What is evolution?

kern

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Franklin, your posts show that you lack even a basic understanding of the Theory of Evolution; all you know is the anti-evolution rhetoric. If you took the time to learn something about the theory people might take you more seriously. And if you kept the ranting down to a minimum.

-Chris
 
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D. Scarlatti

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Originally posted by franklin
You are spuing out of your mouth pure rubbish! Your thinking is totally upside down!! It's the evolutionists and the political correctness crowd that don't want creationism taught in the public schools ... Your thinking is based on the depraved mind of humanism!

Originally posted by franklin
What's your problem? The truth hurt? You sound like the liberals and the political correctness/anti-God crowd who won't allow creationism in the public schools!!

[Balance of Franklin's insulting hyperventilation snipped.]

Once again Franklin demonstrates his complete ignorance of the facts.

You forgot the federal courts, Franklin. Teaching creationism or the oxymoronic "creation science" in the public schools has been ruled a violation of the United States Constitution's First Amendment on numerous occasions.

Most notably, Louisiana's Balanced Treatment Act was struck down by the U.S. Supreme Court in 1987, in a case called Edwards v. Aguillard. Seven Justices out of nine ruled that "creation science" was a "sham."

William Brennan wrote the opinion of the Court. William Brennan was nominated to the Court by Dwight D. Eisenhower, a Republican.

Lewis Powell wrote a concurring opinion. Powell was nominated to the Court by Richard M. Nixon, a Republican. Byron White also wrote a concurring opinion. Although he was nominated to the Court by John F. Kennedy, Byron White was one of the most conservative Supreme Court Justices in modern history.

The other four Justices that joined in the majority opinions were Harry Blackmun, nominated by Nixon; Sandra Day O'Connor, nominated by Ronald W. Reagan, a Republican; John Paul Stevens, nominated by Gerald R. Ford, yet another Republican; and Thurgood Marshall, the first African American Supreme Court Justice, nominated by Lyndon B. Johnson.

So Franklin, that is your "liberals and the political correctness/anti-God crowd who won't allow creationism in the public schools!!" with the "depraved minds of humanists." Five Republicans and two Democrats, including one of the most conservative Democrats ever appointed to the bench.

And you cannot take any comfort from the dissenting opinion, which was written by Antonin Scalia and joined by William Rehnquist, two more Republican appointees. Scalia's dissent by no means represents an endorsement of "creation science," but rather is a technical criticism of some the standards of statutory construction by which the majority reached its conclusion.

In fact Scalia took pains to distance himself from the ludicrous and illogical statements made by the Balanced Treatment Act's main sponsor.

So Franklin if you are referring to the United States Supreme Court as it sat in 1987 (or today for that matter: seven out of nine current Justices are Republican appointees) as the "liberals and the political correctness/anti-God crowd who won't allow creationism in the public schools!!" with the "depraved minds of humanists," clearly you need more than an introductory lesson in biology, you need one in rudimentary American politics.
 
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Morat

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Oh, Franklin...it's not the truth that hurts. It's the appalling weight of ignorance that really stings.

It hurts me, deep down, to see someone rant cluelessly. I cringe in embarassment for them. I realize that, deep down, they are secure in their certainity, but can't help but wince as I see them screw up over and over.

I mean, wouldn't you feel embarassed for the poor sap who had never read the Bible ranting against Christian theology? Would you not cringe with embarassment when he made up verses, indeed whole books, and claimed they were Biblical?
 
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franklin

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Originally posted by kern
Franklin, your posts show that you lack even a basic understanding of the Theory of Evolution; all you know is the anti-evolution rhetoric. If you took the time to learn something about the theory people might take you more seriously. And if you kept the ranting down to a minimum.

This goes to kern, the scar, seebs and the chickenman and mort.....

Your fairyTale deception called Atheism/evolution has hit a brick wall as in big time! It's called: The First Law of Thermodynamics
By Chuck Missler (From his Book "The Creator Beyond Time and Space")
Are you dudes familiar with this Law?

The creationist's model begins with an infinitely intelligent, omnipotent, transcendent Creator who used intelligent design, expertise or know-how to create everything from the sub-atomic particles to giant redwood trees. Was it a miracle? Absolutely!

Genesis 1:1, "In the beginning (time), God created the heavens (space) and the earth (matter)."

