How could angels revolt in heaven if there is no free will in heaven? And why did they revolt?

The angels were under the leadership of Lucifer/Satan and thus were loyal to 'him'. In fact they are called his angels, in reference to battle with Michael's angels.

Doe Deer said:

and why revolt when heaven is perfect?

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Jealousy.
God made this sapient mammal in his image and gave him the world.
Genesis 3 is a coup by the serpent.

Doe Deer said:

why did so many angels join the revolt?

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And if they all started with equally good natures, how could a number of them choose evil while others of the same character chose good?

Doe Deer said:

If heaven ís perfect, then it makes no sense that so many angels did revolt.

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Satan has been right in the presence of Jesus, and he did not benefit from being right there with Jesus Himself. Consider how much you might so deeply appreciate having a face-to-face sharing time with Jesus; but Satan did not appreciate being even with Jesus who is God's own Son. So, this is how stupid evil is; the ones who revolted were that deeply stupid with evil.

And possibly this can help you. You can consider that someone evil could be right in Heaven itself, yet not be satisfied. And like this there are humans who have a lot of nicer things, even people who care about them, yet they turn from it and get negative . . . or allow certain wrong things to decide how they are, instead of submitting to how God has us be and live. So, it is wise not to allow wrong people and things to decide how we are . . . including our own failure. But trust God to have us doing better, with Him and His children who know how to love.

Doe Deer said:

This is something i have thought about for a long time.

Also, why did so many angels join the revolt? If heaven ís perfect, then it makes no sense that so many angels did revolt.

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It is all used as pre-history rationale for the concept of good and evil, there always has to be a bad side if you wish to exist in a dualistic society.

Personally I believe it is all symbolism to explain why human nature is like it is.

Blessings, Gordon

Doe Deer said:

This is something i have thought about for a long time.

Also, why did so many angels join the revolt? If heaven ís perfect, then it makes no sense that so many angels did revolt.

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Here are a few interesting articles on the subject:

Why did God allow Satan and the demons to sin?
How, why, and when did Satan fall from heaven?
Did one third of the angels fall with Lucifer?

' My Father's House has many mansions " ponder those words it tells you a lot.

Doe Deer said:

what makes you think that angels can not get killed? they are not god

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Yes, angels are not God.

"I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven" (Jesus . . . in Luke 10:18)

So, God who is almighty has power to throw Satan at the speed on lightning . . . away.

So, God is not impressed by Satan and the problems Satan's evil spirit causes in us > yes, there is "the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience" (in Ephesians 2:2).

We see in the Gospels what problems demons caused in people they possessed, including major medical trouble. But > Jesus says He cast them out, "with the finger of God" > Luke 11:20. So, from this, I see, how all God needs to cast a devil out of a person is His little pinkie

"Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you." (James 4:7)

So, yes we humans, too, can make Satan flee from us. But first there needs to be submitting to God . . . personal submission, I understand this to mean, with more and more constant obedience to how God in us has us becoming in our new nature in Jesus, so we are all-loving like Jesus who is growing in us. So, this is not merely a power-play thing of being able to easily push Satan around. But we are in sharing with God, Himself, right "in the presence of my enemies" > Psalm 23:5 < our enemies can be memories of our own past which no longer have power in us to keep us suffering or bragging.

Jesus guarantees >

"'Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.'" (Matthew 11:29)

This rest in Christ is almighty, of Jesus God's own Son growing in us as our new inner Person.

So, it is good to notice what it means that God cast Satan and many evil angels out of Heaven. Heaven is not only some nicy nicy place, but safe. And in us Jesus now shares this safety with us here on this earth in this life, even, since Jesus is from Heaven. Saved means safe. Our Apostle Paul was sent by Jesus to the Gentiles in order to turn us Gentiles "from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God", we have in Acts 26:18, so we may "receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me," Jesus says.

So, our table with God our Father is not only with our enemies present. We are not isolated, but in sharing with God Himself and one another who are submissive to how God has us becoming and loving. And in this is almighty safety, more and more >

"There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment. But he who fears has not been made perfect in love." (1 John 4:18)

God's love in us > Romans 5:5 > is almighty against fear. This is not about how spiritual we can make ourselves be, but this is about how spiritual God is and how He shares this with us, spiritually and emotionally > "you will find rest for your souls." (in Matthew 11:28-30)

So, we answer to You, O God, if we are wise, and we are wise not to try to make you answer to us and our arguing. We thank You and glorify You, in the name of Jesus who is Your Son, amen.

