There’s a Giant Flaw in Human History

[sjastro]

Yes so I was right that the base blocks on the pyramid were molded. I had people on your side claiming I was creating conspiracies for suggesting such ideas and there was no evidence. That you for confirming I was right all along.

Yes the limestone used in the moulded blocks comes from the Tura quarry. But its been crushed or broken down and reconstituted with some polymer or something like cement. Except it seems to dry naturally like its stone.

All you have confirmed is an inability to read and comprehend.

There’s a Giant Flaw in Human History

lol I forgot there are certain trigger words. Like a word suddenly is what makes reality. Just mention the word and it all reality becomes the word. Like the word has magic powers. Not about "trigger words" its about you sloppy writing. If you don't mean "new age sprituality" don't use the term...

www.christianforums.com

 

[stevevw]

Read the study there were NO tests or experiments performed.

I never said there were any tests. I said the theorectic simulations were enough to warrant further testing and base new tech on. There were real science from the research that warrants further investigation and not dismissing.

No again, this is just a popular scientific write up of the same study

So why should I believe your opinion over the scientific write up lol. It seems all the so called "scientific write ups" are saying the same thing. Coming to the same conclusion as myself. The write up actually quotes the researchers.

Which is just saying that they want to produce pyramidal antennas, if they are at a nanoscale it will not be radiowaves they are trying to interact with.

So how is this not advanced knowledge. They are learning from the ancient Egyptian structures and methods to generate such waves and energy sources. Surely the structure, its location and the specifiuc way its build with certain stones was not just luck in producing such results.

This is article has not been peer-reviewed (the pre-print even says so in it's watermarks), it tries to build a case for the connection between the shroud of Turin and the Giza pyramids. It contains no test or experimental work.

Ah peer review, peer review. Everything has to be peer reviewed. At least its a scientific paper. You are dismissing it without any peer review or even any scientific published article. Your doing exactly what I was pointing out was double standard.

Here I am linking peer review and at least scientifice papers and reports laying out the process and anaysis. All I am getting from skeptics is single sentence objections with absolutely no support.

Is not the Piezoelectric Phenomena in the King's Chamber the same effect that the other papers which included peer review were talking about. So we have a number of papers all supporting a similar effect. I would rather side with at least scientific papers then someones personal opinion on a social media platform.

Mentioned in the post you quoted before. There is no connection to egyptian pyramids, is there?

I think I may have linked this to show that the tech is possible. That research has shown that granite can be weakened by Piezoelectric Excitation. Along similar lines to the other research and tests showing Piezoelectric Phenomena and effects.

They are all looking at the use of the natural materials involved and how they interact with each other. How specific combinations or architecture enhances natural phenomena that can ebe harnessed.

As mentioned I don't think for example the location of the pyramid on a high electromagnetic location, over a mineral rich subterrainian water network.

No one of your articles has shown the utility of piezoelectrics in conjunction with the pyramids.

Show me the peer review that states there is no connection.

That was no confirmation! It is enough to make further tests interesting.

According to the findings they clearly state that there was human intervention.

The NMR results suggest that the casing stones consist of limestone grains from the Tura quarry, cemented with an amorphous calcium-silicate gel formed by human intervention, by the addition of extra silica, possibly diatomaceous earth, from the Fayium area.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0167577X10008979

Conclusion from the pdf is that it may contain both natural and manmade blocks. No hypothesis testing was performed,

Yes there was. The hypothesis was.
1) If the blocks are artificial, their magnetic moments are parallel, oriented approximately in the north-south direction
2) If the blocks are natural, then the directions of their magnetic moments are oriented randomly.

Magnetic analyses suggest the possibility that the pyramids may contain both natural and man-made blocks.

As far as I understand that the blocks that are orientated paralell north to south have a magnetic moments that corresponds to them being artificial. Being reconstituted in situ and never changing orientation. Whereas the natural stones have random magnetic moments as they are changing orientation over time. It is impossible for a natural stone to have a N to S magnetic moment.

so how probable was it that the magnetization directions would be observed by chance alone? Seven samples don't give them much to work with.

Near impossible. The magnetic moments happen as the stones are orientated. So natural stones from quarry to placement will undergo random orientations. Whereas the cast blocks being cast in situ will only have paralell orientation N to S as they have only been orientation in one position.

No hypothesis testing was performed, so how probable was it that the magnetization directions would be observed by chance alone? Seven samples don't give them much to work with.

Thats 7 out of 7 which makes the odds atronomically high that all these blocks just happen to remain paralelle throughout the entire process from quarry to positioning. If they were chiselled and cut and hauled up the pyramid they are going to have random magnetic moments.

But when you add the other tests that show the makeup of the stones are manmade and contain artificial minerals and chemistry in them it makes a strong case.

The Surprising Truth Behind the Construction of the Great Pyramids
The tiniest structures within the inner and outer casing stones were indeed consistent with a reconstituted limestone. The cement binding the limestone aggregate was either silicon dioxide (the building block of quartz) or a calcium and magnesium-rich silicate mineral.

The sample chemistries the researchers found do not exist anywhere in nature. "Therefore," says Barsoum, "it's very improbable that the outer and inner casing stones that we examined were chiseled from a natural limestone block."

The presence of silicon dioxide nanoscale spheres (with diameters only billionths of a meter across) in one of the samples. This discovery further confirms that these blocks are not natural limestone.

Ancient Egyptians were the original--albeit unknowing--nanotechnologists." "Ironically," says Barsoum, "this study of 4,500 year old rocks is not about the past, but about the future."
The Surprising Truth Behind the Construction of the Great Pyramids

In other words just like we are learning from the Piezoelectric effects of the pyramids and applying this to new tech. The same with the geopolymer cement the early Egyptians created which is natural and environmental. They are teaching us how to manipulate nature from 4,500 years ago or longer.

