To turn away is to cease following Jesus, to no longer be a disciple learning form Him.
John
NZ
so your saying Jesus said to measure whether or not we could handle being saved?
so lets look at Luke 14.
25 A large crowd was following Jesus. He turned around and said to them, 26 “If you want to be my disciple, you must hate everyone else by comparison—your father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters—yes, even your own life. Otherwise, you cannot be my disciple. 27 And if you do not carry your own cross and follow me, you cannot be my disciple.
28 “But don’t begin until you count the cost. For who would begin construction of a building without first calculating the cost to see if there is enough money to finish it? 29 Otherwise, you might complete only the foundation before running out of money, and then everyone would laugh at you. 30 They would say, ‘There’s the person who started that building and couldn’t afford to finish it!’
31 “Or what king would go to war against another king without first sitting down with his counselors to discuss whether his army of 10,000 could defeat the 20,000 soldiers marching against him? 32 And if he can’t, he will send a delegation to discuss terms of peace while the enemy is still far away. 33 So you cannot become my disciple without giving up everything you own.
34 “Salt is good for seasoning. But if it loses its flavor, how do you make it salty again? 35 Flavorless salt is good neither for the soil nor for the manure pile. It is thrown away. Anyone with ears to hear should listen and understand!”
Clearly Jesus says there is a difference, why would he say to measure if you can be saved or not, He says my disciple and He says to be one you must give up everything you own. Now not every Christian can give up everything they own, in fact few do, does that mean they are not saved?
Take this story Mat 19
16 Someone came to Jesus with this question: “Teacher,[f] what good deed must I do to have eternal life?”
17 “Why ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. But to answer your question—if you want to receive eternal life, keep[g] the commandments.”
18 “Which ones?” the man asked.
And Jesus replied: “‘You must not murder. You must not commit adultery. You must not steal. You must not testify falsely. 19 Honor your father and mother. Love your neighbor as yourself.’[h]”
20 “I’ve obeyed all these commandments,” the young man replied. “What else must I do?”
21 Jesus told him, “If you want to be perfect, go and sell all your possessions and give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
22 But when the young man heard this, he went away sad, for he had many possessions.
23 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “I tell you the truth, it is very hard for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of Heaven. 24 I’ll say it again—it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!”
25 The disciples were astounded. “Then who in the world can be saved?” they asked.
26 Jesus looked at them intently and said, “Humanly speaking, it is impossible. But with God everything is possible.”
27 Then Peter said to him, “We’ve given up everything to follow you. What will we get?”
28 Jesus replied, “I assure you that when the world is made new
and the Son of Man[j] sits upon his glorious throne, you who have been my followers will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. 29 And everyone who has given up houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or property, for my sake, will receive a hundred times as much in return and will inherit eternal life. 30 But many who are the greatest now will be least important then, and those who seem least important now will be the greatest then.[k]
Now the man was called to be a disciple, Jesus said if you would be perfect sell every thing and follow me. Here we see Jesus tell some what He says in Luke 14. But when they ask who can be saved Jesus says with God all things are possible. I see your view because He would make it so, but look at this. Jesus did not say the man would be lost, but he clearly would not be a disciple.
What about a man who excepts Christ on his death bed, he never got a chance to be a disciple. Yet he was saved.
I'll say it again for some it is enough that they believe in Jesus and confess they do. Nothing else is required, but others are called to do more.
1 cor 12
27 All of you together are Christ’s body, and each of you is a part of it. 28 Here are some of the parts God has appointed for the church:
first are apostles,
second are prophets,
third are teachers,
then those who do miracles,
those who have the gift of healing,
those who can help others,
those who have the gift of leadership,
those who speak in unknown languages.
29 Are we all apostles? Are we all prophets? Are we all teachers? Do we all have the power to do miracles? 30 Do we all have the gift of healing? Do we all have the ability to speak in unknown languages? Do we all have the ability to interpret unknown languages? Of course not! 31 So you should earnestly desire the most helpful gifts.
But now let me show you a way of life that is best of all.
Ok I look up the definition of disciple. It says follower of Christ, then not all as Paul said the different groups. Apostles must be what Jesus is referring to in Luke 14. So its seems what i was trying to express is the different body parts of Christ while you were describe the whole body i was describing the parts.
so we are both right, and I am wrong Learner comes from the Greek, and in English it is a follower of Christ.
I suspect this is what was going on in the OP group. See what happens when we go to God's word we begin to see.
I hope you can see my view as well and how Jesus is speaking of a different positions in the Body in Luke 14. I think Paul describe the Body best, but lets not forget in chapter 13 of 1 cor he says loving God and everyone else is greatest of all and the best way.
I hope we have work this out and hope it helps the BG.
very fruit full good conversation thank you
Peace and Love
blu
