He’s a citizen with a Real ID. ICE detained him anyway. Twice.

[Belk]

Thanks for the info. I am Latino but I don’t look it so I feel for the more ethnic looking Latinos out there that are going to be harassed simply for their looks. That should be unconstitutional.

Oh look, a point of agreement.

 

[BCP1928]

It's part of our obedience training. We are under an authoritarian* government now and have to be trained for it.

*I use that word advisedly, realizing that for many it is an epithet for tyranny. In fact it is a technical term in social science for a society which is hierarchical and obedient to a single source of power. An dictatorial ruler is an authoritarian, but the peasant who likes to live in that kind of society is also properly called an authoritarian, Just what the Republicans want, along with limiting interference with the real source of power by a representative government. But first, the Republicans have to put the working class in their place, socially and economically.

 

[Hentenza]

It's part of our obedience training. We are under an authoritarian* government now and have to be trained for it.

*I use that word advisedly, realizing that for many it is an epithet for tyranny. In fact it is a technical term in social science for a society which is hierarchical and obedient to a single source of power. An dictatorial ruler is an authoritarian, but the peasant who like to live in that kind of society is also properly called an authoritarian, Just what the Republicans want, along with limiting interference with the real source of power by a representative government. But first, the Republicans have to put the working class in their place, socially and economically.

Or the left can continue going left toward classic socialism and start consolidating power so we can end up like Venezuela.

 

[BCP1928]

Or the left can continue going left toward classic socialism and start consolidating power so we can end up like Venezuela.

Yeah, that's what usually happens, sad to say. It happens in socialist economies and capitalist economies. Bernie thinks he has found a middle path between authoritarian socialism and authoritarian capitalism, and I wish him luck.

 

[wing2000]

Or the left can continue going left toward classic socialism and start consolidating power so we can end up like Venezuela.

...as often happens when the far Right abuses the rights of citizens. Cuba and Nicaragua for example...

 

[BNR32FAN]

What do you think? If a police officer detains you based on your appearance, would you be cool with that?

Yeah I’m perfectly fine with it because it speeds up the process and I have nothing to worry about. So why should I complicate things? You only make yourself look more guilty of a crime by resisting and being combative. And not only that by being a jerk to the officer the only thing you’re going to accomplish is making him angry which will result in him taking his sweet time in conducting his investigation. On the other hand being respectful and completely compliant actually has the opposite effect. The officer doesn’t want to arrest innocent people it’s a waste of his time. If he can get done with you quickly then he can continue his investigation somewhere else. But if the suspect is being uncooperative that only encourages the officer to respond in the same manner. It shouldn’t be surprising that if you treat someone disrespectfully that they might treat you disrespectfully in return. That should just be common sense.

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

Pathetic. I was reading somewhere that ICE can be sued but not sure. This case certainly deserves to try. I bet a bunch of others would join him.

On the news, the ICE beat up a man, that went to say hi to them. It was on video. ICE put him in the hospital. The family is suing.

 

[Hentenza]

...as often happens when the far Right abuses the rights of citizens. Cuba and Nicaragua for example...

Cuba was far left. Communism.

 

[Larniavc]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2025/11/10/ice-construction-worker-real-id-detained/

Garcia is Latino and works in construction. Twice since May, masked federal agents have gone onto private sites where he was working and detained him along with every other Latino worker — and only the Latino workers. Both times, officers ignored clear signs that they were intruding on private property without a warrant. Both times, Garcia told the officers that he was an American citizen and showed them his Real ID. Both times, the officers detained him anyway because, they said, they couldn’t be sure his Real ID was real.​

​

After video of the first arrest went viral, the Department of Homeland Security claimed that officers arrested Garcia for obstruction because he “physically got in between agents and the subject they were attempting to arrest and refused to comply with numerous verbal commands.” Garcia’s first-person video of the incident shows that is not true. He was about 25 feet away from where law enforcement was detaining someone when an officer tackled him without giving any verbal commands — let alone asking any questions. Garcia was kept in handcuffs for an hour after showing evidence of citizenship. Once officers confirmed he was a citizen, they released him. .......​

​

Garcia’s experience shows how these raids are unconstitutional. For starters, construction sites are closed to the public, often fenced off and posted with “No Trespassing” signs. When the government wants to investigate on private property, it needs to get permission or a warrant.​

​

And the right wonders why people complain about ICE. ICE has gone amok in the Trump administration. I believe Homan is making Stephen Miller's hateful dreams a reality.