Gathering 'concrete' evidence
The binder, known as a geopolymer, could have been made from lime, kaolinite (a kind of clay), a fine silica (such as diatomaceous earth) and natron (sodium carbonate). The same ingredients were used by the Egyptians to make self-glazing pottery ornaments, a material called Egyptian faience, and well known to archeologists.

Gathering 'concrete' evidence

MIT class explores controversial pyramid theory with scale model

news.mit.edu

I read the article, they don't claim to have proved anything. What do you want me to do then?

To apply the same standard you apply to me. The skeptics demans peer review and still reject it. They demand scientific evidence from formal sources with credible scientists.

Just saying you disagree meets none of those standards that have been demanded of me. I have several independent sources from either peer review or scientific sources with published papers, reposts and commentary on those papers and reports. You have a personal opinion on a social media site.

It is a suggestion. It even says so in the headline.

Yes just like the idea of giant ramps and wooden sleds or cutting millions of blocks with chisels and copper saws. Why is it that the orthodoxy is accepted out of hand when its also spectulation. At least the idea of hydro lifting is more aligned to a realistic explanation and that the Egyptians were smarter than just using sheer human power.

You're jumping the gun, let us see if others can replicate the findings.

Theres enough evidence to say it was likely. Thats why I always go back to the images. I have shown you observation evidence of softened stone already and its been dismissed. This image is one of the actual blocks on the casing and you can see how it was soft.

How much more evidence do you want.

Even if they were using some sort of cement, how does this follow? Cement-like (true cement with lime came a little later?) construction was known to the ancient egyptians, was it not?

Well the Romans were attributed with create cement. So this like other discoveries pushes back the timeline. But the research results seem to say that this was not just any old cement but one thats eco friendly and lasts longer than any other cement.

Enough to want to reverse engineer it to use as a building product for the future. In other words 4,500 year old knowledge is showing us how ho make cement today.

But also that it explains how the outer casing stones are so tight where you can't even get a human hair between them. This makes sense that they were cast and sank into each other as they dried. The material did not shrink and looked and lasted like real stone. Even to foolw Egyptologists for decades . Claiming they spent years chiseling surfaces to hair tight perfection.

What do you mean with "They all had a purpose associated with the data being collected."? That the egyptians built thing with a purpose in mind, that is more or less a given.

Yes so I am saying that there was much more of a purpose for what they built than given credit for. The same principle but just more of it and more advanced than thought.

I mean the pyramids are a feat in themselves. But the orthodoxy that they were just big tombs and like Sneferu needed three is becoming unreal. There is a lot more going on and thanks to modern tech its only in recent decade that we are finding out.

Only in the sense, that new findings of course changes our current understanding. That is what science does.

Lol its like they never resisted the idea and when it shows their orthodoxy wrong they pretend thats how science works. As though science never has a paradigm change. I think like all sciences this is exactly what is happening.

 

[stevevw]

All you have confirmed is an inability to read and comprehend.

There’s a Giant Flaw in Human History

lol I forgot there are certain trigger words. Like a word suddenly is what makes reality. Just mention the word and it all reality becomes the word. Like the word has magic powers. Not about "trigger words" its about you sloppy writing. If you don't mean "new age sprituality" don't use the term...

www.christianforums.com

Perhaps its the other way around. Refer to my last post and the evidence from several independent sources.

Do you comprehend the following

The tiniest structures within the inner and outer casing stones were indeed consistent with a reconstituted limestone.

The sample chemistries the researchers found do not exist anywhere in nature.

"it's very improbable that the outer and inner casing stones that we examined were chiseled from a natural limestone block."

This discovery further confirms that these blocks are not natural limestone.

Ancient Egyptians were the original--albeit unknowing--nanotechnologists."
The Surprising Truth Behind the Construction of the Great Pyramids

 

[sjastro]

Perhaps its the other way around. Refer to my last post and the evidence from several independent sources.

Do you comprehend the following

The tiniest structures within the inner and outer casing stones were indeed consistent with a reconstituted limestone.

The sample chemistries the researchers found do not exist anywhere in nature.

"it's very improbable that the outer and inner casing stones that we examined were chiseled ctsfrom a natural limestone block."

This discovery further confirms that these blocks are not natural limestone.

Ancient Egyptians were the original--albeit unknowing--nanotechnologists."
The Surprising Truth Behind the Construction of the Great Pyramids

Did I not explain in another post this so called reconstituted limestone is due to the effect of the Giza water table changing the geochemistry of limestone at and near the surface.

There’s a Giant Flaw in Human History

What is the algorithm based on. Is there any assumptions that exclude certain knowledge as being pseudoscience grift...Before its established that its pseudoscience grift. Or that we must use a particular algorithm that you decide is truth. That only tells us a certain kind of reality and not...

www.christianforums.com

Explain why this reconstituted limestone seems to magically disappear for both core and casing stones beyond the lower courses for all the Giza pyramids as confirmed by a number of independent tests.
Also try explaining how individual limestone blocks can have a reconstituted lower region and a natural limestone upper region if the water table played no role.

Your claim reconstituted moulded limestone is settled science is either an example of dishonesty or a lack of comprehension as the independent tests clearly refute this notion.

 

[Stopped_lurking]

I never said there were any tests. I said the theorectic simulations were enough to warrant further testing and base new tech on. There were real science from the research that warrants further investigation and not dismissing.

