Christians - May I have your attention for a moment?

[Carl Emerson]

Understood - and for the record we are following events in the US very closely and I chocked up with you all at the shooting. FYI my wife has been following Charlie closely for several months. The world is small - we fight the same battles together.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Not necessarily. If you feel a pressing in your spirit to do something you should heed it. But don’t get upset if others don’t share your fervor. There’s a time and season for all things. We’re in the middle of a catastrophe and the country is imploding. We have a lot of extremists in our midst. Don’t be surprised if we aren’t rushing to live together or share our resources.

And just because they’re believers doesn’t mean they’re safe. Christians are making some wild statements on the internet. Calling Obama the antichrist, predicting Trump’s death, making heinous remarks against political figures and leaders and so on. I’ve even seen people laughing about Gaza too and justifying the deaths. That passes my line in the sand.

I answered your question on the other thread and I think it’s more engaging.

~bella

Thanks Bella...

Which other thread?

 

[bèlla]

Thanks Bella...

Which other thread?

Living our Christian Faith Together.

In my first essay I spoke about returning to unity-based fellowship as a stepping stone to rediscovering the power of Jesus. Today I have another issue for us to consider, the neglect of community in our modern Christian lives. In the last seven decades I have seen the erosion of community in...

www.christianforums.com

 

[Hentenza]

Thanks for bringing this up Carl. The condition of the many denominations out there today play a central role on how the world sees Christianity. The early church, although, united is still had its divisions and problems as evidenced by the epistles. However, they were united in receiving the stranger and taking care of widows and the poor.

Today, most churches still do fairly well taking care of widows and the poor but as far as welcoming the stranger, some do much better than others. A revival to the Lord requires that we, as Christians, allow for God to work in the hearts of the stranger using us as the tool preaching the gospel. The churches have to be welcoming places where the work of the Lord is evident and clear. We need to welcome this new people without prejudice or hindrance, teach them, and mature them in the faith so that the problems off this world do not snatch them away.

All Trinitarian Christian churches preach the same God, the same Jesus, and the same after life Heaven so why is there so much argument among the churches about which one is the one true church? Why do we speak ill of other churches simply because we don’t conform exactly o the other ones secondary beliefs?

The fact is that all of us worship the same God and will go to the same heaven? Do you all think Jesus is going to care what church did the anyone belonged to? Why can’t we unite and become that light on the hill that shines love and spreads the gospel? Does Christianity have a chance?

 

[com7fy8]

It is not about signs, it is about Love and where there is Love He reigns and He confirms His Word with signs.

But Paul does not mention signs, when he describes who is qualified to be "a bishop" > 1 Timothy 3:1-10.

I see how this means a mature Christian person who can be an example to the flock >

"nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock." (1 Peter 5:3)

But there are churches who do not have mature example leaders like this.

 

[bèlla]

Today, most churches still do fairly well taking care of widows and the poor but as far as welcoming the stranger, some do much better than others.

The migrant issue has set this back irreparably. I don’t think you’ll see that spirit for many generations. The more immigration we have the less likely you’ll have unity. But that’s just the tipping point. We’re moving in the direction of increasing separatism and acceptance of narrower connections. Some will form along racial lines, financial or religious and it’s already underway. Europe is up in arms and we’re not better off.

Why can’t we unite and become that light on the hill that shines love and spreads the gospel? Does Christianity have a chance?

You can make things work when the common denominators overshadow the places you disagree. But we are less alike than ever. Name a subject and you’ll get an argument pretty fast. The divide is evident and I don’t know if it can be repaired. The internet has allowed people to stop fighting for that and seek the company of likeminded people. They don’t have to wrestle with differences anymore or tolerate them either. You can form your own community and ignore the rest.

And that happens all the time in this space. We have the technology to talk, meet and exchange ideas and the world would never know. I see more of that in the future than otherwise. The arguments run their course and after a while you just want peace.

So where does that leave christians?

~bella

 

[Godcrazy]

Back in the late 70's I showed the video "Viva Christo Rey" about the breakout of revival among the poor in Mexico. Those who heard and saw what God was doing were strongly convicted and on occasion the audience was silent for many minutes in response to what they were seeing.

I guess we are light years away from such encounters with God's Love these days - we have focused on 'Church Growth' and less on transforming encounter with God, community, and taking His life to the poor.

