Halloween - Do you celebrate or not?

CoreyD said:

I did not even know that to be a reason. There are so many reasons which do not involve Satanism.

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It's because of that that it became common in Evangelical and Fundamentalist circles to regard Halloween as evil or associated with the devil. This really intensified in the 1980's through the Satanic Panic, where you get a confluence of charlatans like John Todd, Mike Warnke, and others claiming all kinds of stories about how they used to be former witches/Satanists and peddled themselves as experts on the occult (they were lying); along with the the lies and myths surrounding things like Dungeons & Dragons, various cartoons (I wasn't allowed to watch the Smurfs when I was a child in the 80's because some people got it in their head that it was secretly spreading Satanic messages, and told my parents that). And, of course, the Halloween scares--razor blades hidden in candy, that sort of thing.

The "Halloween is bad" phenomenon is recent, and built upon lies, myths, urban legends, and the make believe of charlatans.

-CryptoLutheran

dlamberth said:

Yet from Christians we continually hear about Satan...over and over and over again. Almost like Satan is more of a reality than is God. I don't get that Satan focus at all.

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Yeah, in lieu of Halloween, Christians will put together a "hell house" in lieu of a haunted house... It's weird. Of course, their narrative is more for the purpose of recruitment than faith.

I put them in the same category as Flat Earthers.

ViaCrucis said:

It's because of that that it became common in Evangelical and Fundamentalist circles to regard Halloween as evil or associated with the devil. This really intensified in the 1980's through the Satanic Panic, where you get a confluence of charlatans like John Todd, Mike Warnke, and others claiming all kinds of stories about how they used to be former witches/Satanists and peddled themselves as experts on the occult (they were lying); along with the the lies and myths surrounding things like Dungeons & Dragons, various cartoons (I wasn't allowed to watch the Smurfs when I was a child in the 80's because some people got it in their head that it was secretly spreading Satanic messages, and told my parents that). And, of course, the Halloween scares--razor blades hidden in candy, that sort of thing.

The "Halloween is bad" phenomenon is recent, and built upon lies, myths, urban legends, and the make believe of charlatans.

-CryptoLutheran

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If you want to check out a good movie, with Tom Hanks, it's called "Mazes and Monsters" which focused on demonizing D & D

Speaking of TV, I have known Christians to admit to having never owned a TV (pre-Internet days of course) So when I'd ask "Hey did you see that show..." I'd get stopped abruptly, "We don't own a TV", and there'd be crickets lol

Y'all Evangelicals, be glad that you don't live in Latin America where the Day of the Dead is celebrated.

ThisIsMe123 said:

If you want to check out a good movie, with Tom Hanks, it's called "Mazes and Monsters" which focused on demonizing D & D

Speaking of TV, I have known Christians to admit to having never owned a TV (pre-Internet days of course) So when I'd ask "Hey did you see that show..." I'd get stopped abruptly, "We don't own a TV", and there'd be crickets lol

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The anti-TV doctrine birthed a legalism maneuver on par with sabbath compliant phones. The story was relayed on the Living after Faith podcast, a former Pentecostal minister told of someone who complied with the no TV in the house rule by having one installed in a window facing onto their porch like a window unit.

ThisIsMe123 said:

Yeah, in lieu of Halloween, Christians will put together a "hell house" in lieu of a haunted house... It's weird. Of course, their narrative is more for the purpose of recruitment than faith.

I put them in the same category as Flat Earthers.

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Are you bragging, or complaining?

ThisIsMe123 said:

Yeah, in lieu of Halloween, Christians will put together a "hell house" in lieu of a haunted house... It's weird. Of course, their narrative is more for the purpose of recruitment than faith.

I put them in the same category as Flat Earthers.

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When I was a kid a local church had a "Harvest Festival" as a Halloween alternative. This was apparently pretty common, I didn't see "Hell Houses" until I was in high school. What I think is somewhat ironic is that having a "Harvest Festival" is actually much more Pagan than Halloween.

-CryptoLutheran

Yup.

Landon Caeli said:

Yup.
View attachment 338797

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Yay Dead.Net!!
30 Days of the Dead.
Today with Casey Jones and Sugar Magnolia.

ViaCrucis said:

No. No it's not.