Yes, you did I quoted you in the post that you quoted. Here it is again:

The hypothesis was that the pyramids structure and chambers can concentrate electromagnic energy. The test confirms this.

So why should I believe your opinion over the scientific write up lol. It seems all the so called "scientific write ups" are saying the same thing. Coming to the same conclusion as myself. The write up actually quotes the researchers.

Popular scientific write-up, there is no actual new test performed, you should read the article.

So how is this not advanced knowledge.

We have no reason to believe that any electromagnetic considerations was part of the egyptians purpose. It has not been experimentally verified to even be a real thing (how do you believe all the boundary layers between the blocks would affect the antenna performance?).

They are learning from the ancient Egyptian structures and methods to generate such waves and energy sources.

The simulation did not touch on generating any energy, the electric and magnetic field sources in the calculation was external to the pyramid.

Surely the structure, its location and the specifiuc way its build with certain stones was not just luck in producing such results.

What impact did the stones have then if you have read it (they assumed normal limestone)? If they had used other stones in Egypt how would that change the results? How did the location influence the simulation? Did they have any data on the permittivity of the substrate in their calculations?

It is a simulation study, they basically only tested the pyramidal shape.

Ah peer review, peer review. Everything has to be peer reviewed. At least its a scientific paper.

No, peer-review is part of the modern scientific process.

You are dismissing it without any peer review or even any scientific published article. Your doing exactly what I was pointing out was double standard.

I'm not dismissing anything, but your supposed peer-reviewed papers (which no longer are peer-reviewed) don't support your claims.

Here I am linking peer review and at least scientifice papers and reports laying out the process and anaysis. All I am getting from skeptics is single sentence objections with absolutely no support.

No, peer-review is part of the modern scientific process.

Is not the Piezoelectric Phenomena in the King's Chamber the same effect that the other papers which included peer review were talking about.

Does it even exist? Who has measured it?

So we have a number of papers all supporting a similar effect. I would rather side with at least scientific papers then someones personal opinion on a social media platform.

Piezoelectrics are well-known, what do they have to do with the pyramids in Giza that is the question.

I think I may have linked this to show that the tech is possible. That research has shown that granite can be weakened by Piezoelectric Excitation. Along similar lines to the other research and tests showing Piezoelectric Phenomena and effects.

Piezoelectrics are well-known, what do they have to do with the pyramids in Giza that is the question.

They are all looking at the use of the natural materials involved and how they interact with each other. How specific combinations or architecture enhances natural phenomena that can ebe harnessed.

So link that peer-reviewed article then? What natural phenomena are we talking about here, what do you believe was the source of the radio waves? Or vibrations for piezoelectric power generation?

As mentioned I don't think for example the location of the pyramid on a high electromagnetic location, over a mineral rich subterrainian water network.

So link that peer-reviewed article then?

Show me the peer review that states there is no connection.

Normally, if you claim it you show it. I'm ok with uncertainties regarding the pyramids.

According to the findings they clearly state that there was human intervention.

The NMR results suggest that the casing stones consist of limestone grains from the Tura quarry, cemented with an amorphous calcium-silicate gel formed by human intervention, by the addition of extra silica, possibly diatomaceous earth, from the Fayium area.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0167577X10008979

"The NMR results suggest..." What does suggest mean?

Yes there was. The hypothesis was.
1) If the blocks are artificial, their magnetic moments are parallel, oriented approximately in the north-south direction
2) If the blocks are natural, then the directions of their magnetic moments are oriented randomly.

Magnetic analyses suggest the possibility that the pyramids may contain both natural and man-made blocks.

As far as I understand that the blocks that are orientated paralell north to south have a magnetic moments that corresponds to them being artificial. Being reconstituted in situ and never changing orientation. Whereas the natural stones have random magnetic moments as they are changing orientation over time. It is impossible for a natural stone to have a N to S magnetic moment.

The magnetic moments are not perfect north-south, actually from the pictures they have enough east-west spread so some kind of statistical test would be appropriate to determine if they are semi-aligned by chance alone.

Near impossible.

So what was the p-value then?

The magnetic moments happen as the stones are orientated. So natural stones from quarry to placement will undergo random orientations. Whereas the cast blocks being cast in situ will only have paralell orientation N to S as they have only been orientation in one position.

Thats 7 out of 7 which makes the odds atronomically high that all these blocks just happen to remain paralelle throughout the entire process from quarry to positioning. If they were chiselled and cut and hauled up the pyramid they are going to have random magnetic moments.

See above. Read it there was not 7 blocks that showed that pattern.

But when you add the other tests that show the makeup of the stones are manmade and contain artificial minerals and chemistry in them it makes a strong case.

The Surprising Truth Behind the Construction of the Great Pyramids
The tiniest structures within the inner and outer casing stones were indeed consistent with a reconstituted limestone. The cement binding the limestone aggregate was either silicon dioxide (the building block of quartz) or a calcium and magnesium-rich silicate mineral.

The sample chemistries the researchers found do not exist anywhere in nature. "Therefore," says Barsoum, "it's very improbable that the outer and inner casing stones that we examined were chiseled from a natural limestone block."

The presence of silicon dioxide nanoscale spheres (with diameters only billionths of a meter across) in one of the samples. This discovery further confirms that these blocks are not natural limestone.

Ancient Egyptians were the original--albeit unknowing--nanotechnologists." "Ironically," says Barsoum, "this study of 4,500 year old rocks is not about the past, but about the future."
The Surprising Truth Behind the Construction of the Great Pyramids

In other words just like we are learning from the Piezoelectric effects of the pyramids and applying this to new tech. The same with the geopolymer cement the early Egyptians created which is natural and environmental. They are teaching us how to manipulate nature from 4,500 years ago or longer.

