dad'd "Box"

dad · Jun 28, 2005

235U92 said:
Spirycists? Making up words again I see.

Yes, maybe you could help. If physics is the study of the physical, what would be a good term for the study of the spiritual laws? Spirics? Spiristics? Spiritysics?

235U92 · Jun 28, 2005

dad said:
Yes, maybe you could help. If physics is the study of the physical, what would be a good term for the study of the spiritual laws? Spirics? Spiristics? Spiritysics?

There is no study of the "spiritual laws". Ergo, no word.

dad · Jun 28, 2005

Yes, maybe you could help. If physics is the study of the physical, what would be a good term for the study of the spiritual laws? Spirics? Spiristics? Spiritysics?

There is no study of the "spiritual laws". Ergo, no word.

Of course there is. Not in the physical only box of course. But most people on earth have always known there is a supernatural as well. Those who have had the bible have had a veritable study of the spiritual for millenia!
WE are told of the past, the future, exact building materials of the eternal golden city coming to earth one day, as well as it's inhabitants, and some of their powers. Flying, living forever, etc etc etc. Also some of our duties, like ruling earth with an iron rod forever after! WE even know of some of the animals there, and plants! We also have a good record of angels, and many of the things they did. And more.
Please, don't try to limit this wonderful eternal universe, and men's immortal souls, to only what comparitive scientific cavemen can come up with using the crude instruments of the brutish physical only!

235U92 · Jun 28, 2005

dad said:
Yes, maybe you could help. If physics is the study of the physical, what would be a good term for the study of the spiritual laws? Spirics? Spiristics? Spiritysics?

There is no study of the "spiritual laws". Ergo, no word.

Of course there is. Not in the physical only box of course. But most people on earth have always known there is a supernatural as well. Those who have had the bible have had a veritable study of the spiritual for millenia!
WE are told of the past, the future, exact building materials of the eternal golden city coming to earth one day, as well as it's inhabitants, and some of their powers. Flying, living forever, etc etc etc. Also some of our duties, like ruling earth with an iron rod forever after! WE even know of some of the animals there, and plants! We also have a good record of angels, and many of the things they did. And more.
Please, don't try to limit this wonderful eternal universe, and men's immortal souls, to only what comparitive scientific cavemen can come up with using the crude instruments of the brutish physical only!

Listen dad, I used to think there were monsters in my closet at night... but then I grew up. No one knows there is a spiritual world, it's there if they want it to be. But no, go right ahead and rant on and on about flying people, talking animals, and strange plants in the make-believe fantasy land in your head.

I'm completely at a loss for words that a human being such as yourself can believe something so childish and then talk about it as if it is reality. This is earth. There are no flying people, except in airplanes. The only animals that "talk" are parrots and probably some other animals. But I cannot carry on a complex conversation with one.

You can have your little dreamland to retreat to, but please, stop posting about it.

dad · Jun 28, 2005

235U92 said:
Listen dad, I used to think there were monsters in my closet at night... but then I grew up. No one knows there is a spiritual world, it's there if they want it to be. But no, go right ahead and rant on and on about flying people, talking animals, and strange plants in the make-believe fantasy land in your head.

I'm completely at a loss for words that a human being such as yourself can believe something so childish and then talk about it as if it is reality. This is earth. There are no flying people, except in airplanes. The only animals that "talk" are parrots and probably some other animals. But I cannot carry on a complex conversation with one.

You can have your little dreamland to retreat to, but please, stop posting about it.

Since billions of men throughout all history have believed in a spiritual, I guess you are talking to almost eveyone who ever lived, but a select few, mostly in modern times. You can't dream it away, however, like your monsters you admit to having believed in.
Just because there may have been demons in your closet, does not mean the way to make them go away is to ignore them.
I think we need to take the approach that the little girl did, when they asked her what she would do if the devil came knocking on her heart door. Her reply was simple, she said, " Oh, I'd just get Jesus to answer the door"!
'And though this world, with devils filled
should threaten to undo us
we will not fear, for God hath willed
His truth to tiumph thru us'

nvxplorer · Jun 28, 2005

Spiristics...yes, I've seen this before!

Lemme think...Whoopie Goldberg, Patrick Swayze, Demi Moore... darn it...I know I've seen it...
(no offense, dad)

235U92 · Jun 28, 2005

dad said:
Since billions of men throughout all history have believed in a spiritual, I guess you are talking to almost eveyone who ever lived, but a select few, mostly in modern times. You can't dream it away, however, like your monsters you admit to having believed in.
Just because there may have been demons in your closet, does not mean the way to make them go away is to ignore them.
I think we need to take the approach that the little girl did, when they asked her what she would do if the devil came knocking on her heart door. Her reply was simple, she said, " Oh, I'd just get Jesus to answer the door"!
'And though this world, with devils filled
should threaten to undo us
we will not fear, for God hath willed
His truth to tiumph thru us'

The problem with that is, there aren't any demons or monsters in my closet. The never was and there never will be any. I was a child with a wild imagination, and watching horror movies didn't help any. I still have that imagination, but I know how discern between something that is real or possible from something that is not.

dad · Jun 28, 2005

235U92 said:
The problem with that is, there aren't any demons or monsters in my closet. The never was and there never will be any. I was a child with a wild imagination, and watching horror movies didn't help any. I still have that imagination, but I know how discern between something that is real or possible from something that is not.

