how many believe the prophets and saints of God that Enoch never died?

Raimi Stranger · Aug 8, 2013

how few believe the prophets and saints of God that Enoch never died?

-yet this shows that the essence of man is spirit

Hebrews 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

how few understand that we must be translated, changed to spirit , to take on immortality, to be with God in heaven...

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep [NOTE in death], but we shall all be changed,...

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

and that one can only be translated to spirit once Love is perfected in life, no more abuse with sins else one is returned to life until one does choose Love and so become happy and peaceful and just in life... one cannot do this when dead! ...

drstevej · Aug 8, 2013

Enoch never died -- TRUTH

one can only be translated to spirit once Love is perfected in life -- RAIMI

Who other than Enoch and Elijah were taken out of this life prior to death?

ChetSinger · Aug 8, 2013

I agree that Enoch didn't die.

But our final destination isn't as spirits in heaven, but as new bodies in a new Jerusalem on a new earth.

4LivingCreations · Aug 9, 2013

Who other than Enoch and Elijah were taken out of this life prior to death?

Arguably, Moses, if Deut 34:1-7 are read as though the death was spiritual, Moses was translated, and that "grave unknown to this day" means the modern reader, being carefully defined as a "man" rather than "Son of man" doesn't see it.

drstevej · Aug 9, 2013

4LivingCreations said:
Arguably, Moses, if Deut 34:1-7 are read as though the death was spiritual, Moses was translated, and that "grave unknown to this day" means the modern reader, being carefully defined as a "man" rather than "Son of man" doesn't see it.

The death of Moses is alluded to, in the Bible, ten times.

"Thy days approach that thou must die." (Deut. 31: 14.)

"And thou shalt die on the mount." (Deut. 33: 50.)

"For I am going to die."

"For I know that after my death." (Deut. 31: 29.)

"And how much more after my death." (Deut. 31: 27.)

". . . Blessed the children of Israel before his death." (Deut. 33: 1.)

"And Moses was one hundred and twenty years old when he died." (Deut. 34: 7.)

"And it came to pass after the death of Moses." (Josh. I: 1.)

"Moses, my servant, is dead." (Josh. 1: 2.)

4LivingCreations · Aug 9, 2013

The death of Moses is alluded to, in the Bible, ten times.

Yeah that's why I said arguably. There's a lot of information in the geographical and personal names surrounding the death.
But I'm not preaching it, just saying. You know, cause Moses appeared with Elijah to talk to Jesus, and various people might want to reconcile a dead man walking in different ways.

drstevej · Aug 9, 2013

The Mount of Transfiguration I think was intended to be a preview of the Kingdom. That's why Jesus said SOME of you will not die before you see the kingdom. Moses represented resurrected OT saints.

Matthew 16:28

Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

very next verses...

Matthew 17

1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,

2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.

3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.

sdowney717 · Aug 10, 2013

Neither Elijah or Enoch died a death in the body being taken up into heaven alive.
Scripture says it is appointed for men once to die, then the judgement. Heb 9:27

Thus the two witnesses in Rev are thought to be Enoch and Elijah who had not died. And they are then killed and that will keep scripture from being broken.

Jesus said scripture can not be broken. What God has said must come to pass.

sdowney717 · Aug 10, 2013

There is also the gathering to Him at His coming when He sends out the angels to collect His people.

Then we who are left alive until the coming of the Lord shall not precede those who are asleep (bodies died in the Lord).
Scripture says they are caught up alive to be with the Lord. So these people will also not have died. And not sure myself how this works out in relation to Heb 9:27. Scripture can not be broken but my understanding can be broken!
The appointment with death for all men has some discretion regarding God's will.

1 thess 4

The Comfort of Christ’s Coming

13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.

15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.

Anto9us · Aug 11, 2013

Enoch "was not" for God took him. I don't believe he ever died.

Satan and arch angel Michael were fighting over the BODY of Moses - so I think he died.

Elijah went up without dying - but many people think he came back or was sort of reincarnated as John the Baptist - who was beheaded. But it makes no sense to be reincarnated if you never died in the first place.

"for if ye can accept it - this was Elijah who was to come"

(Jesus speaking of John the Baptist)

Perhaps the TWO WITNESSES in Revelation are really

Tim La Haye and Jerry Jenkins

It is also questionable whether Melchizedek ever died - he is spoken of it seems as having no beginning and "no end". Just saying.

Anto9us · Aug 11, 2013

Hbr 7:1¶For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;

Hbr 7:2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;

Hbr 7:3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days,

nor end of life;

but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.

Anto9us · Aug 11, 2013

I can neither confirm nor deny that Melchisedec is currently playing Third Base on the Texas Ranger farm club in Round Rock.

Meta Tron · Aug 11, 2013

Anto9us · Aug 11, 2013

lol

SAINTS is a good team for Melchisedec to be on

I think Manny Ramirez wanted to be the oldest guy on that Triple-A team in Round Rock anyway

gasman64 · Aug 12, 2013

Both Enoch and Elijah died. The word 'translated' doesn't mean taken up into heaven, but transported. No one gets to heaven before judgement.

Meta Tron · Aug 12, 2013

SilentShadow100 · Aug 12, 2013

It is clearly expressed in the Bible that we will be given a better physical body in our physical eternal world. The righteous will be physically living in a physical new Earth within the walls of the physical New Jerusalem.

If you follow the councils, the fifth ecumenical council said this in their anathemas against Origin:
"XI: If anyone shall say that the future judgment signifies the destruction of the body and that the end of the story will be an immaterial existence/nature, and that thereafter there will no longer be any matter, but only spirit intelligence/mind: let him be anathema."

EinsteinsGirl · Aug 30, 2013

Raimi Stranger said:
how few believe the prophets and saints of God that Enoch never died?

-yet this shows that the essence of man is spirit

Hebrews 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

how few understand that we must be translated, changed to spirit , to take on immortality, to be with God in heaven...

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep [NOTE in death], but we shall all be changed,...

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

and that one can only be translated to spirit once Love is perfected in life, no more abuse with sins else one is returned to life until one does choose Love and so become happy and peaceful and just in life... one cannot do this when dead! ...

You are correct - Enoch's physical body never died..
Additionally, the saints, in reality, do not 'die' - Our spirits just leave this earthly vessel and move into the presence of God. This is why it is not 'summoning the dead' when we see things such as Jesus speaking with Moses (who's physical body died a normal death) on the mount of transfiguration. When we die we are not dead, the Word says we are alive in Christ.

how many believe the prophets and saints of God that Enoch never died?

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