Futurist Only Damascus and animals

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keras said in post 170:

2 Kings 2:11 says Elijah was taken up to the heavens, meaning the sky . . .

Note that in 2 Kings 2:11 the original Hebrew word (shamayim: H8064) translated as "heaven" can refer to the 3rd heaven where God's throne is (1 Kings 22:19; Psalms 11:4), just as the apostle Paul said that he at one point during his lifetime could have been taken bodily to the 3rd heaven (2 Corinthians 12:2), and just as the apostle John at one point during his lifetime was taken to God's throne in the 3rd heaven (Revelation 4:1-2).

keras said in post 170:

. . . and he was transported to another place on earth, because later, he sent a letter to King Joram. 2 Chronicles 21:12

Note that in 2 Chronicles 21:12, the letter from Elijah was sent to Jehoram the son of Jehoshaphat (2 Chronicles 21:1-12). And 2 Kings 1:17 shows that Jehoram the son of Jehoshaphat could have already been in the 2nd year of his reign before Elijah's bodily ascension into heaven in 2 Kings 2:11.

keras said in post 170:

The cop-out of a rapture removal before the SHTF, is a satanic lie.

It is possible that Satan invented the false hope of a pre-tribulation rapture, insofar as he is the father of lies (John 8:44b). But this doesn't mean (as is sometimes claimed) that those who hold to the pre-trib view are Satanic. For they hate Satan, and love God and his Word. They may have just fallen under one of his deceptions out of fear of the tribulation, or because people they respect highly have (mistakenly) assured them that pre-trib is the only possibility.

If Satan did invent the pre-trib false hope, he may have done so in order to weaken the church, to keep it from having any "root in itself" (Matthew 13:21), to keep it from having to face its fear of the tribulation and overcome that fear (cf. Revelation 2:10-11, Hebrews 2:15).

Satan could also use the pre-trib view as a great weapon with which to batter the faith of some Christians during the suffering of the tribulation. He could say something like:

"O, you poor souls! So utterly deceived by that liar YHWH! How cruel of him to promise you a pre-trib rapture and get all your hopes up, only to pull the rug out from under you at the last moment! How he is laughing at you now in your suffering! Doesn't he even admit it in Proverbs 1:26 and Job 9:23? Yes, of course he does, just to spite you. How he hates you, my friends, how he hates all of humanity. All he wants to do is cause suffering, all this tribulation suffering. And this is only a prelude to the eternal torture which he will delight in forever. What a foul and cruel tyrant he is! But I will tell you a secret. He is not all-powerful as he pretends to be. Wasn't he fearful when man built the Tower of Babel? Of course he was, he even admitted it himself in Genesis 11:6. For he knows that when mankind becomes united, nothing can be restrained from it; it can do anything. Even storm heaven and overthrow him. And so he destroyed the unity of mankind, out of fear for himself and his tyranny".

Satan could go on: "But look here, my friends. I do not hate you. I am no tyrant. Who is feeding you? Who is feeding your starving, crying little ones, while YHWH doesn't lift a finger to help you or them? I AM feeding you. I AM helping you. I AM your God, your true Lord, your beneficent Master. Fall down and worship me, Lucifer, and my human Son [the Antichrist], and His image, receive His mark on your hand or forehead, and together we will rise as one to fight against YHWH and destroy his foul tyranny once and for all. YHWH is coming soon to try to stop this unity which we are forging, to try to stop the blessed illumination and power which I, Lucifer, am bringing to all of mankind. But we will win, for nothing can be restrained from us. We can do anything, so long as we do not allow him to break our unity".

Satan could continue: "So, come, my friends, it is time for you to formally renounce YHWH, to curse him to his face and before all the world, that you might completely break free from his hypnotic spell, which has blinded you so long to his utter cruelty and hatred for mankind. And it is time, my friends, for you to formally announce your complete devotion to me, Lucifer, and to my Son, and to worship us in Spirit and in Truth, that you might receive the full Illumination of My Spirit within you, and feel my seething Power within your soul. You will become new creatures in Me, new creatures of Light, and Love for all mankind".

And with speeches such as this, Satan could utterly wear down the defenses of some already-completely-exhausted saints, whose strength of faith could not survive the long, horrible suffering of the tribulation, not only the suffering of themselves, but of their innocent little ones as well. They will be defeated by their doubts: "How could a good God let this happen to me? How could a good God let my innocent little baby starve to an agonizingly painful death while he sits up in heaven and does nothing? No rapture, no manna, nothing. Not even a word of encouragement. Utter silence. Is he dead? Is he evil? What could possibly be the point of all this suffering? I can no longer serve such a 'God' as this. I will serve that God who proves his love for me by helping me, by feeding me, by feeding my precious little ones. You will know them by their fruits. Now I have seen the ultimate fruits of YHWH, and now I have seen the ultimate fruits of Lucifer and His Son. It is plain as day who is truly good and who is truly evil".

And so the love of many will grow cold toward YHWH (Matthew 24:12). They will show that they love their stomachs (Philippians 3:19) and their little ones more than they love God (Matthew 10:37b). They will show that their love for God wasn't based on who he is, their Creator (John 1:3) and Crucified Savior (Acts 20:28) and the Almighty Infinite God compared with whom all of mankind together is an infinitesimal speck of dust, worth less than nothing (Isaiah 40:15-18). No, their love for God was conditional upon what he gave to them in this life: wealth, happiness, health, food, clothing, and the promise of a pre-trib rapture. Take all these things away in the tribulation, and they, unlike Job (Job 1:21-22), will have no more reason to worship God, but only a reason to curse him (Job 2:9-10, Isaiah 8:21-22).

This will be the ultimate fruit of the prosperity gospel, the Americanized gospel of wealth and plenty and a pre-trib rapture: apostasy in the tribulation (2 Thessalonians 2:3; 1 Timothy 4:1), a complete ignorance of such ideas as 1 Peter 4:12-13, 2 Corinthians 4:16-18, and 1 Timothy 6:9-12, a complete denial of such ideas as Philippians 1:29, 2 Timothy 2:12, and Revelation 14:12-13.

--

The lies which were presented above as being what Satan could say during the tribulation should be answered, in case any one of them might be niggling away at some believer's faith. They were presented to serve as vaccines, as it were, so that if a believer is in fact confronted with these lies during the future tribulation, his spiritual immune system, his faith, will have already been prepared to overcome them (Ephesians 6:16).

First, it was said to believers who were in the tribulation that God was cruel to promise them a pre-trib rapture and get all their hopes up, only to pull the rug out from under them at the last moment. The truth is that God has never promised believers a pre-trib rapture. No scripture ever refers to any such thing.

Second, it was said that God was laughing at the suffering of the believers in the tribulation, and Proverbs 1:26 and Job 9:23 were referenced. The truth is that God doesn't ever laugh at the suffering of believers (Psalms 116:15). Proverbs 1:26 is addressing those who have rejected God (Proverbs 1:24-33). And Job 9:23 is just the wrong opinion of Job during his great suffering; not everything he says is correct. For example, he says in Job 19:11 that what was happening to him was God's wrath against him, when in fact it wasn't God's wrath at all, but Satan's wrath. During the future tribulation, Satan is going to have his cake and eat it too. Because of the mistaken pre-trib idea that all of the tribulation is God's wrath, instead of it being mostly Satan's wrath, Satan will get to cause a whole world of suffering during the tribulation and then blame it all on God and say that God did all of it, and people will believe Satan. He will get to present himself as the good guy, and God as the evil tyrant, when it will be Satan doing the evil, just as it was Satan doing the evil against Job.

Third, it was said that God hates all of humanity. The truth is that God hates only some of humanity, the vessels of wrath, those predestined by him to damnation before they were born (Romans 9:11-22). Now this will be where the rubber meets the road for many: Can they accept that the Infinite Creator has the right to do with his infinitesimal creatures (Isaiah 40:15,17) whatsoever he wants (Romans 9:21-22, Proverbs 16:4, Revelation 4:11), or will they insist that God is unjust, evil, to predestine some people to damnation before they have done anything at all? To accept the former shows humility before God; to insist on the latter shows human, nay, Satanic, pride, for it attempts to set God's creatures above God himself: It is saying that infinitesimal humans are more important than the Infinite God and his will and pleasure. The truth of double predestination (Romans 9:11-24) is the ultimate test of our humility before God. No doubt Satan will employ this truth during the tribulation as his ultimate weapon to try to turn people away from God.