Interesting. How do you discern? Is it by the measurement of physical only? Is all that is real what we can touch?
Chidren, I feel, can be more sensitive to the spiritual. Animals also, in some cases, I feel. Look at Ballam's donkey who saw the angel, while the man still could not! Or, look at the animals in the recent tsnunami, who seem to be in tune to something else than physical only based science!

235U92 · Jun 28, 2005

dad said:
Interesting. How do you discern? Is it by the measurement of physical only? Is all that is real what we can touch?
Chidren, I feel, can be more sensitive to the spiritual. Animals also, in some cases, I feel. Look at Ballam's donkey who saw the angel, while the man still could not! Or, look at the animals in the recent tsnunami, who seem to be in tune to something else than physical only based science!

So animals being able to sense something is somehow metaphysical? I think you're overanalyzing.

And if I'm not mistaken, "Ballam's Donkey" is just a story, right? Stories do me no good.

Or, look at the animals in the recent tsnunami, who seem to be in tune to something else than physical only based science!

I also wasn't aware that animals were scientists, let alone metaphysical scientists.

dad · Jun 29, 2005

235U92 said:
So animals being able to sense something is somehow metaphysical? I think you're overanalyzing.
[Could be, so fill us in then, what is it really, if not a sensitivity to a spiritual world?]

And if I'm not mistaken, "Ballam's Donkey" is just a story, right? Stories do me no good. [No, it's true, it was in the bible. Stories are what men come up with, like granny, when they operate in luei of that truth]

I also wasn't aware that animals were scientists, let alone metaphysical scientists. [? I think the point was that science can't explain it, not that the animals were scientists!]

..

Matthew777 · Jun 29, 2005

DrunkenWrestler said:
God, I love this picture.

In order to be closest to the truth, one must find a balance between what we know from the Scriptures and what we observe in the physical world.
Young earth creationism streaches the limits of Biblical interpretation while Darwinism streaches the limits of science.

dad · Jun 29, 2005

Young earth creationism streaches the limits of Biblical interpretation

How so? By calling a day a day, and a morning and evening a morning and an evening, and a week a week? The stretch comes in trying to stetch out a day to a thousand or a billion years.
How is believing in the flood stretching the bible, and if it is, Jesus was the chief stretcher!

DJ_Ghost · Jun 29, 2005

dad said:
Yes, maybe you could help. If physics is the study of the physical, what would be a good term for the study of the spiritual laws? Spirics? Spiristics? Spiritysics?

Metephysics.

Ghost

The Seeker · Jun 29, 2005

Could be, so fill us in then, what is it really, if not a sensitivity to a spiritual world?

Seriously though, there are many explanations, many animals have better physical senses than us. They have better hearing, tactile sensitivity and sense of smell, any of which could be important in predicting a natural disaster.

dad · Jun 29, 2005

DJ_Ghost said:
Metephysics.

Ghost

Yes, there's always that. However, when we look closer, it is not applicable to a known spiritual world.
"The term metaphysics, as used by one school of philosophers, is narrowed down to mean the science of mental phenomena and of the laws of mind, In this sense, it is employed, for instance, by Hamilton ("Lectures on Metaph.", Lect. VII) as synonynous with psychology" http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/10226a.htm
Well, the carnal mind is at emnity (the enemy of) with God, and the spirit world!
"that collection of Aristotelean treatises which since then goes by the name of the "Metaphysics". Aristotle himself had referred to that portion of philosophy as "the theological science" (theologikê), because it culminated in the consideration of the nature of God, and as "first philosophy" (prôtê philosophia), both because it considered the first causes of things, and because, in his estimation, it is first in importance. The editor, however, overlooked both these titles, and, because he believed that that part of the Aristotelean corpus came naturally after the physical treatises, he entitled it "after the physics". This is the historical origin of the term"
So, it was relagated to second fiddle, apparently, after physics. So I think it is therefore best applied to those who embrace only physical things as a theology (modern science). Since modern physical only based speck ulations have come up with some doozies like granny and the speck.
But the real study not of some abstract 'nature of God' or whatever, but of the spirits, and spiritual world is not something that comes 'after the physics', but along with it, and before it, and after it, and all around it!
So, I think I'll settle on 'Spirysics' as the official title of this disipline! -Namely the study of the spiritual universe.
So, how about the merged universe coming, I wonder what a good term for this study is? 'Mergysics'? And of course, we already are very familiar with their nice poor cousin, 'physics'!

