The Sixth Seal

Douggg · Aug 31, 2019

Seventh Head said:
I was showing keras, who stated that the next prophesied event is the 6th seal, that he was wrong and told him why I disagree. Now, if keras prefers 'to be right' when asking me to take my opinions elsewhere, I don't want to bother him. He seems to have enough work with other posters.

You should have wrote more straighforward that the sixth seal events are not next because the events of first seal are still future of us.

Instead you went off on a tangent about how Revelation is structured, bottomlined by, you writing...

"As long as one has not understood these points, there is no discussion possible. NONE."

And you didn't give a link to your thread, whereby you presented your case about June 21, 2019.

"Your statement is but a guesswork too. I state here that the very first seal has not come to fruition yet, but has symbolically started on June 21 2019 (there is a clear reason for that, of course)."

I will give my opinion of what it boils down to Seventh Head, is that no-one here buys into your Princess Diana end times based view, in the video. And really don't care to spend the time and energy on it. The intricacies of your presentation doesn't correspond within the general norms, to relate to the framework of most people's eschatology.

You can try to stir up interest - but my personal opinion is that interest is just not there.

mkgal1 · Aug 31, 2019

keras said:
Can the Holy Spirit post here? Can the HS actually point out and explain the Prophetic Word for us?
Does the HS have a website?
No, we must discern the Word for ourselves and most seem to get it wrong by making wild assumptions and by believing false theories.

This explains a lot.

keras · Sep 1, 2019

mkgal1 said:
This explains a lot.

I will ignore that nasty insinuation.

So if the Holy Spirit is the means whereby we Christians learn about God's Plans, then why is there so much variety of belief and opinion among Christians about what will happen in the end times?
There is only one way that the time between now and the Return of Jesus will take place. That way, Gods' Plan; is told to us by the Bible prophets, but because of peoples beliefs in fables and false teachings, they are unable to see the truth. God makes people incapable of understanding the prophesies and it will be only after things have happened that their eyes will be opened and their ears unstopped. Isaiah 35:4-5, Isaiah 32:3-4, Matthew 11:25

It is provable Biblically, historically and logically; that the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster will be the next prophesied event.
That most just can't see that is because what will happen is God's test of our faith, exactly as 1 Peter 4:12 tells us.

mkgal1 · Sep 1, 2019

keras said:
I will ignore that nasty insinuation.

So if the Holy Spirit is the means whereby we Christians learn about God's Plans, then why is there so much variety of belief and opinion among Christians about what will happen in the end times?

I meant that comment as a matter of fact.

There are so many varieties of beliefs - I believe - because people and their own ideas and biases get in the way of Truth. At least you're admitting (ISTM, anyway) that you rely on your own discernment.

keras · Sep 1, 2019

mkgal1 said:
I meant that comment as a matter of fact.

There are so many varieties of beliefs - I believe - because people and their own ideas and biases get in the way of Truth. At least you're admitting (ISTM, anyway) that you rely on your own discernment.

No mkgal1, I rely on the Prophetic Word.
What I have presented in this thread and elsewhere, is what the Bible prophets wrote.
Because what they actually wrote conflicts with what you have been led to believe, you reject them. Is that the right course of action?
Jesus said that many would be deceived, are you quite sure you aren't one of them?

The Forthcoming Punishment by the Lord; the Sixth Seal:

Psalm 65:1-3 The Lord springs into action! His enemies scatter like smoke and the godless are destroyed before Him. The righteous are happy and praise God.

Isaiah 66:15-16 The Lord will judge with fire...He will test mankind, many will be slain by Him. Zephaniah 3:8, 2 Peter 3:7

1 Peter 4:12-19 Do not be afraid of the fiery ordeal that comes to test everyone. Judgement is coming, continue in your faith, entrust your souls to Him, your Maker will not fail you.

Jeremiah 30:7 How awful is that Day, it will be a time of anguish for Jacob, [His Israelite people, faithful Christians] yet they will come through it safely.

Isaiah 24:6 A curse covers the earth, its people suffer – their numbers dwindle, only a few are left.

Isaiah 10:19 ....forests and pastures will be suddenly devastated, only a few trees will remain.

Isaiah 29:4 Judah will be brought low, the few survivors will hide underground. Isaiah 22:14, Zephaniah 1:14-18

Zephaniah 3:8-10 The whole earth will be burned by the fire of My anger....then I shall purify the speech of the peoples, that they may call upon the Name of the Lord. My worshippers, now far off, will bring offerings to Me.

Ezekiel 34:12 I shall rescue My sheep from wherever they have been scattered in the Day of cloud and darkness. [His sheep- John 10:1-27]

Isaiah 45:20 Gather together and come near, you survivors of the nations. Psalms 107

Isaiah 58:11-12 The Lord will guide and satisfy you in the sun scorched Land. You will rebuild the ancient ruins and restore the houses and towns.