Fourth, it was said that all God wants to do is cause suffering, all the tribulation suffering. The truth is that God loves to care for his creatures (Psalms 104:10-18). He only brings suffering (chastening) to those he loves when they fall into sin and need to repent (Revelation 3:19). And the suffering which comes upon those who are already repentant (Acts 14:22, John 16:33, Philippians 1:29) can still work good things in them, such as patience (Romans 5:3) and a greater hope in the eternal glory to come (2 Corinthians 4:17). Suffering is an innate part of the fallen creation; it is universal (Romans 8:22). It is not like God himself is actively behind every instance of suffering. There can simply be natural disasters. And Satan and evil men cause tremendous amounts of suffering (e.g. Revelation 2:10, Revelation 12:17, Revelation 13:7,10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4).

Fifth, it was said that God will delight in the eternal torture of the unsaved. The truth is that God will not take any pleasure in the unsaved's suffering per se (cf. Ezekiel 33:11). The only pleasure that he will take in connection with people being unsaved is that they will provide him an opportunity to show his wrath and to make his power known (Romans 9:22) forever (Revelation 14:10-11, Matthew 25:41,46, Revelation 20:10,15, Mark 9:45-46). This again will be where the rubber meets the road for many: Will they accept that the Holy God has the right to eternally torture the unsaved as punishment for their free-willed sins (Romans 6:23, Revelation 21:8, James 1:13-15), or will they claim that they know better than God himself what is just and what is not just? If they accept the former, they will show humility before God, while if they claim the latter they will be placing themselves above God, making themselves the judge of God, and so will show the ultimate extent of their human and Satanic pride.

Sixth, it was said that God is not all-powerful as he pretends to be, and that he was fearful when man built the Tower of Babel; Genesis 11:6 was referenced. The truth is that God is all-powerful (Jeremiah 32:17,27), and he wasn't fearful for himself at all at the Tower of Babel. For all of mankind together is an infinitesimal speck, less than nothing compared with the Infinite, Almighty God (Isaiah 40:15,17). He was fearful only for what a fallen, united mankind, in its overweening pride, would end up doing to itself and the planet, or even to other planets, such as creating some huge scientific device which would end up blowing the earth to smithereens, or colonizing Mars and some moons of Jupiter only to utterly defile them with sin and pollution.

Seventh, it was said that Satan doesn't hate mankind, and that his feeding of mankind during the tribulation will prove his love for mankind. The truth is that Satan has wanted to murder all of mankind from the beginning (John 8:44). That is why he deceived Eve into committing sin (Genesis 3:4), so that all of mankind would become mortal and die (Romans 5:12). Now his hope is to drag as much of mankind as possible with him into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:10,15). He will do anything for men in the tribulation, give men anything they want in the tribulation, so long as he gets to see them ultimately tortured forever just as he will be (Matthew 25:41,46). So when he offers men bread and water and clothing and "love" during the tribulation, this will be a ruse, nothing but bait to get men onto the hook of rebellion against YHWH God, to get them to ultimately suffer eternal damnation (Revelation 14:10-11).

Eighth, and last, it was said that a good God would not let an innocent little baby starve to an agonizingly painful death during the tribulation while he sits up in heaven and does nothing. The truth is that this life, even if we live to be 100 years old, is nothing but a nanosecond compared with eternity. And death is better than life in this world for those who are saved, and for little babies who have been elected by God to salvation. For their death will take them into heaven to be with Jesus (2 Corinthians 5:8). Their death will be no loss, but gain for them, far better than any life in this fallen world (Philippians 1:21,23). Only those who wrongly love this world (1 John 2:15) and their life in it (John 12:25) are horrified by death. Satan uses the fear of death to keep people in bondage to himself and to his ways (Hebrews 2:15), to keep their sights on temporal things instead of on that which is eternal (2 Corinthians 4:18).
 
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Luke17:37

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Before you spiritualized the parable let's look at it from a literal sense first.

Parables are spiritual teachings foremost.

Perhaps the wait was longer than expected That is why they all fell asleep ....

EXACTLY. Like I told you, all three parables in Matthew 24 and 25 (starting with the parable of the two servants, Matthew 24:45-51) highlight a long wait. Also, Jesus talks about it in Luke 18:1-8. This is just one reason of many why you can't assume a short wait (a gathering of the Church prior to the Tribulation).

But It's possible they simply forgot to bring extra oil.. A common mistake...

They needed their lamps in working order to go in to the wedding feast or they wouldn't have left to buy more oil. You think it's a common mistake and I think it's the point of the parable.

When Jesus comes back, He isn't going to come only for people hanging out in a certain location. He'll gather all the Christians wherever they are. But the people who fall away, are hypocrites, or are knowingly unobedient won't be ready to meet Him. They would be among the many who say, "Lord, Lord," to whom Jesus replies, "Depart from me..."

To many assumptions can lead to missing the whole point of the parable

The parable seems very clear to me.

It just like when Jesus told his disciples To beware of the bread the scribes and Pharisees prepare for you to eat and they misunderstood and were more concern about bread instead of the command to beware of the false doctrines

Except I'm concerned about false doctrine of pre-tribulation rapture (and mid-tribulation rapture) and you want this parable to be more literal and about something else other than the unwise position of assuming Jesus is coming earlier.

You made up your mind haven't you?
Yes, many years ago I made up my mind, but I let Scripture do it. I formerly believed in a Pre-Tribulation Rapture, and of course I would have liked it to be true, but I am more interested in what is true.

When I read the Bible closely with this in mind, I discovered that it does not ever tell of a pre-Tribulation Rapture. It does speak of a Post-Tribulation Resurrection-Gathering. So that is what I believe. This is not super complicated, either. I did this search (which didn't take all that long) and came to this conviction at 16 or 17 years old.

You, however, have made up your mind a priori. Your hope is a position without a clear basis from Scripture. And I would say, based on the parable of the wheat and tares (Matthew 13), and 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3, and others, your hope is against the clear teaching of Scripture.

Let's look at this verse closely ... Jesus said in my fathers house are many mansions if it were not so I would not have told you I go prepare a place for you...

Now take off your spiritual glasses for a moment and read it literally and tell me what did Jesus just say ?

He prepares a place for His Church to live with Him eternally. It's not talking about the specifics of gathering the Church.
 
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dfw69

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Parables are spiritual teachings foremost.



EXACTLY. Like I told you, all three parables in Matthew 24 and 25 (starting with the parable of the two servants, Matthew 24:45-51) highlight a long wait. Also, Jesus talks about it in Luke 18:1-8. This is just one reason of many why you can't assume a short wait (a gathering of the Church prior to the Tribulation).



They needed their lamps in working order to go in to the wedding feast or they wouldn't have left to buy more oil. You think it's a common mistake and I think it's the point of the parable.

When Jesus comes back, He isn't going to come only for people hanging out in a certain location. He'll gather all the Christians wherever they are. But the people who fall away, are hypocrites, or are knowingly unobedient won't be ready to meet Him. They would be among the many who say, "Lord, Lord," to whom Jesus replies, "Depart from me..."



The parable seems very clear to me.



Except I'm concerned about false doctrine of pre-tribulation rapture (and mid-tribulation rapture) and you want this parable to be more literal and about something else other than the unwise position of assuming Jesus is coming earlier.


Yes, many years ago I made up my mind, but I let Scripture do it. I formerly believed in a Pre-Tribulation Rapture, and of course I would have liked it to be true, but I am more interested in what is true.