DJ_Ghost · Jun 29, 2005

dad said:
Yes, there's always that. However, when we look closer, it is not applicable to a known spiritual world.
"The term metaphysics, as used by one school of philosophers, is narrowed down to mean the science of mental phenomena and of the laws of mind, In this sense, it is employed, for instance, by Hamilton ("Lectures on Metaph.", Lect. VII) as synonynous with psychology" http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/10226a.htm
Well, the carnal mind is at emnity (the enemy of) with God, and the spirit world!
"that collection of Aristotelean treatises which since then goes by the name of the "Metaphysics". Aristotle himself had referred to that portion of philosophy as "the theological science" (theologikê), because it culminated in the consideration of the nature of God, and as "first philosophy" (prôtê philosophia), both because it considered the first causes of things, and because, in his estimation, it is first in importance. The editor, however, overlooked both these titles, and, because he believed that that part of the Aristotelean corpus came naturally after the physical treatises, he entitled it "after the physics". This is the historical origin of the term"
So, it was relagated to second fiddle, apparently, after physics. So I think it is therefore best applied to those who embrace only physical things as a theology (modern science). Since modern physical only based speck ulations have come up with some doozies like granny and the speck.
But the real study not of some abstract 'nature of God' or whatever, but of the spirits, and spiritual world is not something that comes 'after the physics', but along with it, and before it, and after it, and all around it!
So, I think I'll settle on 'Spirysics' as the official title of this disipline! -Namely the study of the spiritual universe.
So, how about the merged universe coming, I wonder what a good term for this study is? 'Mergysics'? And of course, we already are very familiar with their nice poor cousin, 'physics'!

That's all very well, but Metaphysics means beyond physics not after physics. Remember in the ancient Greek the term Meta could mean after, beyond or transcending. In this context it is used to mean beyond or Transcending.

Much as I appreciate your drive to invent a word and have it added to the lexicon, I feel I should caution you that the dive is skirting with the sin of hubris, Especially where you arbitrarily decide that it will be the new official term.

No, metaphysics is a perfectly adequate use of the term, and regardless of what one branch of philosophy may mean when they use it, its use in science is beyond or transcending nature. So there really is no need for you to invent a new official term, beyond personal glorification I suppose.

Ghost

dad · Jun 29, 2005

DJ_Ghost said:
That's all very well, but Metaphysics means “beyond physics” not “after physics”. Remember in the ancient Greek the term Meta could mean after, beyond or transcending. In this context it is used to mean “beyond” or “Transcending”.

Much as I appreciate your drive to invent a word and have it added to the lexicon, I feel I should caution you that the dive is skirting with the sin of hubris, Especially where you arbitrarily decide that it will be the new “official” term.

No, metaphysics is a perfectly adequate use of the term, and regardless of what one branch of philosophy may mean when they use it, its use in science is “beyond or transcending nature”. So there really is no need for you to invent a new official term, beyond personal glorification I suppose.

Ghost

Ha. Well, I think that limiting ourself only to the physical is transending nature, because the spirit world is quite natural, it is our present temporal, physical only, sin, and decay infested, time resticted prison (of the physical only) that is unnatural! So, again, metaphysical would better fit a physical only theology!-Or philosophy, if you prefer.
In the link I provided, it said it meant 'after physics', not the more modern preferred rendition of 'beyond'.
Be it as it may, even if we use the common meaning of the word, yes, the merged, and the spiritual are beyond what is now considered natural (physical only)-however, it is not a study of the spirit world as such at all, especially the biblical one, therefore it is more a word for the non christian aspects of a mixed bag of the supernatural, most often filled with nut case items as well, in the mix!
Therefore metaphysical is not a good word to portray or describe a serious, bible supported study of the real spiritual universe!
So we have a study of the physical, the spiritual, and the merged. I think a good word for physics, in it's present state is Onlyphysical.
That leaves the natural spiritual and spiritual/physical coming univrese, and the 2 odd men out- Onlyphysical, and Metaphysical!

Dark_Lite · Jun 29, 2005

Dad, you seriously have the funniest avatar ever.

Jetgirl · Jun 29, 2005

neverforsaken said:
outside the box is relative to a persons ideologies. kinda reminds me of my uncle, (so liberal he would put almost every liberal on this forum to shame ) he constantly calls me close minded for not agreeing with him. so i always ask him, "uncle, if I give up my ideas in exchange for yours, i will somehow become open minded?"

Oh man, what kind of response do you get to THAT one?

The Lady Kate · Jun 29, 2005

Matthew777 said:
In order to be closest to the truth, one must find a balance between what we know from the Scriptures and what we observe in the physical world.
Young earth creationism streaches the limits of Biblical interpretation while Darwinism streaches the limits of science.

So what exactly do we "know" (as opposed to accept as a matter of faith) from the Scriptures?

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