Love for others vs. personal freedom: Must it be either/or?

LovebirdsFlying

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Posted by me on my Facebook page, in response to the flap over "Baby It's Cold Outside":

People were offended because Jesus and His disciples didn't ceremonially wash their hands. Those people were silly to be offended, and Jesus said so. But He didn't tell His disciples to respond by smearing mud all over their hands and waving it in those people's faces in a deliberate attempt to offend them. Do with that whatever you like.​

I'm still seeing, it feels like every other post in my news feed, some variation on "Oh, some people are offended? Well, they're stupid, so let's keep playing/singing/referring to that song, just to annoy them." I ask again, is that really how Jesus would have it? Is that what He taught? Funnily enough, some of the people endlessly passing those posts along also liked and agreed with what I said above--but then, it seems, totally disregarded it. OK, I get the point that's being made, but at this stage, I'd say it's been made. And hammered into the ground. And then dug up and hammered in again.

To illustrate it another way, let's say that for whatever reason, you're offended by the word "pancake." Well, that certainly seems silly to me. I can't think of any situation in the world where it could even remotely be seen as offensive. But I'm not inside your head. I don't know your reasoning, or your personal history with it. However, hey, now. You've just infringed on my personal freedom to use whatever word I want, whenever I want to. In response, I follow you around all day, constantly getting up in your face, screaming, "Pancake, pancake, pancake, pancake!" In doing this, am I acting out of love for you?

Some people think so. They may believe they're desensitizing the other person, showing them that this "horrible" word isn't so big and bad after all, and teaching them not to be so easily offended. I know from personal experience, that's not how exposure therapy works. A desensitization process needs to be done gently, gradually, and with compassion, not with judgment.

But I suspect that the motivation is not actually love for the overly sensitive person, but having fun at their expense, and feeling superior to them by holding them up to ridicule. Even if you think the ridicule is justified, you're still elevating yourself above them. My "two cents' worth" here is that yes, we do live in a free country. But "free" doesn't equate to "I get to do as I please, whenever I please, regardless of its effect on anybody else, and phooey on you if you don't like it." That is anything but a loving, Christian attitude.

No, I'm not suggesting anybody should stop playing or hearing a song they don't have a problem with, just because somebody else does. But is it too much to ask, not to *make* them listen to it if they don't want to?
 

com7fy8

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You seem like you have grown in how to love :)
A desensitization process needs to be done gently, gradually, and with compassion, not with judgment.
I would say it needs to be done with the consent of the person we want to help to desensitize.

We might make an issue of if the sensitive one is being loving, by making a problem about what does not really matter. Even if something is wrong, it might not be worth giving it a lot of attention. But example can help more.

What do you think? :)

But I suspect that the motivation is not actually love for the overly sensitive person, but having fun at their expense, and feeling superior to them by holding them up to ridicule.
Even if I was not trying to ridicule the person, thank you for reminding me of how I need to have compassion for other people. I need to not look down on people even if they are being sensitive in a way which is maybe self-righteous. Don't let their self-righteousness get me to also be self-righteous by looking down on them and/or ridiculing them.

My "two cents' worth" here is that yes, we do live in a free country. But "free" doesn't equate to "I get to do as I please, whenever I please, regardless of its effect on anybody else, and phooey on you if you don't like it." That is anything but a loving, Christian attitude.
We have rights, but we need to love any and all others as ourselves. I think our rights are meant to be exercised in an unselfish way. Or else, are we truly free? :)

Jesus is free; yet, Jesus in His care for us left Heaven itself in order to reach us and share with us. Jesus could have stayed in Heaven where He had all going for Him like He did. But Jesus is so unconceited, that Jesus came here to us!!!
 
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LovebirdsFlying

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Yes, with the consent of the person being desensitized. Very important point. Thank you. Especially if oversensitivity *is* the result of a mental disorder, help must be wanted or it won't be effective.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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Posted by me on my Facebook page, in response to the flap over "Baby It's Cold Outside":

People were offended because Jesus and His disciples didn't ceremonially wash their hands. Those people were silly to be offended, and Jesus said so. But He didn't tell His disciples to respond by smearing mud all over their hands and waving it in those people's faces in a deliberate attempt to offend them. Do with that whatever you like.​

I'm still seeing, it feels like every other post in my news feed, some variation on "Oh, some people are offended? Well, they're stupid, so let's keep playing/singing/referring to that song, just to annoy them." I ask again, is that really how Jesus would have it? Is that what He taught? Funnily enough, some of the people endlessly passing those posts along also liked and agreed with what I said above--but then, it seems, totally disregarded it. OK, I get the point that's being made, but at this stage, I'd say it's been made. And hammered into the ground. And then dug up and hammered in again.

