Dismantling Judeo-Christian values in America

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

We tell Muslim , come to Jesus , he has eternal life. We tell Muslim , Jesus loves you and Jesus wants you to have eternal life.

And let's suppose he takes on 3 wives and a harem. He ignores the call to faith and raises all his children as Muslims within the Christian community. Do we allow this and him and his descendants to outnumber Christians and their descendants?

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Christianity did not originate or initially spread through Europeans. It began in the Middle East with a Jew named Jesus, followed by another Jew named Paul, who later brought the gospel to non-Jews in parts of Asia and Europe.

And it was preserved in Europe. Those places in Asia where it was originally preached fell to Islam and dwindled or faded entirely.

I suppose you consider this a good thing though because it means Christians were out of power and were killed and persecuted. Isn't how Christianity is in the Middle East today what you want for Christianity more broadly?

 

[prodromos]

We tell Muslim , come to Jesus , he has eternal life. We tell Muslim , Jesus loves you and Jesus wants you to have eternal life.

Why aren't you doing that?
Why haven't you booked a flight to Saudi Arabia to put your beliefs into practice?

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

It is my opinion but one rooted in theology and history. I am not a Protestant and I actually value the lives of Christians before me and consider their experience in what it is we should do today.

The bible itself, the New Testament in particular, gives no explicit instructions on how Christians may interact with the political and when we see the few references to the political we see deference to ruling authorities. Nor do we see that the Gospel is only for a certain class of serfs and slaves. It is for all people's, the poor, the rich and educated and even Kings.

Can you provide anywhere within the bible that a Ruler can't believe in Jesus Christ?

I see you are unable to reference material from the Bible or church doctrine. That is what I thought. It is simply your opinion. nothing more.

I am not interested in human opinion.

 

[ralliann]

This is not about my preferences; it is Christ's prophecy, Jesus said unbelievers would rule the world.

Are we not to use whatever power God gives us for the good of all?

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

And let's suppose he takes on 3 wives and a harem. He ignores the call to faith and raises all his children as Muslims within the Christian community. Do we allow this and him and his descendants to outnumber Christians and their descendants?

you seems to egger to point finger to other. but this is what Jesus said;

"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye."

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

Why aren't you doing that?
Why haven't you booked a flight to Saudi Arabia to put your beliefs into practice?

How do you know I have not done that?

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

Are we not to use whatever power God gives us for the good of all?

he said
“Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.

He didn't say go establish Christian nation . any one preaching to establish Christian nation is preaching something which contradict Biblical principle.

 

[prodromos]

How do you know I have not done that?

Because you are still alive and posting on this forum. I hear Syria is nice this time of year and there are plenty of African nations with Muslim majorities that need to hear the Gospel.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

you seems to egger to point finger to other. but this is what Jesus said;

"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye."

I don't see how this is relevant. Are you saying we must allow Muslims to practice their religion as they see fit in Christian societies?

Do you want Islam to spread without resistance?

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

I see you are unable to reference material from the Bible or church doctrine. That is what I thought. It is simply your opinion. nothing more.

I am not interested in human opinion.

I did reference Paul. He says the rulers of this world are granted thr sword legitimately in order to punish evildoers. He also didn't discriminate in who to convert. He converted the rich and intellectual and even attempted to convert the governor of Jerusalem. Faith i am trying to engage honestly with you but you are unable to interact with even basic ideas. At least hermit had the humility to dip out.

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

Because you are still alive and posting on this forum. I hear Syria is nice this time of year and there are plenty of African nations with Muslim majorities that need to hear the Gospel.

I do not engage online to boast about my action or identity, nor do I intend to criticize others for their actions or inactions. If you wish to discuss the merits of the topic, I welcome a constructive conversation. However, if the discussion turns to personal attacks, all I have for you is “ have a nice day”.

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

I did reference Paul. He says the rulers of this world are granted thr sword legitimately in order to punish evildoers. He also didn't discriminate in who to convert. He converted the rich and intellectual and even attempted to convert the governor of Jerusalem. Faith i am trying to engage honestly with you but you are unable to interact with even basic ideas. At least hermit had the humility to dip out.

When Paul said the ruler of the world are granted thru showed , he was pointing to Roman pagan ruler.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

When Paul said the ruler of the world are granted thru showed , he was pointing to Roman pagan ruler.

When Paul said the ruler of the world are granted thru showed , he was pointing to Roman pagan ruler.

And this changes the moment a ruler becomes Christian? Why then did God convert rulers to the faith? Why did he grant Christians positions of political power?

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Are we not to use whatever power God gives us for the good of all?

Evidently we are to be the slaves and servants of our enemies who may do whatever they want with us. This apparently is the Gospel according to Faith.

 

[prodromos]

I do not engage online to boast about my action or identity, nor do I intend to criticize others for their actions or inactions. If you wish to discuss the merits of the topic, I welcome a constructive conversation. However, if the discussion turns to personal attacks, all I have for you is “ have a nice day”.

It is very easy to make pious judgements on how Christians should live from the comfort of an armchair in a country that does not actively hunt Christians down to jail or murder them.

 

[FAITH-IN-HIM]

It is very easy to make pious judgements on how Christians should live from the comfort of an armchair in a country that does not actively hunt Christians down to jail or murder them.

Fair enough. I am receptive to guidance on how Christians should respond in any situation, provided it is supported by biblical teachings or established church doctrine. Personal opinions, including my own or yours, are not of interest in this context.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Fair enough. I am receptive to guidance on how Christians should respond in any situation, provided it is supported by biblical teachings or established church doctrine. Personal opinions, including my own or yours, are not of interest in this context.

Except we don't have specific guidance for any situation from the bible alone. Hence your attempts to answer my questions about what Christians ought to have done have been utterly incoherent.

 

[RileyG]

In my opinion based on my interpretation of Scripture on the whole, governments and their policies are established by none other than God, Himself.
We abide in His Kingdome and no earthly power can touch that.
I think it was wrong for our early founders to try to establish a "Christian" nation.
He blesses us according to our own, personal relationship with Him and where we abide has no part.
That's the world.

I agree completely.

 

[ralliann]

Evidently we are to be the slaves and servants of our enemies who may do whatever they want with us. This apparently is the Gospel according to Faith.

I do not think that is so.