To be fair brown skin is a lifestyle choice. He only has himself to blame.

 

[wing2000]

Yeah I’m perfectly fine with it because it speeds up the process and I have nothing to worry about. So why should I complicate things? You only make yourself look more guilty of a crime by resisting and being combative. And not only that by being a jerk to the officer the only thing you’re going to accomplish is making him angry which will result in him taking his sweet time in conducting his investigation. On the other hand being respectful and completely compliant actually has the opposite effect. The officer doesn’t want to arrest innocent people it’s a waste of his time. If he can get done with you quickly then he can continue his investigation somewhere else. But if the suspect is being uncooperative that only encourages the officer to respond in the same manner. It shouldn’t be surprising that if you treat someone disrespectfully that they might treat you disrespectfully in return. That should just be common sense.

For a police officer acting professionally, I agree. The ICE and Border Patrol officers have not been acting professionally. They are arresting and asking questions later. It's unaceeptable to have a US citizen detained for simply being at a work site.

 

[wing2000]

Cuba was far left. Communism.

It was far right first.....referring to the Batista regimes.

 

[Hentenza]

It was far right first.....referring to the Batista regimes.

That’s right but in this case it was the far left that inflicted the most damage after Batista.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Unfortunately that is not what is happening here. Not too many 6’2” caucasians being stopped for suspicion of being in the country illegally. But anyone that “looks” Latino or those that are speaking Spanish are fair game. Hardly a comparison.

In my subsequent post, I also mentioned the "proximity to criminal activity" aspect as well.

The example I used:
For instance, if there was a basement of a store being used for for illegal gambling and authorities got a tip about it and decided to raid it...

If I happen to be hanging out in that basement and watching but not actually playing or participating in the gambling, I would assume I'd be getting detained temporarily and asked a few questions.


The types of "visual profiling" they're doing doesn't stray as far from typical law enforcement procedure, it's just that this particular type of infraction (being in the country illegally) happens to be more concentrated and common among people who fit the description of Latino and/or Spanish speaking.


For example:

"We know there's an issue with bikers assaulting people and selling speed out front of a particular bar"

Cops roll up to the scene and see this guy:

And they also see this guy:

Are we going to act all shocked as to why they opt to want to have some words with the latter, but don't pay much attention to the former?


But even if wanted to only focus on instances where demographics play a factor.

If you knew there was crime occurring that was heavily associated Italian mob, and you had to select a group of people to detain and question... you going to pursue the Black guys hanging out front at an urban night club? Or are you perhaps going to want to have some words with the people who clearly look Italian hanging out front at "Vincenzo's ristorante" that's been a known hang-out for mob associates for the last 10 years?

 

[iluvatar5150]

Or the left can continue going left toward classic socialism and start consolidating power so we can end up like Venezuela.

Are you worried about consolidation of power in general or just when the left does it?

 

[BNR32FAN]

For a police officer acting professionally, I agree. The ICE and Border Patrol officers have not been acting professionally. They are arresting and asking questions later. It's unaceeptable to have a US citizen detained for simply being at a work site.

I dunno, so far I haven’t seen a video where they arrested an innocent person who was cooperating.

 

[Hentenza]

In my subsequent post, I also mentioned the "proximity to criminal activity" aspect as well.

The example I used:
For instance, if there was a basement of a store being used for for illegal gambling and authorities got a tip about it and decided to raid it...

If I happen to be hanging out in that basement and watching but not actually playing or participating in the gambling, I would assume I'd be getting detained temporarily and asked a few questions.


The types of "visual profiling" they're doing doesn't stray as far from typical law enforcement procedure, it's just that this particular type of infraction (being in the country illegally) happens to be more concentrated and common among people who fit the description of Latino and/or Spanish speaking.


For example:

"We know there's an issue with bikers assaulting people and selling speed out front of a particular bar"

Cops roll up to the scene and see this guy:
View attachment 373047

And they also see this guy:
View attachment 373046

Are we going to act all shocked as to why they opt to want to have some words with the latter, but don't pay much attention to the former?


But even if wanted to only focus on instances where demographics play a factor.

