Is EVERYTHING an unbeliever does sin?

OkieAllDay · Jul 26, 2023

Romans 14:23 says "everything that does not come from faith is sin."

Does this mean that a lost man who jumps on a grenade to save his friends lives was sinning in his action?

Romans 14:23 seems to say yes, but I have a hard time believing every breath an unbeliever takes is a sin, but I could be wrong...

Tranquil Bondservant · Jul 26, 2023

Romans 14 is speaking to believers. So someone who was given faith to eat all things can do so without sin, however, he who is weak in faith and thinks its wrong to eat all things does not eat all things from faith. And if the weaker brother transgresses the limitation he has placed upon himself then it would be sin to him. Romans 14:20-22.

This goes without saying but I'll mention it to avoid misconceptions; obviously the parameters of faith must be in keeping with Christ.

HTacianas · Jul 26, 2023

OkieAllDay said:
Romans 14:23 says "everything that does not come from faith is sin."

Does this mean that a lost man who jumps on a grenade to save his friends lives was sinning in his action?

Romans 14:23 seems to say yes, but I have a hard time believing every breath an unbeliever takes is a sin, but I could be wrong...

No, not everything an unbeliever does is sin. Only sins are sin. Romans 14:33 more or less describes someone doing something they believe is wrong. If they believe it is wrong and do it anyway it is sin to them. But then how severe of a sin is it really. It's probably best described by the Roman Church's teaching of mortal and venial sin. In the old testament there were some sins that could be atoned for through sacrifice while others could not be. Sins committed in ignorance were forgiven through sacrifice while intentional sins were not. Intentional sins were the egregious type such as murder or adultery and required the sinner's death.

Gregory Thompson · Jul 26, 2023

One passage that speaks of something similar is Titus 1:15-16

15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.
16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

It paints a picture that every good work done for selfish reasons is sin.

For example, in Romans 14 "everything that does not come from faith is sin"

Yes, every bible study that does not come from faith, is sin.

Yes, every sermon that does not come from faith, is sin.

Yes, every action taken, that does not come from faith, is sin.

The reason for this is because the spirit is regenerated when we are born again by the Holy Spirit. Any action not taken by this part of us, but by the flesh instead is sin. The operation of anything spiritual in God's economy is by faith. We are indeed saved by faith, but also must live by faith.

In context of the modern application of sin (bad dog, bad!) .. it may be helpful to think of sin as "missing the mark" since that is what it means. So you missed the mark, then improve and do better next time.

eleos1954 · Jul 26, 2023

OkieAllDay said:
Romans 14:23 says "everything that does not come from faith is sin."

Does this mean that a lost man who jumps on a grenade to save his friends lives was sinning in his action?

Romans 14:23 seems to say yes, but I have a hard time believing every breath an unbeliever takes is a sin, but I could be wrong...

John 15:13

Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends.

Carl Emerson · Jul 26, 2023

Luke 6:32
If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners love those who love them.

The Greek for Love in this verse is Agape...

Gregory Thompson · Jul 26, 2023

eleos1954 said:
John 15:13

Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends.

But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. (Romans 5:8)

anetazo · Jul 26, 2023

Thier not repenting, acts chapter 3. Epistle John chapter 3, thier habitual sinners. They wont repent and don't care about God. The wicked and heathen are going to hell. They think they see brighter light in satan. Luke chapter 13, the wide gate leads to destruction. Those who love and serve God have eternal life. Get the picture.

fhansen · Jul 27, 2023

OkieAllDay said:
Romans 14:23 says "everything that does not come from faith is sin."

Does this mean that a lost man who jumps on a grenade to save his friends lives was sinning in his action?

Romans 14:23 seems to say yes, but I have a hard time believing every breath an unbeliever takes is a sin, but I could be wrong...

Fallen man retains the spark of God's life in him, which means he can still love, That life is dimmed and obscured and often overridden and until he begins to know and enter relationship with God for himself he remains lost. The flip side to this is that not all believers necessarily refrain from sin or are willing to sacrifice themselves for others in one way or another-not all love well. And love is the real criteria for our judgment, BTW, and that which faith is meant to lead to. Without it we're nothing, still apart from God. Love is the mark of His children, those who are becoming like Him.

Lost Witness · Jul 27, 2023

fhansen said:
Fallen man retains the spark of God's life in him, which means he can still love, That life is dimmed and obscured and often overridden and until he begins to know and enter relationship with God for himself he remains lost. The flip side to this is that not all believers necessarily refrain from sin or are willing to sacrifice themselves for others in one way or another-not all love well. And love is the real criteria for our judgment, BTW, and that which faith is meant to lead to. Without it we're nothing, still apart from God. Love is the mark of His children, those who are becoming like Him.

Yep 1 John cuts deep

ViaCrucis · Jul 29, 2023

OkieAllDay said:
Romans 14:23 says "everything that does not come from faith is sin."

Does this mean that a lost man who jumps on a grenade to save his friends lives was sinning in his action?

Romans 14:23 seems to say yes, but I have a hard time believing every breath an unbeliever takes is a sin, but I could be wrong...

Why limit it only to unbelievers? Paul didn't say everything an unbeliever does is sin, but everything that does not come from faith is sin.

I'd encourage anyone to look at Martin Luther's 1518 Heidelberg Disputation. A lot is often said about Luther's 95 Theses against Indulgences, but if you really want to see some of central kernels of Evangelical theology, the Heidelberg Disputation is really the place to start looking.

Luther argues, several theses in, that "Although the works of man always seem attractive and good, they are nevertheless likely to be mortal sins."