Gathering 'concrete' evidence
The binder, known as a geopolymer, could have been made from lime, kaolinite (a kind of clay), a fine silica (such as diatomaceous earth) and natron (sodium carbonate). The same ingredients were used by the Egyptians to make self-glazing pottery ornaments, a material called Egyptian faience, and well known to archeologists.

Gathering 'concrete' evidence

MIT class explores controversial pyramid theory with scale model

news.mit.edu

To apply the same standard you apply to me. The skeptics demans peer review and still reject it. They demand scientific evidence from formal sources with credible scientists.

Just saying you disagree meets none of those standards that have been demanded of me. I have several independent sources from either peer review or scientific sources with published papers, reposts and commentary on those papers and reports. You have a personal opinion on a social media site.

Yes just like the idea of giant ramps and wooden sleds or cutting millions of blocks with chisels and copper saws. Why is it that the orthodoxy is accepted out of hand when its also spectulation. At least the idea of hydro lifting is more aligned to a realistic explanation and that the Egyptians were smarter than just using sheer human power.

Theres enough evidence to say it was likely. Thats why I always go back to the images. I have shown you observation evidence of softened stone already and its been dismissed. This image is one of the actual blocks on the casing and you can see how it was soft.

View attachment 373344

How much more evidence do you want.

How is this picture evidence that it was soft?

Well the Romans were attributed with create cement.

Lime based cement yes, but there was other plasters around.

So this like other discoveries pushes back the timeline. But the research results seem to say that this was not just any old cement but one thats eco friendly and lasts longer than any other cement.

Fine, but @sjastro have a competing hypothesis, so I'll let the archaeologist and the geophysicists work this on out before I'll draw any firm conclusions.

Enough to want to reverse engineer it to use as a building product for the future. In other words 4,500 year old knowledge is showing us how ho make cement today.

But also that it explains how the outer casing stones are so tight where you can't even get a human hair between them. This makes sense that they were cast and sank into each other as they dried. The material did not shrink and looked and lasted like real stone. Even to foolw Egyptologists for decades . Claiming they spent years chiseling surfaces to hair tight perfection.

Yes so I am saying that there was much more of a purpose for what they built than given credit for. The same principle but just more of it and more advanced than thought.

Why would we think that?

I mean the pyramids are a feat in themselves. But the orthodoxy that they were just big tombs and like Sneferu needed three is becoming unreal. There is a lot more going on and thanks to modern tech its only in recent decade that we are finding out.

Lol its like they never resisted the idea and when it shows their orthodoxy wrong they pretend thats how science works. As though science never has a paradigm change. I think like all sciences this is exactly what is happening.

So how many refused articles have the proponents sent to the journals? Any? Are their refusal rate higher than others? Otherwise it is just them complaining.

 

[sjastro]

With regards to the nonsense of the ancient Egyptians using pyramids to 'focus or amplify' electromagnetic energy, all objects including pyramids can exhibit electromagnetic resonances.
These resonances occur when an external electromagnetic wave matches one of the natural oscillation modes of the object.
In conductive materials this involves free electrons oscillating collectively while in insulating materials like limestone or granite, the response is much weaker and consists mainly of small polarization shifts rather than free electron motion.
At resonance the frequency of the electromagnetic radiation matches the frequency of the oscillating electrons or polarization shifts resulting in an increase in the amplitude of the oscillation.

The internal chambers of the Great Pyramid have different dielectric properties than the surrounding limestone and granite walls, so can alter the distribution of electromagnetic fields and support their own weak resonance modes. Inside the chambers, electromagnetic fields can form weak standing-wave patterns due to reflections off the walls to form constructive interference with the incident radiation creating regions where the field is slightly stronger and is normal cavity resonance found in any enclosed space.

It is blatantly obvious the ancient Egyptians were completely unaware of the physics by simply comparing the interiors of the Great Pyramid with the second largest pyramid that of Khafre.

Khafre’s pyramid contains intrusive tunnels created by tomb robbers but would show a far weaker electromagnetic field enhancement than Khufu’s because it lacks internal chambers and therefore dielectric discontinuities which cannot support internal standing-wave resonant modes.

If the ancient Egyptians were aware of the physics they would not have constructed Khafre’s pyramid with the internal chamber below the pyramid where enhancements would have been negligible.

 

[stevevw]

Yes, you did I quoted you in the post that you quoted. Here it is again:

Once again this fixation on words and their meaning as creating the entire meaning of what someone says. Look at the word in its context. I stated this testing supported further testing which was the onsite tests.

I agreed it was a similation and thats what the word 'test' was referring to. Please read the 'word' in the context of the sentence they are written in.

Popular scientific write-up, there is no actual new test performed, you should read the article.

Ok so I will apply the same logic to your claim. You objection holds not weight as its just a popular comment on a social media thread. I would rather believe the popular scientfic write-up than someones personal opinion on a social media thread.

But it was not just the popular science article that was making these claims was it. It was the actual scientists. Scientists (not the article) concluded the Pyramid may have been a gigantic resonator that was designed to trap electromagnetic waves.

We have no reason to believe that any electromagnetic considerations was part of the egyptians purpose. It has not been experimentally verified to even be a real thing (how do you believe all the boundary layers between the blocks would affect the antenna performance?).

I don't know, isnt that what the tests are for. The fact is they have found good theorectical reasons to do further tests. There have been a number of theorectical studies that tell us there is good reason.

Even if the Egyptians did not purposely build the pyramids for generating any effects. Its still worth the investigation by the fact that effects are theorised by the modelling. They claim this can teach us something. Your actually contradicting science now by denying the idea of persuing further investigation when the theory supports it.

