Watch: CNN Cuts Tulsi Gabbard Off as She Lays Out the Inconvenient Facts of the Russia Hoax

[probinson]

On one hand, we have a bunch of different government agencies who've looked at the evidence and concluded that Russia poked around, a lot.

And they are 100% truthful with the American public, always and without excerption!

On the other hand, we have your incredulity.

Yep. With the reasons for it.

I posited a number of scenarios that show your incredulity to be unwarranted.

You made stuff up that may or may not be true. It proved nothing other than your imaginative abilities.

"Russia" isn't one singular entity any more than the US is. As with any large organization, it's made up of individuals and subgroups constantly vying for more power/money/prestige/etc. It's not uncommon at all for a leader of a less significant group to try to take their group to the next level and, in doing so, impress their bosses.

Alighty then. I guess Boris just wanted a promotion.

If their goal is to extract some concessions from us, merely threatening to do harm can be sufficient. A bank robber doesn't usually just murder everybody in the bank, does he? No, he points the gun, takes the money, and usually leaves.

But the bank robber still took the money in your analogy, didn't he? Your analogy doesn't even fit your point.

It's a thing.

Hackers for Hire - Digital Front Lines

Confronting the Growing Market for Cyber Mercenaries

digitalfrontlines.io

How would breaking into US election systems translate into being able to hack into ANY election system? It's already been pointed out that election systems aren't even consistent across various counties in the same state. Demonstrating your ability to hack into a single system in a single county in the US isn't exactly compelling stuff.

This was ~10 years ago. Yes, there was discord, but their hacking efforts have pour a LOT of fuel on the fire.

I would posit that incessantly TALKING ABOUT their hacking efforts has fueled far more discord than their actual hacking efforts.

"I have not failed. I have just found 10,000 ways that won't work" - Thomas Edison

Even if that quote is apocryphal, the principle is still valid. SpaceX launches don't go perfectly right out of the gate, either. There is always some amount of failure involved in trying to perfect a skill.

Interesting theory.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Three major broadcast networks didn't report on heinous Cincinnati brawl, review finds

Three major broadcast networks neglected to cover the horrific Cincinnati brawl that left a woman unconscious on their main morning and evening news broadcasts.

www.foxnews.com

The other networks buried this story

This is neither relevant to the thread, nor of any national consequence. No TV network should waste any part of their 20-minute newscast on a local story. It belongs on the Cincinnati new, not the national news.

 

[probinson]

This is imo a good argument for non-centralization of voting systems, to keep it within the control of the states and counties.

As a Manager of IT systems, the idea of this inconsistency goes against everything I stand for. But having a decentralized system certainly presents a more secure voting system by not having a single point of failure.

 

[probinson]

I did answer you. Go back about a week ago, this thread starting with post #52.

You did not. Here is that conversation:

Russia did in fact target all 50 states voting systems. Including inside the data bases. With that, exactly what or who was saying they changed the vote tallies?

Why do you think that 67% of Democrats polled believed that Russia had tampered with vote tallies if no one was saying that?

It's your claim. You're saying the media convinced them of that by making that claim. I am asking who?

Let me reiterate the question I asked that you never answered: Why do you think that 67% of Democrats polled believed that Russia had tampered with vote tallies if no one was saying that?

I've been abundantly clear that Democrats and the media were very careful about their word choice. They may have never stated directly that vote tallies were changed, but they had a coordinated propaganda campaign claiming that the election was "stolen" and that Trump was an "illegitimate President". It's quite clear to any objective, critical-thinking person what they were implying. And it worked. 67% of Democrats believed that vote tallies had been changed to elect Trump.

 

[Say it aint so]

You did not. Here is that conversation:







Let me reiterate the question I asked that you never answered: Why do you think that 67% of Democrats polled believed that Russia had tampered with vote tallies if no one was saying that?

I've been abundantly clear that Democrats and the media were very careful about their word choice. They may have never stated directly that vote tallies were changed, but they had a coordinated propaganda campaign claiming that the election was "stolen" and that Trump was an "illegitimate President". It's quite clear to any objective, critical-thinking person what they were implying. And it worked. 67% of Democrats believed that vote tallies had been changed to elect Trump.

