Gillette's new ad isn't about shaving. It's about men in the age of #metoo

Hazelelponi · Jan 17, 2019

A_Thinker said:
You do know that all people are not Christian.

What percentage of people do you think are really christian. Jesus said that the road to life is narrow.

What are you willing to do to protect your female loved-ones from the non-Christians who think that they can have their way with them ?

The majority aren't Christian. The majority in the ghetto I was safe walking in at 4am weren't Christian either. The Christian is actually a minority in this nation..

The majority of people I've met in this country were not Christian. as a matter of fact I would go so far as to say the first real Christian I ever met was my (current) husband.

What am I willing to do to protect my granddaughters? I see nothing broken in western society. And I'm happy to hand them, and my grandsons, freedom.

ToBeLoved · Jan 17, 2019

A_Thinker said:
Too many of my female loved-ones have related to me stories like this ... told only after years of hiding the secret ... for me to not be a part of a possible solution.

The ad was not calling for men to be neutered ... it was calling for good, decent men to step up and do what they can ... to shield and protect their loved-ones ...

I don’t think there is a question about whether bad people need correction.

The question to me, is as Christians, set apart by Christ, it should not be from the world.

We should all be troubled at the idea of advertisers pushing a political or moral agenda on the public.

Next we will see advertisers targeting LBTQ ( I think that’s the initials) and we can enter the underground raves of cross dressers r transvestite prostitution compliments of Proctor and Gamble. Playing in our Facebook sidebars for our kids to see or as a YouTube commercial

RDKirk · Jan 17, 2019

Albion said:
Well, I am a man, and I have had to deal with it in my own life.

But the more important point is that what happens somewhere, sometime, to somebody is NOT "what men are like." And that is what the commercial we are discussing is--stereotyping.

Except that the commercial actually spends more air time showing men doing good than men doing bad, so how can you say they are stereotyping?

Albion · Jan 17, 2019

RDKirk said:
Except that the commercial actually spends more air time showing men doing good than men doing bad, so how can you say they are stereotyping?

It does show both types of men, but it is obvious that the "good" ones are to be seen as men who have turned over a new leaf, so presenting them that way only supports the idea that men are naturally of the other kind.

grasping the after wind · Jan 17, 2019

RDKirk said:
So what are the two sides, exactly? Who is on them?

Let's draw a line and all the men who want to grab women's butts can get on one side, and the other ment who don't care for a culture in which the butts of their wives and sisters and daughters are free for men to grab can stand on the other side.

I already draw that line and am, along with just about every man I know, firmly ensconced on the side of not grabbing, but Gillette seems to want to say the side of the line that wants to grab is the norm not the exception. They show one or two men intervening in some action that we actually only guess would have happened as it is contravened in advance and a line that seems to stretch to infinity saying "boys will be boys" . The whole idea that a corporation like Gillette considers itself to have the moral chops to preach to us is also quite insulting.

Kaon · Jan 17, 2019

Norbert L said:
The way I see the core issue, is it the right way to deal with the past? Present day boys and young men are more like clean slates and have little or nothing to do with those previous decades of toxic masculinity.

I believe Dr. Jordan B. Peterson in his numerous talks and interviews about western society around the world correctly points out that it's having a negative effect on young men. It's like the saying, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

The reason why something becomes toxic is because remedies are ignored or postponed out of discomfort.

stop coddling boys, because the world won't stop breaking their testicles. Keep teaching them how to correctly respond.

The reason why Americans see this as novel is because the nation as a whole only superficially acknowledges its own historical atrocities done to others, and their own people. As long as that continues, companies teaching the consumer will continue. And, the toxicity will continue.

But to be clear on my point, the outcry is futility; on many facets America is too far gone. That's how toxic it is - only now that the STINCH of the deeds of the nation have risen so high it's saturated the population is there outcry and complaining. It's too late.

No reason to be soft with children/young adults since those older than them are adults set in their ways, who perpetuated the toxicity through SILENCE, COMPLACENCY, or ACTIVITY.

Pedra · Jan 17, 2019

Looks like Gillette has some splaining to do! marketing hypocrisy-- much??

Kaon · Jan 17, 2019

People keep forgetting that while your son or nephew may not "need" to see the ad, the COMMANDER IN CHIEF that publically berates women, and many other misogynist activities, is getting a platform to express this toxicity to the world.

