Let's talk about economic collapse

ZNP

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Joel 2 Hear this, ye old men, and give ear, all ye inhabitants of the land. Hath this been in

your days, or in the days of your fathers?


There is no example, no precedent for what has happened. It is startling. For example, even though we have had plagues before that have killed millions, have we ever seen anything like this? The entire world shuts down?

3 Tell ye your children of it, and let your children tell their children, and their children another generation. 4 That which [a]the palmer-worm hath left hath the locust eaten; and that which the locust hath left hath [c]the canker-worm eaten; and that which the canker-worm hath left hath [d]the caterpillar eaten.

Every creature moves at God’s command. He is describing them like an assembly line in which the entire world’s economy is dismantled and consumed. The ability of this little virus to so completely destroy the economy is what makes this judgement so remarkable and unique.

5 Awake, ye drunkards,

Awake from the drunken stupor. The people fail to see the hand of God in the terrible calamity. You can compare this virus to locusts. It was at the gates while these drunken revellers were still carrying on their feasts.

and weep; and wail, all ye drinkers of wine, because of the sweet wine; for it is cut off from your mouth. 6 For a nation is come up upon my land, strong, and without number; his teeth are the teeth of a lion, and he hath the jaw-teeth of a lioness.

The term nation has the meaning not only of a people but of a foreign people. The bible often refers to creatures like ants and bees as “a people”. But this virus is not simpy a

people but it is a “foreign people”. It devours everything. A lion doesn’t just eat the meat, it eats the bones, it will devour everything. And just like a lion, once it has the prey there is no hope of rescuing it from him.

7 He

Now it refers to this plague as “He”. It has been compared to insects, worms, a foreign nation, a lion, and now “He”. That is it represents every enemy that wastes the inheritance of God. “The prince of this world”. This plague will be used by those seeking a new world order to impose the mark of the beast.

hath laid my vine waste, and [e]barked my fig-tree: he hath made it clean bare, and cast it [f]away; the branches thereof are made white.

The church is the vine tree, the Jewish nation is the fig tree. The gathering of believers in the church and in synagogues is the greatest threat to the prince of the power of the air, so they have attacked the church and God’s people during this age. As you have done it will be done to you, for 2,000 years “he” attacked and killed the church and the Jews, so in like ways God will do the same to them.

8 Lament like a virgin girded with sackcloth for the husband of her youth.
The analogy is to a virgin lamenting because she has forfeited her marriage due to


unworthy conduct. I go into detail on this point in the book of Habakkuk.

9 The meal-offering and the drink-offering are cut off from the house of Jehovah; the priests, Jehovah’s ministers, mourn.

All the outward and visible signs of communion with God are cut off. Ellicot’s commentary

10 The field is laid waste, the land mourneth; for the grain is destroyed, the new wine is [g]dried up, the oil languisheth.

The field is where we work, where we labor. That has been laid waste. The land mourneth, you see this on the news, and on social media. The grain is our wealth, that

is destroyed. The New wine is the delight of ife, that is dried up. The oil makes our face to shine, instead of shining we see languishing. People are weak, feeble, losing their vitality.

11 [h]Be confounded, O ye husbandmen, wail, O ye vinedressers, for the wheat and for the barley; for the harvest of the field is perished.

Be struck with confusion. Look at all the leaders, the “husbandmen” and the “vinedressers”. They don’t know what to do.

12 The vine is withered, and the fig-tree languisheth; the pomegranate-tree, the palm-tree also, and the apple-tree, even all the trees of the field are withered: for joy is [j]withered away from the sons of men.

The economic loss is universal. All the trees of the field are withered. This is not just the US, or Europe, or Ethiopia.

13 Gird yourselves with sackcloth, and lament, ye priests; wail, ye ministers of the altar; come, lie all night in sackcloth, ye ministers of my God: for the meal-offering and the drink-offering are withholden from the house of your God.

Prepare yourself for a national humiliation, there are no offerings, it will be a time of fasting.

14 Sanctify a fast, call a solemn assembly, gather the [k]old men and all the inhabitants of the land unto the house of Jehovah your God, and cry unto Jehovah.

This refers to a festival day, the Feast of Trumpets.
 
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ZNP

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Nearly 66,000 businesses have folded since March 1, according to data from Yelp, which provides a platform for local businesses to advertise their services and has been tracking announcements of closings posted on its site. From June 15 to June 29, the most recent period for which data is available, businesses were closing permanently at a higher rate than in the previous three months, Yelp found. During the same period, permanent closures increased by 3% overall, accounting for roughly 14% of total closures since March.

Researchers at Harvard believe the rates of business closures are likely to be even higher. They estimated that nearly 110,000 small businesses across the country had decided to shut down permanently between early March and early May, based on data collected in weekly surveys by Alignable, a social media network for small-business owners.

Coronavirus Surge Is Killing America's Small Businesses
 
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istodolez

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Nearly 66,000 businesses have folded since March 1, according to data from Yelp, which provides a platform for local businesses to advertise their services and has been tracking announcements of closings posted on its site. From June 15 to June 29, the most recent period for which data is available, businesses were closing permanently at a higher rate than in the previous three months, Yelp found. During the same period, permanent closures increased by 3% overall, accounting for roughly 14% of total closures since March.