When I read the Bible closely with this in mind, I discovered that it does not ever tell of a pre-Tribulation Rapture. It does speak of a Post-Tribulation Resurrection-Gathering. So that is what I believe. This is not super complicated, either. I did this search (which didn't take all that long) and came to this conviction at 16 or 17 years old.

You, however, have made up your mind a priori. Your hope is a position without a clear basis from Scripture. And I would say, based on the parable of the wheat and tares (Matthew 13), and 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3, and others, your hope is against the clear teaching of Scripture.



He prepares a place for His Church to live with Him eternally. It's not talking about the specifics of gathering the Church.

Do you believe Jesus's coming to earth soon or are you prepared for the long wait still yet to come ?



You say that with spiritual glasses on

But I see a house .. A temple or tabernacle in which the presence of God resides ... ..ie heaven ..a home with many rooms ...if it was not so he would not have told us ...called new Jerusalem in heaven ...
 
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Luke17:37

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Do you believe Jesus's coming to earth soon or are you prepared for the long wait still yet to come ?

I believe the Tribulation and Jesus' return may come to this generation, but I don't expect to survive the Tribulation. I think the Tribulation will be so hard it will seem long.

You say that with spiritual glasses on

But I see a house .. A temple or tabernacle in which the presence of God resides ... ..ie heaven ..a home with many rooms ...if it was not so he would not have told us ...called new Jerusalem in heaven ...

I am supposed to have spiritual glasses on. That doesn't mean I don't believe Jesus is preparing a physical place for us to dwell in. I do.

I don't think we need to keep writing on this, dfw69. Good day.
 
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dfw69

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I believe the Tribulation and Jesus' return may come to this generation, but I don't expect to survive the Tribulation. I think the Tribulation will be so hard it will seem long.



I am supposed to have spiritual glasses on. That doesn't mean I don't believe Jesus is preparing a physical place for us to dwell in. I do.

I don't think we need to keep writing on this, dfw69. Good day.



Ok thanks for the chat ... Peace

Ps keep the faith and keep in mind that Jesus may not return anytime soon but a false messianic age may come soon and last for some time
 
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Luke17:37

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Ok thanks for the chat ... Peace

Ps keep the faith and keep in mind that Jesus may not return anytime soon but a false messianic may come soon and last for some time

False christs and false prophets will come, yes, and deceive many (Matthew 24:5,11,24). I will keep the faith.

Shalom.
 
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Luke17:37 said in post 182:

When Jesus comes back, He isn't going to come only for people hanging out in a certain location. He'll gather all the Christians wherever they are.

That's right.

For the rapture is not just a catching up (1 Thessalonians 4:17), but also a gathering together to Jesus (2 Thessalonians 2:1). That is, the rapture will take believers straight up into the sky wherever they are on the earth's surface. But this will be thousands of different places in the sky (the 1st heaven), all around the globe, whether above Damascus or anywhere else. So then believers will need to be gathered together by angels (Mark 13:27; cf. 2 Thessalonians 2:1) to the one place in the sky where Jesus will be, above Jerusalem, before he sets his feet on the Mount of Olives (Zechariah 14:4). For example, if a believer is raptured into the sky above New Zealand (very far from Jerusalem, unlike Damascus), he will then need to be led by an angel over oceans and continents until he arrives above Jerusalem.

So this is one purpose for the rapture: to get believers from all around the globe into one place in the sky above Jerusalem, to meet with the returned Jesus (1 Thessalonians 4:17b).

A 2nd purpose will be so that the church can then be judged by Jesus (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27), and the obedient part of the church can then be married to Jesus (Revelation 19:7-8, Matthew 25:1-12), in the sky, before Jesus descends to wage war against the armies of the unsaved world (Revelation 19:15-21).

Luke17:37 said in post 182:

But the people who fall away, are hypocrites, or are knowingly unobedient won't be ready to meet Him.

Indeed.

For the need for believers to be ready for Jesus' 2nd coming (Matthew 24:44, Matthew 25:10) doesn't have to do with whether or not they will be raptured at that time, but with whether or not they will lose their salvation at that time (e.g. Luke 12:45-46, Matthew 25:26,30, Mark 8:35-38).

For some saved people, at the judgment of the church by Jesus (2 Corinthians 5:10, Romans 2:6-8, Luke 12:45-48, Matthew 25:19-30), at his 2nd coming (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27), will lose their salvation because of such things as unrepentant sin (Luke 12:45-46, Hebrews 10:26-29; 1 Corinthians 9:27), unrepentant laziness (Matthew 25:26,30, John 15:2a, Romans 2:6-8), or apostasy (Mark 8:35-38, Hebrews 6:4-8; 2 Timothy 2:12b). That is why saved people know the "terror" of the coming judgment of the church by Jesus (2 Corinthians 5:10-11), why they must remain in fear of being cut off the same as unbelievers if they don't continue in God's goodness (Romans 11:20-22, Luke 12:45-46), why they must be careful to work out their own ultimate salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12b; 1 Peter 1:17, Romans 2:6-8).

Luke17:37 said in post 182:

They would be among the many who say, "Lord, Lord," to whom Jesus replies, "Depart from me..."

Matthew 7:21 ¶Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

This shows that both faith and obedience to God are required for believers to enter ultimate salvation (Romans 2:6-8, Hebrews 5:9, James 2:24). But there is no assurance they will choose to obey (Matthew 25:26,30, Luke 12:45-46).

Matthew 7:23a could be hyperbole (like Matthew 23:24b is hyperbole). For Matthew 7:22 could refer to truly saved people, true believers in the gospel (1 Corinthians 15:1-4, John 20:31), who had truly repented from their sins (1 John 3:6) and had truly performed many wonderful works for Jesus to the end (John 15:4-5). But at some point subsequent to their initial repentance, they had fallen back into some unrepentant sin (Matthew 7:23b; 2 Peter 2:20-22), so that they had to be completely rejected by Jesus in the end despite their continued faith and good works (1 Corinthians 9:27; 1 Corinthians 6:9-10, Hebrews 10:26-29).

Regarding the ability to cast out demons (Matthew 7:22), that is one of the signs that people are saved, that they are believers in the gospel (Mark 16:17). People must be very careful not to fall into the unforgivable presumption of Mark 3:22-30.
 
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Damascus is the world's oldest continually inhabited city. It looks very bad now, but the Bible says it will literally stop being. We see in Genesis that Damascus existed in Abrams day.
Gen. 14:
14 And when Abram heard that his brother was taken captive, he armed his trained servants, born in his own house, three hundred and eighteen, and pursued them unto Dan.

15 And he divided himself against them, he and his servants, by night, and smote them, and pursued them unto Hobah, which is on the left hand of Damascus.

16 And he brought back all the goods, and also brought again his brother Lot, and his goods, and the women also, and the people.

We believe Genesis was written by Moses, and we know that Moses did not cross over into the promised land with the children of Israel. Yet, in writing about Abram, he mentions Damascus and Dan. I don't know how long ago that was, but It was a pretty long time ago, and apparently it was a pretty important city then.
 
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keras

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The sudden and shocking Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath, His terrible punishment by fire, will affect all the world, but will particularly affect all that area given to Abraham, so many centuries ago. Deuteronomy 32:22 & 34-35, Zephaniah 1:14-18, Genesis 17:8

In the past there were two times that the holy Land has been virtually depopulated. First Assyria conquered Israel and Babylon conquered Judah. Judah was again conquered by the Romans in 70AD and Jerusalem was flattened and ploughed over. But in each of these times the Land was never completely cleared or devastated to the extent described in the prophecies below. They will be fulfilled by the next prophesied event, as we can see from Isaiah 61:2b...proclaim a Day of vengeance of our God.
It will be the ‘third swing of the sword’, Ezekiel 21:8-16 and the opening of the Sixth Seal:

Isaiah 26:21 The Lord is coming from His dwelling place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their sins.

Isaiah 28:2 The Lord has one at His bidding; like a sweeping storm of hail and a destroying tempest that will beat down upon the earth with violence.

Jeremiah 11:15-16 What right have My people to live in My holy Land with their shameless ways? Nothing they can do now will ward off the disaster, that with a great roaring noise will burn and consume them.