And my response to that, #62:

"If they did hack into voting data, which they did. And voting data is used for elections, which it is. Then it can be said they did hack into our election systems. What I am asking is about is changing voting tallies. Who said that?"

Your assertion is it's the news media in this "coordinated propaganda campaign" "indirectly" made them think that by correctly stating Russian hacked into our voting systems, it means changing vote tallies. So just to be clear, no one in news media was saying vote tallies were changed. You are making a grandiose cause and affect stretch here without fact. I will offer this, and it drives me batty. Most Americans (including Dems) get informed from social media rather than journalism. And that trend is getting worse with the increase of podcasters who don't know you know what from Apple Butter.

 

[probinson]

And my response to that, #62:

"If they did hack into voting data, which they did. And voting data is used for elections, which it is. Then it can be said they did hack into our election systems. What I am asking is about is changing voting tallies. Who said that?"

Your assertion is it's the news media in this "coordinated propaganda campaign" "indirectly" made them think by correctly stating Russian hacked into our voting systems,

The media and Democrats did not just say that Russia hacked into our voting systems. They incessantly repeated that the election had been STOLEN!!! from them.

it means changing vote tallies. So just to be clear, no one in news media was saying vote tallies were changed. You are making a grandiose cause and affect stretch here without fact. I will offer this, and it drives me batty. Most Americans (including Dems) get informed from social media rather than journalism. And that trend is getting worse with the increase of podcasters who don't know you know what from Apple Butter.

So if Democrats and the media were not insinuating that vote tallies had been changed, by what mechanism do you believe they were claiming that the election had been "stolen"?

 

[BPPLEE]

This is neither relevant to the thread, nor of any national consequence. No TV network should waste any part of their 20-minute newscast on a local story. It belongs on the Cincinnati new, not the national news.

If the race of the parties involved would have been reversed this would be major news on all the networks.
Thank you for confirming that when the victims are white liberals don't think it's newsworthy

 

[Postvieww]

Really? If one does not agree with him they are committing treason.​

From the Department of Justices to the most peripheral federal agencies, Trump and his political appointees are weaponizing the bureaucracy to go after hundreds of the president’s political opponents and public officials who attempt to hold him accountable.
To carry out this effort, Trump has obliterated the longstanding firewall protecting the Department of Justice (DOJ) and other agencies from bhttps://www.democracydocket.com/analysis/trump-administration-weaponization-government-targeting-political-opponents/being used for political ends.

Trump’s Chilling Retribution Campaign Poses a Grave Threat to Democracy

Article is an absurd liberal spin of several events..

You mean aside from ignoring court orders​

The Trump administration’s conflict with the courts, explained

Trump has went out of his way to abide by even unconstitutional rogue Judges orders . Opting wait for a higher court smack down of said judges.

Stripping Power from Independent Regulatory Agencies​

https://www.npr.org/2025/02/19/nx-s1-5302481/trump-independent-agencies

Great, way too many unelected agency leaders make laws and regulations in a way totally outside of the democracy you say Trump is destroying.

DOGE Access to Government Payment Systems​

DOGE is a legitimate investigative part of the government which is perfectly entitled to look at the books. Good for DOGE. This in no way undermines democracy

Executive Order Freezing Federal Grant Funding​

Many grants were slush funds and unneeded waste of taxpayer money. Some of these cuts have been signed into law. This is good business and in no way undermines democracy.

Rollback of Healthcare Regulations​

Great again. Many regulations based on faulty science only hindered freedoms, the economy and served no national interest purpose.
No threat to democracy.

Reducing Administrative Support for NIH Grants​

Only wasteful grants are reduced. Not a threat to democracy this is just a priority issue not related to democracy.

Executive Order to Dismantle the Department of Education​

Fantasic. This has been talked about for years and a president who actually cares about test score results and cleaning up the monstrosity DOE union mess that has not severed our youths education. Give the power back to the localities. No threat to democracy here.

Attacks on the Department of Education and Locking Lawmakers Out​

Addressed above!

Rollback of EPA Regulations​

Too many pointless regulations that only harm the public interest . Thank you Trump. No problem for democracy actually this is democracy in action.

Executive Orders Targeting Law Firms

I bet you really don'y want to get into the reasons why. Again no threat to democracy.