Psalm 69:34-36 The Lord will deliver Zion and rebuild the towns of Judah. His [righteous] people will settle there and possess the holy Land.

Ezekiel 36:36 The nations around that remain, will know that I, the Lord, have rebuilt what was destroyed and have replanted what was desolate.

Ezekiel 6:8-18 As the slain fall around you, you will know that I am the Lord. But among the nations, there will be some of you that will survive. They will remember Me; those of My people, scattered in exile, when I remove their idolatrous hearts. They will loath themselves for the evils they committed and know My threats were not in vain.
Ref: REB. NIV. Some verses abridged.

keras · Sep 2, 2019

What Comes Next:

Habakkuk 1:5 Look around you among the nations, see there a sight that will utterly astound you, you will not believe it when you are told of what is being done in your days.

Habakkuk 1:6-11 goes on to say how the Babylonians were appointed to execute judgement against the House of Judah, but the preceding verses in Habakkuk 1:1-4 are a general indictment onto peoples and nations whose ‘laws are ineffective and where justice is overruled’. Therefore this threat of action by the Lord applies to our times, as well.

Acts 13:40-41 Beware, then lest you bring down upon yourselves the doom proclaimed by the prophets. Look, you who fail to grasp the truth, be surprised and perish. I am doing a work in your days, something that you will not believe, even though it has been pointed out to you.

This is the parallel passage from the New Testament. Pauls quote, was nothing to do with Jesus and His work on the cross, the message of salvation is not ‘doom’.
It applies to the end times: ‘your days’, not his days; but our days.

The ‘Doom proclaimed by the prophets’, will be the great and terrible Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath. All the prophets and Jesus make it clear that this ‘Day of doom’, is the next prophesied event that we can expect to happen. Jesus quoted the first and half of the second verse of Isaiah 61:1-2, at the commencement of His ministry. The worldwide Day of vengeance of our God’, is the next prophesied event, still not yet happened. It will be the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster, which commences all the prophesied end times events, leading up to the glorious Return of Jesus.

More than 100 prophecies throughout the Bible describe in vivid detail this forthcoming punishment onto the whole world by devastating fire, earthquakes, storms and tsunamis. This sudden and shocking event will take most people unawares and we are told by Paul, that those who are ‘surprised’; that is unaware and unprepared, then: they may perish.. Ezekiel 21:3-4

Isaiah 30:26 tells us what it is that causes this worldwide devastation and also that it will be ‘the Day the Lord saves His people’. who are all faithful Christians, who truly believe in Jesus and a few Messianic Jews who are protected in Jerusalem. Isaiah 29:4

Therefore it is up to us to take heed of the warnings, Isaiah 24:1, Isaiah 26:20-21 and to be prepared for all the effects of a massive CME sunstrike that will kill about 1/3 of the world’s population and will destroy all of our modern infrastructure. Jeremiah 9:22

Then, for all who love the Lord and keep His Commandments, the Lord is ‘waiting to show His favor’, Isaiah 30:18-20

Douggg · Sep 3, 2019

keras said:
What Comes Next:
....................................
...................................
Therefore it is up to us to take heed of the warnings, Isaiah 24:1, Isaiah 26:20-21 and to be prepared for all the effects of a massive CME sunstrike that will kill about 1/3 of the world’s population and will destroy all of our modern infrastructure. Jeremiah 9:22

Then, for all who love the Lord and keep His Commandments, the Lord is ‘waiting to show His favor’, Isaiah 30:18-20

Keras, in Matthew 24 where is there indication of a CME sunstrike killing a third of mankind aforehand of the great tribulation?

keras · Sep 3, 2019

Douggg said:
Keras, in Matthew 24 where is there indication of a CME sunstrike killing a third of mankind aforehand of the great tribulation?

You know very well that Bible prophecy is a little here, a little there.
Prophesies that inform us what the Lord will use on Hs terrible Day of fiery wrath, are mostly found in the Old Testament, but Matthew 24:27 & 37-41 do refer to it.
Also Luke 21:25-26 describes the cosmic effects and how people will be terrified as they see the approaching mass about to strike. Jeremiah 6:24-26

A Coronal Mass Ejection is the only thing that can and will cause all the prophesied effects on the Day of the Lord's vengeance and wrath.
As CME's are naturally occurring phenomena, this forthcoming disaster will allow people to continue in their denial of God and to form a One World Govt, soon to be ruled by a dictator.

It is clear from many prophesies that the Day of fiery wrath will be the commencement of the end time events, there has to be some kind of dramatic change to the world to enable all the events to happen, leading up to the glorious Return of Jesus. Where He dose NOT destroy anything other than the armies at Armageddon.