But wait. Did not some of the tests happen on site in the pyramids.
Scientists blasted the 4,600-year-old structure with electromagnetic waves, a form of radiation that travel though the universe, finding it focused and amplified the energy into specific chambers and around the base.

The simulation did not touch on generating any energy, the electric and magnetic field sources in the calculation was external to the pyramid.

But there was also actual tests done in the pyramids that show that it concentrated energy into the chambers. Its no longer theorectical.

What impact did the stones have then if you have read it (they assumed normal limestone)? If they had used other stones in Egypt how would that change the results?

The made a couple of assumptions and all science does. They did not just assume limestone. They also accounted for the pink granite in the chambers and shafts.

This stone has high piezoelectric effect under pressure. Its the position of the chambers, shafts and stones that generate the concentratede effect in the Kings chamber. The quartz crystals in pink granite is known for its high piezoelectric effect.

But its not just the stones. Its also the location of the pyramids themselves on a high electromagnetic location. Over a minreal rich natural subterrainian water way deposit. All this is not just some coincident and accident. The Egyptians were chemists and physicists as well in their own way.

As the scientists who did the research said and not popular science "Ancient Egyptians were the original--albeit unknowing--nanotechnologists."

How did the location influence the simulation? Did they have any data on the permittivity of the substrate in their calculations?

Not that particular research but other research has establish the influence of the location on potential advanced knowledge of nature.

Development of Sulfuric Acid Speleogenetic Deposits within Cavernous Middle Eocene Beds: Inference on Hydrocarbon Gas Seepages, Giza Pyramids Plateau, Egypt
https://www.researchgate.net/public...rbon_Gas_Seepages_Giza_Pyramids_Plateau_Egypt

The Great Pyramid of Giza: A Modern View on Ancient Knowledge, Air and Fire – Part II
The Great Pyramid of Giza: A Modern View on Ancient Knowledge, Air and Fire – Part II | Ancient Origins

It is a simulation study, they basically only tested the pyramidal shape.

Why is it that skeptics are so eaher to minimise everything. They did way more than just test its shape. They were able tyo get new tech from it that can have real world effects.

No, peer-review is part of the modern scientific process.

Its become a a tool to deny scientific ideas that don't conform to the orthodoxy in some cases. Some ideas don't even get through the front door. They are deemed unreal before peer review. Some non peer review science has shown peer review as wrong.

I'm not dismissing anything, but your supposed peer-reviewed papers (which no longer are peer-reviewed) don't support your claims.

But you do so without the same standards you demand of those proposing alternative ideas. You demand of them peer review while claiming them wrong wroung without peer review. Its double standards.

Does it even exist? Who has measured it?

First the high Piezoelectric effect in granite has already been verified. So its logical that a concentration of granite in the chambers is going to cause a higher Piezoelectric effect. From memory the shafts were also granite. Its whether they knew this and made it so to concentrate the effect in the chambers. .

Experimental results of the piezoelectric activity of quartzose rocks

https://library.seg.org/doi/abs/10.1190/1.1892893?download=true

Electromagnetic Properties of Pyramids from Positions of Photonics

Electromagnetic Properties of Pyramids from Positions of Photonics - Russian Physics Journal

The choice of the operating wavelength of electromagnetic radiation is justified for a pyramid considered as an antenna. It is shown that due to the strong dispersion of the refractive index of the pyramid material, there will always be a part of the spectral range, in which the refractive index...

link.springer.com

Electromagnetic properties of the Great Pyramid: First multipole resonances and energy concentration

https://pubs.aip.org/aip/jap/article-abstract/124/3/034903/156109/Electromagnetic-properties-of-the-Great-Pyramid?redirectedFrom=fulltext

Piezoelectrics are well-known, what do they have to do with the pyramids in Giza that is the question.

Thats what all the articles on the Piezoelectric effects of the pyramids are trying to find out.

So link that peer-reviewed article then? What natural phenomena are we talking about here, what do you believe was the source of the radio waves? Or vibrations for piezoelectric power generation?

Not sure if we are at the peer review stage yet. Still there is good science behind the idea.

The Overall Science behind the Pyramid
The generation of electricity requires the pyramid to vibrate always. Hence the location at which the electromagnetic waves are more on the surface of the globe are chosen to be the perfect sites for the pyramid. For example, the pyramid at Giza is standing on the underwater currents of the river Nile plus on a location where high electromagnetic flux lines can be measured and felt. This provides the vibrations required for the crystals to vibrate at all times. And Graphite rods are connected to the pyramid floors made of diamagnetic granites.[4] The figure below illustrates the ionic emission at the apex.

The Overall Science behind the Pyramid – IJERT

The Overall Science behind the Pyramid - written by K. S. Vishwanath Vashisht published on 2016/11/03 download full article with reference data and citations

www.ijert.org

Normally, if you claim it you show it. I'm ok with uncertainties regarding the pyramids.

Yes and when I show it its dismissed without the same level of peer review.

"The NMR results suggest..." What does suggest mean?

Here we go with word meanings. So if I find a word that means 'assurity' rather than suggest then logically that would mean the findings are definite.

So when the article says 'Barsoum (the lead scientists) 'the outer casing stones were indeed consistent with a reconstituted limestone'. The the word 'indeed' means they definitely found that the casing stones were made of reconsituted limestone.

What about "electron microscope analysis indicates the Egyptians used diatomaceous earth, a naturally occurring, commonly found soft sedimentary rock". Not (suggests) but definietly used diatomaceous earth in the mixture that was found in the samples of casing stones.