Samhain and Halloween have literally nothing to do with each other. It's a commonly repeated myth that gets said again and again on the internet, but there's literally no basis for this in fact.

Like so many oft-repeated statements of falsehood like this, we can thank James Frazer and his quackery. Frazer, essentially, makes the whole of Christianity just a copy-cat of paganism. And is the reason why Christ Mythicism remains so popular on the internet--where a lack of critical analysis and proper documentation gets a free pass.

Halloween is based on Samhain the same way that Jesus is based on Osiris. Which is to say, there's notta, zilch, nothing to substantiate that. The Irish converted to Christianity, and rather quickly. Irish monastaries were sending missionary-monks back to Britain. In fact this led to a bit of a clash, as the Mission of St. Augustine of Canterbury to the Anglo-Saxons, sponsored by Rome, brought Roman liturgical customs to the British Isles and which clashed (usually in very small ways) with local liturgical customs. These things were eventually resolved at the Synod of Whitby in the 7th century. The fact of the matter is, by the time The Feast of All Saints was settled on November 1st, between the 8th and 9th centuries, the Irish were a thoroughly Christianized people.

Virtually everything we "know" about pre-Christian Celtic Paganism comes from either Roman sources (like the work of Julius Caesar who clearly had a bias against the Celts of Gaul), or else later Christian sources. Irish fairytales are a product of Christian imagination centuries after the conversion of the Irish to Christianity. As a result of this we know exceedingly little. It's not even entirely clear what the word "druid" actually refers to, as depending on the source one reads it can mean whatever the author wanted it to mean. This also holds true with Samhain, we know next to nothing about this observance. Virtually everything that gets mentioned on the internet about it can be traced back to people in the 1800's pulling speculations out of their hindquarters (such as the aforementioned James Frazer).

The 19th century was the wild west of comparative religious studies. And to call the ideas that emerged back then outdated is a bit like calling phrenology outdated. A better word would be pseudoscience.

-CryptoLutheran

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Samhain and Halloween are connected, but I'm not going to argue with anyone. You don't want to believe samhain and Halloween are connected, then don't believe it.

I celebrate Halloween enough for everybody, though I didn’t dress up this year. I did, however, spend more money than I should admit to on Martha Rotten jewelry the Sunday before Halloween so I was covered head-to-toe in pewter cast bones, skulls, and snakes. So I guess that’s kind of close to a costume…? Except I wear it all outside of Halloween too, so probably not. LoL

BARNEY BRIGHT said:

Samhain and Halloween are connected, but I'm not going to argue with anyone. You don't want to believe samhain and Halloween are connected, then don't believe it.

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You'd certainly provide more credibility to the claim if you can back it up with sourcing.

-CryptoLutheran

ViaCrucis said:

You'd certainly provide more credibility to the claim if you can back it up with sourcing.

-CryptoLutheran

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QV please:

Halloween is a holiday celebrated each year on October 31, and Halloween 2023 will occur on Tuesday, October 31. The tradition originated with the ancient Celtic festival of Samhain, when people would light bonfires and wear costumes to ward off ghosts.

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SOURCE

ZephBonkerer said:

I would have a hard time crediting the notion that tarot cards are evil per se. They may have been used in questionable activities, but that's the problem with the sinner, not the object.

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That's like saying it's okay to use Ouija boards to teach kids the alphabet.

AV1611VET said:

That's like saying it's okay to use Ouija boards to teach kids the alphabet.

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Or Genesis to teach them science.

ZephBonkerer said:

What's wrong with using an Ouija board to teach the alphabet? Aside from it being probably ineffective.

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Every time I scroll through these threads, these analogies people keep making keep getting weaker and weaker.

AV1611VET said:

That's like saying it's okay to use Ouija boards to teach kids the alphabet.

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I enjoy the irony of “all Tarot cards and Ouija Boards are bad and should be avoided,” but also after a mass shooting “banning guns is stupid because guns aren’t inherently bad, it’s how they’re used and most people use them safely” and “guns don’t kill people, people kill people.”

