Virginia braces for gun-rights rally as worries over violence, hate groups and militias grow

jimmyjimmy · Jan 21, 2020

civilwarbuff said:
Virginia braces for gun-rights rally as worries over violence, hate groups and militias grow

RICHMOND, Va. -- Threats of violence, including claims of a militia storming Virginia's Capitol and protesters weaponizing drones, have put federal and state authorities on high alert ahead of Monday's gun-rights rally.

Thousands of people across the country are expected to show up as part of a demonstration demanding state Democrats drop a push for comprehensive gun control in the commonwealth.

The fear of violence has spread quickly and has led to heightened security, road closures and a ban on firearms in the Capitol and on its grounds. An event memorializing victims of gun violence, including one honoring the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr., was canceled due to safety concerns. The Federal Aviation Administration has banned drones within a 2-mile radius of the Capitol and nearby students at VCU and the Medical College of Virginia have been encouraged to stay indoors.

Virginia Citizens Defense League President Philip Van Cleave told Fox News it's not the pro-gun groups that are stoking fear.

"It's the Democrats," he said. "It's almost like they want something to happen. It sounds crazy, but they keep doing it and you have to start wondering if that's intentional."

Cleave said membership in his organization has tripled in the past six weeks and that 10,000 people have signed up for free email alerts. He attributes the spike in popularity to Gov. Ralph Northam and Democrats in the state legislature. Van Cleave believes they have "declared war on gun owners" and is counting on gun-rights advocates to show up Monday to have their collective voices heard.

Agreed. Sounds as if Northam and the democrats are simply trying to stoke the fires....

More guns in the hands of the people = a better society.

renniks · Jan 21, 2020

Jonathan Walkerin said:
Would have been great if the second amandment had been written that every citizen has the right to bear musket.

What do you have against law abiding citizens possessing firearms?

Speedwell · Jan 21, 2020

renniks said:
What do you have against law abiding citizens possessing firearms?

Off topic for this thread. Nobody is arguing that law-abiding citizens should not be able to possess firearms.

durangodawood · Jan 21, 2020

renniks said:
What do you have against law abiding citizens possessing firearms?

I believe in a right to bear arms.

But its not unlimited.

And we must infringe upon it here and there. Everybody agrees with this.

essentialsaltes · Jan 21, 2020

rjs330 said:
Lo and behold this turned out to be a peaceful protest of people addressing grievances. Who duh thunk? All the hand wringing aside.

And the governor's order did not diminish anybody's voice.

renniks · Jan 21, 2020

durangodawood said:
I believe in a right to bear arms.

But its not unlimited.

And we must infringe upon it here and there. Everybody agrees with this.

But the poster thinks it should be limited to muskets? That's absurd.

durangodawood · Jan 21, 2020

renniks said:
But the poster thinks it should be limited to muskets? That's absurd.

I agree.

But I also think semi auto ar15 type weapons are absurd, especially large capacity.

Ironhold · Jan 21, 2020

Skreeper said:
The day is young, let's see and wait. You never now what happens when it comes to the basket of deplorables.

Uh...

I'm one of them.

Alongside millions of other people who Hillary thought were human scum because they didn't use the internet to support her.

That's a major part of why she lost.

tall73 · Jan 21, 2020

Speedwell said:
Of course back in the day when there were real Minute Men and not just wannabes,

Ridicule is a debate tactic. But it rarely changes minds.

By the way, if you want an interesting read, here is a scholarly study that looks at how concealed carry permit holders are hyper-law abiding.

https://scholarship.law.duke.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=4831&context=lcp

It discusses how the presence of a weapon is not necessarily a predictor for improper use. This is one of several studies that shows CC permit holders as being more law abiding than police officers.

It also discusses the dynamic of how officers have more leeway legally with use of force. And of course they are more often in situations where they may have to use it. Therefore, despite their higher training, they may be more prone to illegitimate use of force. CC permit holders, on the other hand will often have an acute awareness of the limitations on their use of force, and the consequences of brandishing, etc.

Not all of course. And the trend of states passing constitutional carry without any training may undercut this.

