why do you believe?

Endure2 · Mar 24, 2007

I spent 22 years of my life believing and living for christianity and eventually it didnt make sense to me anymore, the promises the explanations, they just didnt work anymore.

And now, whenever i find a moment of honesty and say "Jesus...am i wrong? are you really there? ...if your there speak to me so i can know... show me that if i believe in you i wont just be on blind faith...show me i can really know, know without a doubt that your real..."

and i pray that prayer honestly...and i get nothing more than random little thoughts of what he might be saying back to me.

I dont understand you people...how do you believe in him when he gives so little for reassurances?
I know you have your life experiences and your many explanations and ideas, but its all just a world built on phrases and cliches and other unexplained things like nature.

I dont know how you guys doit.
How do you know, how do you know your not just jumping to conclusions and believing a nice fairy tale when he doesnt actually talk to you or get personally real with you?

Rhododendron · Mar 24, 2007

May I ask, what made you believe in the first place? Did you really believe if you now don't?

I am the opposite. I believe because nothing makes sense to NOT believe. You're right, you can't see God. It's stepping out onto nothing, completely believing in it. That's what it is. You will not physically "see" anything. You will be filled with the Holy Spirit. There is no mistake when this happens. Then, you will KNOW He EXISTS!!!! You will also be living on nothing, and being provided for. God does not desert His people. My husband and I are living on nothing. We still have all of our needs met! That is GOD. It is not coincidence. That is why I believe. Because I KNOW He is real. He has revealed Himself to me (not by seeing Him) by how well He takes care of us. And there's no mistake when the Holy Spirit comes.

Please feel free to ask more questions, or PM me if you like

TexasGirl06 · Mar 24, 2007

Endure2 said:
I spent 22 years of my life believing and living for christianity and eventually it didnt make sense to me anymore, the promises the explanations, they just didnt work anymore.

And now, whenever i find a moment of honesty and say "Jesus...am i wrong? are you really there? ...if your there speak to me so i can know... show me that if i believe in you i wont just be on blind faith...show me i can really know, know without a doubt that your real..."

and i pray that prayer honestly...and i get nothing more than random little thoughts of what he might be saying back to me.

I dont understand you people...how do you believe in him when he gives so little for reassurances?
I know you have your life experiences and your many explanations and ideas, but its all just a world built on phrases and cliches and other unexplained things like nature.

I dont know how you guys doit.
How do you know, how do you know your not just jumping to conclusions and believing a nice fairy tale when he doesnt actually talk to you or get personally real with you?

Hey Endure2 ~
Thank you for your post....with all of your questions.
It is good that you are questioning.

I know it is the Truth...
because God has revealed Himself to me....
over and over.

He does speak to me...
through His Word. (The Bible)

I would suggest that you get into His Word.
Tell Him that you do not understand.
Ask Him to show you.
Get into the Book of John.
It's a great start.

Man, He is real.
I was 26 before I came into a relationship with the living God.
Before then....
I knew "of Him".

He is a living God...
who loves you so much.

I would not be spending my time on a Saturday night...
writing to strangers on a Forum...
if He were not real.

Thank you for being here.
Bring all of your questions to Him.
He wants to visit with you.

Take care.

bluemarkus · Mar 25, 2007

hello !

i had been raised in a religious environment, but never known the power of god for 20 years. so i became agnostic for 2 years. it was a hard time.
the question if there is a god was very crucial for me, it wasn´t even a logical, conscient thing, but something that was much deeper.

todady whn i look back, maybe it would have been good to just relax more, and not worry so much. we should follow our heart in our search of god.

it is written"whoever seeks will find, woever knocks him shall be opened". that is a true saying, although we need be patient, because our timing is not always the set timing...

greetings

Markus

OldChurchGuy · Mar 25, 2007

Endure2 said:
I spent 22 years of my life believing and living for christianity and eventually it didnt make sense to me anymore, the promises the explanations, they just didnt work anymore.

And now, whenever i find a moment of honesty and say "Jesus...am i wrong? are you really there? ...if your there speak to me so i can know... show me that if i believe in you i wont just be on blind faith...show me i can really know, know without a doubt that your real..."

and i pray that prayer honestly...and i get nothing more than random little thoughts of what he might be saying back to me.

I dont understand you people...how do you believe in him when he gives so little for reassurances?
I know you have your life experiences and your many explanations and ideas, but its all just a world built on phrases and cliches and other unexplained things like nature.