I agree with you, and many well known pastors that had good results and the power from God always said or saying that we have to preach repentance, about sin, that without that there is no repentance and without that there is no fire from God. That it leaves the void. I am not saying anything else does not have its place, but I do believe this must take up a large part. How else are people going to be saved and changed/born again? It is not just enough "just say this little prayer with me" and they have no knowledge about the rest,and what it takes. same as real prayer meetings, not just ten minutes. A longer prayer time, over 30 minutes. As i experienced when I recieved the power from God He was working through me when I prayed and put hands on people, and they got healed ,people that were doomed to pain and wheelchairs, and demons in nursing homes and friends that had toyed with stuff they should not calling me speaking backwards in tounges and He set them free, the power came when I tried to live a holy life. I am saying, trying to do what was right, not sin free as we can never be as well I have always prayed for sins of mine before anything. This made all the difference. He came. I recall how pastor ministry John Ramirez, that was within devil worshipper and turned to Jesus he said he used to take out christians especially, no matter denomination as well as everyone else, but especially christians. He said the only ones he could not touch was the ones that lived a holy life, and had a relationship with Jesus. They had a fire around them and mighty tall angels flaming with flaming swords. He could not even go near. Those who did not live a holy life and no relationship with Jesus they were easy to take out. This is what He said. I am not saying this to raise fear or create anything but because what he is saying is important. But I have seen it with my own eyes, and the moment I went down again and did not care of sins or got lax. Not the same power. And yes it is easy. so easy to do. I constantly beat myself in front of God for everything. But this makes it even more important to talk about sin and repentance in church more. and more prayer time. if we are going to win.

 

[Godcrazy]

The migrant issue has set this back irreparably. I don’t think you’ll see that spirit for many generations. The more immigration we have the less likely you’ll have unity. But that’s just the tipping point. We’re moving in the direction of increasing separatism and acceptance of narrower connections. Some will form along racial lines, financial or religious and it’s already underway. Europe is up in arms and we’re not better off.



You can make things work when the common denominators overshadow the places you disagree. But we are less alike than ever. Name a subject and you’ll get an argument pretty fast. The divide is evident and I don’t know if it can be repaired. The internet has allowed people to stop fighting for that and seek the company of likeminded people. They don’t have to wrestle with differences anymore or tolerate them either. You can form your own community and ignore the rest.

And that happens all the time in this space. We have the technology to talk, meet and exchange ideas and the world would never know. I see more of that in the future than otherwise. The arguments run their course and after a while you just want peace.

So where does that leave christians?

~bella

It leaves us with a giant task that would be something for true christians to try to help with. If there is anyone that is us that could create something that unite and that focus on how human we all are. In a time like this I think that is needed more than ever as well as good leaders standing up for what is right and let people have a dialogue, but not to exclude or condemn. we are much needed in a time like this. Think about how Jesus had people come together. I know we have a lot of problems. But I have been thinking about this, for the church, especially after the sorrowful things that happened to the Kirk family.

 

[Godcrazy]

Not necessarily. If you feel a pressing in your spirit to do something you should heed it. But don’t get upset if others don’t share your fervor. There’s a time and season for all things. We’re in the middle of a catastrophe and the country is imploding. We have a lot of extremists in our midst. Don’t be surprised if we aren’t rushing to live together or share our resources.

And just because they’re believers doesn’t mean they’re safe. Christians are making some wild statements on the internet. Calling Obama the antichrist, predicting Trump’s death, making heinous remarks against political figures and leaders and so on. I’ve even seen people laughing about Gaza too and justifying the deaths. That passes my line in the sand.

I answered your question on the other thread and I think it’s more engaging.

~bella

we have to focus on love and uniting instead even if we don`t agree with people, or think that someone display the traits of you know who, even then, as a living breathing human being every being have a right to live in peace.

 

[david p]

​

May I have your attention for a moment? I write as a lay person with a deep concern for Christianity in the modern world.
I am inviting comment and reflection, maybe some will share my passion, some may disagree. However, let us review how we practically live out our Christianity in this age.
Where do I begin? Back in the mid 70’s I made a very conscious decision to refer to the Christian scripture as the last word on matters of faith and reality. I had experienced a prodigal’s return and building on my Christian roots was crucial to the journey back to normality.
It became clear to me early on, that pride in its various forms was a very basic trap, so I resolved to keep matters simple. It was clear to me that our God does not judge on the basis of intelligence therefore the truth had to be simple and understandable.
If the bible was indeed God’s roadmap for life then its understanding was not confined to the scholars, but rather the keys for understanding were available to all.