Executive Actions Targeting Colleges and Universities

Thank you Trump. No need for taxpayer fund to support anti semitic views and protests, or an outlet to allow foreign spies into out country. No threat to democracy here only support for democracy.

Unfortunately the GOP is ok with all that.

Yes that is correct, MAGA! This list is just a liberal complaint against and effort to support democracy not destroy it. Many of these issues put in place by liberalism are being undone by Trump, only support democracy and does nothing to undermine it. Elections do have consequences.

 

[Say it aint so]

The media and Democrats did not just say that Russia hacked into our voting systems. They incessantly repeated that the election had been STOLEN!!! from them.



So if Democrats and the media were not insinuating that vote tallies had been changed, by what mechanism do you believe they were claiming that the election had been "stolen"?

Yes, the media did correctly note Russian hacked into our voting systems. Yes, some Dems did say the election was stolen with the rational being Russian helped Trump. Just like the media covered Trump saying the election was stolen. Is it the medias fault they covered Trump at ej and Hillary et al making the same election stolen claims? Was the media who covered Trump's stolen election claims in some "coordinated propaganda campaign conspiracy?" ....oh wait, FOXnews and Newsmax actually were. I think you may need to think this through further.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Yep. With the reasons for it.

No, you have not articulated any reasons beyond your own incredulity.

You made stuff up that may or may not be true. It proved nothing other than your imaginative abilities.

Which is no less substantive than the basis of your skepticism.

But the bank robber still took the money in your analogy, didn't he? Your analogy doesn't even fit your point.

This sort of thing doesn't have to operate on the timeline of a bank heist. Why would you assume that they'd make their demands immediately? They've demonstrated their capabilities. It's the computer equivalent of brandishing a weapon.

How would breaking into US election systems translate into being able to hack into ANY election system? It's already been pointed out that election systems aren't even consistent across various counties in the same state. Demonstrating your ability to hack into a single system in a single county in the US isn't exactly compelling stuff.

They didn't merely hack into a single one. They hacked into a lot of them.

I would posit that incessantly TALKING ABOUT their hacking efforts has fueled far more discord than their actual hacking efforts.

I agree, completely, but that's a distinction without a difference and a hallmark of good psyops. If you want to cause some trouble, you don't necessarily have to cause all of it yourself. If you can identify a situation that's about ready to pop, all you have to do is go in and poke it a bit and it'll take care of the rest on its own.

 

[BPPLEE]

Really? If one does not agree with him they are committing treason.​

From the Department of Justices to the most peripheral federal agencies, Trump and his political appointees are weaponizing the bureaucracy to go after hundreds of the president’s political opponents and public officials who attempt to hold him accountable.
To carry out this effort, Trump has obliterated the longstanding firewall protecting the Department of Justice (DOJ) and other agencies from bhttps://www.democracydocket.com/analysis/trump-administration-weaponization-government-targeting-political-opponents/being used for political ends.

Trump’s Chilling Retribution Campaign Poses a Grave Threat to Democracy

You mean aside from ignoring court orders​

The Trump administration’s conflict with the courts, explained

​

Stripping Power from Independent Regulatory Agencies​

https://www.npr.org/2025/02/19/nx-s1-5302481/trump-independent-agencies

DOGE Access to Government Payment Systems​

Executive Order Freezing Federal Grant Funding​

​

Rollback of Healthcare Regulations​

Reducing Administrative Support for NIH Grants​

Executive Order to Dismantle the Department of Education​

Attacks on the Department of Education and Locking Lawmakers Out​

Rollback of EPA Regulations​

Executive Orders Targeting Law Firms

Executive Actions Targeting Colleges and Universities


Unfortunately the GOP is ok with all that.

As much talk as there has been in this thread about Western Journal and Fox News, these sources are the same thing just from the left

 

[DaisyDay]

As much talk as there has been in this thread about Western Journal and Fox News, these sources are the same thing just from the left

Where is your evidence that these sources are not reliable when it comes to facts?

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

Article is an absurd liberal spin of several events..


Trump has went out of his way to abide by even unconstitutional rogue Judges orders . Opting wait for a higher court smack down of said judges.

Great, way too many unelected agency leaders make laws and regulations in a way totally outside of the democracy you say Trump is destroying.


