union’s, and more than eight times as fast as the United Kingdom’s.

“It’s hard to think of a time when the U.S. economy has diverged so fundamentally from its peers,” Mark Zandi, the chief economist at Moody’s Analytics, told me. Over the past year, some of the world’s biggest economies, including those of Japan and Germany, have fallen into recession, complete with mass layoffs and angry street protests. In the U.S., however, the post-pandemic recession never arrived. The economy just keeps growing.
...
Price increases on their own, however, can’t tell us if the cost of living has gone up. What really matters is the relationship between how expensive things are and how much money people have to spend on them. As Vox’s Eric Levitz recently pointed out, prices have increased by 1,400 percent since 1947; that doesn’t mean Americans have less buying power today than at a time when a third of the country didn’t have running water and 40 percent lived in poverty. That’s largely because incomes have increased by 2,400 percent over the same stretch. If prices go up but people’s incomes go up faster, then the cost of living decreases. And that is exactly what has happened in the U.S. over the past five years.

It took some time. When inflation was at its worst, in late 2021 and 2022, prices were rising too fast for workers’ pay to keep up. Over the course of 2023, however, the rate of inflation plummeted while wages kept rising. According to calculations by the economist Arindrajit Dube, prices rose about 20 percent from the beginning of the pandemic to the end of 2023—but the median worker’s hourly wages had increased by more than 26 percent. In other words, a dollar in 2024 might not go as far as a dollar in 2019, but today the average worker has so many more dollars that they can afford a higher quality of life.


June 12, 2024:

The Dow surges 300 points and the S&P 500 hits a record high as inflation cools

The Dow Jones Industrial Average and other stock indexes rose sharply after markets opened Wednesday, as the latest Consumer Price Index data showed inflation cooling. The CPI rose 3.3% year-over-year in May, according to data released by the Bureau of Labor Statistics, lower than the 3.4% expected increase.

With inflation slowing more than expected last month, investors are hopeful that the Federal Reserve will cut interest rates soon. The inflation report was released shortly before the Fed is expected to announce its latest interest-rate decision and economic forecasts for the year. That announcement is set for 2 p.m., with Fed Chair Jerome Powell scheduled to speak at 2:30 p.m.


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FireDragon76

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The economy is doing better, but there's still alot of economic inequality, and many pressing problems looming over us.

America is a dysfunctional and unjust society. Whether or not Biden is re-elected, I am pessimistic about its future. Progressives should be pressuring him to do alot more about climate change, possibly by supporting a third party if need be. If we don't do something about Climate Change, America won't be worth saving from somebody like Trump, and we might just be adding to the problems the whole world is facing, and we will reap the whirlwind anyways.
 
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The Barbarian

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The economy is doing better, but there's still alot of economic inequality, and many pressing problems looming over us.
Yes, while wages are rising faster than prices, it's not happening for everyone. This is why slowing of inflation is a good thing.

And climate change is continuing to be a problem. The frog in a pan of cold water slowly heating is an apt metaphor. But if the Thwaites Glacier lets go, the resulting sudden rise in sea levels might sober up some people.

I'm not optimistic.
 
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FireDragon76

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Yes, while wages are rising faster than prices, it's not happening for everyone. This is why slowing of inflation is a good thing.

And climate change is continuing to be a problem. The frog in a pan of cold water slowly heating is an apt metaphor. But if the Thwaites Glacier lets go, the resulting sudden rise in sea levels might sober up some people.

I'm not optimistic.

I have been learning about Rene Girard's ideas in more depth. It's caused me to nuance my political stances. Sometimes politics does more harm than good.

The problem is that we cannot bracket something like the environmental crisis within our existing social structures or ways of thinking about the world. Ordinarily, these kinds of things were solved through religion, as it was the only thing that could give us that kind of cosmic or transhistorical perspective necessary to address these kinds of undertakings. But religion has been supplanted by capitalism and consumerism. And organized religion, at least in its dominant forms (Christianity and Islam), has been largely stuck in an iron age paradigm.

Like Girard said, the world is almost certainly headed into trouble, and perhaps the only thing left to do is pursue personal sanctity and pray.
 
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The Barbarian

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Like Girard said, the world is almost certainly headed into trouble, and perhaps the only thing left to do is pursue personal sanctity and pray.
The world is always headed into trouble. But it's always new troubles. We have to be in this world, but we don't have to be of it. Try to make things better, but rely on God, as you suggest.
 
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ozso

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The talk around the water-cooler is still how unaffordable everything is.

Glowing reports don't make rent and mortgage payments, utility payments, food prices, car insurance, gas etc prices affordable. And we know that Biden is going to start tax gouging us.
 
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FireDragon76

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The world is always headed into trouble. But it's always new troubles. We have to be in this world, but we don't have to be of it. Try to make things better, but rely on God, as you suggest.

The limitation in "making things better" is that people often use that as a way to advance what are really parochial agendas driven by their own internal psychological insecurities. It doesn't help that society hasn't really internalized the positive aspects of postmodernism- humility, respect for context, and instead focused on the more negative elements, like cynicism.
 
