Jordan says ICE agents ‘doing the Lord’s work’

[Hans Blaster]

As guest workers, they would go home and not be low wage nor hard labor among their own culture.

Do you support wide-spread guest worker programs?

 

[Say it aint so]

The obvious solution is farmers deal with economic realities that they voted to deal with by having their cheap illegal easily exploited labor deported.

As I heard one farmer say, "want to stop illegals? then stop eating"

 

[Desk trauma]

As I heard one farmer say, "want to stop illegals? then stop eating"

Sounds like something someone profiting from their labor would say.

 

[Say it aint so]

Sounds like something someone profiting from their labor would say.

Last time I checked labor cost is, well, a cost.
What it does sound like is a farmer who has tried to get Americans to do the work, but can't.

 

[Desk trauma]

Last time I check labor cost is, well, a cost.
What it does sound like is a farmer who has tried to get Americans to do the work, but can't.

Can’t for the pay offered, don’t leave that part out. But I know, farmers are special and get to ignore the law if they can’t legally get workers for what they’re wanting to pay them.

 

[Desk trauma]

Do you support wide-spread guest worker programs?

Not who you were replying to but anyhow, no I don’t. They are just legal means of avoiding labor costs and having more control over your laborers. It’s not in our national interest to replace domestic work forces with cheaper imported labor, it only serves those who profit from it.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Not who you were replying to but anyhow, no I don’t.

It was for our confused purple circle friend.

They are just legal means of avoiding labor costs and having more control over your laborers. It’s not in our national interest to replace domestic work forces with cheaper imported labor, it only serves those who profit from it.

I used to work summers with migrant/guest laborers. They were paid the same wage I was for the same work.

 

[Valletta]

I respectfully disagree with your definition of conservatism. As a conservative, I have supported leaders such as Ronald Reagan, H. Bush, W. Bush, M Romney, Paul Ryan, among others; their policies reflected the principles of conservatism.

However, I understand that since 2015, the meaning of conservatism has shifted notably from the policies of the past fifty years. Today, conservatism is often associated with apprehending farm workers harvesting tomatoes and avocados, or detaining day laborers at home improvement stores. This policies do not reflect the conservatism that characterized American ideals over the last five decades.

You are correct about President Trump was transparent about his intentions if elected. He openly stated his plan to deport millions of individuals who pick tomatoes or avocado in farms or work in meat factory or clean bathrooms in motel room. Despite this, 78 million Americans voted for him, fully aware of these policies. In his capacity as president, he has implemented actions to apprehend women and children at their homes, separate families based on citizenship status, and expedite deportations—consistent with the commitments made during his campaign. It shows that promises were made and fulfilled. However, this does not necessarily indicate conservatism.

Here is a brief historical perspective: a single election result does not constitute blanket approval of all policies. If today's Republicans believe they have received a mandate from the American people to pursue the policies they campaigned on, they are entitled to do so. However, after 13 months, during the midterm elections, they will learn what the American public truly thinks about those policies. They may take this period to celebrate and assert that they are implementing the policies Americans voted for, but any necessary corrections will occur following the midterm election.

The best definition I know of conservatism is common sense. So too conservatives are for a limited or smaller government. I've never heard about conservatism shifting around 2015. To me immigration is not a liberal or conservative issue at all. But during the Biden administration border laws were blatantly violated and the people were lied to, be told the border was safe, secure, and closed while we as a country were inundated with numbers of border crossings in numbers beyond imagination. The scheme appeared to be fueled by a quest to establish essentially one party control. Whole towns were decimated and human trafficking rose to a level not seen since the Civil War. Despite a campaign that outspent Trump by more than 2 to 1 people could see for themselves that the border was not closed or safe or secure, so much so that many who personally did not like Trump as a person voted for him. Because of the great numbers of people overwhelming our nation, and because so many were unvetted, the common-sense choice was to secure the border and remove those here illegally. They are welcome to try for American citizenship from outside of the country.

 

[Lukaris]

But surely you must concur that federal cutbacks that exacerbate income inequality, educational deficits, mental health challenges, etc. have an impact on crime.

I agree with this in a basic logical sense. How this is unfolding from bad governance and social decay aside from funding issues is hard to determine.