Jeremiah 22:6-7 The Lord says about the Royal House of Judah: Though you are dear to Me, I swear that I shall turn your Land into a desert, a Land of towns no longer inhabited. A destructive force will come upon you and burn your dwellings.

Isaiah 28:22b...for I have heard that destruction is decreed upon the whole Land.

Ezekiel 20:47...I am about to kindle a fire...all the Land will be scorched by it.

Jeremiah 7:32-34 The time is coming when the dead will fill the valley of Topeth [beside Jerusalem] and the whole Land will become like a desert. Jeremiah 19:11

Jeremiah 6:8 & 12 I shall raise My hand against all the inhabitants of the Land and leave you devastated, a land without inhabitants.

Jeremiah 12:14 The Lord says: I shall uproot the evil neighbours who have encroached onto My peoples Land. Also I shall uproot Judah from among them.

Jeremiah 10:18 & 22 The Lord says: This time I shall throw out the whole population of the Land, I shall press them and squeeze them dry. Listen; a devouring horde comes to make Judah’s cities utterly desolate.

Jeremiah 8:16 The Destroyer approaches and the whole Land trembles – it comes and consumes everything; crops, trees, city and citizens alike.

Isaiah 24:18b-19 The earth’s foundations shake when the window of heaven is opened, the earth is struck and it staggers and reels wildly.

Jeremiah 4:7 The Destroyer of nations has come out from his lair to devastate your Land and make your cities waste and empty. In an instant, the whole Land crashes down in ruin. I looked and there was no one, even the birds have gone.

Joel 1:15-20 The Day of the Lord comes, a terrible destruction from the Almighty, all food is destroyed and fire has consumed the pastures and trees.

Zephaniah 1:18 On the Day of the Lord’s wrath, by the fire of His jealousy the whole Land will be consumed, for He will make a sudden and terrible end to all who live in the Land.

Micah 1:6 I shall reduce Samaria to a ruin...I will level the hills and valleys.

Jeremiah 25:33-38 The Lord is ravaging the shepherd’s pastures and their homes are ruined beneath the Lord’s fierce anger. The Land becomes a waste under the sword of the Destroyer and those whom the Lord kills on that Day, will be scattered from one end of the earth to the other, neither mourned or buried.

Micah 5:11 I shall devastate the cities of your Land and destroy your military power.

Jeremiah 9:10-11 & 21-22 I will chant a funeral dirge over the Land when I make Jerusalem a heap of ruins and the towns of Judah uninhabited. Death will enter your houses and will kill anyone in the streets. Corpses will lie like dung, like swaths behind the reaper, with no one left to gather them. Isaiah 17:1 & 14

Hosea 4:3 The Land will become desolate, all that lives in it will be wasted, even the wild animals, birds and fishes will vanish.
Isaiah 64:10-11 Zion becomes a desert, the holy cities desolate, all that we cherished lies in ruins, burned to the ground.

Jeremiah 4:26 The fertile Land has become desolate, its towns all razed to the ground before the fierce anger of the Lord.

Isaiah 33:8a The roads are deserted, no one travels anywhere. The Land is parched and dry, stripped bare, like a desert.

Isaiah 24:10 The city is shattered and in chaos, every house is barred and shuttered.

Isaiah 32:14 Houses are empty, the crowded streets are deserted and the military areas are turned into open fields.

Jeremiah 12:4 & 10-13 How long must the Land lie parched, its grass withered? No birds or beasts are left, because God has judged the wicked inhabitants, they said: God does not see what we are doing. Therefore a sword from the Lord has devoured the Land from end to end and now it’s all a desolate wilderness. Ref: REB. Some verses abridged.

This dramatic clearance of the holy Land coincides with the completion of the decreed punishment of the House of Israel. Righteous Israel are now able to go back to their heritage, a great gathering, described in over 40 prophecies.
But before they “march, with great joy into the Land”; Psalm 68:7-9 & 24-27, the Lord will send rain and a tremendous regeneration will take place and they “will find food and water in plenty”. Isaiah 49:8-19, Ezekiel 36:8, Joel 2:21-24, Isaiah 51:3
 
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keras said in post 195:

The sudden and shocking Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath, His terrible punishment by fire, will affect all the world, but will particularly affect all that area given to Abraham, so many centuries ago. Deuteronomy 32:22 . . .

Regarding Deuteronomy 32:22: For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.

This could refer to the same event as 2 Peter 3:10 and Revelation 20:11b, which event will occur at the great white throne judgment (Revelation 20:11), and will be followed by the creation of a new heaven and earth (2 Peter 3:13, Revelation 21:1).

keras said in post 195:

. . . Zephaniah 1:14-18 . . .

Regarding Zephaniah 1:14-18, it refers to an ancient day of the Lord, like, for example, the ancient day of the Lord in Jeremiah 46:2,10. In its context, Zephaniah 1:14-18 was prophesying the destruction of the land of ancient Judah and neighboring countries (Zephaniah 1:4 to 2:5) by the Babylonians in the 6th century BC.

keras said in post 195:

They will be fulfilled by the next prophesied event, as we can see from Isaiah 61:2b...proclaim a Day of vengeance of our God.

Regarding Isaiah 61:2b, "the day of vengeance of our God" can refer to the day of Jesus' 2nd coming, when "he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God" (Revelation 19:15c).

keras said in post 195:

It will be the ‘third swing of the sword’, Ezekiel 21:8-16 . . .

Note that there is no "third swing of the sword" in Ezekiel 21:8-16.

Instead, Ezekiel 21:14 says "let the sword be doubled the third time", meaning increased 8-fold. This could refer to a nuclear bomb having its destructive power multiplied by 8 times. Compare the "ruins multiplied" in Ezekiel 21:15.

That is, in Ezekiel 21:8-16, the "sword" could represent a nuclear bomb which could be detonated in Israel by Islamic terrorists (Ezekiel 21:12). The sword being "bright" (Ezekiel 21:15) could refer to the stupendous flash of light given off when a nuclear bomb is detonated, as bright as lightning. Indeed, the original Hebrew word (baraq: H1300) translated as "glitter" in Ezekiel 21:10 can be translated as "lightning" (cf. Ezekiel 1:13c).

keras said in post 195:

. . . and the opening of the Sixth Seal:

Regarding the Sixth Seal (Revelation 6:12-14), it could be fulfilled in our future by a huge volcanic eruption (possibly of the Yellowstone Caldera) which will occur during only the 1st stage of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24. This eruption could begin with a large earthquake (Revelation 6:12), signaling the sudden rising of magma within the volcano. When it erupts, it could shoot so much ash and smoke into the sky that the sun will appear darkened and the moon blood-red (Revelation 6:12b), like happens during large forest fires. The volcano could also shoot blobs of red-hot magma into the sky, which as they fall back down could appear like falling stars (Revelation 6:13). And it could shoot so much super-heated ash and smoke so high and so quickly into the sky that they could form a gigantic mushroom cloud which will make the sky (the 1st heaven) look like a scroll being rolled up (Revelation 6:14). Earthquakes connected with the eruption could be so large that they set off a chain reaction of other earthquakes in nearby faults and volcanoes, which could set off even more earthquakes further away, and so on, so that earthquakes will end up affecting every mountain and island, moving each of their positions at least a little bit (Revelation 6:14b).

keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 26:24 The Lord is coming from His dwelling place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their sins.

Note that there is no Isaiah 26:24 (the chapter ends at verse 21).

keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 28:2 The Lord has one at His bidding; like a sweeping storm of hail and a destroying tempest that will beat down upon the earth with violence.

Isaiah 28:2 Behold, the Lord hath a mighty and strong one, which as a tempest of hail and a destroying storm, as a flood of mighty waters overflowing, shall cast down to the earth with the hand.

This brings to mind the hail part of the 7th vial (Revelation 16:21).

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 11:15-16 What right have My people to live in My holy Land with their shameless ways? Nothing they can do now will ward off the disaster, that with a great roaring noise will burn and consume them.