From my learning about Church history I found that repeatedly, when God impacted a whole society and there was wholesale repentance, everywhere bibles were being dusted off, as everyone intuitively knew that when things got serious with God, the bible was the place to look for understanding.
And so it is today, we are in need of a fresh visitation; our society is progressively and rapidly rejecting Christian values and truths.

But it is us I would like to talk about. Brothers and Sisters in Christ, how does our mode of living compare to the simple teachings of the scripture?
There is general agreement that wherever Jesus reigns the Kingdom of God is present.
God in Jesus was quite specific about how we should recognise this. He sent word to John, in order that these would be no doubt, “the blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cured, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is preached to the poor.”

Now the reality is that these signs of the Kingdom are almost totally absent in New Zealand Christianity today yet these signs confirm the presence of Jesus.
What then has happened? This evidence of Jesus was clearly present in the early church but is noticeably absent in modern day Christianity for the most part.
I have to say that there are some simple reasons for this.
Those committed to our church work have become sophisticated and professional. They are generally well trained, talented individuals, able to lead, good managers, but are usually unfamiliar with the power of Jesus at work.

Why has this happened?
Looking back on the last thirty years, the times when Kingdom miracle signs have been evident in New Zealand certain conditions have been met.
Firstly there has been a God given unity among the believers involved.
Management and motivation were not predominant but simple Faith and Love was.
There was generally a lay ministry flowing, the believers would come together to share what God had done, there was a credible manifestation of Jesus in everyday life.
Being part of such an exciting experience meant that things of earth did grow strangely dim… we held onto our possessions more lightly, and there was supply for those who stepped out in God’s purpose without visible support.
The body of believers owned the vision which was planted in their hearts by Jesus rather than being sold by the leaders.
It seems that in the absence of God’s power we have built better programmes to compensate, become better organised so much so that it would be business as usual whether Jesus turns up or not.
Of course we have modified our theology to justify what isn’t happening, but this only masks the problem.
How then do we return to a vibrant biblical Christianity with conversion growth, and transformed lives? We need to return to the early church model clearly represented in the first Jerusalem Church (Acts 2:42-47), and the writings of Paul.
Start small with your close friends, read the scripture together and give God a blank page and room to move. Say less and pray more. Believe and act on the words of promise in the scripture. Confess your sin to one another and pray for one another that you may be healed…

Now the reality is that these signs of the Kingdom are almost totally absent in New Zealand Christianity today yet these signs confirm the presence of Jesus.

in other words, where is the 'it is finished' part of life overall, right?

Now the reality is that these signs of the Kingdom are almost totally absent in New Zealand Christianity today yet these signs confirm the presence of Jesus.

The Kingdom... there are many who will not enter into it, right? the wicked, the idolaters, etc....

and so the question that was asked...... If God Is Good, then why are there so many wrongful things going on everyday?

and there is that thing which many will die for in lieu of some sort of discipline that their own family did not instill in them... etc... freedom of choice; free will...

And then there is Country and its Constitution with its own laws and morals and ethics towards family, neighbors, work, etc...

You reap what you sow. In relationships, etc.... So the question.. 'why is what is being reaped something I personally did not sow'... or something to that affect....

So on a personal level... 'why am I reaping something I did sow myself'? 'Why am i reaping another persons' 'what they sowed'... 'Why am I personally not reaping back two fold or 3 fold or even 10 fold of all those 'good' I sowed'?

So yes, something is contrary to what I thought about 'reap what you sow'...

So then there is that point of view... to look at the scenario from a 3rd person point of view. The Lord is telling this 'value' to those who were around Him when He was speaking. Who were they He was addressing and encouraging to 'sow' rightly so they can 'reap' even more rightly than what they sowed?

1. Those who were already, those who had been,
keeping with their own Law. They were keeping a set of Laws which The Lord was able to share these 'valuables' with.... But He couldn't have really said these 'valuables' if another in a different country, per se, was having difficulties on the topic of circumcision or what to eat, etc....
Because then, they would have to start from square 1 of what God and The LORD expects from those who wish to 'reap' the blessings of being obedient...


Could you imagine what could occur if a self capitalist were to live in a despotic type Government trying to lead their own citizens in a direction which goes against their own ways, values, culture, history, etc and these attempts on the high levels of Government?