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The Barbarian

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The talk around the water-cooler is still how unaffordable everything is.
Hasn't changed much since I retired, then.
Glowing reports don't make rent and mortgage payments, utility payments, food prices, car insurance, gas etc prices affordable.
But wages rising more quickly than inflation will do that. And that's what's going on today, even as inflation is slowing down. Reality matters.

And we know that Biden is going to start tax gouging us.
Actually, Trump structured his "tax cut" so our taxes would go up after he left office. Not Biden's doing. He hasn't changed things.
 
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ozso

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Hasn't changed much since I retired, then.

But wages rising more quickly than inflation will do that. And that's what's going on today, even as inflation is slowing down. Reality matters.


Actually, Trump structured his "tax cut" so our taxes would go up after he left office. Not Biden's doing. He hasn't changed things.
As “Bidenflation” Robs Workers’ Wages, Biden Wants to Send Them a Bigger Tax Bill

Biden's Tax Hike Threatens Retirement - Negative Returns After Inflation Looms For May

Biden’s proposed tax hike would crush workers and the economy

How Bidenomics is crushing Generation Z

Chairman Smith: High Interest Rates to Fight “Bidenomics” Putting American Dream Out of Reach

Bidenomics is Broken
 
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Solo81

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Right now America’s economic-growth rate is the envy of the world. From the end of 2019 to the end of 2023, U.S. GDP grew by 8.2 percent—nearly twice as fast as Canada’s, three times as fast as the European Union’s, and more than eight times as fast as the United Kingdom’s.

“It’s hard to think of a time when the U.S. economy has diverged so fundamentally from its peers,” Mark Zandi, the chief economist at Moody’s Analytics, told me. Over the past year, some of the world’s biggest economies, including those of Japan and Germany, have fallen into recession, complete with mass layoffs and angry street protests. In the U.S., however, the post-pandemic recession never arrived. The economy just keeps growing.
...
Price increases on their own, however, can’t tell us if the cost of living has gone up. What really matters is the relationship between how expensive things are and how much money people have to spend on them. As Vox’s Eric Levitz recently pointed out, prices have increased by 1,400 percent since 1947; that doesn’t mean Americans have less buying power today than at a time when a third of the country didn’t have running water and 40 percent lived in poverty. That’s largely because incomes have increased by 2,400 percent over the same stretch. If prices go up but people’s incomes go up faster, then the cost of living decreases. And that is exactly what has happened in the U.S. over the past five years.

It took some time. When inflation was at its worst, in late 2021 and 2022, prices were rising too fast for workers’ pay to keep up. Over the course of 2023, however, the rate of inflation plummeted while wages kept rising. According to calculations by the economist Arindrajit Dube, prices rose about 20 percent from the beginning of the pandemic to the end of 2023—but the median worker’s hourly wages had increased by more than 26 percent. In other words, a dollar in 2024 might not go as far as a dollar in 2019, but today the average worker has so many more dollars that they can afford a higher quality of life.


June 12, 2024:

The Dow surges 300 points and the S&P 500 hits a record high as inflation cools

The Dow Jones Industrial Average and other stock indexes rose sharply after markets opened Wednesday, as the latest Consumer Price Index data showed inflation cooling. The CPI rose 3.3% year-over-year in May, according to data released by the Bureau of Labor Statistics, lower than the 3.4% expected increase.

With inflation slowing more than expected last month, investors are hopeful that the Federal Reserve will cut interest rates soon. The inflation report was released shortly before the Fed is expected to announce its latest interest-rate decision and economic forecasts for the year. That announcement is set for 2 p.m., with Fed Chair Jerome Powell scheduled to speak at 2:30 p.m.


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I was thinking this was satire until i saw the pics at the end.

Are you a genuine Biden supporter or are you an 'anyone but Trump' person?
 
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Laodicean60

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The talk around the water-cooler is still how unaffordable everything is.

Glowing reports don't make rent and mortgage payments, utility payments, food prices, car insurance, gas etc prices affordable. And we know that Biden is going to start tax gouging us.
Many non-mainstream economists have been questioning the BLS data (cooking the books) for the past several months. Unemployment is rising and that doesn't happen in a healthy economy. The government is spending over 1 Trillion dollars every hundred days to keep our economy afloat instead of letting the cycle take its course. Overseas economies are heading into a recession that's why they are lowering interest rates and what happens there will eventually hit our shores since we are globally synchronized.
 
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The Barbarian

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I was thinking this was satire until i saw the pics at the end.
Haven't been reading the news, um?
Are you a genuine Biden supporter or are you an 'anyone but Trump' person?
Are you trying to do a Poe here, or are you really saying "All those businesses and economists are LYING!!!"? Calm yourself and do a little checking.
The sky isn't falling, the pandemic is over,and recovery is proceeding. Here, I'll help you...
Many non-mainstream economists have been questioning the BLS data (cooking the books) for the past several months. Unemployment is rising and that doesn't happen in a healthy economy. The government is spending over 1 Trillion dollars every hundred days to keep our economy afloat instead of letting the cycle take its course. Overseas economies are heading into a recession that's why they are lowering interest rates and what happens there will eventually hit our shores since we are globally synchronized.
It's not just BLS. The data is coming in from business sources with the same results. Unemployment is...