The atheist's model begins with an even more impressive miracle - the appearance of all matter in the universe from nothing, by no one, and for no reason. A supernatural event. A miracle! However, the atheist does not believe in the outside or transcendent "First Cause" we call God. Therefore, the atheist has no "natural explanation" nor "supernatural explanation" for the origin of space-time and matter. Consequently, the atheistic scenario on the origin of the universe leaves us hanging in a totally dissatisfying position. He begins his model with a supernatural event. This supernatural event, however, is accomplished without a supernatural agent to perform it.

Atheism/evolution has hit the first brick wall, however, there is a second brick wall your theory hits also! News at 11
 
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Franklin,

Yes, we are all familiar with Newton's laws of thermodynamics. If they were a major issue to any of the scientific theories we accept, we would already be aware of it. We would either have solved the problem or discarded the theory. There is no tension between generally accepted modern scientific theories and the laws of thermodynamics. Trust me.

Science and religion are two separate fields of knowledge and inquiry. Atheism is a position on religion. Evolution (and cosmogeny) are scientific theoretical structures and are not a part of any religious position or view. You insult many Christians by conflating their views of science with atheism.

Please do yourself and us a favor: please learn as much as you can about the various areas of science you want to discuss with us, whether it be chemistry, physics or biology, before you draw more conclusions based on an incomplete understanding of them.

If your understanding comes from the book you read by Chuck Missler, it may be that you have happened upon a poor source for your information. It would be helpful to learn some from others who are themselves more knoledgeable than Missler.

Regards,

Jerry
 
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kern

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Originally posted by franklin

Your fairyTale deception called Atheism/evolution has hit a brick wall as in big time!

I am not an athiest, I am a Christian. AFAIK the same is true of seebs.


The atheist's model begins with an even more impressive miracle - the appearance of all matter in the universe from nothing, by no one, and for no reason.

Your attempts to confuse the issue by throwing athiesm into the mix add nothing to the discussion. Science does not say that the matter came from nothing, it merely says that we cannot prove it came from a deity. Therefore, proclaiming that God created the universe has no place in science, it is a religious proclamation.


He begins his model with a supernatural event. This supernatural event, however, is accomplished without a supernatural agent to perform it.

Your post is full of misunderstandings and absurdities.

1. Evolution has nothing to do with creation of matter or of the universe.
2. Atheism and evolution are not inextricably linked.
3. Science does not claim that the beginning of the universe is a supernatural event.

-Chris
 
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franklin

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Originally posted by kern
I am not an athiest, I am a Christian. AFAIK the same is true of seebs.
Oooh I am so touched! Then choose which God or god you will serve! I choose to serve the God of the Bible, the God who created the universe out of nothing! The God that has no beginning and no end, the God who is not subject to time! Kern, it sounds like to me that you and Seebs can't make up your mind who to please. If you choose to please men then you are an enemy of God!

Your attempts to confuse the issue by throwing athiesm into the mix add nothing to the discussion..[/B]

I'm confusing the issue??? Evolution/athiesm is the ultimate in confusion and it all started in the garden when Eve spoke to the serpent! atheism, evolution... it's the same thing.... It also denies the sactity of life! It's a direct insult to God! Add to the discussion??? OK how about if I include some more fairyTale stories to the mix, would that make you happy?? awhaaaa!!! The god of evolution is so touching !

Science does not say that the matter came from nothing, it merely says that we cannot prove it came from a deity. Therefore, proclaiming that God created the universe has no place in science, it is a religious proclamation.[/B]

Who cares what science says!! God's word says matter came from nothing! If you say your a Christian, what does the inspiration of scripture mean to you? Does science have authority over scripture? What do you think scripture has to say about science anyway? Did you ever bother to find out? 1 Timothy 6:20, "O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain (evolution, false teachings, false doctrines)babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:"
Wake up brother! It's time for you to stop trying to friends with the world! Sounds to me like you and Seebs are afraid to take a stand against these false prophets! I pull no punches and take no prisioners, this is the no nonsense zone!!!!

Your post is full of misunderstandings and absurdities..[/B]

your beginning to make me cry! :cry: and that's from ROFLOL!!!!!

1. Evolution has nothing to do with creation of matter or of the universe...[/B]

and reality! this is getting better by the minute!!!

