"The temple of God" 2 Thes 2:4

John Davidson said:

Ephesians 2:19-22
Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone, in whom the whole building, being fitted together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord, in whom you also are being built together for a dwelling place of God in the Spirit.

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There's no point John in trying to teach Christian theology to people who are intent on Judaizing Christianity.

"And I saw no temple therein; for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it"



Anyone who has read the Revelation knows there will be NO PHYSICAL TEMPLE BUILDING in New Jerusalem at the end of the Tribulation Period, after the Second Coming of Christ, (Revelation 21:22). That not only means there will be No Physical Temple Building in Jerusalem DURING the Millennial Reign... but there will also be NO PHYSICAL TEMPLE BUILDING in Jerusalem BEFORE the Second Coming of Christ either.

If there was a Tribulation Period Third Jewish Temple in Jerusalem... what happened to it ??? Did it just magically disappear somehow ?! Was it destroyed at some point ?! Where in the Scripture is the story, or evidence of its' destruction during the Tribulation Period ?!.. Because it is conspicuously absent from the Scripture and Jerusalem in Revelation 21:22.

Logically speaking, there is only ONE conclusion that makes any sense. The Third Jewish Temple is a MYTH.
It doesn't exist, and it will NEVER exist. It is nothing more than an attempt to Judaize NT prophecy and Christian theology.

ken777 said:

Do you believe that all true Christians will be physically living in Israel before the return of Jesus?

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Yes, look at the 'Do the Lord's people live in the Land before the Return? thread.
Ezekiel 34:11-16....I will search for My sheep, that are scattered and I will bring them out from wherever they are, after the dark and cloudy Day.......they shall feed upon the mountains of Israel......
Although Matthew 24:19 does say the sun, etc, will be darkened at the Return of Jesus, Revelation 19:11 doesn't and that 'darkening' matches better with the Sixth Seal, Day of the Lord's wrath event: Zephaniah 1:15, Psalms 18:11-12, Joel 2:2
It is the Day of the Lord's wrath that will clear and cleanse all the holy Land. Jeremiah 10:18, Deuteronomy 32:43, a worldwide disaster years before the Return, that will set the scene for all that must happen before that glorious Day.

ken777 said:

Do you believe there will be literal animal sacrifices too?

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Read carefully prophesies like Ezekiel 40-48, Isaiah 56:6-7, Jeremiah 33:17, Daniel 9:27 and many others that show God will again require sacrifices and offerings from His people. After Jesus Returns, during the Millennium, it will be different.

keras said:

There will, however, be a Third temple built in Jerusalem before Jesus Returns.

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The third temple was already built and destroyed.

1st temple = Solomon's temple

2nd temple = Cyrus' temple

3rd temple = Herod's temple.

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John Davidson said:

The body of Christ is the temple.

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The bodies of believers are living temple stones. 1 Peter 2:5

Divine marriage to Christ = two are joined as one body.

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AlasBabylon said:

The third temple was already built and destroyed.

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See, this Tribulation Jewish Temple nonsense is so obscure and ridiculous, nobody even knows whether to call it the Third, or the Fourth Temple. That ought to tell everyone what a "fringe" doctrine this whole Tribulation Temple thing is. I bet as a doctrine, it doesn't even go back 50 years. I haven't investigated it though, because I don't generally waste my time investigating mythology.

stephen583 said:

Anyone who has read the Revelation knows there will be NO PHYSICAL TEMPLE BUILDING in New Jerusalem at the end of the Tribulation Period, after the Second Coming of Christ, (Revelation 21:22). That not only means there will be No Physical Temple Building in Jerusalem DURING the Millennial Reign... but there will also be NO PHYSICAL TEMPLE BUILDING in Jerusalem BEFORE the Second Coming of Christ either.

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Your premise is faulty.
You just assume there is no Temple before Eternity. Many scriptures prove you wrong. Revelation 11:1, 2 Thessalonians 2:4 and a raft of OT prophesies that you choose to ignore.
Why should there not be another Temple? God required one before and He will again. Only your incorrect notions of God's plans, as stated in the Bible leads you to think as you do.

stephen583 said:

"And I saw no temple therein; for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it"

Anyone who has read the Revelation knows there will be NO PHYSICAL TEMPLE BUILDING in New Jerusalem at the end of the Tribulation Period, after the Second Coming of Christ, (Revelation 21:22). That not only means there will be No Physical Temple Building in Jerusalem DURING the Millennial Reign... but there will also be NO PHYSICAL TEMPLE BUILDING in Jerusalem BEFORE the Second Coming of Christ either.

