Judge's 'promise' let career criminal walk free to butcher Ukrainian refugee after his MOM said he should be locked up

[LizaMarie]

Interesting that I read "JAIL HIM FOR LIFE! SO MANY OPPORTUNITIES TO PUT HIM AWAY" (not really..not for low level things).

Nobody is saying "WE NEED TO STRENGTHEN MENTAL HEALTH SUPPORTS IN THIS COUNTRY"... Until a right winger shoots someone up.

Did his mom say he should be "locked up"? I didn't go too deep but it sounds like she's actually advocating for him to be held on a psychiatric eval. (whatever that may mean down there)....

Since the '60s, '70s' and '80s there has been a huge move towards deinstitutionalization of mental health institutions and most mentally ill people, which this man was, are put on the streets. It is true that especially in the early 20th century and prior there were human rights abuses(along with involuntary commitment) in these institutions but I'm thinking maybe we need to look at people like this needing to be kept off the streets. I don't think those abuses would exist today. Maybe we need re-institutionalization.
People are rightly outraged as am I that someone who is doing nothing more than taking a train home from work and minding her own business is murdered in cold blood(and yes school children killed in a church) we need to stop the finger-pointing and race baiting on both sides and FIGURE OUT A SOLUTION TO THIS!! It's not a Republican or Democrat problem it's a recent American problem. Because this kind of stuff didn't happen or happened far less when I was growing up in the '60's. I was talking to a friend of mine whom I've known since second grade, and we were talking about how as neighbors and children we used to run all around our neighborhood, through orange groves, walk a mile to the local 7-11 in a Southern California neighborhood suburban area and we were told to be home by sunset, and our parents didn't worry something would happen to us. Now of course something could have happened then as well but things really didn't happen that frequently like these days back then.
My friend is a liberal Democrat and we were talking about how we were glad we grew up before the digital age and had free play time and time to explore so we didn't mention politics but even rearing my own children in the '90's I would never have let them roam free like that in a city we lived in at those ages without supervision, the way I grew up.
I know some of the answers* as to why this is happening but we need solutions that also respect civil liberties.





*Family societal breakdown, no "right or wrong these days.

 

[rambot]

Since the '60s, '70s' and '80s there has been a huge move towards deinstitutionalization of mental health institutions and most mentally ill people, which this man was, are put on the streets. It is true that especially in the early 20th century and prior there were human rights abuses(along with involuntary commitment) in these institutions but I'm thinking maybe we need to look at people like this needing to be kept off the streets. I don't think those abuses would exist today. Maybe we need re-institutionalization.
People are rightly outraged as am I that someone who is doing nothing more than taking a train home from work and minding her own business is murdered in cold blood(and yes school children killed in a church) we need to stop the finger-pointing and race baiting on both sides and FIGURE OUT A SOLUTION TO THIS!! It's not a Republican or Democrat problem it's a recent American problem. Because this kind of stuff didn't happen or happened far less when I was growing up in the '60's. I was talking to a friend of mine whom I've known since second grade, and we were talking about how as neighbors and children we used to run all around our neighborhood, through orange groves, walk a mile to the local 7-11 in a Southern California neighborhood suburban area and we were told to be home by sunset, and our parents didn't worry something would happen to us. Now of course something could have happened then as well but things really didn't happen that frequently like these days back then.
My friend is a liberal Democrat and we were talking about how we were glad we grew up before the digital age and had free play time and time to explore so we didn't mention politics but even rearing my own children in the '90's I would never have let them roam free like that in a city we lived in at those ages without supervision, the way I grew up.
I know some of the answers* as to why this is happening but we need solutions that also respect civil liberties.

The simple fact is that America would need to invest a LOT, and I mean A LOT of money into mental health supports. Keeping mental health supports within the private insurance realm is useless; socializing mental healthcare is going to get the BEST results.

I agree with what you say though.

I think people need to stop looking at any one solution as the "smoking gun"; the one thing that will solve everything. You could do a couple of small actions that build up to a positive affect.

 

[bèlla]

then why are you here arguing about it? what's your concern?

I’m not arguing nor do I post that often on CF. i pop in on occasion and comment for a day or two and won’t reappear for months. That isn’t the behavior of someone interested in arguing anything.

I'm not aware of a larger online Christian forum... do you have a suggestion?

I don’t frequent other venues and you’re probably better off doing that on YouTube.

because, collectively, we've covered up how real that danger is. our idolatrous 20th century obsession with "anti-racism" has censored just basic brute aspects of reality, and so many people like that woman do not fully understand the danger they are in - because where would she have heard it? up until very recently, nobody was allowed to talk about it.