The magnetic moments are not perfect north-south, actually from the pictures they have enough east-west spread so some kind of statistical test would be appropriate to determine if they are semi-aligned by chance alone.

So more tests need to be done rather than dismiss it as conspiracy or psuedoscience.

So what was the p-value then?

I don't know. I think you would need way more stones tested to gather enough data to determine this.

How is this picture evidence that it was soft?

Can you see the lip at the bottom as though the soft mixture spread into a gap between the blocks. This was not the result of grinding the block away to create a protruding lip. We see much evidence of this signature. I have linked them earlier. Why is it now you only recognise them.

Lime based cement yes, but there was other plasters around.

Yes an advanced cement that is revealing an advanced tech that we are recognising 4,500 years later. The advanced knowledge keeps getting pushed back earlier and earlier.

Fine, but @sjastro have a competing hypothesis, so I'll let the archaeologist and the geophysicists work this on out before I'll draw any firm conclusions.

Thats ok but like I said a social media platform is not a good place to make the case and especially make claims about existing peer review or even scientific reports or research that has been published. At least these make full article with the process linked out and tests done. I have not seen this yet and if I do then I will include it.

Why would we think that?

Because of the accumulation of data pointing that way. At the very least to do further investigation. You have to remember that these ideas and findings have only come in the past decade or so because the tech has improved. We are really only beginning to understand the level of knowledge and tech involved with the ancient Egyptians.

So how many refused articles have the proponents sent to the journals? Any? Are their refusal rate higher than others? Otherwise it is just them complaining.

It depends. As shown there are a few in mainstream journals. There are a fair few Russian journals lol. But there are a fair few good scientfific papers that are not yet peer reviewed. But as a total I don;t think there are many articles done full stop. I don't think many have even been submitted at all.

Its still seen as fringe so it has a long way to go before being accepted by the mainstream. I think perhaps the area of natural energies may lead to more research into the Egyptians ancient worls as is happening now. We have a long history of seeing the pyramids as being something more than just a tomb. Now we have the tech to find out. Watch this space I reckon.

 

[Brother Del]

Professor Heihnsohn, to the best of my knowledge died an unbeliever, that should in no way detract from the importance of his well documented research and purely scientific observations.

"History is a set of lies agreed upon."
Napolean

 

[stevevw]

With regards to the nonsense of the ancient Egyptians using pyramids to 'focus or amplify' electromagnetic energy, all objects including pyramids can exhibit electromagnetic resonances.

But the pyramids are extra special. They have some mean acoustics. But also the whole setup within an electromagnetically active location. It all seems to add up to a combination of factors that are being utilised to generate Piezoelectric effects.

These resonances occur when an external electromagnetic wave matches one of the natural oscillation modes of the object.
In conductive materials this involves free electrons oscillating collectively while in insulating materials like limestone or granite, the response is much weaker and consists mainly of small polarization shifts rather than free electron motion.
At resonance the frequency of the electromagnetic radiation matches the frequency of the oscillating electrons or polarization shifts resulting in an increase in the amplitude of the oscillation.

Yes thats why I say its the combination of the location of the pyramids within a high electromagentic region and the specific layout of shafts, vents and chambers in granite and the different stones to concentrate the energy. The particular exterior of high reflective stone, the Gold plated cap stone. The subterrainian water ways with righ minerals conducive of quartz crystals. Its the specific combination of these factors.

The internal chambers of the Great Pyramid have different dielectric properties than the surrounding limestone and granite walls, so can alter the distribution of electromagnetic fields and support their own weak resonance modes. Inside the chambers, electromagnetic fields can form weak standing-wave patterns due to reflections off the walls to form constructive interference with the incident radiation creating regions where the field is slightly stronger and is normal cavity resonance found in any enclosed space.

I mean all your doing is giving your personnal take on this.

It is blatantly obvious the ancient Egyptians were completely unaware of the physics by simply comparing the interiors of the Great Pyramid with the second largest pyramid that of Khafre.

Thats only if you assume each pyramid was used for the same purpose. Or that one was not an improvement on the other as part of an experiment to perfect the best energy creation.

As you are giving your opinion here are opinions from others. Why is your opinion more truthful than others.

King's and Queen's Chambers
A simple galvanic cell uses metallic native elements having varying electrical potentials (anodes and cathodes) that transfer electrons when placed apart in baths of their own salt solutions and interconnected by conductive metal wiring for the electron exchange (fig. 6).

In the Great Pyramid, the copper (Cu) anode gives up electrons to the gold (Au) cathode having an electrical potential roughly three times higher (fig. 6) . Copper wire was historically reported to have been found on the floor of the salt-encrusted Queen's chamber upon breeching. 2021 Giza Pyramids Science and Engineering

Ancient Egyptians closely observed the night sky for agricultural purposes, and the pyramids' relationship with the heavens during the Old Kingdom era suggests a deliberate correlation.

Various scientific studies have also explored the pyramid's ability to concentrate electromagnetic energy. Researchers have observed that radio waves within specific resonant lengths are concentrated within the pyramid's chambers and base. These findings support the idea that the pyramids may have functioned as power-generating machines.
The Pyramids: Unveiling Nikola Tesla's Bone-Chilling Revelation

Nummulitic limestone from the Abu Rawash area was analyzed by the National Research Center of Cairo. It was found its conductance improves at higher frequency - to the point where it is exceptional. If the conductivity of a material needs to be about 600 Tera Hz, in addition to structurally strong, there could not be better material than limestone.

The Great Pyramid is located at the geographical center of Earth, as noticed by Charles Smyth and reported in this book “Our Inheritance in the Great Pyramid” in 1864. The fact that the geographical center of Earth is at the location of the Great Pyramid is startling. Now, for a structure to emit high frequency radiation (which is really light), it must be surrounded by a large land mass.