If there was a Tribulation Period Third Jewish Temple in Jerusalem... what happened to it ??? Did it just magically disappear somehow ?! Was it destroyed at some point ?! Where in the Scripture is the story, or evidence of its' destruction during the Tribulation Period ?!.. Because it is conspicuously absent from the Scripture and Jerusalem in Revelation 21:22.

Logically speaking, there is only ONE conclusion that makes any sense. The Third Jewish Temple is a MYTH.
It doesn't exist, and it will NEVER exist. It is nothing more than an attempt to Judaize NT prophecy and Christian theology.

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The third temple... Herod's temple... was totally destroyed just like Christ said it would be.
Jesus Christ is God's Temple made without hands... and we are the living stones in His Temple.

There will never be another physical temple building.

Jesus said... destroy this temple and I will raise it up in three days. John 2:19-21

They thought Jesus was referring to Herod's temple... but Jesus was referring to His death and resurrection.

The interesting irony is... Herod was not an Israelite... he was an Edomite "Jew"... as were many "Jews" in Judea
at the time of Christ. Their Edomite ancestors had a hand in destroying Solomon's temple when Babylon destroyed
Jerusalem. 1 Esdras 4:45 Psalms 137:7. Herod totally tore down Cyrus' decreed second temple... even removing the
foundation stones and grating the land... to build his own temple, Herod's third temple [Josephus' History of the Jews.]
Herod also tried to destroy Jesus, God's Temple made without hands, when he murdered the babes of Bethlehem.

Knowing the history... helps one understand the full impact of what Jesus said, to whom He said it and why.

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AlasBabylon said:

The third temple was already built and destroyed.

1st temple = Solomon's temple

2nd temple = Cyrus' temple

3rd temple = Herod's temple.

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It can be put that way, but Herod's Temple was basically a rebuild and a continuation of the Second Temple.
This argument is pedantic and of no proof either way, of another Temple.

Also, it won't be just the Jews who will build the next Temple, but all of God's righteous people. Pray to be among them! Haggai 2:9

stephen583 said:

See, this Tribulation Jewish Temple nonsense is so obscure and ridiculous, nobody even knows whether to call it the Third, or the Fourth Temple. That ought to tell everyone what a "fringe" doctrine this whole Tribulation Temple thing is. I bet as a doctrine, it doesn't even go back 50 years. I haven't investigated it though, because I don't generally waste my time investigating mythology.

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It's more evil than you may think... they want to rebuild Herod's temple... the one Jesus, God's Temple made without hands,
said would be destroyed. They want to revive animal sacrifices that blaspheme the Lamb of God. Why any Christian would
condone that sacrilege is beyond my comprehension.

Biblically there were three physical temples.

1st temple = Solomon's temple = Babylon/Edom totally destroyed it

2nd temple = Cyrus' temple = Herod totally destroyed it

3rd temple = Herod's temple = Romans totally destroyed it

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keras said:

It can be put that way, but Herod's Temple was basically a rebuild and a continuation of the Second Temple.

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No it wasn't. Herod totally destroyed the second temple... removing the foundation stones and grating the bare land.

Why did he do that ?

To understand... one must understand who Herod was and the history,

Herod was NOT an Israelite. He was an Edomite "Jew." In the 2nd century BC, Edom [Israel's enemy] lost a war
against Israel. Then the prince/high priest of Israel did something very evil and stupid. He allowed Israel's enemy,
Edom, to live in the Kingdom of Israel if they "converted"... which they all did en masse. These Edomite fake "Jews"
proceeded to usurp and disinherit the Israelites. In 37BC, Herod with the help of Rome conquered Jerusalem and
Rome proclaimed him, King of Judea. Herod proceeded to murder all the Israelite royal heirs which brought to
an end the last Israelite Hasmonean dynasty and began the Edomite Herod dynasty. So, Herod totally destroying
the second temple and rebuilding his own... was part of his mission to disinherit Israelites by destroying their heritage.