A 13 year old was arrested today for making threats online. When they captured him he had 23 guns in his possession and a fixation on school shooters. This comes on the heels of the recent shooting at a church by another young man. With all due respect, black on white crime isn’t your greatest dilemma. The bigger issue is the other.

and as far as precautions, she wasn't walking down some dark alley somewhere, she was riding on a well-lit major public transit line - the average outsider does not understand how dangerous public places are, even in broad daylight.

It’s been statistically proven that bystanders rarely get involved when witnessing a crime. I’m uncertain if she was alone on the car or not. But you have to be mindful of your surroundings. When I go outside I’m not on my phone or listening to music or podcasts. I‘m noticing the people around me, the foot traffic on the street and so on. Many crimes are the result of opportunities and they target people who appear distracted for their antics. I’m not suggesting that’s the case in this situation.

I don’t take the train anymore but when I did I chose seats that were standalone and near the door. I would not be comfortable with a man behind me but that’s my bend. I did the same on the bus and sat in the front where the driver could see me. It’s a vehicle full of strangers. You never know who’s beside you.

~bella

 

[bèlla]

Since the '60s, '70s' and '80s there has been a huge move towards deinstitutionalization of mental health institutions and most mentally ill people, which this man was, are put on the streets.

The same occurred here and resulted in a spike in homelessness. I thought about that the other day when they mentioned his schizophrenia and the mother‘s unsuccessful bid to have him committed. They don’t want to house them.

~bella

 

[rambot]

The same can be said, even more so for liberals. Try googling something...all you get is 99% liberal bent stories and info fed to you

I'm not sure what your algorithms look like when you're searching for stuff but I am left wing and even I don't have 99% "liberal bent" stories. And as vague as the term "liberal bent" is, there's quite a "spectrum of bias" and sometimes we are unaware of our own biases that can skew things.

 

[rambot]

LAstly, I find it fascinating that people characterize how violent and scary everything is right now when, again, the LONG term trends in violence are going down.

When we were younger playing outside as kids, it was MORE dangerous than now. But as adults we are more worried about it. Numbers don't lie though.

 

[rambot]

The same occurred here and resulted in a spike in homelessness. I thought about that the other day when they mentioned his schizophrenia and the mother‘s unsuccessful bid to have him committed. They don’t want to house them.

~bella

That costs money.

American may need to come to terms with the idea that safety costs money and police can't keep you safe; they respond to danger (usually after the fact).

 

[Aldebaran]

LAstly, I find it fascinating that people characterize how violent and scary everything is right now when, again, the LONG term trends in violence are going down.

When we were younger playing outside as kids, it was MORE dangerous than now. But as adults we are more worried about it. Numbers don't lie though.

Why is violent crime only down when people are randomly attacked by illegal aliens and career criminals, but it's way up and "something needs to be done" when someone shoots and kills a couple kids at a school?

 

[Belk]

Why is violent crime only down when people are randomly attacked by illegal aliens and career criminals, but it's way up and "something needs to be done" when someone shoots and kills a couple kids at a school?

You don't understand why people think addressing kids getting shot in school should be a priority?

 

[Aldebaran]

You don't understand why people think addressing kids getting shot in school should be a priority?

Not one that warrants claiming that violent crime is up when it supposedly now isn't.
Accuracy still matters.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Why is violent crime only down when people are randomly attacked by illegal aliens and career criminals, but it's way up and "something needs to be done" when someone shoots and kills a couple kids at a school?

Nobody uses school shootings to claim that overall crime rates are "way up".

 

[Aldebaran]

Nobody uses school shootings to claim that overall crime rates are "way up".

Are you saying then that something doesn't need to be done about repeat offenders who end up back on the street even after 14 arrests, this time stabbing a Ukrainian refugee who happened to be minding her own business while riding a train?
I'd say this sort of thing has become too normalized and accepted. Maybe because he didn't use an AR15?

 

[iluvatar5150]

Are you saying then that something doesn't need to be done about repeat offenders who end up back on the street even after 14 arrests,

Why would you interpret my post, or any of my previous ones as saying that? First you create a strawman about mass shootings and now this? Is your reading comprehension getting worse or are you just looking to start an argument?

 

[Aldebaran]

Why would you interpret my post, or any of my previous ones as saying that? First you create a strawman about mass shootings and now this? Is your reading comprehension getting worse or are you just looking to start an argument?

I'm attempting to find the reason why certain people here were all riled up about recent killings with guns, and yet this one (and others done with something other than a gun by a white guy) seems to be getting shrugged off as "you guys and your rage bait".