I dont know how you guys doit.
How do you know, how do you know your not just jumping to conclusions and believing a nice fairy tale when he doesnt actually talk to you or get personally real with you?

Frankly, I don't know that I'm not jumping to conclusions and believing a nice fairy tale. I cannot deny the possibility that religion is the creation of people to explain the unexplainable.

On the other hand, I believe that God exists and that I am in a relationship with God. It's nothing I can prove from a scientific point of view.

For me, the evidence is the subjective observation / interpretation of random chance. From my perspective, I have had too many chance occurrences that I feel can be chalked up to fate working in my favor. Perhaps it is, but I find much more comforting to chalk it up to God rather than fate.

A book that helped me a great deal with understanding God is by J.B. Philips entitled "Your God is Too Small". Basically, the premise is that when one is frustrated with God, the frustration may not be with God but with our expectation of how God should act, i.e. putting God in a box and then being frustrated when God refuses to fit into it. Have you read it?

The book may or may not be of help to you (I really wish I could give you that perfect piece of advice / guidance that would make everything right all at once) but it came to mind while reading your post. No doubt I am overlooking a significant nugget of information so please be patient with me.

Sincerely,

OldChurchGuy

Ailanthus · Mar 25, 2007

Man, I've been in your shoes many times. I was saved at the age of twenty, spent a few years where I felt I was "strong with God," then spent a few years where i felt seperated from Him. However, just during this month, He has forcefully pulled me back closer to Him.
I have found myself also asking Him, "Jesus, are you really there? If so, SAY SOMETHING!" and then.... nothing.
It would seem, at least for me, that God knows when i am doubting His plan. When i was asking Him if he was there, I was actually doubting that He was, and He said nothing. However, now, when i seek Him with faith, the faith that I just KNOW he is listening to every word I pray, I can hear Him. No, not audibly, but I can "feel" His words.
Man, the enemy is trying every way he can to seperate you from God; don't let him. God wants you for His kingdom and He wants to communicate with you, but you've got to faithfully BELIEVE, without doubt, before He's gonna talk to you.

Endure2 · Mar 25, 2007

i will reply to each of you, though i did not create this post just to start an argument, it was just something i felt like saying at the time and wanted to say it. Because i really dont understand you guys.

I dont enjoy fighting with christians or trying to tear down christianity. I am pretty confident in what i believe becuase over time its what seems real to me. I am not asking for help or wanting advice on how to be a christian. Please dont be offended, thats just not what i want.

rododendron,
It was all id ever known, something i grew up in, the only thing i had ever believed, the only possibility i had ever considered. that changed over time and with experience.
Honestly friend, im not very fond of living on nothing and i find believing in nothing, stepping out on nothing...quite foolish... you have no reason to believe you arent simply wrong. I need something.

texas girl,
well honestly, im not new to christianity, kinda an old timer really... it was all i did for the first 22 years of my life and i believed it whole heartedly and its all i wanted more of. It just doesnt work anymore, and i believe if knew back then what i know today,... i wouldn't have. i was young and moldable. hehe...i think i got very old very fast that first year away from christianity. not in terms of maturity, but in terms of hardness, im a very cold person when it comes to religion now, i dont want it and i find no use for it, ill also never forget the pain i went through when i found out it was all wrong, my best friend and all my hopes and dreams had been a wool pulled over my eyes... i had been wrong. You really cant convince me otherwise with anything you say, ill need to see God for myself for that to happen.
I dont want to read the bible, the very last thing i will do, is go to a book to find out what is actually real in life. I am yelling back at you, i just wont do that ever again. I am sorry friend.
Life is learned by walking through it and experiencing it for yourself, not from books though they can compliment it a little here and there along the way.

bluemarkus,
well man, honestly that just isnt what ive found to be true in my life, just didnt work that way for me.

oldchurchguy,
hehe....thanks man, replies like yours make me smile.
no i havent read the book but it seems enteresting.
It does explain why i was angry and such, but i do have things i beleive he ought to be, and i cant accept that he would be any other way if he were who he says he is. I mean, yah we could come to this completely vague idea of God where nothing is objective and there are no truths or faults...but whats the point of that? and why need it be so if he is who he says he is?

ailanthus
...man, nah i cant do that... its like putting my head on the lions mouth...as much i want answers, i want to the truth more becuase id rather be right than wrong... i cant just choose to believe regardless as a prerequisit... what if it wasnt true? id never know. i dont trust him, your right...becuase i dont know if hes real or not and i have no way of knowing, and i care about my life and my beliefs, i dont want to have the wrong beliefs, no one does.
Anytime you purchase something you see what your getting first, when you sign something you read it first, i cant just give my life to christianity before i know if its real or not man.

salida · Mar 25, 2007

Ensure2--

I believe because of my spiritual experiences. First receiving the Holy Spirit. When this happens to someone, it can't be denied and/or mistaken for anything else. No one can talk you out of it. Its like someone talking you out of the sky being blue. Besides many experiences with God which gives you many clues when one learns the voice of the Holy Spirit. The Bible (Word of God) is in harmony with the Holy Spirit because its God.

