Orthodox Church -- Channel for Life? What about Russia?

truefiction1 said:

Wow, how awesome is this?! Pretty much what I was thinking and feeling yet, due to my limited ability, unable to express. Thanks Easy G!

Click to expand...

Glad to know that it blessed you/helped in articulating what you were feeling

By this measure, the NT Testament times also stand as a failure of Christianity.

Ceri... One illustration maybe will bring you to understand what is the matter with that picture that you describe.
You know the saying ...

You can bring the horse to the waterhole but you cannot persuade it to drink?

That is what you are dealing with at this present time... It is said actually in the prophesy that much disbelief will reign... We do live in the end times where people have gotten cold to Christ's call. So I do not see why Orthodoxy would be any different... Christianity has been mocked, taken down watered down and plain out called "evil" from different people who have been apostates for a long time now. The so called "atheism" has denounced the faith in God but the faith on one's own belief that we are gods instead. Like every era this is the era of 'unkindness' and plain individualism. So in posting pictures of "unbelieving" apostate christians one is supposed to find the truth about Christianity or a peticular Church? Nah..one finds the fallen nature the existential needs of people who have lost all hope in a "theory" or form of Christianity NOT Christ.... Let's not confuse the two...please..

Ceridwen said:

I understand that the Orthodox Church is the channel of God's invigorating activities on the planet earth. The sacraments, particularly the eucharist, are the means by which God is feeding humanity, restoring humanity, and bringing therapy to the sick, repentance to the corrupted. The sacraments are "for the life of the world." The icons are windows by which the light of heaven illuminates the earth. Given this, have you ever wondered why the social demographics of Orthodox countries are so dismal?

Click to expand...

Actually the Eucharist can (and does) have an adverse effect on those partaking unworthily. Also true that icons are windows into heaven whose saints pray for us.
So yes Cerid, the country of Greece is proof that God through the prayers of the Saints watches out for it moreso than other countries. Greeks live for the day, they like their coffee, wine and cigarettes. They like to retire early while still in their 50's, yet they never end up in homeless shelters. They dont see the virtue of hard work, just like Plato who said the hard-worker makes for a bad citizen. They love to complain about wages and excess taxes by going on strike and not getting paid for the day, yet they never starve. Their unemployment rate has been abysmal since 1821 yet nightlife in all the major cities are buzzing. Their salaries are meager yet they have name brand clothing. It is one of 4 or 5 countries where a college education returns you less of a financial reward than a high school drop out but atleast those college youth arent burdened by financial debt. Most dont have the luxury of central airconditioning during the hot summer months so you find them on the beaches sipping on their frappes. They have a weak police force with even weaker laws yet it has one of the lowest homicide rates in any industrialized country ( even less than switzerland). There are no minimum age requirements for consuming alcohol nor a taboo against its use by minors, yet Greece has one of the lowest death by alcohol poisoning rate (at 0.3 its less than in Saudi Arabia with a 0.4 per 100000).

Visit Pakistan, Haiti, or even Detroit with all its social welfare help and then take a vacation in Greece, you'll be scratching your head as to why its paradise compared to the problems found in big american cities .

The problem is that the so-called Orthodox countries are being governed by godless elites.

God's grace is not a magic spell, nor can it be quantified.
Also, it is poured out, and then we must use it. If we don't want to use it, we can fail to do so and we can fail to offer creation back to God in the transformative ways we should.

The theory is that, when God integrates his life into human communities through the church and the sacraments, these human communities will have more life.

Click to expand...

yeah, but that's only if and when they want the Life He offers. if it were automatic like that, you would not have seen the golden calf, or denial and betrayal before the Cross. to run with what choirfiend said and to quote Fr Thomas Hopko, God is not a mechanic, magician, or a fairy godmother.

He offers salvation and the means to get there, but we must surrender our will to Him.

ArmyMatt said:

yeah, but that's only if and when they want the Life He offers. if it were automatic like that, you would not have seen the golden calf, or denial and betrayal before the Cross. to run with what choirfiend said and to quote Fr Thomas Hopko, God is not a mechanic, magician, or a fairy godmother.

He offers salvation and the means to get there, but we must surrender our will to Him.

Click to expand...

When we choose Christ, God doesn't just zap us with a magic wand so that we are instantly like Christ. Salvation is a process. The old man has to be constantly crucified in order for us to become like Christ. It's a race as the Apostle Paul said. We are athletes who have to train if we are to run the race properly. It takes an athlete a long time to train to where he or she becomes great in their chosen sport. The fact is, Christians are sinners. We are to become like Christ (known as theosis), but, again, that is a process. It takes time. Also, we have to cooperate with God and allow the old man to be crucified, and a lot of times we don't cooperate and we fall.

Real...

Easy G (G²);59599407 said:

Real...

Click to expand...

not sure I understand...

Ceridwen said:

I understand that the Orthodox Church is the channel of God's invigorating activities on the planet earth. The sacraments, particularly the eucharist, are the means by which God is feeding humanity, restoring humanity, and bringing therapy to the sick, repentance to the corrupted. The sacraments are "for the life of the world." The icons are windows by which the light of heaven illuminates the earth. Given this, have you ever wondered why the social demographics of Orthodox countries are so dismal?

Click to expand...

I think this is a great topic for thought and discussion. Thanks.

Colleen1 said:

I think this is a great topic for thought and discussion. Thanks.

Click to expand...

Ortho_Cat said:

not sure I understand...

Click to expand...

"Real" means "That's significant and true." Street talk