Douggg · Sep 3, 2019

keras said:
Also Luke 21:25-26 describes the cosmic effects and how people will be terrified as they see the approaching mass about to strike. Jeremiah 6:24-26

You are one verse shy in Luke 21. If you had included verse 27, it is obviously not at the beginning of the 7 years.

25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;

26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.

27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.

Luke 21:25-27, I equate with Matthew 24:30, both at the end of the 7 years.

A Coronal Mass Ejection is the only thing that can and will cause all the prophesied effects on the Day of the Lord's vengeance and wrath.
As CME's are naturally occurring phenomena, this forthcoming disaster will allow people to continue in their denial of God and to form a One World Govt, soon to be ruled by a dictator.

Instead of your interpretation and application, I think during the great tribulation...

Revelation 8:7 The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.

Revelation 16:8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.

9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.

It is clear from many prophesies that the Day of fiery wrath will be the commencement of the end time events, there has to be some kind of dramatic change to the world to enable all the events to happen, leading up to the glorious Return of Jesus. Where He dose NOT destroy anything other than the armies at Armageddon.

During the great tribulation, a big portion of the world's population will perish. The second trumpet woe has a third of mankind killed by the big army.

I think if there was an event, substantial as you are interpreting happening before the 7 years, there would have been mention of it by Jesus in Matthew 24. Also it is not in Daniel 7, the rise of the little horn person.

keras · Sep 3, 2019

Douggg said:
You are one verse shy in Luke 21. If you had included verse 27, it is obviously not at the beginning of the 7 years.

Luke 21:27 goes on to mention the Return. Like most prophecy, the passage is a sequence of events.
It isn't necessary to think the Return will come immediately after the Lord's Day of wrath.
The fact of those 2 events being placed where they are in Revelation, is the proof.

Douggg said:
Instead of your interpretation and application, I think during the great tribulation...

Yes, there will be another CME during the Great Tribulation, as you show; in Rev 16:8
But this fact; again messes up your theory of the Lords Day of fiery wrath will happen at the Return.

Douggg said:
I think if there was an event, substantial as you are interpreting happening before the 7 years, there would have been mention of it by Jesus in Matthew 24. Also it is not in Daniel 7, the rise of the little horn person.

Jesus did, of course; know about His Day of fiery Wrath, He stopped reading Isaiah 61:1-2, just before that prophecy. At that time He didn't know when it would happen, Matthew 24:36, only God knew. Now; He is ready to do this: Psalms 11:4-6, 2 Peter 3:7

As for Daniel 7 and the rise of the 'beast', how do you think a One World Govt can be formed, that the Anti-Christ will lead and persecute the Christians?
There has to be some kind of dramatic event, in order for the nations to relinquish their sovereignty. That worldwide disaster is graphically described in more that 100 Bible prophesies. Be ready for it!

The verse in Revelation 19:12 may confuse you, because it says;.... for it is He who will rule the nations with a rod of iron and tread the winepress of the fierce wrath of God.
But we know that the Day of wrath and all the 7 Trumpets and 7 Bowls are finished BEFORE the Return, from Revelation 15:1
It is totally illogical and unscriptural to believe that Jesus will destroy the world when He comes to rule over it.

mkgal1 · Sep 3, 2019

keras said:
Also Luke 21:25-26 describes the cosmic effects and how people will be terrified as they see the approaching mass about to strike. Jeremiah 6:24-26

Luke 21:28 - So when all these things begin to happen, stand and look up, for your salvation is near!”

By placing the context of what Jesus was speaking of, in Luke 21, in the future you are also placing His work of salvation also into the context of a future event.

keras · Sep 3, 2019

mkgal1 said:
Luke 21:28 - So when all these things begin to happen, stand and look up, for your salvation is near!”

By placing the context of what Jesus was speaking of, in Luke 21, in the future you are also placing His work of salvation also into the context of a future event.

Luke 21:28 When all this begins to happen, hold your heads high because your liberation is near. Revised English Bible. A translation that makes sense.

mkgal1 · Sep 3, 2019

keras said:
Luke 21:28 When all this begins to happen, hold your heads high because your liberation is near. Revised English Bible. A translation that make sense.

Okay, well ...considering that Jesus' audience was in ancient Jerusalem around 33-34 AD.....liberation from what (if not sin and death)?

Douggg · Sep 3, 2019

keras said:
As for Daniel 7 and the rise of the 'beast', how do you think a One World Govt can be formed, that the Anti-Christ will lead and persecute the Christians?
There has to be some kind of dramatic event, in order for the nations to relinquish their sovereignty. That worldwide disaster is graphically described in more that 100 Bible prophesies. Be ready for it!