Second reason I believe which I don't need but does exist - is intellectual reasons. The Bible is the most true book in the world and has hundreds of detailed prophesies in it that has come true and more to be fulfilled. It has overwhelming facts to support it where its the most true book in the world. Read Examine the Evidence by Muncaster (an athiest but now a christian) and Evidence Demands A Verdict by Josh McDowell. These two books are a great start.

Plus, sometimes people like to say "it contradicts science". Well, it doesn't at all. I'm a scientist. There is good science and junk science. Go to www.reasons.org - it has faith and science it in. A large website.

Endure2 · Mar 25, 2007

well i dont know the whole science scene well, its not something i considered very valuable when i was a christian and i still dont ponder it much today.
When i was a christian debating the science of it all didnt seem very functional or beneficial as i believed it more inner knowledge and spiritualism and ideals that made christianity, not facts and science.
so today, science and such doesnt really excite me.
I dont understand it much.

As far as fullfilled prophecies, i dont really know of any. I mean im sure there lots of theories on things that are considered fullfillments of biblical predictions but i dont put alot of weight in that sort of thing.

I cant get in touch with any God personally. So to me that means theres nothing for me to devote my life to, if he is real he isnt something i need to have a personal relationship with.
I think we look at things through a diffrent perspective, My idea of God is a very relationship filled, emotional, personal relationship.

humbledbyhim · Mar 26, 2007

There were certain personal sins that I committed on a daily basis that I wanted to stop doing long before I accepted Christ. I had been in church since I was 11 and heard the word of God. In some sense, I wanted the freedom from sin that other people had, but I still liked the pleasure of sin.

However, one night, at the age of 19, it was as if every thought or question that came up in my mind was being answered by the preacher. I knew God was talking to me. I began to praise him, and two days later I realized that I had neither committed nor thought about sins that i committed on a daily basis that I actually wanted to stop doing but couldn't for years. In that instant of accepting Christ, I was freed for real. That is the primary reason that I believe.

Secondly, I have witnessed God make provisions for my family. I have also heard testimonies from family members and friends, who have no reason to lie to me, of supernatural occurences.

Third, I understand that the things that contradict my belief (certain scientific theories, other religions, etc.) are built on assumptions (though they would like you to think that they aren't) that I don't agree with.

Endure2 · Mar 26, 2007

Well, you certainly have a reason to believe then. Great.
I hope it continues the way it has. thats enteresting.
It doesn't seem to work that way for me.

OldChurchGuy · Mar 31, 2007

Endure2 said:
oldchurchguy,
hehe....thanks man, replies like yours make me smile.
no i havent read the book but it seems enteresting.
It does explain why i was angry and such, but i do have things i beleive he ought to be, and i cant accept that he would be any other way if he were who he says he is. I mean, yah we could come to this completely vague idea of God where nothing is objective and there are no truths or faults...but whats the point of that? and why need it be so if he is who he says he is?

Glad I could give you a smile. Life is too short to be without them, in my opinion.

At the risk of being too inquisitive, what are the things you believe God ought to be? Why is it not possible God would be another way?

Sorry, nothing witty this time. Maybe next post.

OldChurchGuy

salida · Apr 1, 2007

Endure2---

If you knew the hundreds of prophesies that has already come true, you would put a whole lot of weight on prophesies that are going to be fulfilled.

salida · Apr 1, 2007

Endure2--

You can't get in touch with God personally or you won't?

If you ask God for forgiveness of your sins and repent; then ask the Holy Spirit in your life - then you can be in touch with God personally.

He gives mankind a free choice and won't force Himself on people. The decision is in your court.

Eph429 · Apr 9, 2007

Endure2, no-one can convince you, only the Holy Spirit can convict you. And in my honest opinion, I can't believe that you were a true born of the Spirit Christian, because you would never have turned your back on God, no matter what. He is our rock, our comforter. You mentioned something about the wool being pulled over your eyes about Christianity? You have alot of anger in you?