The purpose of the King’s chamber was to collect all free electrons produced in the Queen’s chamber and push those toward the top of the pyramid. The granite beams in the King’s chamber are made of red granite, which has high crystal content when exposed to vibration and creates an electric field, pulling electrons from the Queens’ chamber toward the peak of the pyramid.
Has the Function of the Great Pyramid of Giza Finally Come to Light? | Ancient Origins

View attachment 373374​

Khafre’s pyramid contains intrusive tunnels created by tomb robbers but would show a far weaker electromagnetic field enhancement than Khufu’s because it lacks internal chambers and therefore dielectric discontinuities which cannot support internal standing-wave resonant modes.

I don't know. Do a paper on it. It may be each pyramid had a different function or Khufu’s pyramid was an upgrade.

If the ancient Egyptians were aware of the physics they would not have constructed Khafre’s pyramid with the internal chamber below the pyramid where enhancements would have been negligible.

Then write a paper on this. It seems you can make these claims as though they are fact. All I know is the more data we get the more we will understand. I don't think each pyramid was designed as a tomb and for the same purposes. But each is designed for a purpose beyond the tomb. Its silly to think a massive structure is just for a tomb. Or that one pharoah needs three tombs.

We know there are irrigation channels and even copper piping and shafts that had a purpose. The small shafts inside the Great pyramid are said to be tunnels for the pharoahs spirit to escape. The large Kiln in the Red pyramid is said to be a building error when it shows burn marks on stones and was used as part of some chemical process. The ammonia stench is said to be bat droppings when there are no bats. The evidence is building.

 

[Stopped_lurking]

Once again this fixation on words and their meaning as creating the entire meaning of what someone says. Look at the word in its context. I stated this testing supported further testing which was the onsite tests.

I agreed it was a similation and thats what the word 'test' was referring to. Please read the 'word' in the context of the sentence they are written in.

Ok so I will apply the same logic to your claim. You objection holds not weight as its just a popular comment on a social media thread. I would rather believe the popular scientfic write-up than someones personal opinion on a social media thread.

Popular scientific write-ups, are attempts to make the original article approachable to the general public, I can read the actual article why should I care about the popular version.

But it was not just the popular science article that was making these claims was it. It was the actual scientists. Scientists (not the article) concluded the Pyramid may have been a gigantic resonator that was designed to trap electromagnetic waves.

May have been...

I don't know, isnt that what the tests are for. The fact is they have found good theorectical reasons to do further tests. There have been a number of theorectical studies that tell us there is good reason.

So link the experimentally verified results when they are done then.

Even if the Egyptians did not purposely build the pyramids for generating any effects. Its still worth the investigation by the fact that effects are theorised by the modelling. They claim this can teach us something. Your actually contradicting science now by denying the idea of persuing further investigation when the theory supports it.

I'm perfectly fine with anybody doing experiments. What gave you the idea that I would find that troublesome? I want them to publish thier results in scientific journals.

But wait. Did not some of the tests happen on site in the pyramids.
Scientists blasted the 4,600-year-old structure with electromagnetic waves, a form of radiation that travel though the universe, finding it focused and amplified the energy into specific chambers and around the base.

It refers back to the same 2018 simulation study, this is why you shouldn't take scientific reporting from the Daily Mail.

But there was also actual tests done in the pyramids that show that it concentrated energy into the chambers. Its no longer theorectical.

Link that article then.

The made a couple of assumptions and all science does. They did not just assume limestone. They also accounted for the pink granite in the chambers and shafts.

Flat out wrong. In the simulation study about electromagnetic waves they didn't.

This stone has high piezoelectric effect under pressure. Its the position of the chambers, shafts and stones that generate the concentratede effect in the Kings chamber. The quartz crystals in pink granite is known for its high piezoelectric effect.

Don't mix up those who are talking about piezoelectric effects with the electromagnetic waves.

But its not just the stones. Its also the location of the pyramids themselves on a high electromagnetic location. Over a minreal rich natural subterrainian water way deposit. All this is not just some coincident and accident. The Egyptians were chemists and physicists as well in their own way.

Do you have an maps showing areas with "high electromagnetic"?

As the scientists who did the research said and not popular science "Ancient Egyptians were the original--albeit unknowing--nanotechnologists."

This is about the proposed plaster, why would you refer to it in this context about electromagnetic properties on the macroscale?

Not that particular research but other research has establish the influence of the location on potential advanced knowledge of nature.

Development of Sulfuric Acid Speleogenetic Deposits within Cavernous Middle Eocene Beds: Inference on Hydrocarbon Gas Seepages, Giza Pyramids Plateau, Egypt
https://www.researchgate.net/public...rbon_Gas_Seepages_Giza_Pyramids_Plateau_Egypt

Relevant how?

The Great Pyramid of Giza: A Modern View on Ancient Knowledge, Air and Fire – Part II
The Great Pyramid of Giza: A Modern View on Ancient Knowledge, Air and Fire – Part II | Ancient Origins

Link the journal article instead if you got it.

Why is it that skeptics are so eaher to minimise everything. They did way more than just test its shape. They were able tyo get new tech from it that can have real world effects.

Read the article. Antenna construction is interesting but there was nothing new learnt about it from that study, how do you think they have constructed the program calculating the effects on the electromagnetic field?

Its become a a tool to deny scientific ideas that don't conform to the orthodoxy in some cases. Some ideas don't even get through the front door. They are deemed unreal before peer review. Some non peer review science has shown peer review as wrong.

If that is true then it usually gets picked up sooner or later.

