Utopia

2ndRateMind said:

I'm a great believer in dreams and ambitions. I believe God is good, and therefore wants the best for us, in this world as well as the next. If the best we can conceive is a perfect world - Utopia - then that must be where God's plan finds it's eventual fulfillment. For me, that means cherishing each other, and cherishing creation, in the same way God cherishes us.

Specifically, it means valuing, nourishing, nurturing and encouraging each individual to develop into the fullness of their potential, without regard to sex, race, politics, religion, colour, bank balance, class, sexuality or nationality. I believe an enlightened Christianity to be an asset for this ambition. I think that by building Utopia for each other, rather than for ourselves, humanity will eventually get pretty close to the ideal - and moreover, grow the kind of individuals that will populate heaven.

I wonder, what is your definition of Utopia, and what contribution to it might Christianity make?

Best wishes, 2ndRateMind.

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Utopia to me would me getting rid of all the greed in the world, and a perfect world to me would be one where we are smart enough to grow healthy food and maintain healthy water, and that everyone should have a share in this land God gave to us because there is an awful lot of land just sitting there wasted, and that people would be hospitable and charitable at all times, and that education would be considered a right and that all should have one. And that we stop fighting over religion, end oppressive tyrants, and stop all wars.

It's nice to think about, but I don't see it happening. Though my Mom and my ex husband are two of the most hospitable and charitable and unselfish people I've ever known. If more people were like my Mom and my ex, we'd be having a better world.

I hope for the day when I am fully reconciled to my ex husband. He is my only husband, but I have to have patience regarding that issue.

My vision of utopia has always been at odds with my faith. Even my desire to make a better world can distract me for God's plan and will for my life.

Because God made me and knows me better than anyone, my idea of utopia is to live in His will and look forward to whatever He has for us, because it is certainly more than I can imagine in my limited thinking. (But I hope whatever His plan is includes Ice cream)

My vision of Utopia lines up with the world portrayed in Rev. 21:1-8. God is in charge, there is no death or suffering, there is no sin, and all who are unwilling to love are gone. Ultimately, I believe we as Christians are called to work toward this vision, knowing that we can never achieve without Divine intervention. Our contribution is to teach the gospel of God's grace and love, through our words and actions, to all who will listen and to strive to love as He loves, so as to model His love to those whose faith is yet too weak to sense it.

And, to add to timlamb's comment, I hope that there is ice cream and that I am no longer lactose sensitive.

i enjoyed the comments about the ice cream, but i will also state that personally i don't think utopia is possible until Christ returns and eternity begins. there are a couple passages that state "the poor you will always have with you" and that can probably be taken as a sign that utopia will be a little hard to reach (until Christ returns that is).

I believe Christians are called to bring heaven to earth in the form of Gods undying love for his creation. I also believe this will not come to pass in this world involving all faiths. There are too many conflicts people are unwilling to let go of because letting go of them would compromise their faith.

However I do believe that Christians can create that Utopia, that heaven on earth, within the faith. Christians in Acts banded together to create tight knit communities where no one thought ill of them, and they worshipped with one mind and singleness of purpose. If Christianity can get to the point where this happens again, then I believe that Gods purpose for us will be fulfilled.

2ndRateMind said:

I'm a great believer in dreams and ambitions. I believe God is good, and therefore wants the best for us, in this world as well as the next. If the best we can conceive is a perfect world - Utopia - then that must be where God's plan finds it's eventual fulfillment. For me, that means cherishing each other, and cherishing creation, in the same way God cherishes us.

Specifically, it means valuing, nourishing, nurturing and encouraging each individual to develop into the fullness of their potential, without regard to sex, race, politics, religion, colour, bank balance, class, sexuality or nationality. I believe an enlightened Christianity to be an asset for this ambition. I think that by building Utopia for each other, rather than for ourselves, humanity will eventually get pretty close to the ideal - and moreover, grow the kind of individuals that will populate heaven.

I wonder, what is your definition of Utopia, and what contribution to it might Christianity make?

Best wishes, 2ndRateMind.

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Utopia, not a physical state of the world nor a mental state of mind but a spiritual indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

Utopia to me is 1st of all people not stealing or taking other peoples things.
2nd would be people helping other people.