DOGE is a legitimate investigative part of the government which is perfectly entitled to look at the books. Good for DOGE. This in no way undermines democracy

Many grants were slush funds and unneeded waste of taxpayer money. Some of these cuts have been signed into law. This is good business and in no way undermines democracy.

Great again. Many regulations based on faulty science only hindered freedoms, the economy and served no national interest purpose.
No threat to democracy.

Only wasteful grants are reduced. Not a threat to democracy this is just a priority issue not related to democracy.

Fantasic. This has been talked about for years and a president who actually cares about test score results and cleaning up the monstrosity DOE union mess that has not severed our youths education. Give the power back to the localities. No threat to democracy here.


Addressed above!

Too many pointless regulations that only harm the public interest . Thank you Trump. No problem for democracy actually this is democracy in action.

I bet you really don'y want to get into the reasons why. Again no threat to democracy.


Thank you Trump. No need for taxpayer fund to support anti semitic views and protests, or an outlet to allow foreign spies into out country. No threat to democracy here only support for democracy.

Yes that is correct, MAGA! This list is just a liberal complaint against and effort to support democracy not destroy it. Many of these issues put in place by liberalism are being undone by Trump, only support democracy and does nothing to undermine it. Elections do have consequences.

In your twisted view you probably think the January 6th rioters and their unlawful destructive actions were democracy in action and their pardon some kind of warped justice.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

As much talk as there has been in this thread about Western Journal and Fox News, these sources are the same thing just from the left

Well come on. Even you must acknowledge that congress and SCOTUS have become nothing more than puppets for Trump. But that is not his fault. It is theirs. Like the obnoxious boor that he is, he is simply taking full advantage of the situation and exploiting the power of the office given to him for all it can offer him personally.

 

[eclipsenow]

What is happening now reminds me of some lectures that I listened to online by Dr. Lance Wallnau.





This whole idea reminds me of the clear and simple picture of the future two or three centuries as was shown to near death experiencer and former Atheist Howard Storm.

Howard Storm's Near-Death Experience - Near-Death Experiences and the Afterlife

Near-Death Experiences and the Afterlife profiles Howard Storm's Near-Death Experience . Did you enjoy reading this post, we have more!

near-death.com

It seems like it is time for all of us who are led by the Holy Spirit to pray Thy Kingdom Come with a whole new level of fervency and hunger for the will of God to be done on earth.

Not this again? All these end times visions contradict each other. Take it to the eschatology forum - there are a few in there that will be quite happy to correct your preferred rumour of a hunch of a wiggle from someone's left ear of a vision with visions of their own. I keep telling people the bible is enough - and to stop eating cheese so close to bedtime. But do they listen? Nope. So take it to the Eschatology section - and let the Vision Wars commence! (I'm having a break from that area for a few months because those peeps be cray-cray passionate!)

 

[eclipsenow]

In your twisted view you probably think the January 6th rioters and their unlawful destructive actions were democracy in action and their pardon some kind of warped justice.

Yes - it amazes me that the party of law and order are so patriotic they cheered on as Trump pardoned career criminals who stormed the capital and bashed police!

 

[BPPLEE]

Where is your evidence that these sources are not reliable when it comes to facts?

They are left biased

 

[BPPLEE]

Well come on. Even you must acknowledge that congress and SCOTUS have become nothing more than puppets for Trump. But that is not his fault. It is theirs. Like the obnoxious boor that he is, he is simply taking full advantage of the situation and exploiting the power of the office given to him for all it can offer him personally.

Well is he a full blown idiot on one hand but on the other hand a genius that has taken over all 3 branches of the government?
Surely he can’t be both

 

[Postvieww]

In your twisted view you probably think the January 6th rioters and their unlawful destructive actions were democracy in action and their pardon some kind of warped justice.

Nice diversion to avoid the topic of your faulty charge that Trump is anti democracy. Just wait until you get the real story about Jan 6. I assure it was not instigated by Trump.

 

[Postvieww]

Yes - it amazes me that the party of law and order are so patriotic they cheered on as Trump pardoned career criminals who stormed the capital and bashed police!

This is a twisted view. Many of those Jan 6ers were denied basic due process were used a scapegoats for liberal agendas. Do you have a problem with some of the pardons under Biden by his handlers using the auto pen? Probably not ! That amazes me.