To illustrate it another way, let's say that for whatever reason, you're offended by the word "pancake." Well, that certainly seems silly to me. I can't think of any situation in the world where it could even remotely be seen as offensive. But I'm not inside your head. I don't know your reasoning, or your personal history with it. However, hey, now. You've just infringed on my personal freedom to use whatever word I want, whenever I want to. In response, I follow you around all day, constantly getting up in your face, screaming, "Pancake, pancake, pancake, pancake!" In doing this, am I acting out of love for you?

Some people think so. They may believe they're desensitizing the other person, showing them that this "horrible" word isn't so big and bad after all, and teaching them not to be so easily offended. I know from personal experience, that's not how exposure therapy works. A desensitization process needs to be done gently, gradually, and with compassion, not with judgment.

But I suspect that the motivation is not actually love for the overly sensitive person, but having fun at their expense, and feeling superior to them by holding them up to ridicule. Even if you think the ridicule is justified, you're still elevating yourself above them. My "two cents' worth" here is that yes, we do live in a free country. But "free" doesn't equate to "I get to do as I please, whenever I please, regardless of its effect on anybody else, and phooey on you if you don't like it." That is anything but a loving, Christian attitude.

No, I'm not suggesting anybody should stop playing or hearing a song they don't have a problem with, just because somebody else does. But is it too much to ask, not to *make* them listen to it if they don't want to?

That's why they put "on/OFF" knobs on radios.
 
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LovebirdsFlying

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That's why they put "on/OFF" knobs on radios.
True. But what if we're not the ones in control of the radio? If we're in a shopping mall or something, and the song is playing overhead, what are we going to do? Tell them not to play it? We don't get to make that decision for everybody, but we can choose to step outside for the maybe three minutes or so it would take for the song to stop playing. Or use headphones so we can listen to the music of our own choosing.

If I'm in my house or my car, for example, and one of my guests or passengers was disturbed by a song, I'd just listen to it later, when they're not around. If they have a problem with me listening to it at all, even in their absence, then that's controlling me, and that would be them in the wrong.

If the situation is reversed, if I'm the one bothered by the song playing in somebody else's house or car, I think I'd just grit my teeth and bear it. If I know the person well enough, I'd tell them why it bothers me. But if their response is to laugh at me, call me names, and then put the song on repeat and turn up the volume just to spite me, I seriously believe I should rethink associating with that person. I may be oversensitive, but that's mean-spirited, and that's not good either.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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True. But what if we're not the ones in control of the radio? If we're in a shopping mall or something, and the song is playing overhead, what are we going to do? Tell them not to play it? We don't get to make that decision for everybody, but we can choose to step outside for the maybe three minutes or so it would take for the song to stop playing. Or use headphones so we can listen to the music of our own choosing.

If I'm in my house or my car, for example, and one of my guests or passengers was disturbed by a song, I'd just listen to it later, when they're not around. If they have a problem with me listening to it at all, even in their absence, then that's controlling me, and that would be them in the wrong.

If the situation is reversed, if I'm the one bothered by the song playing in somebody else's house or car, I think I'd just grit my teeth and bear it. If I know the person well enough, I'd tell them why it bothers me. But if their response is to laugh at me, call me names, and then put the song on repeat and turn up the volume just to spite me, I seriously believe I should rethink associating with that person. I may be oversensitive, but that's mean-spirited, and that's not good either.

When my kids or grandkids play something on the radio or tv that bothers me...I just leave the room.
 
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LovebirdsFlying

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This is related. I'm tacking it onto the existing thread rather than starting a new one.

I saw it again on Facebook, a meme with the words "It's called a joke. We used to make those, back before everybody started getting offended over everything."

First of all, if they think getting offended is anything new, perhaps they've forgotten why the Smothers Brothers were taken off the air, and how they couldn't even say the word "pregnant" on I Love Lucy.

But that's not where I was going with this.

The trouble with "it's just a joke" is that too many times, it's been used as an excuse for genuine cruelty. Picture this scenario, one that has happened many times in many forms.

Shelly is taking a class in architecture in high school. She's just about completed building a 3D model of a house, but she hasn't added the roof yet. She wants to show the detail inside the rooms before she puts the roof on, so she calls her family to come and look at what she's done so far. Immediately, "Why doesn't it have a roof?"

When Shelly tries to explain that it's right over there; she simply hasn't put it on yet, nobody lets her get a word in edgewise. "You're studying architecture, and you don't even know houses are supposed to have a roof? What, is there some kind of invisible force field to keep the rain out? That's something we'd expect of you. You've got no sense."

Of course she puts the roof on before turning it in, whereupon they make it out like she wouldn't have known to do it until they told her to. They start telling all of their friends and relatives how silly old Shelly has invented something new; houses with no roof.

Naturally, if Shelly gets very upset, they'll turn it all on her. "We know you were going to put on a roof, dummy. It's called a joke. We're just having fun with you. Quit being such a stick in the mud. You might want to consider growing a sense of humor."

My contention is that this is not "joking" but out-and-out emotional abuse. This is why, when people fall back now on the defense of "it's just a joke," I tend to hear alarm bells.
 
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