Jeremiah 11:15 What hath my beloved to do in mine house, seeing she hath wrought lewdness with many, and the holy flesh is passed from thee? when thou doest evil, then thou rejoicest.
16 The LORD called thy name, A green olive tree, fair, and of goodly fruit: with the noise of a great tumult he hath kindled fire upon it, and the branches of it are broken.

This could refer to ancient Judah (Jeremiah 11:2,6,9,12-13) and its destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 22:6-7 The Lord says about the Royal House of Judah: Though you are dear to Me, I swear that I shall turn your Land into a desert, a Land of towns no longer inhabited. A destructive force will come upon you and burn your dwellings.

Jeremiah 22:6 For thus saith the LORD unto the king's house of Judah; Thou art Gilead unto me, and the head of Lebanon: yet surely I will make thee a wilderness, and cities which are not inhabited.
7 And I will prepare destroyers against thee, every one with his weapons: and they shall cut down thy choice cedars, and cast them into the fire.

This refers to ancient Judah, i.e. to when Judah had a Davidic king (Jeremiah 22:1-2), and to that kingdom's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 28:22b...for I have heard that destruction is decreed upon the whole Land.

Isaiah 28:22b ...for I have heard from the Lord GOD of hosts a consumption, even determined upon the whole earth.

This could refer to the destruction of the land of ancient Judah (Isaiah 28:14) by the Babylonians in 586 BC. For in Isaiah 28:22b, the original Hebrew word (erets: H0776) translated as the "earth" can indeed be translated as the "land" (cf. Isaiah 6:12).

keras said in post 195:

Ezekiel 20:47...I am about to kindle a fire...all the Land will be scorched by it.

Ezekiel 20:47 And say to the forest of the south, Hear the word of the LORD; Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will kindle a fire in thee, and it shall devour every green tree in thee, and every dry tree: the flaming flame shall not be quenched, and all faces from the south to the north shall be burned therein.

Here "the forest of the south" brings to mind the vast Congo forest, which is south of the Middle East, where Ezekiel was located when he received this prophecy (Ezekiel 20:45-47). The Congo forest could be burned by "flaming flame" (Ezekiel 20:47) at Jesus' 2nd coming in "flaming fire" (2 Thessalonians 1:7-10).

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 7:32-34 The time is coming when the dead will fill the valley of Topeth [beside Jerusalem] and the whole Land will become like a desert.

Jeremiah 7:32 Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that it shall no more be called Tophet, nor the valley of the son of Hinnom, but the valley of slaughter: for they shall bury in Tophet, till there be no place.
33 And the carcases of this people shall be meat for the fowls of the heaven, and for the beasts of the earth; and none shall fray them away.
34 Then will I cause to cease from the cities of Judah, and from the streets of Jerusalem, the voice of mirth, and the voice of gladness, the voice of the bridegroom, and the voice of the bride: for the land shall be desolate.

This could refer to Judah's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 19:11

Jeremiah 19:11 And shalt say unto them, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Even so will I break this people and this city, as one breaketh a potter's vessel, that cannot be made whole again: and they shall bury them in Tophet, till there be no place to bury.

This could refer to Judah's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 5:8 & 12 I shall raise My hand against all the inhabitants of the Land and leave you devastated, a land without inhabitants.

Note that your references must be off. For Jeremiah 5:8 & 12 actually say something very different:

Jeremiah 5:8 They were as fed horses in the morning: every one neighed after his neighbour's wife.

Jeremiah 5:12 They have belied the LORD, and said, It is not he; neither shall evil come upon us; neither shall we see sword nor famine:

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 12:14 The Lord says: I shall uproot the evil neighbours who have encroached onto My peoples Land. Also I shall uproot Judah from among them.

Jeremiah 12:14 ¶Thus saith the LORD against all mine evil neighbours, that touch the inheritance which I have caused my people Israel to inherit; Behold, I will pluck them out of their land, and pluck out the house of Judah from among them.

This can refer to the destruction of the pagan nations neighboring ancient Judah, as well as ancient Judah itself, by the Babylonians in 586 BC. Jeremiah 12:15 can then refer to Judah's subsequent return from the Babylonian Captivity.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 10:18 & 22 The Lord says: This time I shall throw out the whole population of the Land, I shall press them and squeeze them dry. Listen; a devouring horde comes to make Judah’s cities utterly desolate.

Jeremiah 10:18 For thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will sling out the inhabitants of the land at this once, and will distress them, that they may find it so.

Jeremiah 10:22 Behold, the noise of the bruit is come, and a great commotion out of the north country, to make the cities of Judah desolate, and a den of dragons.

This could refer to Judah's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 8:16 The Destroyer approaches and the whole Land trembles – it comes and consumes everything; crops, trees, city and citizens alike.

Jeremiah 8:16 The snorting of his horses was heard from Dan: the whole land trembled at the sound of the neighing of his strong ones; for they are come, and have devoured the land, and all that is in it; the city, and those that dwell therein.

This could refer to Judah's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 24:18b-19 The earth’s foundations shake when the window of heaven is opened, the earth is struck and it staggers and reels wildly.

Isaiah 24:18b ...for the windows from on high are open, and the foundations of the earth do shake.
19 The earth is utterly broken down, the earth is clean dissolved, the earth is moved exceedingly.

Note that Isaiah 24 could happen at Jesus' 2nd coming. For the events of "that day" in Isaiah 24:21-22 match the 2nd coming events of Revelation 19:19 to 20:3. And the events of Isaiah 24:23 match the post-tribulation, 2nd coming events of Matthew 24:29-30 and the subsequent millennial reign of Jesus on the earth in Revelation 20:4-6 and Micah 4:1-4.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 4:7 The Destroyer of nations has come out from his lair to devastate your Land and make your cities waste and empty. In an instant, the whole Land crashes down in ruin. I looked and there was no one, even the birds have gone.

Jeremiah 4:7 The lion is come up from his thicket, and the destroyer of the Gentiles is on his way; he is gone forth from his place to make thy land desolate; and thy cities shall be laid waste, without an inhabitant.

This could refer to Judah's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Joel 1:15-20 The Day of the Lord comes, a terrible destruction from the Almighty, all food is destroyed and fire has consumed the pastures and trees.

Joel 1:15 Alas for the day! for the day of the LORD is at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come.
16 Is not the meat cut off before our eyes, yea, joy and gladness from the house of our God?
17 The seed is rotten under their clods, the garners are laid desolate, the barns are broken down; for the corn is withered.
18 How do the beasts groan! the herds of cattle are perplexed, because they have no pasture; yea, the flocks of sheep are made desolate.
19 O LORD, to thee will I cry: for the fire hath devoured the pastures of the wilderness, and the flame hath burned all the trees of the field.
20 The beasts of the field cry also unto thee: for the rivers of waters are dried up, and the fire hath devoured the pastures of the wilderness.

This could refer to an ancient, severe drought, and resulting wildfires, which affected the Israelites in their land.

Similarly, the subsequent verses of Joel 2:1-27 could refer poetically to a literal locust invasion which destroyed ancient Israel's crops (Joel 2:25) sometime before the Acts 2 day of Pentecost in the 1st century AD (Joel 2:28-29, Acts 2:16-18). For the day of the Lord in Joel 2:1-27 can refer to an ancient day of the Lord, like, for example, the ancient day of the Lord in Jeremiah 46:2,10. Both of these ancient days of the Lord can be different than the future day of the Lord (Joel 2:31), which won't start until sometime after (as in only a few years after) the 6th seal (Revelation 6:12, Joel 2:31) of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24. For the future day of the Lord (Christ) (2 Thessalonians 2:2) won't begin until Jesus' 2nd coming (1 Corinthians 1:7-8; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8; 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10), which won't occur until immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6).

keras said in post 195:

Zephaniah 1:18 On the Day of the Lord’s wrath, by the fire of His jealousy the whole Land will be consumed, for He will make a sudden and terrible end to all who live in the Land.