So what is the Government of New Zealand like? What is the common citizens' level of personal distance, safety, respect, etc? And how has these declined from when these values were being held on higher levels?

Because please remember that Government also works within the 'reap what is sown' balance....

Why did Rome fall; within the 'reap what is sown' scale, did Rome fall because they actually reaped what they did not sow?

They did not 'sow' safety?
They did not 'sow' strong barriers/borders?
They did not 'sow' strong moral values?
etc....

If a State Government 'sows' for legal purchase and use of cannabis, what might that State 'reap' for itself and for the citizens of that State? etc....

If a State Government 'sows' for legal prostitution, what might that State 'reap' for itself and for the citizens of that State?

Now if a State Government 'sows' for both legal cannabis and legal prostitution, what might that State 'reap' for itself and for the citizens of that State?

And if a State Government 'sows' for both legal cannabis and legal prostitution and legal underage use of substances, what might that State 'reap' for itself and for the citizens of that State?

 

[Godcrazy]

well, I do have heard stories about people that lived like they wanted or did not know the truth, and got to hell or in a void of sorts and met Jesus or called to Jesus, and that got given a chance. There are plenty of death stories like that. I believe there is a difference if someone knows about God and his standards and not heard it.

 

[bèlla]

we have to focus on love and uniting instead even if we don`t agree with people, or think that someone display the traits of you know who, even then, as a living breathing human being every being have a right to live in peace.

I’m not going to unite with anyone making unproven slanderous statements on a social media platform. It wouldn’t matter if they were believers or not. And if they want to make those statements they should be subject to the same legal ramifications as others in print. These a reason why The Enquirer, Star and similar publications were sued.

I firmly support copyright strikes, demonetization and canceling the channel if necessary. Trying to predict the President’s assassination using gematria or what the lord said and claiming this is it is where I draw the line.

There’s a lot of sick people in this world and as recent events have shown being in their path can be calamitous. If ostracizing some keeps me out of harms way so be it. I can live with it.

~bella

 

[ralliann]

I’m not going to unite with anyone making unproven slanderous statements on a social media platform. It wouldn’t matter if they were believers or not. And if they want to make those statements they should be subject to the same legal ramifications as others in print. These a reason why The Enquirer, Star and similar publications were sued.

I firmly support copyright strikes, demonetization and canceling the channel if necessary. Trying to predict the President’s assassination using gematria or what the lord said and claiming this is it is where I draw the line.

The power of persuasion is the better option. Like Charley Kirk.

There’s a lot of sick people in this world and as recent events have shown being in their path can be calamitous. If ostracizing some keeps me out of harms way so be it. I can live with it.

~bella

That is why I don't want government shutting things down.

 

[bèlla]

The power of persuasion is the better option. Like Charley Kirk.

If you want to do that you should. Start a YouTube channel and share your thoughts. If you believe his approach is best prove it and follow suit.

~bella

 

[bèlla]

we have to focus on love and uniting instead even if we don`t agree with people, or think that someone display the traits of you know who, even then, as a living breathing human being every being have a right to live in peace.

True christians? In all my years I’ve never used that term. Including it in a reply promoting unity is a little ironic. But I’m sure you have your share of ideas to combat what awaits. As do others as well.

~bella

 

[ralliann]

If you want to do that you should. Start a YouTube channel and share your thoughts. If you believe his approach is best prove it and follow suit.

~bella

I am on a forum sharing my thoughts? And it does not mean I "should" start a channel. For pity sake you seem pretty fired up? As for proof, I think Charley has done a good job of that so far.

 

[Godcrazy]

True christians? In all my years I’ve never used that term. Including it in a reply promoting unity is a little ironic. But I’m sure you have your share of ideas to combat what awaits. As do others as well.

~bella

Let`s say those who try do their best. I mean, compared to the I do not care crowd

 

[Godcrazy]

I’m not going to unite with anyone making unproven slanderous statements on a social media platform. It wouldn’t matter if they were believers or not. And if they want to make those statements they should be subject to the same legal ramifications as others in print. These a reason why The Enquirer, Star and similar publications were sued.

I firmly support copyright strikes, demonetization and canceling the channel if necessary. Trying to predict the President’s assassination using gematria or what the lord said and claiming this is it is where I draw the line.

There’s a lot of sick people in this world and as recent events have shown being in their path can be calamitous. If ostracizing some keeps me out of harms way so be it. I can live with it.