2. Atheism and evolution are not inextricably linked.[/B]

Wrong again Pilgrim! evolutions has it's roots in Atheism!
Just take a trip down to communist Cuba! What do you think they teach their children down there! It surely isn't creationism or the Bible; they teach them at a very early age that there is no God starting with evolution/atheism!

3. Science does not claim that the beginning of the universe is a supernatural event.[/B]

Genesis 1:1, "In the beginning (time), God created the heavens (space) and the earth (matter)."
I hate to repeat myself but what part of Gen 1:1 don't you understand? Who cares what science says! IN THE BEGINNING GOD! Is God supernatural or not? I don't give a rat's.... what science has to say, I'm more concerned about what God has to say!!!! Is this falling on deaf ears or what?!?
Your a Christian, that should be cyrstal clear to you! Not because I'm saying it but because God's word says it!
 
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Morat

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Wrong again Pilgrim! evolutions has it's roots in Atheism!
Just take a trip down to communist Cuba! What do you think they teach their children down there! It surely isn't creationism or the Bible; they teach them at a very early age that there is no God starting with evolution/atheism!
One can hope they taught them better logic skills than you got.

Evolution is such an atheistic concept that large numbers of committed Christians work with it and on it daily.

Heck, as I'm sure you consider cosmology just as atheistic, the Big Bang was first proposed by a Jesuit.
 
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D. Scarlatti

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Franklin, since you continually fail to address the information that's been brought to your attention exposing your exceptional lack of both plain facts and any semblance of common sense, I'm afraid I don't see any point replying further to your godawful meritless gibberish.

If it's any consolation, at least Jesus loves you, or so they say.
 
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kern

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Originally posted by franklin

Oooh I am so touched! Then choose which God or god you will serve!

Back off, franklin. Your accusations are growing tiresome.


Who cares what science says!! God's word says matter came from nothing!

I never said differently.


1 Timothy 6:20, "O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain (evolution, false teachings, false doctrines)babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:"

Interesting, that verse in my Bible says nothing about science.


Wrong again Pilgrim! evolutions has it's roots in Atheism!
Just take a trip down to communist Cuba! What do you think they teach their children down there!

What does Cuba have to do with anything?


Genesis 1:1, "In the beginning (time), God created the heavens (space) and the earth (matter)."
I hate to repeat myself but what part of Gen 1:1 don't you understand?

Apparently the part that conflicts with evolution, which is about the development of life rather than the creation of life or the universe.


what science has to say, I'm more concerned about what God has to say!!!!

What's the difference? Science is figuring out the world God created -- he speaks through his creation just fine.


Your a Christian, that should be cyrstal clear to you! Not because I'm saying it but because God's word says it!

Apparently I have a different understanding of the Bible than you do.

-Chris
 
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seebs

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Originally posted by kern

I am not an athiest, I am a Christian. AFAIK the same is true of seebs.

Yup. And a few of the others, too.

I love the "what do you think they teach down in cuba!" thing. I suppose we should drop the germ theory of disease - after all, atheists believe it.
 
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GTX

<font size=1><font color=gray><b>Rapid Transit Aut
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Originally posted by RufusAtticus
Age calculations can only go back as far as the big bang when current time, space, and matter came into being. The universe exists outside of time, so it is possible for the universe to not have a beginning or end.

Well if you would believe that, why wouldn't you believe God as a Creator that has always existed? There is more proof supporting a creator than an ad infinitum universe.
 
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Originally posted by GTX
Well if you would believe that, why wouldn't you believe God as a Creator that has always existed?

Because I don't believe that God exists at all. It's hard to believe that God has always existed if you don't believe He exists at all.

There is more proof supporting a creator than an ad infinitum universe.

I have yet to see some. Belief in God is a position of faith not evidence.
 
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<font size=1><font color=gray><b>Rapid Transit Aut
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Originally posted by RufusAtticus


Because I don't believe that God exists at all. It's hard to believe that God has always existed if you don't believe He exists at all.


Oh boy, so ad infinitum universe is easier to believe than a well documented account of God? Why?


I have yet to see some. Belief in God is a position of faith not evidence.

Yet to see some? More people wrote the bible than have witnessed an ad infinitum universe, this is trippy, I must ask why, why? Pride?
 
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