Once one understands how dispossessed Israelites had become in their own land... one can understand why
God chose that time in history to incarnate in His people to save them. Just imagine... at the time of Christ,
the vast majority of Israelites had been scattered into Asia and Europe since the 8th century BC... most of them
now "gentiles"... while the much smaller group of Israelites in Judea had been dispossessed by a pagan empire
[Rome] and Edomite fake "Jews" who had not only disinherited Israelites... but had taken over their identity.
Revelation 2:9 and Revelation 3:9 also refer to these fake "Jews" for the same reason that Paul quoted the OT
saying God loved Jacob [Israel] but hated Esau [Edom] Romans 9:13 .... because that conflict... the confllict
between Israel and Edom that began in the OT... continued in the NT... still continues to this day... and will
continue until Christ returns [Luke 19:27.]

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AlasBabylon said:

No it wasn't. Herod totally destroyed the second temple... removing the foundation stones and grating the bare land.

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I checked in Josephus and you are right, he says: 'Herod took away the old foundations....'
So from now on, I will call the new Temple that will be built, the Fourth Temple.
The question of who exactly are true descendants of Jacob, is one that God only knows. Amos 9:9

ken777 said:

You argument amounted to one word: "No".
Apart from Paul's consistent use of the word "naos" to refer to the people of God, the context of 2 Thes 2 is the body of believers.

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My argument did not amount to one word. I made 3 points. The main point being the temple the Man of Sin shows himself in as God is not a spiritual temple. And you know that, but you don't want to admit it.

ken777 said:

Paul's comment in 2 Cor 6:16 is a quote from the OT which prophesied the NT Church as the "temple of the living God". Look up a cross reference Bible.

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Which has nothing to do with the fact. Paul never said that whenever he mentioned the temple in the future, he was referring to a spiritual temple. The context of 2 Thes 2 proves that.

Where ever a spiritual temple is mentioned, it is understood and pointed out as such. And that would have to be the case in 2 Thes 2, which it isn't.

ken777 said:

Your understanding of your references to Revelation is unclear. What you seem to see as self explanatory is simply more evidence of a spiritual temple not a literal building.


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Of course it's unclear, because you're a propagandist. You post mountains out of mole hills comments because you're opposed to the fact. That is why you play these silly games of placing a period 3 lines down below your last comment. You are the same person with many different names fighting against the truth. There's nothing unclear about the Revelation verses other than they contradict your spiritual temple claim because it says Christ is the temple as Christ himself proclaimed when he said "tear down this temple and in 3 days I will raise it up"!

The scriptures have been tampered with. The reason one is to use line upon line, precept upon precept.


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stephen583 said:

There's no point John in trying to teach Christian theology to people who are intent on Judaizing Christianity.

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Pointing out contradictions is not Judaizing Christianity, so get the facts straight before you cast the first stone.

stephen583 said:

"And I saw no temple therein; for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it"



Anyone who has read the Revelation knows there will be NO PHYSICAL TEMPLE BUILDING in New Jerusalem at the end of the Tribulation Period, after the Second Coming of Christ, (Revelation 21:22). That not only means there will be No Physical Temple Building in Jerusalem DURING the Millennial Reign... but there will also be NO PHYSICAL TEMPLE BUILDING in Jerusalem BEFORE the Second Coming of Christ either.

If there was a Tribulation Period Third Jewish Temple in Jerusalem... what happened to it ??? Did it just magically disappear somehow ?! Was it destroyed at some point ?! Where in the Scripture is the story, or evidence of its' destruction during the Tribulation Period ?!.. Because it is conspicuously absent from the Scripture and Jerusalem in Revelation 21:22.

Logically speaking, there is only ONE conclusion that makes any sense. The Third Jewish Temple is a MYTH.
It doesn't exist, and it will NEVER exist. It is nothing more than an attempt to Judaize NT prophecy and Christian theology.

Click to expand...

The issue is not there being a physical temple or not. The issue is that Christ IS the temple, and not man.

The scriptures have been tampered with, which is the reason for the contradiction.

Plus God will never sanctify a third temple. That is blasphemy since Christ fulfilled the law when he sacrificed himself for us.

It's shameful to think "Christians' would actually believe God would accept animal sacrifices again in the future.