~bella

I`m like, how can we help them if we don`t try to help or teach or have a dialogue But now I am not english either but from a humanitarian country where everyone really are equal.
we do not have the split we see in the US in my country of origin. neither the same split racially or faith based. just saying, not to critisise. I do agree that anyone who it is no matter what if they talk about murder there is the limit. Where i am coming from is more like we can do a lot to change their minds or help them, as we do not know the deeper reasoning. trying to create positive change in their lives and society.

 

[bèlla]

I`m like, how can we help them if we don`t try to help or teach or have a dialogue But now I am not english either but from a humanitarian country where everyone really are equal.
we do not have the split we see in the US in my country of origin. neither the same split racially or faith based. just saying, not to critisise. I do agree that anyone who it is no matter what if they talk about murder there is the limit. Where i am coming from is more like we can do a lot to change their minds or help them, as we do not know the deeper reasoning. trying to create positive change in their lives and society.

The body has many parts and if we work in the area the Lord assigns all will be well. These are the things I encounter in the course of my work. It’s unfortunate believers have taken this course but a pruning is on the horizon. A lot of things taking place in our country didn’t happen overnight. They’ve been bubbling underneath the surface for a while and it only takes a nudge to set them off.

I’m familiar with the situation in the UK and France and follow them closely. Much like we have in the US a financial exodus is underway in the UK too and further ahead than ours.

Notably, during the six-year period from 2017 to 2023 post Brexit the UK has lost 16,500 millionaires to migration. Provisional estimates for 2024 are even more concerning, with a massive net outflow of 9,500 millionaires projected for this year alone.

The top destination cities for millionaires leaving the UK in 2024/2025 are expected to include Paris, Dubai, Amsterdam, Monaco, Geneva, Sydney, and Singapore, as well as retirement hotspots such as Florida, the Algarve, Malta, and the Italian Riviera.

The money is leaving and you‘re going to feel the effects in social services and others that rely on donations including the church. This is the era of leaving the world behind and letting it fend for itself.

~bella

 

[Godcrazy]

The body has many parts and if we work in the area the Lord assigns all will be well. These are the things I encounter in the course of my work. It’s unfortunate believers have taken this course but a pruning is on the horizon. A lot of things taking place in our country didn’t happen overnight. They’ve been bubbling underneath the surface for a while and it only takes a nudge to set them off.

I’m familiar with the situation in the UK and France and follow them closely. Much like we have in the US a financial exodus is underway in the UK too and further ahead than ours.

Notably, during the six-year period from 2017 to 2023 post Brexit the UK has lost 16,500 millionaires to migration. Provisional estimates for 2024 are even more concerning, with a massive net outflow of 9,500 millionaires projected for this year alone.

The top destination cities for millionaires leaving the UK in 2024/2025 are expected to include Paris, Dubai, Amsterdam, Monaco, Geneva, Sydney, and Singapore, as well as retirement hotspots such as Florida, the Algarve, Malta, and the Italian Riviera.

The money is leaving and you‘re going to feel the effects in social services and others that rely on donations including the church. This is the era of leaving the world behind and letting it fend for itself.

~bella

I believe you are right, while still try to help when asked or see a chance, of course. But of course not we can`t rescue a sinking ship. I am from Sweden Scandinavia and we are very humantiarian still and very equal meaning everyone should have and you do not see class differences. Or differences in having it is not tolerated either. Being so isolated and not used to all the problems of the rest we are very behind in dealing with the problems. Creating more problems. As well as being a small country with small towns. And lax laws because of it. A very can`t talk about things either. But many that are not involved in the gov per se have always thought it should be clear rules and guidelines and a fair sharing but not over sharing or wrong judgements either. It is sad to see what is happening in America. I have relatives that emigrated all over in the 1800. The evil have been working on it ever since. It is sad to see. When so much good have been. And how they treat people. At least people that are disabled in Scandinavia still are treated well compared to my friend who is in America telling me everything. It is truly shocking. I can`t help it, I am a big humanitarian because of how I grew up. Equality and sharing. fair trade fair respect. christian values. not misuse or abuse however. Never been a fan of brexit, saw the writing on the wall. we all need each other. but the control should be fair and control who is coming and how much. as well as those that abuse shall leave. There was a prophetess that said before the end the immigration would happen.
I believe it is staged by evil to erode europe and they are doing it to the Us of course. sad to see. it is not fair to the people.