I have endured somethings in my life, that I NEVER would have been able to endure without Jesus by my side. There have been many times I don't understand why?, but I trust in Him, because of my walk with Him.

We are so incredibly small compared to the Almighty God, and we have the cheek to shake our fists at Him? If you had a true, belief and faith in God, you would have recognized satan's deceptive and destroying strategy, and turned to the Lord and with His help fought him off.

I'm truly sorry you are in the place you are. I pray that your heart will soften and you will come into a true relationship with Jesus.

Muchloved
J

Eph429 · Apr 9, 2007

PS, many, but many people have died for their faith in Jesus Christ. Starting with the apostles. Can you tell me who would die for a lie?

Much loved
J

Digit · Apr 10, 2007

Endure2 said:
I cant get in touch with any God personally. So to me that means theres nothing for me to devote my life to, if he is real he isnt something i need to have a personal relationship with.
I think we look at things through a diffrent perspective, My idea of God is a very relationship filled, emotional, personal relationship.

Hiya Endure2,

You said earlier you won't read the Bible, and here you are saying that you just can't seem to get a relationship with God. My friend, it is often said that God's Word, convicts. God's Word is in the Bible. If you don't read the Bible, or do a Bible Study, or an Alpha course, how will any of these things make sense to you?

I think what all the posters are saying, is that at some stage in their life, they hit a point and through whatever circumstances, they read the Bible or were exposed to God's Word. And He spoke to them, through it. For example, if I was struggling with forgiveness and I read a particular version as one of my devotionals about Jesus forigiving people, and the state of the heart when this happens and what it means, and suddenly, everything makes sense to me. That's why it's important to do these things.

Before you can have a relationship with God, you need to know about him. To know about Him, you need to read the Bible. Imagine you and girl, how well do you think that relationship will work out if you knew nothing about her. If you talked to her maybe once every week, or once a month... or never?! I think it will break down, just like your relationship with God has.

TexasGirl was very right in recommending the Bible to you. And I will do the same, either that or go to an Alpha Course (google it) or a Bible Study. For just an hour a week, you could have that relationship back. I won't question your 22 years of Christianity already, all I am saying is that in order to maintain it, these things need to happen.

In answer to your question (why do I believe) I do so because I had a hole in my life. Nothing I could do gave me any sense of fulfillment. With God in my life, things rapidly changed. I like the person I am now, my relationships have flourished and I am engaged. My life has never been better. I don't expect it to remain being so grand, as every life is beset with issues, yet I am comforted that knowing when I have those issues, I can rely on God. He may not come down and help me change a tire on my car, but His teachines will help me make the best choices and do the right things to get back on track, and out of the mud.

Digit

Lehr · Apr 11, 2007

Hey Endure,

First i would like to tell you that i just got out of that phase not but 2 years ago, i had almost lost all belief in god because god would not speak to me where i could actually hear him. I later regained my faith when my grandma kept nagging me about going to this RCIA class (bible study and discussion) and after the first 2 sessions i had been brought back. I am almost finished with the year long class and i am going for a second round, not because i need to renew my faith but because i want to learn even more!

God has done so much for me in my life, and my friend, you will come to believe. Don't expect god to knock at your front door one day and say "yo what up, you believe now?" you have to search with all of your being for him. Read the bible, meditiate, do whatever is necessary to find god. Trust me my friend you will! The holy spirit will guide you to the right path.

Endure, god loves you beyond your imagination and he knows more about you then you do.

Endure we all love you and we will pray that the holy spirit will guide you to our Loving god.

GOD BLESS YOU!

Criada · Apr 13, 2007

I believe because I cannot not believe!
I believe because I see Him in His creation.
I believe because He answers my prayers.
I beleive because I know His love and provision in my life.
I beleive because He has never, never let me down.
Even at the times when I turned away from Him, He never left me.
And He has never left you - nor will He! Though you may choose to turn from Him.
I pray that He will make Himself known to you in a way that you can accept!

AdJesumPerMariam · Apr 27, 2007

We are to believe like children. Children just naturally belive what you teach them. As they grow up, they decide to analyse life and everything else. I think you could analyze anything and come up with different how's & why's .

I have always believed...even when I was rebellious, and not following God's Will...But, I have always believed

Believe with the faith of a child. Walk in that faith.

why do you believe?

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