And, it is like pulling chicken teeth to get people to admit it. That is why a company would feel the need to educate the consumer base. For one thing, they want you brain dead, but not so brain dead that you cannot even see or acknowledge what is in front of you, and how it affects the world. Otherwise, you aren't a useful consumer; you are a zealot, and not a possible customer anyway.

Gillette is targeting those lukewarm people who are not so sure about where and what they are in this plane of existence.

Kaon · Jan 17, 2019

Pedra said:
Looks like Gillette has some splaining to do! marketing hypocrisy-- much??

Companies have no moral obligation in capotalism; only law. Hypocrisy is legal, and a useful tactic for business - and presidencies.

The hypocrisy of Gillette isn't the issue, it's that they actually believed that the culture was so weak that THEY could provide their own insight. I think everyone is focused on the posterior pain, and not the subtle up finger to consumers and the average PERSON (including women).

Hazelelponi · Jan 17, 2019

A good article for people to read when they have a few minutes.

Radical constructivism is thus a dangerous idea that has become authoritative. It forwards the idea that we must, on moral grounds, largely reject the belief that access to objective truth exists (scientific objectivity) and can be discovered, in principle, by any entity capable of doing the work, or more specifically by humans of any race, gender, or sexuality (scientific universality) via empirical testing (scientific empiricism). (This particular belief is sometimes referred to as “radical skepticism,” although philosophers also have other meanings for this term.) Although knowledge is always provisional and open to revision, there are better and worse ways to get closer to it, and the scientific method is the best we have found. By contrast, the means offered by critical theory are demonstrably and fatally flawed. Particularly, this approach rejects scientific universality and objectivity and insists, on moral grounds, that we must largely accept the notion of multiple, identity-based “truths,” such as a putative “feminist glaciology.” Under critical constructivism, this gains an explicitly radical political motivation.

Academic Grievance Studies and the Corruption of Scholarship - Areo

And while this article discusses the issues within academia, this is what has become pervasive throughout society. They've done a good job exporting their ideology throughout our society.

This is the problem. A serious one.

Pedra · Jan 17, 2019

Speaking of targeting ......Gillette seems to have drank the left's kool-aid & there is the hypocrisy as we see-- the tightly clothed women in ad & Gillette's Brand logo across models' butts in order to sell razors! sexually exploitive of Gillette. Tsk, Tisk!

JacobKStarkey · Jan 17, 2019

ToBeLoved said:
Adopt me

I like Beamers. Donate Gillette to homeless shelter.

I donate heavily to the shelters.

Certain men in our society are still preying on women, instead of praying for them.

If a business can make a profit by pushing for a better world, I will support it.

Pedra · Jan 17, 2019

Finger pointing by Gillette---> points right back at Gillette for exploiting women & making them sex objects to sell razors.

Kaon · Jan 17, 2019

Pedra said:
Speaking of targeting ......Gillette seems to have drank the left's kool-aid & there is the hypocrisy as we see-- the tightly clothed women in ad & Gillette's Brand logo across models' butts in order to sell razors! sexually exploitive of Gillette. Tsk, Tisk!

If you see this as left-right, the ad was for you.

If you see this as men-women, the ad was for you.

If you see this as a polar issue - brilliant or disgusting, for example - then, this ad is for you.

Even the Easter eggs of Gillette hypocrisy are engineered for those who have a view of duality.

As I said, US is so culturally confused that they hold on to what they know and lash out at changes. It's human EXPLOITABLE nature. The point isn't about toxic masculinity or extolling the good men: it is about the psychological exploitation of cultural insecurities and ignorance.

A capitalist company that uses women in apparent scant clothing is so comfortable with the toxicity of the culture that it feels it can get away with educating such a culture. America is predictably fallen, because no matter what the culture is UNIFIED in being segregated and separate. Easy pickings for those kingdoms that have been through this before.

Albion · Jan 17, 2019

Kaon said:
Gillette is targeting those lukewarm people who are not so sure about where and what they are in this plane of existence.

Probably not. It is more likely that the company wants to cater to those "progressives" who think of themselves as activists. These are people who make every purchase be a reflection of their politics.