I don't think Daniel 7 indicates a one world government. I think that there will be a dominant kingdom, the fourth kingdom.

The other three kingdoms will be allowed to continue for a while, although their dominion is take away, after the fourth kingdom, that of the little horn is destroyed. Daniel 7:11-12 KJV.

I don't think the little horn will initially come to power as a dictator. I think he will come to power in some sort of democratic process.

A dramatic event does not have to climate disaster. Hitler for example came to power because of financial collapse in Germany. And the worldwide great depression.

What I think to be ready for is Luke 21:34-36.

keras said:
It is totally illogical and unscriptural to believe that Jesus will destroy the world when He comes to rule over it.

Yes it is illogical. Who is advocating that ?

I think I would consider the dismantling and destruction of Satan's kingdom of Babylon the Great instead.

Douggg · Sep 3, 2019

keras said:
Luke 21:28 When all this begins to happen, hold your heads high because your liberation is near. Revised English Bible. A translation that make sense.

mkgal1 said:
Okay, well ...considering that Jesus' audience was in ancient Jerusalem around 33-34 AD.....liberation from what?

28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh. KJV

Rapture, redemption of the body.

keras · Sep 4, 2019

mkgal1 said:
Okay, well ...considering that Jesus' audience was in ancient Jerusalem around 33-34 AD.....liberation from what (if not sin and death)?

Luke 21:25-28 is plainly an unfulfilled end time prophecy. It does not refer to a rapture or a change of the body.
It means our liberation from the wiles of Satan.

keras · Sep 4, 2019

Douggg said:
I don't think Daniel 7 indicates a one world government. I think that there will be a dominant kingdom, the fourth kingdom.

Dominant kingdom; that is over all the world, excepting for the holy Land, the new nation of Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5

Douggg said:
I don't think the little horn will initially come to power as a dictator. I think he will come to power in some sort of democratic process.

Why do you rely on guesswork and supposition for your beliefs?
The Bible tells us how the AC will gain power. Revelation 17:11-13, Daniel 11:21

Douggg said:
What I think to be ready for is Luke 21:34-36.

Yes; that prophecy refers to the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster and verse 36b refers to the final Judgment after the Millennium.

Douggg said:
Yes it is illogical. Who is advocating that ?

I think I would consider the dismantling and destruction of Satan's kingdom of Babylon the Great instead.

I didn't mean the total destruction of the world, just the death of millions and the loss of our modern infrastructure.
Satans power will end when Jesus destorys his armies and chains him up. Revelation 19:17-21 He will be released for a short time at the end of the Mill, then he and all the ungodly angels and humans willbe thrown into the Lake of Fire.

Douggg · Sep 4, 2019

keras said:
Dominant kingdom; that is over all the world, excepting for the holy Land, the new nation of Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5

Israel included, because them in Judea are told to flee to the mountains.

keras said:
The Bible tells us how the AC will gain power. Revelation 17:11-13, Daniel 11:21

Revelation 17:11-13 - is after the person has become the beast.* It is then that he becomes dictator of the fourth kingdom, but not when he initially comes to power as the little horn. *see my chart below. "Brought back to life, now the beast"

Daniel 11:21 is not end times.

keras said:
Yes; that prophecy refers to the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster and verse 36b refers to the final Judgment after the Millennium.

Luke 21:34-36 is referring to the beginning of the Day of the Lord, as a snare, no escape. In 1Thessalonians5:3

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

verse 36 escape all those things = rapture

Douggg · Sep 4, 2019

keras · Sep 4, 2019

Douggg said:
Israel included, because them in Judea are told to flee to the mountains.

That warning applied to the Christian Jews in 70 AD. Past history.

Douggg said:
Revelation 17:11-13 - is after the person has become the beast.* It is then that he becomes dictator of the fourth kingdom, but not when he initially comes to power as the little horn. *see my chart below. "Brought back to life, now the beast"

Correct.
As for your chart, you probably wouldn't like a critique of it, as it is more error than truth. The 2300 days, for example was fulfilled in 167-164 BC.

Douggg said:
Daniel 11:21 is not end times.

Who was that vile person, then? Please support your opinion with scripture or historical facts.

Douggg said:
Luke 21:34-36 is referring to the beginning of the Day of the Lord, as a snare, no escape. In 1Thessalonians5:3

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

verse 36 escape all those things = rapture

This belief is anomalous. Luke 21:34-36 says that the Lord's wrath will fall upon everyone, no one can escape it. Then you and most 'rapture to heaven' deceived people, stupidly think verse 36 means removal.
This idea totally contradicts the many verses that plainly say we must endure until the end.

The Sixth Seal

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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