The NEA is pushing far left teaching upon children

[Say it aint so]

The studies are based on questionnaires only. All the other things I mentioned are not included. Its not real scientific research.

And I'm not answering a hypothetical like that. "If" is not worth talking about.

I literally said put the studies aside. Your response is telling.

 

[rjs330]

Why is it a lie and not just a social convention?

Man, if you don't know by now what my answer to the question would be its ra t her hopless. I'm actually surprised you asked the question.

 

[rjs330]

I literally said put the studies aside. Your response is telling.

Believe what you will. I don't care.

 

[BCP1928]

Man, if you don't know by now what my answer to the question would be its ra t her hopless. I'm actually surprised you asked the question.

As I remember, it is that while a trans person isn't doing you any harm, using preferred pronouns for a transwoman, say, would be a positive assertion that she is a biological female.

 

[RileyG]

My question was more like if a trans person "pass" (are seen as the gender they want to present by the general public) are they then entitled to using their preferred pronouns in your view? If yes, that is an argument for medical intervention. If no, why say it is about secondary sex characteristics at all?

Sure why not. I’m not the pronoun police nor a control freak. Simple really.

 

[rjs330]

As I remember, it is that while a trans person isn't doing you any harm, using preferred pronouns for a transwoman, say, would be a positive assertion that she is a biological female.

I knew you would know the answer. Although, you really, really had to throw in your own two cents into it. Just couldn't help yourself.

 

[Stopped_lurking]

Its an absolute fact. Try it. Fashion changes. Names change. What was once a male name can become interchangeable and be male or female.

So how it is connected to sex then? Did the sex change?

Even in names you don't need an amorphous term like gender. You can substitute sex for it. Male (sex reference) names, female (sex reference) names or names that can be used by both sexes.

If you are ONLY showing a photograph that may be true. But if you went there and interacted with them you would figure it out.

That includes social and cultural factors.

Like what?

Names, for example. In Russia Sasha is a man's name in Sweden it's a woman's.

You know good and well what the norm is for male and female. Don't play games. If you are born with xy what are you, male or female?

XY I would call male. But most XY SRY- have been called female, up until the discover of sex chromosomes and the SRY-gene, and probably even today as most places don't do karyotyping as a standard procedure on newborns.

 

[Stopped_lurking]

They used sexual expression. Gender and sex are the same thing. You can use them interchangeably and tgey will mean the same thing.

Gender genitalia and sex genitalia are the same thing.

Gender genitalia? Sex genitalia? What are sex genitalia, in contrast to non-sex genitalia? I understand genitalia as the sex organs.

Gender expression and sex expression are the same thing.

Now, you're just repeating the assertion.

 

[Stopped_lurking]

Sure why not. I’m not the pronoun police nor a control freak. Simple really.

Which pronouns did you use for Jazz Jennings?

 

[RileyG]

Which pronouns did you use for Jazz Jennings?

He since he’s a biological male.

 

[Stopped_lurking]

He since he’s a biological male.

Do you also think she doesn't "pass" then? Otherwise your statements seem to conflict with each other.

 

[RileyG]

Do you also think she doesn't "pass" then? Otherwise your statements seem to conflict with each other.

I know he’s a male though. That’s the difference.

 

[RileyG]

Gender genitalia? Sex genitalia? What are sex genitalia, in contrast to non-sex genitalia? I understand genitalia as the sex organs.

Now, you're just repeating the assertion.

Gender and sex are the same thing from those who don’t accept transgender ideology.

 

[Stopped_lurking]

I know he’s a male though. That’s the difference.

And you point it out, isn't that being the pronoun police?

 

[RileyG]

And you point it out, isn't that being the pronoun police?

I don’t care if others do. I just go with biology. That’s all.

 

[rjs330]

So how it is connected to sex then? Did the sex change?

I don't think anyone said names where tied to sex. They could be, thats why I said "if." Such as the name Tom or Amber. Yes it is a social convention that is tied to males or females. If clothing is tied to males or females it is tied to their sex because male and female is sex.

Clothing doesn't determine sex. Did you think it did? If it is tied to male or female societally it is tied to sex.

That includes social and cultural factors.

Factors of what?

Names, for example. In Russia Sasha is a man's name in Sweden it's a woman's.

Ah... a man or woman. Which is a reference to sex.

XY I would call male. But most XY SRY- have been called female, up until the discover of sex chromosomes and the SRY-gene, and probably even today as most places don't do karyotyping as a standard procedure on newborns.

Are you making a claim that transgender people have Swyer Syndrom? If not why bring it up? Whats your point?

 

[rjs330]

Gender genitalia? Sex genitalia? What are sex genitalia, in contrast to non-sex genitalia? I understand genitalia as the sex organs.

Now, you're just repeating the assertion.

Thats because you seem to be having a hard time with it.

Gender norms are the same thing as sex norms.

There isn't anything gender related that cannot be referred to as sex related and vice versa. That's why there is no such thing as gender that is not tied to sex.

 

[rjs330]

And you point it out, isn't that being the pronoun police?

No, because the pronoun police demand that certain pronouns be used by others. No one here has made that demand. Are you?

 

[Stopped_lurking]

I don't think anyone said names where tied to sex. They could be, thats why I said "if." Such as the name Tom or Amber. Yes it is a social convention that is tied to males or females. If clothing is tied to males or females it is tied to their sex because male and female is sex.

Clothing doesn't determine sex. Did you think it did?

No, but you seem to argue that sex determines clothing? But what clothing is related to which gender is a social convention, not a biological one. This is an example of when it is useful to have the sex-gender distinction.

If it is tied to male or female societally it is tied to sex.

Factors of what?

Their society. Then you can see them interact with each other you can, talk to them yourself. Start building a mental model of their society.

Ah... a man or woman. Which is a reference to sex.

Gender.

Are you making a claim that transgender people have Swyer Syndrom? If not why bring it up? Whats your point?

Only a few, but it is enough to make chromosomes an imperfect sex marker (which was my point).

 

[Stopped_lurking]

Thats because you seem to be having a hard time with it.

Gender norms are the same thing as sex norms.

There isn't anything gender related that cannot be referred to as sex related and vice versa. That's why there is no such thing as gender that is not tied to sex.

So how is fashion connected to genitalia or chromosomes or gamete size?