I have nothing to offer before God as good. All my righteousness is really unrighteousness. Every good work I do thinking and believing I am justified by the Law is, in fact, a sin and compounds my guilt before the Law which declares me in every way guilty. I am a sinner. Even in my good works, even in my best works, in every good I think I do, in every righteous deed I consider righteous, I am a sinner. God, have mercy on me.

Just how deep does this abyss of despair that lay within us go? All the way to deepest and darkest hell.
So, therefore, knowing just how depraved we are, hear this amazing word of grace: God loves you and Christ died for you. How deep, how unplumbable are the fathomless depths of God's love for us. That while still sinners Christ died for us.

-CryptoLutheran

OkieAllDay · Jul 30, 2023

ViaCrucis said:
Why limit it only to unbelievers? Paul didn't say everything an unbeliever does is sin, but everything that does not come from faith is sin.

I limited to unbelievers because unbelievers do not have faith - and it says what we do that does not come from faith is sin

ViaCrucis said:
I'd encourage anyone to look at Martin Luther's 1518 Heidelberg Disputation. A lot is often said about Luther's 95 Theses against Indulgences, but if you really want to see some of central kernels of Evangelical theology, the Heidelberg Disputation is really the place to start looking.

Luther argues, several theses in, that "Although the works of man always seem attractive and good, they are nevertheless likely to be mortal sins."

I have nothing to offer before God as good. All my righteousness is really unrighteousness. Every good work I do thinking and believing I am justified by the Law is, in fact, a sin and compounds my guilt before the Law which declares me in every way guilty. I am a sinner. Even in my good works, even in my best works, in every good I think I do, in every righteous deed I consider righteous, I am a sinner. God, have mercy on me.

Just how deep does this abyss of despair that lay within us go? All the way to deepest and darkest hell.
So, therefore, knowing just how depraved we are, hear this amazing word of grace: God loves you and Christ died for you. How deep, how unplumbable are the fathomless depths of God's love for us. That while still sinners Christ died for us.

-CryptoLutheran

ViaCrucis · Jul 30, 2023

OkieAllDay said:
I limited to unbelievers because unbelievers do not have faith - and it says what we do that does not come from faith is sin

Yet the Apostle is not talking to unbelievers, but to believers.

-CryptoLutheran

FireDragon76 · Jul 30, 2023

OkieAllDay said:
Romans 14:23 says "everything that does not come from faith is sin."

Does this mean that a lost man who jumps on a grenade to save his friends lives was sinning in his action?

To understand total depravity, you have to understand the context of it originally.

OkieAllDay said:
Romans 14:23 seems to say yes, but I have a hard time believing every breath an unbeliever takes is a sin, but I could be wrong...

Of course not everything an unbeliever does is a sin. However, the idea is that all human life is affected by sin. It might shock some modern American Evangelicals to learn, so enmeshed in libertarian notions of freedom, human perfectionism, and choice, but it was a basic Protestant doctrine at one time that even believers have sin remaining in them, not any different in this respect than an unbeliever. All that faith and baptism removes is the guilt, and baptism represents a sign and seal of God's grace towards us. This is why Luther speaks of the believer living two lives at once. On the one hand, he is the Old Adam, daily dying because of sin, but he is also a new man daily rising with Christ.

FireDragon76 · Jul 30, 2023

HTacianas said:
No, not everything an unbeliever does is sin. Only sins are sin. Romans 14:33 more or less describes someone doing something they believe is wrong. If they believe it is wrong and do it anyway it is sin to them. But then how severe of a sin is it really. It's probably best described by the Roman Church's teaching of mortal and venial sin. In the old testament there were some sins that could be atoned for through sacrifice while others could not be. Sins committed in ignorance were forgiven through sacrifice while intentional sins were not. Intentional sins were the egregious type such as murder or adultery and required the sinner's death.

That's how humans understood it (wrongly). However, Paul makes it clear all sins merit death, that there aren't particular groups of people for whom that isn't the case.

The sacrificial system of the Old Testament didn't remove sin- how could the blood of animals and burned grain, after all, remove moral depravity? The Epistle to the Hebrews even acknowledges this It functioned as a sacramental system only, a way for primitive people to try to commune with God.

eleos1954 · Jul 31, 2023

Michael Collum said:
But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. (Romans 5:8)

Yes, everyone has sinned but that does not mean everything we do is sinful.

Carl Emerson · Jul 31, 2023

Faith comes from hearing the Word of Christ.

Not acting in accordance with His Word is sin.

Unbelievers do not obey the Word of Christ but do what is right in their own eyes.

Everything they do is in this sense sinful and this can sadly apply to believers as well.

However never forget that it is Love rather than Faith that brings reward...

1 Cor 13... If I speak with the tongues of mankind and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and know all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 And if I give away all my possessions to charity, and if I surrender my body so that I may glory, but do not have love, it does me no good.

Soyeong · Jul 31, 2023

OkieAllDay said:
Romans 14:23 says "everything that does not come from faith is sin."

Does this mean that a lost man who jumps on a grenade to save his friends lives was sinning in his action?

Romans 14:23 seems to say yes, but I have a hard time believing every breath an unbeliever takes is a sin, but I could be wrong...

Sin is what is whatever is in transgression of God’s law, whatever is in transgression of God’s law is not of faith, and whatever is not of faith is sin.

Laying down our life for our friends is an action of a believer, not an unbeliever.

Jesus is YHWH · Jul 31, 2023

No as Jesus said if you being evil give good gifts to your children how much more will My Father I heaven give good gifts to those who ask .

Carl Emerson · Jul 31, 2023

Soyeong said:
Laying down our life for our friends is an action of a believer, not an unbeliever.

Even sinners love those who love them... The Greek for love in this verse is AGAPE...

So the matter is not so 'black and white' - it seems a residual gift of god's love is given to all under common Grace.

Is EVERYTHING an unbeliever does sin?

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