Why did Adam and Eve, sin when they were in a “heaven on earth situation”?

There is a problem with “never ever sinning”, not having satan around, and starting out fully Spiritual.

Human initially lacking Godly type Love, Deity not existing within us, God not physically beside us, our lacking experience with sin and experience with satan being around assures all mature adults will sin, so what did the angels not have that would assure some would sin?

bling said:

what did the angels not have that would assure some would sin?

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One might think that Satan was the one who got the angels started in rebellion; but Satan was an angel > what got him started?

Ones say pride. But every angel could have given in to pride, if all were equal in character which could give in to pride, I consider. So, in case all created angels started off equal in nature, why would ones go with pride and rebellion while others did not?

This would include Satan > if he started equal in character with the others, how come he gave in while others did not??

The Bible does not directly deal with this, to my knowledge.

But I consider how Romans 9:21 might be applied to this, along with Ephesians 2:2.

And I think we all have proof of what we can do if God does not change us to be like Jesus. So, whether we explain everything or not, we are wise to seek You, O God our Father, to correct us so we share with You in Your holiness > Hebrews 12:4-11. Thank You for having mercy on us plus however You perfect us in Your love so we share with You in Your inability to do evil > 1 John 4:17.

com7fy8 said:

One might think that Satan was the one who got the angels started in rebellion; but Satan was an angel > what got him started?

Ones say pride. But every angel could have given in to pride, if all were equal in character which could give in to pride, I consider. So, in case all created angels started off equal in nature, why would ones go with pride and rebellion while others did not?

This would include Satan > if he started equal in character with the others, how come he gave in while others did not??

The Bible does not directly deal with this, to my knowledge.

But I consider how Romans 9:21 might be applied to this, along with Ephesians 2:2.

And I think we all have proof of what we can do if God does not change us to be like Jesus. So, whether we explain everything or not, we are wise to seek You, O God our Father, to correct us so we share with You in Your holiness > Hebrews 12:4-11. Thank You for having mercy on us plus however You perfect us in Your love so we share with You in Your inability to do evil > 1 John 4:17.

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Let me ask you another way:

What advantages do you as a Christian have today over those angels prior to their fall?

bling said:

Let me ask you another way:

What advantages do you as a Christian have today over those angels prior to their fall?

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We have trusted in Jesus, and our Heavenly Father is committed to blessing His Son Jesus with us being changed into His image.

This, unfortunately for the fallen angels, was not how God was committed to them.

com7fy8 said:

We have trusted in Jesus, and our Heavenly Father is committed to blessing His Son Jesus with us being changed into His image.

This, unfortunately for the fallen angels, was not how God was committed to them.

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I like your saying “trust” which is the same Greek word faith and believe. Yes, we have “faith in Jesus”, but the angels would have direct knowledge of Christ, so how is faith better than knowledge?

Where do you find: “God’s commitment to the angels” to say it is less than His commitment to us?

From your previous post it sounds like (so please correct me if I am wrong) that God created some angels to fall and gave the other angels special powers arbitrarily?

I do not blame God for the fall of some angels but see it as them making a free will choice, but because we spent time on earth having sinned, having already experienced satan, having learned about demons and satan, needing forgiveness of an unbelievable huge debt, accepting that forgiveness that allows us to obtain Godly type Love we can with the help of the Spirit literally next to us be able to keep from sinning.

The angels seem to have not had experience with sin, never needed to be sacrificially unconditionally forgiven, had previous experience with satan, and thus could be tempted something new and different and satan.

bling said:

Where do you find: “God’s commitment to the angels” to say it is less than His commitment to us?

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Romans 8:29 to me shows how God has destined us children of God differently than He has destined fallen angels.

bling said:

From your previous post it sounds like (so please correct me if I am wrong) that God created some angels to fall and gave the other angels special powers arbitrarily?

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Romans 9:21 to me means there can be angels which are vessels for honor and others for dishonor.

I would not say God has given gifts arbitrarily, but with exact purpose and His commitment for what He pleases to do with each angel. The ones for honor would have gifts and abilities. I am not exactly sure what fallen angels would have, because by falling they in an evil spirit would lose any gifts or ability they had, or their ability to function well with them, I would think.