Actually, "utopia" means "no place." <G>

billwald said:

Actually, "utopia" means "no place." <G>

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And the man who was going about telling people how to get to the place, his name meant "peddler of nonsense." (in the original story by Sir Thomas More)

Ya, utopia is more about our attitude than being in a certian place ...

It's never worked in the past. Either the lazy don't work, and resentment builds with those supporting them, or it is highly structured and the leader abuses his absolute rule.

Where... we live in beautiful houses surrounded by nature.
Most of our jobs are in the field of science - advancing humanity.
The 'working day' is generally four hours long.
We have one day a week of rest.
Implementation of an education system i have devised - massive reforms.
No money, TV, advertisments, etc.
And where compassion for each other and nature is are main attitude.
But most of all freedom.

2ndRateMind said:

I'm a great believer in dreams and ambitions. I believe God is good, and therefore wants the best for us, in this world as well as the next. If the best we can conceive is a perfect world - Utopia - then that must be where God's plan finds it's eventual fulfillment. For me, that means cherishing each other, and cherishing creation, in the same way God cherishes us.

Specifically, it means valuing, nourishing, nurturing and encouraging each individual to develop into the fullness of their potential, without regard to sex, race, politics, religion, colour, bank balance, class, sexuality or nationality. I believe an enlightened Christianity to be an asset for this ambition. I think that by building Utopia for each other, rather than for ourselves, humanity will eventually get pretty close to the ideal - and moreover, grow the kind of individuals that will populate heaven.

I wonder, what is your definition of Utopia, and what contribution to it might Christianity make?

Best wishes, 2ndRateMind.

Click to expand...

This reminds me of, "in Christ there is no Greek or Jew...male nor female." A very important passage that talks about how God's love doesn't discriminate when we are given faith and a relationship with Jesus a brother and the Father. However, utopia is impossible on earth but that doesn't mean we should not try to make it a more loving place, and we can only make it a more loving place by dying to the world - the ultimate paradox. To restore life to world we must die to the world, so that by Christ's death we have the fullness of life, by his wounds we are healed, and by his Spirit we are reborn.

I think "heaven" is the full communion between us and God - it will be dynamic, and yet simple. People will be who they are, according to God's design, and by being who they are, they will be freed to love and receive love. I'm afraid with all the sexual identity issues, (men wanting to be women, and women wanting to be men), along with a huge increase in depression and suicide, and the amazing escapism that exists (facebook, drugs, TV, et cetera), that generally in the obtuse usage or misuse of such goods, people are affraid to be who they are. Ultimately who we are is a child of God, loved so immeasurably, and called to respond to this generosity with love.

BjorkIsCool said:

Where... We live in beautiful houses surrounded by nature.
Most of our jobs are in the field of science - advancing humanity.
The work day is four hours long.
We have one day a week of rest.
Emplamentation of an education system i have devised - massive reforms.
No money, TV, advertisments, etc.
And where compassion for each other and nature is are main attitude.

Thats a very small taste of my utopia.

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Also why Utopia can not exist, that sounds a little like hell to me...

david_x said:

Also why Utopia can not exist, that sounds a little like hell to me...

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What sounds so hellish about it?

Utopia could exist to certain degree. But yes of course there can never be a utopia in the perfect sense of the word because there will always be suffering. All we can do is make things more tolerable.

Have you read Huxley's book 'Island', about his utopia?

BjorkIsCool said:

What sounds so hellish about it?

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All jobs in science.

Couldn't stand a four hour work day myself. Would wake up early and get all sweated up for a measely four hours of work and get nothing done.

BjorkIsCool said:

What sounds so hellish about it?

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Off topic/ doesn't matter

Utopia could exist to certain degree. But yes of course there can never be a utopia in the perfect sense of the word because there will always be suffering. All we can do is make things more tolerable.

Have you read Huxley's book 'Island', about his utopia?

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Utopia has always existed to a degree.

You are correct, there will never be a perfect Utopia was my original point.

Utopia for me is being with God, and that for all of us to worship Him in spirit and in truth.