 

[Lukaris]

DP

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

The best definition I know of conservatism is common sense. So too conservatives are for a limited or smaller government. I've never heard about conservatism shifting around 2015. To me immigration is not a liberal or conservative issue at all. But during the Biden administration border laws were blatantly violated and the people were lied to, be told the border was safe, secure, and closed while we as a country were inundated with numbers of border crossings in numbers beyond imagination. The scheme appeared to be fueled by a quest to establish essentially one party control. Whole towns were decimated and human trafficking rose to a level not seen since the Civil War. Despite a campaign that outspent Trump by more than 2 to 1 people could see for themselves that the border was not closed or safe or secure, so much so that many who personally did not like Trump as a person voted for him. Because of the great numbers of people overwhelming our nation, and because so many were unvetted, the common-sense choice was to secure the border and remove those here illegally. They are welcome to try for American citizenship from outside of the country.

You think conservatism is just common sense, and liberals don't have it? How unfortunate to think this way.

Unfortunately, this is the perception that contributes to polarization in America today. Each side believes it possesses all the common sense and facts, while considering the other side delusional. Progress will be limited until we acknowledge that both liberals and conservatives possess common sense, and that each ideology aims to improve America and the world.

The remainder of your comments regarding border security are not accurate. It is true that during the Biden administration, more undocumented immigrants have crossed the southern border compared to his predecessor. However, attributing sole responsibility to President Biden lacks factual basis and does not adequately consider the complexity of the issue.

For over six decades, the United States has faced challenges related to migration from the south and individuals overstaying their legal status. This was a significant factor leading President Reagan to grant amnesty to nearly three million undocumented immigrants. Subsequent administrations, including those of Presidents Bush, and Obama, pursued comprehensive immigration reforms to address the ongoing issue.

Nearly 2 million undocumented immigrants crossed the US southern border during President Trump’s first term.

Your post suggests this issue only emerged during the last four years under the Biden administration, as if it hasn’t happened before in American history.

One principle of conservatism is accurately assessing facts. It is important to begin with factual understanding before making claims about common sense.

 

[Say it aint so]

Can’t for the pay offered, don’t leave that part out. But I know, farmers are special and get to ignore the law if they can’t legally get workers for what they’re wanting to pay them.

It's not the pay, it's the type of work. Again, Americans just don't have the history of doing that kind of work.

 

[Desk trauma]

It's not the pay, it's the type of work.

Again, if a type of labor is unattractive you have to pay a premium to get people to do it.

Again, Americans just don't have the history of doing that kind of work.

Guess those white share croppers and dairy farmers I’m descended from weren’t real Americans?

 

[Say it aint so]

Guess those white share croppers and dairy farmers I’m descended from weren’t real Americans?

Vast majority were NOT Americans.

Timeline of Agricultural Labor in the U.S.​

 

[Desk trauma]

Vast majority were NOT Americans.

Timeline of Agricultural Labor in the U.S.​

Ok then. Not real Americans.

 

[ralliann]

If you have a pathway of citizen for them, then presto-chango, they are not illegal. I don't know about "slave class" specially if that pathway comes with worker protections to keep at bay rules like Texas who wanted to legally limit water breaks.

Foreign workers at these jobs,. If they become citizens they won't have to. Simple.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Vast majority were NOT Americans.

Timeline of Agricultural Labor in the U.S.​

What an odd and randomly narrow site. While claiming to be about agricultural laobr in the US it says nothing about anything going on in the northern plains, midwest, or northeast.

 

[ralliann]

You think conservatism is just common sense, and liberals don't have it? How unfortunate to think this way.

Unfortunately, this is the perception that contributes to polarization in America today. Each side believes it possesses all the common sense and facts, while considering the other side delusional. Progress will be limited until we acknowledge that both liberals and conservatives possess common sense, and that each ideology aims to improve America and the world.

The remainder of your comments regarding border security are not accurate. It is true that during the Biden administration, more undocumented immigrants have crossed the southern border compared to his predecessor. However, attributing sole responsibility to President Biden lacks factual basis and does not adequately consider the complexity of the issue.

For over six decades, the United States has faced challenges related to migration from the south and individuals overstaying their legal status. This was a significant factor leading President Reagan to grant amnesty to nearly three million undocumented immigrants. Subsequent administrations, including those of Presidents Bush, and Obama, pursued comprehensive immigration reforms to address the ongoing issue.

Nearly 2 million undocumented immigrants crossed the US southern border during President Trump’s first term.

Your post suggests this issue only emerged during the last four years under the Biden administration, as if it hasn’t happened before in American history.

One principle of conservatism is accurately assessing facts. It is important to begin with factual understanding before making claims about common sense.

Forcing transgender on our children is more than divisive, it is control over our lives. For sure liberals are in fact divisive and control freaks.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Forcing transgender on our children is more than divisive, it is control over our lives. For sure liberals are in fact divisive and control freaks.

No one is "forcing" children to be transgender.

 

[Valletta]

No one is "forcing" children to be transgender.

"Encouraging" is perhaps a better word.