What is never holy can never be defiled. That's just lunacy.

AlasBabylon said:

The third temple was already built and destroyed.

1st temple = Solomon's temple

2nd temple = Cyrus' temple

3rd temple = Herod's temple.

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These comments are so blasphemous. You are repeating what the heaters of the word have propagated. Cyrus nor Herod, two unholy gentiles, have never built anything for God. Cyrus only gave the decree for Joshua who was crowned king and high priest post the Babylonian captivity to build the 2nd temple along with Zerubabel, the deposed king made governor. Herod merely repaired that said temple. Get your facts straight.

Mal 3:1 Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.

There is too many propaganda in Christianity! But the truth will be told. It was his temple!

AlasBabylon said:

No it wasn't. Herod totally destroyed the second temple... removing the foundation stones and grating the bare land.

Why did he do that ?

To understand... one must understand who Herod was and the history,

Herod was NOT an Israelite. He was an Edomite "Jew." In the 2nd century BC, Edom [Israel's enemy] lost a war
against Israel. Then the prince/high priest of Israel did something very evil and stupid. He allowed Israel's enemy,
Edom, to live in the Kingdom of Israel if they "converted"... which they all did en masse. These Edomite fake "Jews"
proceeded to usurp and disinherit the Israelites. In 37BC, Herod with the help of Rome conquered Jerusalem and
Rome proclaimed him, King of Judea. Herod proceeded to murder all the Israelite royal heirs which brought to
an end the last Israelite Hasmonean dynasty and began the Edomite Herod dynasty. So, Herod totally destroying
the second temple and rebuilding his own... was part of his mission to disinherit Israelites by destroying their heritage.

Once one understands how dispossessed Israelites had become in their own land... one can understand why
God chose that time in history to incarnate in His people to save them. Just imagine... at the time of Christ,
the vast majority of Israelites had been scattered into Asia and Europe since the 8th century BC... most of them
now "gentiles"... while the much smaller group of Israelites in Judea had been dispossessed by a pagan empire
[Rome] and Edomite fake "Jews" who had not only disinherited Israelites... but had taken over their identity.
Revelation 2:9 and Revelation 3:9 also refer to these fake "Jews" for the same reason that Paul quoted the OT
saying God loved Jacob [Israel] but hated Esau [Edom] Romans 9:13 .... because that conflict... the confllict
between Israel and Edom that began in the OT... continued in the NT... still continues to this day... and will
continue until Christ returns [Luke 19:27.]

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Again with the period lines below the last comment, the sign of your rebellion. If your statement were true, God would never have said Christ would be returning to his temple!

Mal 3:1 Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.

How you like me now?

keras said:

I checked in Josephus and you are right, he says: 'Herod took away the old foundations....'
So from now on, I will call the new Temple that will be built, the Fourth Temple.
The question of who exactly are true descendants of Jacob, is one that God only knows. Amos 9:9

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Josephus adopted the name of the scriptural 8th Roman emperor, which was the Roman custom of becoming a Roman citizen. Look it up. He is not one to be trusted. He took the "name of the Beast"!

precepts said:

That is why you play these silly games of placing a period 3 lines down below your last comment. You are the same person with many different names fighting against the truth.

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I often use periods before and after my posts. If I don't, on some forum formats my text is confined to a very tiny space.
Frankly, I don't like tiny spaces... maybe that's because I live in Texas. I only post under one name here... and I have no
association with anyone else who might use a similar posting method. In fact if you will read my posts here, I agree with you
that Christ is God's Temple. Christ is the Temple of God made without hands and the Christ-bearing people are living stones
in God's Temple. Furthermore... in both the OT and NT, God says He wants His Laws written in the hearts of His people.
God prefers His Word written in the hearts of His people... rather than on tablets of stone hidden away in a stone building.

Jeremiah 31:33 & Hebrews 10:16

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precepts said:

Again with the period lines below the last comment, the sign of your rebellion. If your statement were true, God would never have said Christ would be returning to his temple!

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Oh please... you are straining at a gnat. Get over my periods already. They are my personal preference in framing my text.
If you will pay attention to the text I write... instead of my format... you might learn something.

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precepts said:

How you like me now?

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Frankly, I think you've silly.

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