As somebody who’s used Tarot and Ouija Boards extensively and owns literally hundreds of decks and about a dozen boards, I can confirm there is nothing inherently bad about them. One cannot mass produce portals to demons and if they could, we wouldn’t be having philosophical debates on the existence of hell and Satan. The loss of life through Tarot and Ouija would be as tangible as it is with guns and not debated as it would be an accepted statistic in society.

However, deaths by Tarot and Ouija? Still a solid zero. Mass casualties from Tarot and Ouija? Also zero.

ZephBonkerer said:

What's wrong with using an Ouija board to teach the alphabet? Aside from it being probably ineffective.

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I learned by memorizing Edward Gorey’s “The Gashlycrumb Tinies.” A is for Amy who fell down the stairs, B is for Basil assaulted by bears, C is for Cara who wasted away, D is for Desmond thrown out of a sleigh…

dlamberth said:

Thanks.
Expanding it a bit, how does compassion and service to those in need fit into your experience of Love?

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Since I have been obeying Christ's commands, and following his teachings and example, the following has been my experience.
Isaiah 61:1-3
The Spirit of the Sovereign Lord is on me,
because the Lord has anointed me
to proclaim good news to the poor.
He has sent me to bind up the brokenhearted,
to proclaim freedom for the captives
and release from darkness for the prisoners,[a]
2 to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor
and the day of vengeance of our God,
to comfort all who mourn,
3 and provide for those who grieve

Isaiah 52:7
How beautiful on the mountains are the feet of those who bring good news, who proclaim peace, who bring good tidings, who proclaim salvation, who say to Zion, “Your God reigns!”

Romans 10:13-15
14 How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher? 15 And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written:
“How beautiful are the feet of those who [a]preach the gospel of peace, Who bring glad tidings of good things!”

2 Timothy 4:2 preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with complete patience and teaching.
2 Timothy 4:5 As for you, always be sober-minded, endure suffering, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.

dlamberth said:

What's going on in your soul during those times of Love?

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I experience fulfillment in my life, as I know I am pleasing the father, since his son said
Matthew 22:37-40
37 Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

Showing love for God and neighbor, involves doing God's will.
1 Timothy 2:3, 4
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Knowing that I am giving people an opportunity to experience joy and satisfaction, and have the best life ever, gives me great pleasure.

dlamberth said:

What is Christ experiencing with the same?

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Luke 10:21
At that same time Jesus was filled with the joy of the Holy Spirit, and he said, “O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, thank you for hiding these things from those who think themselves wise and clever, and for revealing them to the childlike. Yes, Father, it pleased you to do it this way.

Jesus is overjoyed - elated; exceedingly pleased, when persons show that they love him and his father, by doing the will of the father - helping people to get a knowledge of truth.
1 Timothy 2:3, 4
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Truth matters to God and his Christ. Light, and not darkness, brings people true happiness and joy.
These are the things that show love - love for God, first and foremost, and love for our neighbor, secondly.

1 Corinthians 13:4-6
4 Love ... 6 does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth;

John 8:44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.

Do you agree that love of God is most important, and this involves loving the truth?
Are you happy with the witch's hat, and vampire bats? Do these promote the truth, or Satan's lies?
Do you think that God will overlook our love for Satan's world, because we buy groceries for our next door neighbor, and give candy to children?

James 4:4
Adulterers and adulteresses! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Whoever therefore wants to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.

dlamberth said:

Yet from Christians we continually hear about Satan...over and over and over again. Almost like Satan is more of a reality than is God. I don't get that Satan focus at all.

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Perhaps this is the reason.
Ephesians 6:11-18
10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. 11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the [a]wiles of the devil. 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of [b]the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. 13 Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having girded your waist with truth, having put on the breastplate of righteousness, 15 and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace; 16 above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one. 17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God; 18 praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, being watchful to this end with all perseverance and supplication for all the saints

Do you think Paul thought Satan is more of a reality than is God, because he zeroed in on our primary enemies? Or, was he trying to keep the brothers alert to the fact that they needed to be alert and of sober mind [because] your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. 1 Peter 5:8

How easily many have proven to have been seduced by the Devil.
2 Corinthians 11:4
But I am afraid that as the serpent deceived Eve by his cunning, your thoughts will be led astray from a sincere and pure devotion to Christ.

They can't even let go of the world and its traditions, and remain devoted to Christ.
John 17:16 They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world.