 

[iluvatar5150]

I'm attempting to find the reason why certain people here were all riled up about recent killings with guns, and yet this one (and others done with something other than a gun by a white guy) seems to be getting shrugged off as "you guys and your rage bait".

Because the two groups are screaming about different things.

When there's a shooting, we lefties scream about access to guns.

In this case, your side is screaming about media coverage and the judge not predicting this murder and pre-emptively imprisoning him for 9+ months for making a crank phone call. I'd also add that the people screaming about this one 1.) neither do nor propose anything to improve the situation, and 2.) in some cases actively obstruct efforts to at least move the needle. Your side supposedly wants more mental health treatment, but Trump's cut funding to a bunch of mental health research and treatment programs. Where is your outrage about that?

 

[Aldebaran]

Are you suggesting that we jail people for the crimes that they might commit someday in the future? They made a movie about how badly that turns out - and that was even with precogs.

If the crime had been committed with a gun, that's exactly what would be suggested; banning gun ownership because of what someone might do with it in the future. But it's not exactly unusual for individual people to be kept in custody who have demonstrated that they are a threat to themselves or others. This guy was clearly a threat to others. A woman can't even sit in her seat on a train without being stabbed to death by the passenger behind her. Should we all have to move to another part of a train because a black guy is sitting behind us? That'd be racist, right? This woman wasn't racist at all, and now she's dead.
Now, if we had a justice system that keeps bad people off the street so we don't have to fear for our safety wherever we go, things would be different.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Ah yes, that classic, mature, well-reasoned argument "No u!"

The difference is that I recognize that what I see on social media is skewed and actively seek out alternate viewpoints (it's part of the reason why I continute to participate on this forum, in fact). I also try to avoid making sweeping claims on a subject based solely on the fact that I encounter a lot of videos featuring it.

Except in this case it is true...many "news outlets" like FB and others have already admitted it...they even admitted that the Biden admin asked them to...

 

[Aldebaran]

Because the two groups are screaming about different things.

When there's a shooting, we lefties scream about access to guns.

In this case, your side is screaming about media coverage and the judge not predicting this murder and pre-emptively imprisoning him for 9+ months for making a crank phone call. I'd also add that the people screaming about this one 1.) neither do nor propose anything to improve the situation, and 2.) in some cases actively obstruct efforts to at least move the needle. Your side supposedly wants more mental health treatment, but Trump's cut funding to a bunch of mental health research and treatment programs. Where is your outrage about that?

Now you're trivializing his criminal past. He was arrested 14 times, and for more serious things that the one thing you like to focus on. Read here:

When he was 22, Brown was charged in at least four separate cases that included shoplifting, larceny, breaking and entering and felony conspiracy. Court records show he was convicted of all of those charges except conspiracy.
Less than a year later, Brown pulled a gun on a man in the middle of the day at a Charlotte apartment complex and robbed him of his cellphone and $450. Brown pleaded guilty as part of a plea deal and a judge sentenced him to serve between six and eight years in prison.

Prison records show Brown spent six years in prison, followed by a year of probation.
His next court case came in January this year, when court records say Brown was at a hospital and someone called police about him. When they arrived, that's when records say Brown told them someone gave him a "manmade material" that was controlling him.

"Officers advised Brown that the issue was a medical issue and that there was nothing further they could do," a police report says. "Brown became upset with officers' answers and with officers still on scene, called 911 to speak with police."
Officers then arrested him on a charge of misuse of 911.

A judge later released him without bail. In July, a different judge agreed with a defense attorney's request to have Brown mentally evaluated for competency to understand the court proceedings he faced. It's unclear whether Brown was evaluated before Zarutska's killing on the light rail.

The Mecklenburg County Public Defender's Office did not respond to a request for comment about Brown.

Charlotte train stabbing suspect had a long criminal history

As politicians present competing explanations for the killing, many Americans grapple with a simple question: How could this happen?

www.usatoday.com

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

I'm not sure what your algorithms look like when you're searching for stuff but I am left wing and even I don't have 99% "liberal bent" stories. And as vague as the term "liberal bent" is, there's quite a "spectrum of bias" and sometimes we are unaware of our own biases that can skew things.

When I google something negative about liberal agendas or news, very little comes up or anti-conservative stories come up...I get MSNBC, NY TIMES, etc only news stories. Never Fox unless I actually search for FOX and even then the same think happenes.

 

[RocksInMyHead]

If the crime had been committed with a gun, that's exactly what would be suggested; banning gun ownership because of what someone might do with it in the future

Are you seriously arguing that not being able to own a gun is the same as life in prison?