Zephaniah 1:18 Neither their silver nor their gold shall be able to deliver them in the day of the LORD'S wrath; but the whole land shall be devoured by the fire of his jealousy: for he shall make even a speedy riddance of all them that dwell in the land.

See the reply above (in this post) to your previous reference to Zephaniah 1:14-18.

keras said in post 195:

Micah 1:6 I shall reduce Samaria to a ruin...I will level the hills and valleys.

Micah 1:6 Therefore I will make Samaria as an heap of the field, and as plantings of a vineyard: and I will pour down the stones thereof into the valley, and I will discover the foundations thereof.

This could refer to Samaria's destruction by the Assyrians in 722 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 25:33-38 The Lord is ravaging the shepherd’s pastures and their homes are ruined beneath the Lord’s fierce anger. The Land becomes a waste under the sword of the Destroyer and those whom the Lord kills on that Day, will be scattered from one end of the earth to the other, neither mourned or buried.

Jeremiah 25:33 And the slain of the LORD shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth: they shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried; they shall be dung upon the ground.
34 Howl, ye shepherds, and cry; and wallow yourselves in the ashes, ye principal of the flock: for the days of your slaughter and of your dispersions are accomplished; and ye shall fall like a pleasant vessel.
35 And the shepherds shall have no way to flee, nor the principal of the flock to escape.
36 A voice of the cry of the shepherds, and an howling of the principal of the flock, shall be heard: for the LORD hath spoiled their pasture.
37 And the peaceable habitations are cut down because of the fierce anger of the LORD.
38 He hath forsaken his covert, as the lion: for their land is desolate because of the fierceness of the oppressor, and because of his fierce anger.

This could refer to Jesus' 2nd coming (Revelation 19:21, Jeremiah 25:31). Compare also the shout and treading of Jeremiah 25:30 with the 2nd coming shout and treading of 1 Thessalonians 4:16 and Revelation 19:15b.

keras said in post 195:

Micah 5:11 I shall devastate the cities of your Land and destroy your military power.

Micah 5:11 And I will cut off the cities of thy land, and throw down all thy strong holds:

This, like its context (Micah 5:5-15), could refer to Jesus' 2nd coming and the subsequent millennium.

That is, in Micah 5:5, "the Assyrian shall come into our land" could refer to when the Antichrist and his world armies will pillage Jerusalem right before Jesus' 2nd coming (Zechariah 14:2-4, Daniel 11:45) and Jesus' defeat of the Antichrist (Isaiah 30:30-33, Revelation 19:20). The subsequent successful fighting by the Jews in Zechariah 14:14 and Zechariah 12:6-8 could include what Micah 5:5b-6a is referring to.

The ancient Assyrian empire included Lebanon, and the Antichrist could have Assyrian blood in him.

The Antichrist could have grown up as a Druze Arab, in Lebanon, in the modern city of Tyre (Ezekiel 28:2; 2 Thessalonians 2:4). So he could at first present himself to the world as being of the (quasi-Islamic) Druze religion, which is waiting for the 2nd coming of a God-man named Hakim. The Antichrist's last name could be Hakim, and he could at first present himself to the Druze people as the fulfillment of the 2nd coming of this God-man. In this way, he could get the Druze to support him without question during an initial rise to power among the Arabs. The Druze Arabs could be the numerically "small people" of Daniel 11:23. The Antichrist could make them his completely-devoted bodyguard, and buy them many key positions of power within a future United Arab States (which the Antichrist could become the leader of in the 1st stage of his world takeover), and employ the Druze as loyal spies and assassins at every level of his United Arab government and military.

The Druze religion is very secretive. What it teaches to its higher-level initiates isn't even taught to its lower-level initiates. What it could teach to its higher-level initiates could basically be Gnosticism mixed in with the Hakim God-man idea. The Antichrist himself, while outwardly a Druze, could inwardly be a Gnostic Luciferian. He could be a highest-level initiate of a worldwide secret society which ultimately teaches Gnostic Luciferianism, but keeps this a secret even from its own members who haven't been initiated into its highest level.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 9:10-11 & 21-22 I will chant a funeral dirge over the Land when I make Jerusalem a heap of ruins and the towns of Judah uninhabited. Death will enter your houses and will kill anyone in the streets. Corpses will lie like dung, like swaths behind the reaper, with no one left to gather them.

Jeremiah 9:10 For the mountains will I take up a weeping and wailing, and for the habitations of the wilderness a lamentation, because they are burned up, so that none can pass through them; neither can men hear the voice of the cattle; both the fowl of the heavens and the beast are fled; they are gone.
11 And I will make Jerusalem heaps, and a den of dragons; and I will make the cities of Judah desolate, without an inhabitant.

Jeremiah 9:21 For death is come up into our windows, and is entered into our palaces, to cut off the children from without, and the young men from the streets.
22 Speak, Thus saith the LORD, Even the carcases of men shall fall as dung upon the open field, and as the handful after the harvestman, and none shall gather them.

This could refer to Judah's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 17:1

Isaiah 17:1 ¶The burden of Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.

Damascus is said to be the oldest, continually-inhabited city on the earth. But it could be nuked by Israel during a future all-out war (Isaiah 17:1). Yet this war will also break the power of Israel (Isaiah 17:4).


keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 17:1 & 14

Isaiah 17:14 And behold at eveningtide trouble; and before the morning he is not. This is the portion of them that spoil us, and the lot of them that rob us.

Isaiah 17:12-14 could refer to the final pillaging of Jerusalem which will occur right before Jesus' 2nd coming and the subsequent millennium (Zechariah 14).

keras said in post 195:

Hosea 4:3 The Land will become desolate, all that lives in it will be wasted, even the wild animals, birds and fishes will vanish.

Hosea 4:3 Therefore shall the land mourn, and every one that dwelleth therein shall languish, with the beasts of the field, and with the fowls of heaven; yea, the fishes of the sea also shall be taken away.

The "fishes of the sea also shall be taken away" brings to mind the 2nd vial (Revelation 16:3).


keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 64:10-11 Zion becomes a desert, the holy cities desolate, all that we cherished lies in ruins, burned to the ground.

Isaiah 64:10 Thy holy cities are a wilderness, Zion is a wilderness, Jerusalem a desolation.
11 Our holy and our beautiful house, where our fathers praised thee, is burned up with fire: and all our pleasant things are laid waste.

This could refer to Jerusalem's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 4:26 The fertile Land has become desolate, its towns all razed to the ground before the fierce anger of the Lord.

Jeremiah 4:26 I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, and by his fierce anger.

This could refer to Judah's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 33:8a The roads are deserted, no one travels anywhere. The Land is parched and dry, stripped bare, like a desert.

Isaiah 33:8 The highways lie waste, the wayfaring man ceaseth: he hath broken the covenant, he hath despised the cities, he regardeth no man.

This could refer to what the Antichrist will do to Judah (southern Israel) after he breaks a 7-year covenant (peace treaty) which he will have made with a false Jewish "Messiah" in Jerusalem (Daniel 9:26a,27, Daniel 11:22-23).

keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 24:10 The city is shattered and in chaos, every house is barred and shuttered.

Isaiah 24:10 The city of confusion is broken down: every house is shut up, that no man may come in.

See the reply above (in this post) to your prior reference to Isaiah 24:18b-19.

keras said in post 195:

Isaiah 32:14 Houses are empty, the crowded streets are deserted and the military areas are turned into open fields.

Isaiah 32:14 Because the palaces shall be forsaken; the multitude of the city shall be left; the forts and towers shall be for dens for ever, a joy of wild asses, a pasture of flocks;

This could refer to what will happen at Jesus' 2nd coming.

keras said in post 195:

Jeremiah 12:4 & 10-13 How long must the Land lie parched, its grass withered? No birds or beasts are left, because God has judged the wicked inhabitants, they said: God does not see what we are doing. Therefore a sword from the Lord has devoured the Land from end to end and now it’s all a desolate wilderness. Ref: REB. Some verses abridged.

Jeremiah 12:4 How long shall the land mourn, and the herbs of every field wither, for the wickedness of them that dwell therein? the beasts are consumed, and the birds; because they said, He shall not see our last end.

