The Brokenness of Christianity

[Delvianna]

The term "Christian" means to be a follower of Christ. That in turn, means to be a student of his teachings and walk those teachings out in your every day life. In this day and age though, there are over 45,000 different denominations world wide with 6 main branches. We are just way too fragmented... To give that point on how inconsistent we are, here is an article that discusses a research poll on percentages of just the core main points of Christianity and what people believe.
-Article-
Here is an example:

• 64% believe that “Everyone is born innocent in the eyes of God.”
• 53% agree that “Everyone sins a little, but most people are good by nature.”
• 53% think that “The Holy Spirit is a force but is not a personal being”—compare this with the fact that 98% agreed with the statement: “There is one true God in three persons: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.” Talk about inconsistent!
• 47% agree that “God accepts the worship of all religions, including Christianity, Judaism, and Islam.”
• 28% say that “Jesus was a great teacher, but he was not God.”
• 17% believe that “The Bible, like all sacred writings, contains helpful accounts of ancient myths but is not literally true.”
• 19% affirm that “Modern science disproves the Bible.”
• 16% likewise say that “The Bible’s condemnation of homosexual behavior doesn’t apply today.”
• 28% think that “Religious belief is not about objective truth”—and another 19% aren’t sure how to answer this question.

But read the rest in order to see just how disjointed it really is.

We.... are a mess.... How can we spread the gospel when we can't even agree on the basics!?

 

[ChubbyCherub]

As soon as we split our following of Christ into 'denominations' we were set onto a path of chaos.

 

[JustaPewFiller]

I do see your point.

I admit that I have sometimes felt like if a person is a Christian then regardless of which denomination they are, or if they are non-denominational, or what interpretations of Scripture they believe, or how they pray, or their theology, or the worship music they like, or how they dress or how they conduct themselves...... there is always some other Christian that is more than happy to tell them they are doing it all wrong.

To use an example, among the Baptists (of which I am one) I was honestly surprised to see just how much arguing, backbiting, condescending snide remarks etc there were between different flavors of Baptists and sometimes within the same flavor.

However, I honestly don't see much the way of agreement likely to happen between the various denominations.

 

[Delvianna]

I do see your point.

I admit that I have sometimes felt like if a person is a Christian then regardless of which denomination they are, or if they are non-denominational, or what interpretations of Scripture they believe, or how they pray, or their theology, or the worship music they like, or how they dress or how they conduct themselves...... there is always some other Christian that is more than happy to tell them they are doing it all wrong.

To use an example, among the Baptists (of which I am one) I was honestly surprised to see just how much arguing, backbiting, condescending snide remarks etc there were between different flavors of Baptists and sometimes within the same flavor.

However, I honestly don't see much the way of agreement likely to happen between the various denominations.

I think we might make strides if we actually came to the table and sorted stuff out. Instead, people are quite happy sitting in their denominational echo chamber and everyone says the same thing, "we have scripture right, everyone else is wrong". Personally, I think every single denomination is wrong to some extent but we are only getting more fragmented because people are uncomfortable with admitting they're wrong on something. I mean, 45,000 denominations?! No wonder the bible talks about the church diverting from the truth before the trib starts.

 

[JustaPewFiller]

I think we might make strides if we actually came to the table and sorted stuff out. Instead, people are quite happy sitting in their denominational echo chamber and everyone says the same thing, "we have scripture right, everyone else is wrong". Personally, I think every single denomination is wrong to some extent but we are only getting more fragmented because people are uncomfortable with admitting they're wrong on something. I mean, 45,000 denominations?! No wonder the bible talks about the church diverting from the truth before the trib starts.

To add another wrinkle, you also have to contend with the human emotions around territory, control, power, fear, jealousy, etc.

I'm not sure I'm saying the above in the best manner. Let me give an example. Church A and Church B may be of the same denomination and have very few differences. However, they will likely be hesitant to work together on a project where members of their congregations mingle with those from the other church. Typically this is because they don't want to risk losing people to the other church.

To use a very worldly example. In my part of the US there are 2 major big box home improvement stores. They are Lowes and Home Depot. They have different color schemes in the stores but they are virtually identical in the goods they offer and the prices they offer them at and the services they provide. But, you would never ever hear Home Depot tell a customer they might as well go to Lowes because there really isn't much difference between them. I hate to say it, but sometimes churches can fall into this same pattern.

 

[Yarddog]

The term "Christian" means to be a follower of Christ. That in turn, means to be a student of his teachings and walk those teachings out in your every day life. In this day and age though, there are over 45,000 different denominations world wide with 6 main branches. We are just way too fragmented... To give that point on how inconsistent we are, here is an article that discusses a research poll on percentages of just the core main points of Christianity and what people believe.
-Article-
Here is an example:

• 64% believe that “Everyone is born innocent in the eyes of God.”
• 53% agree that “Everyone sins a little, but most people are good by nature.”
• 53% think that “The Holy Spirit is a force but is not a personal being”—compare this with the fact that 98% agreed with the statement: “There is one true God in three persons: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.” Talk about inconsistent!
• 47% agree that “God accepts the worship of all religions, including Christianity, Judaism, and Islam.”
• 28% say that “Jesus was a great teacher, but he was not God.”
• 17% believe that “The Bible, like all sacred writings, contains helpful accounts of ancient myths but is not literally true.”
• 19% affirm that “Modern science disproves the Bible.”
• 16% likewise say that “The Bible’s condemnation of homosexual behavior doesn’t apply today.”
• 28% think that “Religious belief is not about objective truth”—and another 19% aren’t sure how to answer this question.