Researchers at Harvard believe the rates of business closures are likely to be even higher. They estimated that nearly 110,000 small businesses across the country had decided to shut down permanently between early March and early May, based on data collected in weekly surveys by Alignable, a social media network for small-business owners.

Coronavirus Surge Is Killing America's Small Businesses

I suspect that as our daily death rate climbs (it's already back at levels similar to the beginning of April) the entire economy will go back into shutdown which will kill for good the strangely "optimistic" stock market we've been enjoying during this last shutdown.

At that point Trump's economic "boon" will be wiped out completely and for many years to come. One will be able to argue that Trump's failure to address the disease OR his failure to take the brief respite before this current spike to put the nation on a footing to handle this or keep the numbers lower (like they are in most of the developed world) will make him responsible for overseeing the worst economic collapse since the Great Depression.

Trump will make Herbert Hoover look like an economic savant.
 
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ZNP

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I suspect that as our daily death rate climbs (it's already back at levels similar to the beginning of April) the entire economy will go back into shutdown which will kill for good the strangely "optimistic" stock market we've been enjoying during this last shutdown.

At that point Trump's economic "boon" will be wiped out completely and for many years to come. One will be able to argue that Trump's failure to address the disease OR his failure to take the brief respite before this current spike to put the nation on a footing to handle this or keep the numbers lower (like they are in most of the developed world) will make him responsible for overseeing the worst economic collapse since the Great Depression.

Trump will make Herbert Hoover look like an economic savant.
The stock market it not behaving strangely, the Fed has bought $5 trillion worth of ETFs, it isn't considered debt because they exchange the paper they printed for something of "equal value". The Fed is propping up the stock market by printing money, every central bank is doing that.
 
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jgarden

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Let's talk about economic collapse

This President and his supporters steadfastly refuse to accept the link between overcoming the spread of COVID-19 and economic prosperity!

The American public is now supposed to accept the most recent conservative "bill of goods" that these skyrocketing rates in new cases and deaths are to be accepted as "the new normal" and the necessary price that every nation must endure for reopening their economies!

The only reason that Trump is placing pressure on the states and their governors to reopen the schools in the Fall, irrespective of the consequences, is because its viewed as a stepping-stone in resurrecting the economy!

The fact that the Senate is on summer recess, and in no hurry to pass legislation that would equip schools to reduce the impact of the Pandemic, speaks volumes - apparently educators, without PPEs, are now being told its their duty to "make bricks without straw!"
 
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ZNP

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wonder how much of this is due to trumps incompetence with the handling of covid and travel bans.
How about the other airlines (china airlines, Singapore airlines, British Airlines, etc), they doing OK?
 
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FireDragon76

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Large groups of people unemployed, to the point they start squatting on properties or make large camps. A lack of ability to move food and goods around the country.

And then comes the roving bands of raiders and warlords, some for loot, most for food and security.

I think we are a long way from that.

I notice prices rising for some goods right now, precisely because there are supply disruptions or companies have furloughed people producing them. It is true they are not yet affecting key industries but if it keeps up, that can't hold out for ever. If a necessary company or organization can't buy new power supplies, for instance (which are being reported in short supply by some), things will get much, much worse . Right now, things haven't quite started to fall apart like that (power supplies, for instance, typically last a while), but if it persists we are in trouble.
 
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Paulos23

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I notice prices rising for some goods right now, precisely because there are supply disruptions or companies have furloughed people producing them. It is true they are not yet affecting key industries but if it keeps up, that can't hold out for ever. If a necessary company or organization can't buy new power supplies, for instance (which are being reported in short supply by some), things will get much, much worse . Right now, things haven't quite started to fall apart like that (power supplies, for instance, typically last a while), but if it persists we are in trouble.
I have noticed other small things as well. Some packaging for some products is becoming more generic. Some don't come with the little extras you use to get. Which I can understand. It is hard to give out free gloves for hair coloring when they are needed elsewhere.

There are still goods my store runs out on, and sometimes it is because they haven't restocked yet.

But in general, we are not starving and the power and water is running.
 
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ZNP

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1. April and May half of all commercial establishments did not pay their rent. Landlords put into a jam, failure to pay rent plunges the landlords, banks and tenants into a mushrooming crisis. They have all now turned to their lawyers and are getting ready to go into court and fight.

2. Federal reserve is buying corporate bonds in the secondary market. That means the Fed is backstopping the entire credit apparatus of the US. This is no longer a free economy.

Level of breakdown can’t see in World history or American history. The reaction to this case is completely different from the reaction to the great depression. In the Great depression the government moved to the left. What we are seeing now is a move to the right.

Unemployment is off the charts with 40 million unemployed. Here is what is coming — a compression. Decrease in standard of living. Cut wages, increase hours, decrease benefits.

Compare the US to Germany. Our unemployment rate has quadrupled, Germanies has gone from 5% to 6%. Germany picked up 70-80% of wage bill. As a result there wasn’t such a pressure to go back to work and ignore social distancing.
 
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