But you do so without the same standards you demand of those proposing alternative ideas. You demand of them peer review while claiming them wrong wroung without peer review. Its double standards.

No, your claim. You prove it.

First the high Piezoelectric effect in granite has already been verified. So its logical that a concentration of granite in the chambers is going to cause a higher Piezoelectric effect.

Higher than what? Limestone? Limestone was assumed in the of the radiowave calculation. They didn't use granite in their calculations.

From memory the shafts were also granite. Its whether they knew this and made it so to concentrate the effect in the chambers. .

Granite was not modeled in the calculations.

Experimental results of the piezoelectric activity of quartzose rocks

https://library.seg.org/doi/abs/10.1190/1.1892893?download=true

Yes, this known but it has zero to do with the pyramids.

Electromagnetic Properties of Pyramids from Positions of Photonics

Electromagnetic Properties of Pyramids from Positions of Photonics - Russian Physics Journal

The choice of the operating wavelength of electromagnetic radiation is justified for a pyramid considered as an antenna. It is shown that due to the strong dispersion of the refractive index of the pyramid material, there will always be a part of the spectral range, in which the refractive index...

link.springer.com

Now your mixing electromagnetic and piezoelectric again. This is just another simulation of the pyramids as antennas for electromagnetic waves. They also model the pyramid as a single monolith (they don't even use any chambers)

Electromagnetic properties of the Great Pyramid: First multipole resonances and energy concentration

https://pubs.aip.org/aip/jap/article-abstract/124/3/034903/156109/Electromagnetic-properties-of-the-Great-Pyramid?redirectedFrom=fulltext

Now your mixing electromagnetic and piezoelectric again. This is the same article we have been discussing for a couple of posts now.

Thats what all the articles on the Piezoelectric effects of the pyramids are trying to find out.

And the articles actually studied the piezoelectric properties of the pyramids? Who has actually measured the electric power generated by the pyramids?

Not sure if we are at the peer review stage yet. Still there is good science behind the idea.

The Overall Science behind the Pyramid
The generation of electricity requires the pyramid to vibrate always. Hence the location at which the electromagnetic waves are more on the surface of the globe are chosen to be the perfect sites for the pyramid. For example, the pyramid at Giza is standing on the underwater currents of the river Nile plus on a location where high electromagnetic flux lines can be measured and felt. This provides the vibrations required for the crystals to vibrate at all times. And Graphite rods are connected to the pyramid floors made of diamagnetic granites.[4] The figure below illustrates the ionic emission at the apex.

The Overall Science behind the Pyramid – IJERT

The Overall Science behind the Pyramid - written by K. S. Vishwanath Vashisht published on 2016/11/03 download full article with reference data and citations

www.ijert.org

There is no original research in this article, it is at best a speculative review.

Yes and when I show it its dismissed without the same level of peer review.

I'm critical about your claims. If you are critical about someone else's claims ask them for corroborating evidence.

Here we go with word meanings. So if I find a word that means 'assurity' rather than suggest then logically that would mean the findings are definite.

So when the article says 'Barsoum (the lead scientists) 'the outer casing stones were indeed consistent with a reconstituted limestone'. The the word 'indeed' means they definitely found that the casing stones were made of reconsituted limestone.

... were indeed consistent with with a reconstituted limestone.

What about "electron microscope analysis indicates the Egyptians used diatomaceous earth, a naturally occurring, commonly found soft sedimentary rock". Not (suggests) but definietly used diatomaceous earth in the mixture that was found in the samples of casing stones.

... indicates the Egyptians used...

So more tests need to be done rather than dismiss it as conspiracy or psuedoscience.

I just point out that the peer-reviewed articles don't support your claims (some times even your claims about the articles themselves, such as that the permittivity of anything but limestone was used in the calculations).

I don't know. I think you would need way more stones tested to gather enough data to determine this.

There was no (statistical) hypothesis testing. So they can't say how likely or unlikely the observed patterns were. Which makes your claim of near impossible nonsense.

Can you see the lip at the bottom as though the soft mixture spread into a gap between the blocks. This was not the result of grinding the block away to create a protruding lip. We see much evidence of this signature. I have linked them earlier. Why is it now you only recognise them.

What do you believe that I am recognizing? What are you talking about? Why can't that be remains of abrasive cut?

Yes an advanced cement that is revealing an advanced tech that we are recognising 4,500 years later. The advanced knowledge keeps getting pushed back earlier and earlier.

It is not even clear that the best explanation is reconstituted limestone yet.

Thats ok but like I said a social media platform is not a good place to make the case and especially make claims about existing peer review or even scientific reports or research that has been published. At least these make full article with the process linked out and tests done. I have not seen this yet and if I do then I will include it.

Because of the accumulation of data pointing that way. At the very least to do further investigation. You have to remember that these ideas and findings have only come in the past decade or so because the tech has improved. We are really only beginning to understand the level of knowledge and tech involved with the ancient Egyptians.

I'm perfectly fine with people investigating what ever interests them, but I want the rigour of the scientific process to be used and that includes peer-review.

It depends. As shown there are a few in mainstream journals. There are a fair few Russian journals lol. But there are a fair few good scientfific papers that are not yet peer reviewed. But as a total I don;t think there are many articles done full stop. I don't think many have even been submitted at all.

So why do you claim that they are unfairly refused then? If you don't have any data.

Its still seen as fringe so it has a long way to go before being accepted by the mainstream. I think perhaps the area of natural energies may lead to more research into the Egyptians ancient worls as is happening now. We have a long history of seeing the pyramids as being something more than just a tomb. Now we have the tech to find out. Watch this space I reckon.

Time will tell.