If you knew there was crime occurring that was heavily associated Italian mob, and you had to select a group of people to detain and question... you going to pursue the Black guys hanging out front at an urban night club? Or are you perhaps going to want to have some words with the people who clearly look Italian hanging out front at "Vincenzo's ristorante" that's been a known hang-out for mob associates for the last 10 years?

Even in situations as you describe, if it is ICE raiding the illegal gambling business, they are going to hone on Latinos and ignore caucasians. Secondly, in the example shown in the OP the guy showed them his real ID and they still held him for an hour. In Texas, in order to get a real ID you have to prove either citizenship or bring a legal immigrant. ICE should known this and just let him go right away. I have no problem with ICE asking nicely and legally but unfortunately that is not what is happening.

The bedrock of our judicial system is fairness and due process. The 4th amendment clearly defends against unreasonable search and seizure so ICE should have a probable cause to stop someone. I remember when the same argument applied against middle easterners after 911. The constitution is important.

 

[BNR32FAN]

For a police officer acting professionally, I agree. The ICE and Border Patrol officers have not been acting professionally. They are arresting and asking questions later. It's unaceeptable to have a US citizen detained for simply being at a work site.

I can’t imagine why that out of the tens of thousands of encounters that they’ve have with citizens there are only a handful of videos claiming that they’re overstepping their authority. So far I’ve only seen 3 videos and in all 3 of them the people were not being cooperative.

 

[Hentenza]

Are you worried about consolidation of power in general or just when the left does it?

I have experience when the left does it because my family had to flee Cuba. However, in danger of citing Godwin law, it can be just as bad when the far right does it. I’m against both extremes.

 

[Hans Blaster]

In my subsequent post, I also mentioned the "proximity to criminal activity" aspect as well.

Where does "proximity to criminal activity" come into effect here? The subject of the OP is a construction site. It is not

The example I used:
For instance, if there was a basement of a store being used for for illegal gambling and authorities got a tip about it and decided to raid it...

[more on raid below]

If I happen to be hanging out in that basement and watching but not actually playing or participating in the gambling, I would assume I'd be getting detained temporarily and asked a few questions.


The types of "visual profiling" they're doing doesn't stray as far from typical law enforcement procedure, it's just that this particular type of infraction (being in the country illegally) happens to be more concentrated and common among people who fit the description of Latino and/or Spanish speaking.


For example:

or:

"We know there's an issue with bikers assaulting people and selling speed out front of a particular bar"

[more on this below]

Cops roll up to the scene and see this guy:
View attachment 373047

And they also see this guy:
View attachment 373046

Are we going to act all shocked as to why they opt to want to have some words with the latter, but don't pay much attention to the former?

This is what is known as a Kavanaugh stop in legal parlance. Detaining someone for their appearance.

But even if wanted to only focus on instances where demographics play a factor.

If you knew there was crime occurring that was heavily associated Italian mob, and you had to select a group of people to detain and question... you going to pursue the Black guys hanging out front at an urban night club? Or are you perhaps going to want to have some words with the people who clearly look Italian hanging out front at "Vincenzo's ristorante" that's been a known hang-out for mob associates for the last 10 years?

[more on these below].

The problem with your examples, is that to raid the suspected gambling den, THEY NEED A WARRANT.

If they see people outside a biker bar committing crimes in plain sight, then it doesn't matter if they guy looks like you or some biker gang member. The plain sight commission of crime (selling meth to customers or committing assault) is the probable cause for arrest, not the appearance.

Hanging outside an establishment known for criminal activity by people of your ethnic group is not probable cause for search or arrest.

The case in the OP is about a closed construction site. It doesn't matter what the immigration agents *think* is going on. If they want to enter private property and detain people for working here they NEED A WARRANT issued by a judge with evidence of the violation to support the warrant application.

 

[calicocat]

I heard that "looking Mexican" or similar is actually acceptable probable cause for apprehension in this regime.

Is that so?

They're allowed to racially-profile...

"In September, the supreme court’s conservative majority sided against Los Angeles area plaintiffs who said “roving” immigration patrols were violating their fourth amendment rights by stopping people on the basis of race, language, employment or location. Critics say the ruling effectively “legalized racial profiling”." - The Guardian US citizens on the threat of being racially profiled by ICE: ‘I carry my passport card at all times’