Norbert L · Jan 17, 2019

Sparagmos said:
Grabbers don’t do it right in front of other men, for the most part. And in my expertience men don’t call each other out for sexist and degrading comments.

Albion said:
In Gillette's case, however, that is made to seem perfectly okay if you, the viewer, happen to be that sort of guy. The company runs commercials that feature women in such poses.

For those who are of the other persuasion, though, there is the hope that these might fall for the "toxic masculinity" commercial we are discussing here.

None of this would be happening, it is certain, if Gillette's share of the market had not fallen from 70% to under 50% in recent years.

RDKirk said:
And some will say, "Boys will be boys."

Nobody ever says, "Boys will be boys," when the boys are doing something right.

And every time someone says "boys will be boys," every single time that's said is a time that some man should have stepped in, stopped it, and used it as a teaching moment to be a better man.

Is the controversy just about profit margins, that there are grabbers and sexist comments or just about boys will be boys? I believe that's missing the mark as to why there's an uproar about this in the first place.

I believe people should ask themselves why there is such a division about these types of commercials in the first place. There have been others like the Pesi ad where someone gives a police officer a can of their product during a protest. Why?

There's something about it reflected in the numbers that doesn't inspire men to be better. There's no denying that and trying to unpack it seems to lead to numerous rabbit trials. One of the better focused and in depth articles I've read is from Forbes.
Why Gillette's New Ad Campaign Is Toxic

Edit:

Kaon said:
The reason why something becomes toxic is because remedies are ignored or postponed out of discomfort.

stop coddling boys, because the world won't stop breaking their testicles. Keep teaching them how to correctly respond.

The reason why Americans see this as novel is because the nation as a whole only superficially acknowledges its own historical atrocities done to others, and their own people. As long as that continues, companies teaching the consumer will continue. And, the toxicity will continue.

But to be clear on my point, the outcry is futility; on many facets America is too far gone. That's how toxic it is - only now that the STINCH of the deeds of the nation have risen so high it's saturated the population is there outcry and complaining. It's too late.

No reason to be soft with children/young adults since those older than them are adults set in their ways, who perpetuated the toxicity through SILENCE, COMPLACENCY, or ACTIVITY.

There are too many topics for me to adequately address. I would suggest reading the above article from Forbes.

JacobKStarkey · Jan 17, 2019

Albion said:
It does show both types of men, but it is obvious that the "good" ones are to be seen as men who have turned over a new leaf, so presenting them that way only supports the idea that men are naturally of the other kind.

Nope, Albion, there is nothing to indicate that the do-gooders "are to be seen as men who have turned over a new leaft, . .".

There is nothing to suggest that.

Albion · Jan 17, 2019

JacobKStarkey said:
Nope, Albion, there is nothing to indicate that the do-gooders "are to be seen as men who have turned over a new leaf, . .".

There is nothing to suggest that.

We are each entitled to our opinions, but what I suggested is what I thought as I viewed the commercial for the first time. It did not leave me with the idea that most men do raise their children not to be bullies, etc. etc., so hooray for them.

Pedra · Jan 17, 2019

Albion said:
We are each entitled to our opinions, but what I suggested is what I thought as I viewed the commercial for the first time. It did not leave me with the idea that most men do raise their children not to be bullies, etc. etc., so hooray for them.

And why the progressives/ gillette attribute bullying as a male quality?? because little girls get bullied by mean bullying girls as much or more. There is a whole feminist myth that men are worse then women & manly qualities are all negative & that men should be more like women. God forbid!

Pedra · Jan 17, 2019

Kaon said:
Companies have no moral obligation in capotalism; only law. Hypocrisy is legal, and a useful tactic for business - and presidencies.

The hypocrisy of Gillette isn't the issue, it's that they actually believed that the culture was so weak that THEY could provide their own insight. I think everyone is focused on the posterior pain, and not the subtle up finger to consumers and the average PERSON (including women).

Gillette & the likes of them, really need to stop on the moral lecturing of the rest of society, it's the glass house effect. Imo, any Celebrity or Brand that uses their platform to get political looses my business. The phoney-ness, dishonesty, obvious biases & hypocrisy of the progressive view just gets just so tiresome.

Gillette's new ad isn't about shaving. It's about men in the age of #metoo

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