Jeremiah 12:10 Many pastors have destroyed my vineyard, they have trodden my portion under foot, they have made my pleasant portion a desolate wilderness.
11 They have made it desolate, and being desolate it mourneth unto me; the whole land is made desolate, because no man layeth it to heart.
12 The spoilers are come upon all high places through the wilderness: for the sword of the LORD shall devour from the one end of the land even to the other end of the land: no flesh shall have peace.
13 They have sown wheat, but shall reap thorns: they have put themselves to pain, but shall not profit: and they shall be ashamed of your revenues because of the fierce anger of the LORD.

This could refer to Judah's destruction by the Babylonians in 586 BC.

keras said in post 195:

But before they “march, with great joy into the Land”; Psalm 68:7-9 & 24-27 . . .

Psalms 68:7 ¶O God, when thou wentest forth before thy people, when thou didst march through the wilderness; Selah:
8 The earth shook, the heavens also dropped at the presence of God: even Sinai itself was moved at the presence of God, the God of Israel.
9 Thou, O God, didst send a plentiful rain, whereby thou didst confirm thine inheritance, when it was weary.

Psalms 68:24 They have seen thy goings, O God; even the goings of my God, my King, in the sanctuary.
25 The singers went before, the players on instruments followed after; among them were the damsels playing with timbrels.
26 Bless ye God in the congregations, even the Lord, from the fountain of Israel.
27 There is little Benjamin with their ruler, the princes of Judah and their council, the princes of Zebulun, and the princes of Naphtali.

This can refer to the millennium.

keras said in post 195:

. . . the Lord will send rain and a tremendous regeneration will take place and they “will find food and water in plenty”. Isaiah 49:8-19, Ezekiel 36:8 . . .

Regarding Isaiah 49:8-19 and Ezekiel 36:8, they can refer to the millennium.

keras said in post 195:

. . . Joel 2:21-24 . . .

Regarding Joel 2:21-24, see the reply above (in this post) to your reference to Joel 1:15-20.

keras said in post 195:

. . . Isaiah 51:3 . . .

Regarding Isaiah 51:3, it can refer to the millennium.
 
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keras

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Well, Bible2+. that was a lengthy rebuttal. I doubt any will bother to read it all, as I didn't.
All the prophesies I posted you think can refer to the Return or the Millennium. That's your prerogative, certainly not my belief, as in most the context simply doesn't fit any other situation than the forthcoming Day of the Lord's vengeance and wrath.

I thank you for pointing out my typos:
Isaiah 26:24...should be Isaiah 26:21
Jeremiah 5:8 & 12....should be Jeremiah 6:8 & 12
 
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keras said in post 197:

All the prophesies I posted you think can refer to the Return or the Millennium. That's your prerogative, certainly not my belief, as in most the context simply doesn't fit any other situation than the forthcoming Day of the Lord's vengeance and wrath.

Note that the Day of the Lord will begin at the Return and include the Millennium.

For example, regarding 2 Peter 3:10-13, in the day of the Lord will occur the destruction of heaven (the 1st heaven: the sky/atmosphere) and the earth (its surface) at the great white throne judgment (Revelation 20:11, Revelation 21:1). And this will be followed by the creation of a new atmosphere and surface for the earth (2 Peter 3:13, Revelation 21:1) onto which New Jerusalem, God the Father's house (John 14:2, Revelation 21:2-3), will descend from the 3rd heaven (Revelation 21:2-3).

But the day of the Lord won't immediately bring the destruction of earth's atmosphere and surface. For the day of the Lord will begin at Jesus' still-unfulfilled 2nd coming (1 Corinthians 1:7-8) as a thief (2 Peter 3:10a, Revelation 16:15). And after his 2nd coming, he will establish his kingdom physically on the earth with the physically resurrected church for 1,000 years (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29, Psalms 66:3-4, Psalms 72:8-11, Zechariah 14:3-21).

And after the 1,000 years, the Gog/Magog rebellion will occur (Revelation 20:7-10, Ezekiel chapters 38-39). And after its defeat, at least 7 more years will occur (Ezekiel 39:9b), before the earth's atmosphere and surface are destroyed at the great white throne judgment (Revelation 20:11). All these events, from Jesus' 2nd coming to the great white throne judgment, will be part of the day of the Lord. For it is not a 24-hour day, but to God is like a 1,000-year "day" (2 Peter 3:8).

keras said in post 197:

Isaiah 26:24...should be Isaiah 26:21

Isaiah 26:21 For, behold, the LORD cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.

Isaiah 26:21c refers to the earth not covering those who will be slain by Jesus at his 2nd coming (Isaiah 26:21a, Revelation 19:11-21), when the bodies of those slain will be eaten by birds, instead of being buried in the earth (Revelation 19:21).

keras said in post 197:

Jeremiah 5:8 & 12....should be Jeremiah 6:8 & 12

Jeremiah 6:8 Be thou instructed, O Jerusalem, lest my soul depart from thee; lest I make thee desolate, a land not inhabited.

Jeremiah 6:12 And their houses shall be turned unto others, with their fields and wives together: for I will stretch out my hand upon the inhabitants of the land, saith the LORD.

Jeremiah 6:8,12 can refer to the destruction of ancient Jerusalem by the Babylonians in 586 BC (Jeremiah 6:22-23).
 
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keras

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Note that the Day of the Lord will begin at the Return and include the Millennium.
Your opinion, that conflicts with the given sequence of Revelation.
Revelation 6:17 states that the Day of Lord's wrath comes at the Sixth Seal.
Then, later at the end the Great Tribulation Trumpets and 7 Bowls, His wrath is completed. Revelation 15:1
Note that at the Return, in Revelation 19:13, Jesus appears in garments splashed in blood......we know where that blood came from; Isaiah 63:1-6: His earlier judgement/punishment of the nations, that will happen at the Sixth Seal event, a terrible disaster by fire from the sun. Not the same as His disposal of the armies of the Anti-Christ by the Sword of His Word.
The Millennium period will be a time of peace on all the world, except at the end of the 1000 years, when a final rebellion will be wiped out.
 
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keras said in post 199:

Your opinion, that conflicts with the given sequence of Revelation.

Note that what has been presented doesn't conflict with the fact that Revelation chapters 6 to 22 are chronological insofar as the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 will begin with the events of the 2nd through 6th seals, occurring in the order shown in Revelation 6:3-14. After the events of the 6th seal, Revelation 7 will occur. Then the 7th seal will be unsealed, and out of it will come the tribulation's 7 trumpets (Revelation 8:1-6). Then the events of the first 6 trumpets in Revelation 8:7 to Revelation 9:21 will occur in the order shown there. Then Revelation 10 will occur. Then the literal 3.5 years of the Antichrist's worldwide reign will occur, which time period is shown from 4 different angles in Revelation chapters 11 to 14 (Revelation 11:2b-3, Revelation 12:6,14, Revelation 13:5,7, Revelation 14:9-13).

Then the 7th trumpet will sound, announcing the legal end of the Antichrist's reign (Revelation 11:15). Out of the 7th trumpet's heavenly-temple opening will come the 7 plagues of the 7 vials (Revelation 11:19, Revelation 15:5 to 16:1), the tribulation's final stage. Then the events of the 7 vials will occur in the order shown in Revelation 16. Jesus will return right after the 7th vial (Revelation 16:17,19, Revelation 19:2-21), and he will rapture and marry the church at that time (Revelation 19:7). Then he will defeat the world's armies (Revelation 19:11 to 20:3) and reign on the earth with the physically resurrected church for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29; 1 Corinthians 15:51-53). Then the events of Revelation 20:7 to Revelation 22:5 will occur in the order shown there.

keras said in post 199:

Revelation 6:17 states that the Day of Lord's wrath comes at the Sixth Seal.