Interesting read either way.

tall73 · Jan 21, 2020

civilwarbuff said:
As long as your gov knows that and you are required to report buys and sells....yeah, you are disarmed.

This I don't necessarily understand. A registry would give the government an easier task of trying to remove guns if it came to it. But once you reach the hundreds of millions mark the reality is that it is still a deterrent even if they know you have them. And since more and more guns are now in the hands of collectors and enthusiasts with many guns per person, the authorities could not count on them all staying in one place once things heated up. They would likely start handing out the surplus to friends and family.

Perhaps more insidious though is the leaking of such a list as it could lead to harassment, thieves targeting, etc.

See this article for example:

Newspaper sparks outrage for publishing names, addresses of gun permit holders - CNN

rjs330 · Jan 21, 2020

Speedwell said:
Snotty non-sequitur. Well played.

Illegal border crossers are not any more dangerous than visa overstayers. The only reason I can see that you want to subject one kind of illegal alien to criminal prosecution in addition to deportation but not the other is that the illegal border crossers are more likely to be poor, brown and Roman Catholic than the visa overstays.

Thank you. Legal gun owners are no more dangerous than illegal aliens. Especially when you take into consideration gangs, drugs and all the violence that goes with it.

And nice snotty unfounded racial, religious accusation. Kind of a typical left wing accusation when one has no real argument. I was hoping you'd be more original than that.

jimmyjimmy · Jan 21, 2020

durangodawood said:
I believe in a right to bear arms.

But its not unlimited.

And we must infringe upon it here and there. Everybody agrees with this.

The constitution doesn't agree with your view.

durangodawood · Jan 21, 2020

jimmyjimmy said:
The constitution doesn't agree with your view.

I realize that.

But pretty much nobody agrees with the constitution on this matter.... probably including you.

jimmyjimmy · Jan 21, 2020

durangodawood said:
I realize that.

But pretty much nobody agrees with the constitution on this matter.... probably including you.

That's irrelevant., and you are out of touch with the people.

Citizens should carry automatic weapons and rocket launchers, because the reason for the 2nd is to defend against the *state*.

durangodawood · Jan 21, 2020

jimmyjimmy said:
That's irrelevant., and you are out of touch with the people.

Citizens should carry automatic weapons and rocket launchers, because the reason for the 2nd is to defend against the *state*.

How am I out of touch with the people if I concur with like 99.8% of them?

jimmyjimmy · Jan 21, 2020

durangodawood said:
How am I out of touch with the people if I concur with like 99.8% of them?

There's your proof, right there.

durangodawood · Jan 21, 2020

jimmyjimmy said:
There's your proof, right there.

Are you the 0.2% ?

Jonathan Walkerin · Jan 22, 2020

renniks said:
What do you have against law abiding citizens possessing firearms?

Apart from stuff like 5 year olds actually shooting other kids ? People shooting family members accidentally ? Stuff like that.

Jacksonville police: Toddler accidentally shot by another child

The argument that then the criminals would only have guns is pretty much invalid since if there were no guns then the criminals would also have a lot less hardware around.

How many armed robberies have you heard of happening in Japan ?

Also having so many guns around create that environment of fear that makes cops shoots too easily because they know everyone is armed, it makes you crab your shotgun when you hear a strange sound in the night and shoot through the door to kill your daughter that was getting a glass of milk.

So useless. By all the means if you are in position that you have a credible threat to your life go for concealed carry.

If you just lug it around for that one in a million case you might need it, or you might actually react correctly when you did.....just ditch it and get some first aid skills. They would be nonlethal and statistically save more lives.

If you are doing it for principle...as discussed too late. You are already forbidden heavy weapons and what did populace do about that ......nothing.

Which is exactly the same they would do if government forbade assault rifles. Nothing.

Feel free to lie to yourself about it.

Nithavela · Jan 22, 2020

How many people of color were in the protest?

Desk trauma · Jan 22, 2020

Nithavela said:
How many people of color were in the protest?

At least ten, who were heavily photographed for memes.

Virginia braces for gun-rights rally as worries over violence, hate groups and militias grow

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