But read the rest in order to see just how disjointed it really is.

We.... are a mess.... How can we spread the gospel when we can't even agree on the basics!?

I had a vision while in Mass and God pointed out another person and said " This person cannot be One with God" and pointing out another person said, "and this person cannot be One with God, without you each being One with each other."

If we agreed with each other wasn't the important issue. It's if God accepts each of us a his child, through possession of the Holy Spirit, that Spirit also makes us One with each other, even if we did not accept it.

God gives his children a Spirit of love which makes us One. If we would stop worrying about our disagreements and focus on what we agree on, that would help bring us together.

 

[tdidymas]

I think we might make strides if we actually came to the table and sorted stuff out. Instead, people are quite happy sitting in their denominational echo chamber and everyone says the same thing, "we have scripture right, everyone else is wrong". Personally, I think every single denomination is wrong to some extent but we are only getting more fragmented because people are uncomfortable with admitting they're wrong on something. I mean, 45,000 denominations?! No wonder the bible talks about the church diverting from the truth before the trib starts.

It is said among Jews: if you put 10 Jews in a room to discuss an issue, there will be 15 different opinions. This, of course, is a joke, indicating that Jews have generally accepted the fact that everyone has their own opinion about things, having different perspectives. It doesn't make any of them right or wrong.

And even if Christians accept the same attitudes about themselves, it doesn't mean we have to say that someone else's opinion is right, just to try to position ourselves in unity. One of the problems with separating into different denominations has to do with the pride or fear of people not willing to say, "I could be wrong about my opinion." Many times when people have conflicts of opinion, they fear that if they are wrong, then maybe they're wrong also about what they believe, and if they're wrong with that, then they might be going to hell. This kind of fear is included in "the fear of death" in Heb. 2:15. It's a very complex fear that only faith in Christ can deliver from, since it has many factors involved.

Since most Christians, and even Christian leaders, are "sheep," with limited knowledge, the tendency to cultism is a real danger. This is why many of us talk about "majoring on the majors and minoring on the minors," and try to come up with "essential doctrines" of the faith. Just because some respected leader says something provocative to get people to think, doesn't mean we have to accept it as absolute truth. The problem is that most people are like sponges of knowledge - once they hear something, it becomes tradition, and to hell with anyone who disagrees.

 

[d taylor]

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That is because Christianity is full of followers of the Christianity they have created and not believers of the promises that God has given.

I would not crawl out of bed to hear what 95% of what, these churches are teaching.

 

[ChubbyCherub]

I think we might make strides if we actually came to the table and sorted stuff out. Instead, people are quite happy sitting in their denominational echo chamber and everyone says the same thing, "we have scripture right, everyone else is wrong". Personally, I think every single denomination is wrong to some extent but we are only getting more fragmented because people are uncomfortable with admitting they're wrong on something. I mean, 45,000 denominations?! No wonder the bible talks about the church diverting from the truth before the trib starts.

I have read in the Bible that Jewish elders argued amongst themselves regarding the commandments, meaning of the scriptures, rituals and so forth. This is why some Jewish people accepted Jesus Christ as the Messiah and others didn't and don't to this day.

The denominations just formalized disunity and discord for the masses.

I guess we're not unique in having division. It would, however, be nice to acknowledge it and seek to minimize it but there is no one that can be trusted to lead this movement. Communities would be a great start but we're all very insular.

 

[Jerry N.]

Two Jewish scholars were having a very heated argument. They were actually very aggressive. Then one said that it was time to say the Shema. They stopped the argument and respectfully recited the Shema together. Unity among Christians comes with common focus on the task at hand. If Christians are feeding the poor, helping the sick, and living the gospel, the differences in doctrines are put in their proper place. Discussing doctrine can be good, but unity is in doing the work of the body of Christ.

 

[seeking.IAM]

We.... are a mess.... How can we spread the gospel when we can't even agree on the basics!?

Can we even agree those are the basics?

 

[Delvianna]

Can we even agree those are the basics?

Lol good point

 

[seeking.IAM]

Can we even agree those are the basics?

Lol good point

I only read the OP, not the entire article, but I only see one thing in those poll results that I consider "basic":

• 28% say that “Jesus was a great teacher, but he was not God.”

I have always liked what C.S. Lewis said on the subject. "A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic—on a level with the man who says he is a poached egg—or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You can shut Him up for a fool, you can spit at Him and kill Him as a demon; or you can fall at His feet and call Him Lord and God. But let us not come with any patronising nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to." Mere Christianity​

I do not see any of the others as essential for salvation. They are beliefs, any of which might be proven or disproven, when we meet God. I think we are all doing our best with partial or incomplete understanding. I suspect in the end, all of us will learn we were wrong about something.

It's like the old joke about tip toeing quietly past a certain room in heaven lest its occupants figure out they are not the only ones who made it there.

 

[Delvianna]

I suspect in the end, all of us will learn we were wrong about something.

100% agree with this and that's been my stance in the last few years. I do not think there is a single denomination out there that is 100% accurate. This is why I've categorized myself as non-denominational because I want to just read the scriptures and talk about whats in it and not stick myself into a box. I end up agreeing to various topics from various different denominations and hell, I even agree with Jehovah's Witnesses on certain points even though a lot of people don't accept them as "Christian". My stance is, does the bible back it up? Then that's where I'm at and I'm not worried if the Baptists agree with me or if it aligns with the Presbyterian doctrine.