Note that the tribulation's 6th seal (Revelation 6:12-14) will happen sometime before the day of the Lord (Joel 2:31, Revelation 6:12), as in only a few years before. The day of the Lord itself won't begin until Jesus' 2nd coming (1 Corinthians 1:7-8; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8; 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10), which won't happen until Revelation 19:7 to 20:6, immediately after the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8). Similarly, the day of the Lord's wrath (Psalms 110:5) won't begin until Jesus' 2nd coming (Revelation 19:19-21).

So the people quoted at the 6th seal (Revelation 6:17), during only the 1st stage of the tribulation, could be just as mistaken as Job was when Job said that what was happening to him was God's wrath against him (Job 19:11). Just as what was happening to Job was actually Satan's wrath against him, not God's wrath, so the 6th seal could actually be Satan's wrath, not God's wrath. And just as the writer of the book of Job didn't go out of his way to correct Job's mistaken statement in Job 19:11, and just as the apostles John and Matthew didn't go out of their way to correct the mistaken statements of the people they quoted in John 7:12b and Matthew 27:63a, so the apostle John could have not gone out of his way to correct the statement of the people he quoted in Revelation 6:17.

After the tribulation's 6th seal will occur its 7th seal (Revelation 8:1), out of which will come its 7 trumpets (Revelation 8:1-2). Note that nothing requires that any of the first 6 trumpets' events in Revelation chapters 8 and 9 will be God's wrath. The 5th trumpet's events will be the work of strange locust-like beings from the bottomless pit (Revelation 9:2-10), led by a fallen angel from the bottomless pit (Revelation 9:11). And the 6th trumpet's events to the end of Revelation 9 will be the work of weird horse-like beings led by 4 fallen angels previously bound at the Euphrates (Revelation 9:14-19). So even though good angels of God will sound the first 6 trumpets, this could be announcing God's allowing the wrath of Satan to destroy 1/3 of different things (Revelation 8:7-12, Revelation 9:15,18), just as Satan will subsequently, mid-tribulation, be allowed by God to cause 1/3 of the angels (i.e. his fallen angels) to be cast down to the earth permanently (Revelation 12:4,9).

Revelation chapters 8 and 9 will happen before the Antichrist's (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's beast's) future, literal 3.5-year worldwide Luciferian/Satanic reign (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9). And the events in Revelation chapters 8 and 9 could be used by Satan to help prepare the world to welcome that reign. For what Satan could do is first take great pleasure in causing the destruction in each event, but then claim that the destruction isn't from him, but from YHWH, and that YHWH is a cruel tyrant god who hates mankind and only wants to make it suffer, while he (Satan, as "Lucifer") only wants the best for mankind (cf. Mark 8:33b). In this way, he could deceive the world into turning away from YHWH and instead worshipping him (the dragon) and the Antichrist (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9). The Antichrist will utterly revile YHWH (Revelation 13:6, Daniel 11:36).

After the Antichrist's literal 3.5-year reign (Revelation 13:5-7) is declared legally over at the sounding of the tribulation's 7th trumpet (Revelation 11:15), the 7 plagues of the 7 vials of God's wrath will come out of the heavenly-temple opening of the 7th trumpet (Revelation 11:19, Revelation 15:5 to 16:1). The vials will then be poured out on the Antichrist's followers as God's judgment for their receiving the Antichrist's mark and worshipping his image (Revelation 16:2), and for their killing of people in the church (Revelation 16:6-7, Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).

During the Antichrist's worldwide reign, people in the church will be hated and killed in every nation for refusing to renounce the name of Jesus Christ (Matthew 24:9-13). They will be beheaded for refusing to renounce the witness of Jesus Christ (Revelation 20:4), for refusing to accept the antichrist lies that Jesus himself isn't the Christ (1 John 2:22), and that Christ himself isn't in the flesh (2 John 1:7). They will be beheaded for refusing to renounce the sound doctrine of the Bible, the Word of God (Revelation 20:4; 2 Timothy 3:15 to 4:4), for refusing to depart from the Biblical faith and to give heed instead to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils (1 Timothy 4:1-2). They will be beheaded for refusing to worship the Antichrist's image (Revelation 20:4, Revelation 13:15). And all of this will be Satan's wrath against the church (Revelation 12:17), not God's wrath, for the church isn't appointed to God's wrath (1 Thessalonians 5:9).

Even when God's wrath comes in the 7 vials (Revelation 16), the tribulation's final stage, because the church isn't appointed to God's wrath, none of the vials will be directed at any of those in the church who will still be alive on the earth at that time, still waiting for Jesus' coming as a thief (Revelation 16:15). Instead, they will go into protective chambers which they will have prepared for themselves on the earth (Isaiah 26:20), just as Noah and his family went into the protective ark which they had prepared for themselves on the earth (Genesis 7:11,13).

Jesus will return right after the 7th-and-last vial is completed (Revelation 16:17,19, Revelation 19:2-21, Matthew 24:29-30), and he will bring the 2nd-coming wrath of God on the unsaved world (Revelation 19:15-21). But before that 2nd-coming wrath begins, the church will be caught up together/gathered together (raptured) (1 Thessalonians 4:17; 2 Thessalonians 2:1, Matthew 24:31) into the sky to hold a meeting in the air with the returned Jesus (1 Thessalonians 4:17).

At that meeting, Jesus will judge everyone in the church (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) by their works (2 Corinthians 5:10, Romans 2:6-8, Luke 12:45-48, Matthew 25:19-30). And then Jesus will marry in the clouds the obedient part of the church (Revelation 19:7-8, Matthew 25:1-12), those in the church (of all times) who "overcame" to the end (Revelation 3:5, Revelation 2:26). They will then mount white horses and come back down from the sky (the 1st heaven) with Jesus (Revelation 19:14) as he defeats the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") and the world's armies (Revelation 19:15-21). Jesus will then make the marriage supper of Revelation 19:9 for the resurrected and married obedient part of the church in the earthly Jerusalem (Isaiah 25:6-9; 1 Corinthians 15:54). Jesus and the obedient part of the church will then reign on the earth for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29).

keras said in post 199:

Then, later at the end the Great Tribulation Trumpets and 7 Bowls, His wrath is completed. Revelation 15:1

Note that none of the "wrath" verses in Revelation chapters 15-16 requires that the entire future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 will be God's wrath. For they refer only to the tribulation's final stage, the 7 plagues of the 7 vials of God's wrath, which could be the "last" plagues which "fill up" (complete) God's wrath (Revelation 15:1) in relation to the earlier plagues brought on the world by God's 2 witnesses (Revelation 11:6). Also, nothing requires that any of the plagues from God in Revelation 11:6 or Revelation 16 will be directed against any of the saved people (1 Thessalonians 5:9) who will still be alive on the earth during those times (Matthew 24:9-13, Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6), still waiting for Jesus' coming as a thief (Revelation 16:15).

keras said in post 199:

Note that at the Return, in Revelation 19:13, Jesus appears in garments splashed in blood......we know where that blood came from; Isaiah 63:1-6 . . .

Note that Isaiah 63:3 won't occur until Jesus' 2nd coming in Revelation 19:15-21. So Revelation 19:13 could refer to his own blood, like how believers' robes are dipped in his blood (Revelation 7:14). Also, note that Isaiah 63:3 refers not to a dipping in blood, but to only a sprinkling with blood. Also, in Revelation 19:13 the original Greek word (bapto: G0911) translated as "dipped" means the same as baptism, and Jesus referred to his own bloody death as a baptism (Luke 12:50, Mark 10:38-39), just as believers are baptized into his death (Romans 6:3).

keras said in post 199:

The Millennium period will be a time of peace on all the world, except at the end of the 1000 years, when a final rebellion will be wiped out.

The day of the Lord that will stretch from the 2nd coming, through the millennium, and up to the great white throne judgment, will be one long period of time of judgment from God. It will begin with the judgment of the 2nd coming (Revelation 19:11-21), extend through the judgment of the millennium (e.g. Zechariah 14:19, Revelation 2:26-29), then include the judgment on Gog, Magog, and Satan after the millennium (Revelation 20:7-10), and then end with the great white throne judgment (Revelation 20:11-15).
 
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