Economy added 272,000 jobs in May, surging past expectations

The unemployment rate rose to 4 percent, ending a historic streak of unemployment below that benchmark.
 
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Laodicean60

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Haven't been reading the news, um?

Are you trying to do a Poe here, or are you really saying "All those businesses and economists are LYING!!!"? Calm yourself and do a little checking.
The sky isn't falling, the pandemic is over,and recovery is proceeding. Here, I'll help you...

It's not just BLS. The data is coming in from business sources with the same results. Unemployment is...

Economy added 272,000 jobs in May, surging past expectations

The unemployment rate rose to 4 percent, ending a historic streak of unemployment below that benchmark.
Something no one is told is the revisions to the data.
 
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The Barbarian

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Something no one is told is the revisions to the data.
NBC publishes that information. So do other major networks. Fox News sometimes does, depending on which way the revisions go. When review of the preliminary data shows things are worse, it generally shows up on Fox. But not when it's better, as in the May data.
 
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Laodicean60

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NBC publishes that information. So do other major networks. Fox News sometimes does, depending on which way the revisions go. When review of the preliminary data shows things are worse, it generally shows up on Fox. But not when it's better, as in the May data.
I don't listen to those mainstream liars anyway. They'll change their tune when it is obvious, it's all about psychology. Like on today's FED calendar data below you'll see the jobless (A)ctual is worse than (F)orcasted for the month of May (from FINVIZ stockcharts). Also, unemployment is at 4% which has risen from 3.6% Unemployment usually doesn't rise when the economy is booming.
1718299522235.png


Credit card delinquencies are rising because people are struggling to make payments and retailers are slashing prices because of weak demand including necessities.
 
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The Barbarian

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I don't listen to those mainstream liars anyway. They'll change their tune when it is obvious, it's all about psychology.
Fox News got a lot more careful about that, after the Dominion voting machine debacle. Cost Rupert a lot of money, and he didn't like it much.
1718304788801.png

Also, unemployment is at 4% which has risen from 3.6% Unemployment usually doesn't rise when the economy is booming.
Interesting that there were more new jobs than projected, which suggests a lot of people who had given up finding jobs are now motivated to get out and find a job.

Which is pretty good news, as long as wages continue to increase faster than inflation.
 
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trophy33

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Right now America’s economic-growth rate is the envy of the world. From the end of 2019 to the end of 2023, U.S. GDP grew by 8.2 percent—nearly twice as fast as Canada’s, three times as fast as the European Union’s, and more than eight times as fast as the United Kingdom’s.
It depends on what constitutes the GDP growth. In the USA, it was mainly healthcare and social services. If you have a lot of sick people and the most expensive and ineffective healthcare from the developed countries, it will create GDP, but... is it a good thing?

Also, GDP is influenced by the government spending. And here also lies a potential problem - is the spending invested into infrastructure or into less effective areas?

On the other hand, the technology sector in the USA is a superstar - the whole world uses youtube, google, google maps, microsoft products, apple products, NVIDIA graphic chips, US-based clouds etc. However, are these money going to the American society or are they concentrated in the hands of few?

High social inequality, ineffective government spending, sick population, environment pollution or expensive services can basically negate the GDP growth numbers.
 
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The Barbarian

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It depends on what constitutes the GDP growth. In the USA, it was mainly healthcare and social services. If you have a lot of sick people and the most expensive and ineffective healthcare from the developed countries, it will create GDP, but... is it a good thing?
More money moving into the economy is a good thing, if one cares about wages, standard of living, etc. And...

Real gross domestic product (GDP) increased at an annual rate of 1.3 percent in the first quarter of 2024 (table 1), according to the "second" estimate released by the Bureau of Economic Analysis. In the fourth quarter of 2023, real GDP increased 3.4 percent.

The GDP estimate released today is based on more complete source data than were available for the "advance" estimate issued last month. In the advance estimate, the increase in real GDP was 1.6 percent. The update primarily reflected a downward revision to consumer spending (refer to "Updates to GDP").

The increase in real GDP primarily reflected increases in consumer spending, residential fixed investment, nonresidential fixed investment, and state and local government spending

 
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The Barbarian

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"It took some time. When inflation was at its worst, in late 2021 and 2022, prices were rising too fast for workers’ pay to keep up. Over the course of 2023, however, the rate of inflation plummeted while wages kept rising. According to calculations by the economist Arindrajit Dube, prices rose about 20 percent from the beginning of the pandemic to the end of 2023—but the median worker’s hourly wages had increased by more than 26 percent. In other words, a dollar in 2024 might not go as far as a dollar in 2019, but today the average worker has so many more dollars that they can afford a higher quality of life."
 
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