Christian nationalist pastor McPherson: "Empathy is aligned with hell."

[partinobodycular]

The post you are responding to I cannot see as I’ve ‘ignored’ that user. Does it show a lack or misunderstanding of empathy?

I'm sorry, you've lost me. (Not hard to do) Or I've lost myself. (Not hard to do either) Could you dumb that down for me? There's a question in there but I'm not exactly sure what it is.

 

[ViaCrucis]

What's the point you're making with these quotes?

How far do we have to fall before we discover we're in hell.

I know, gay people have cooties, they're icky, I mean, they're over there doing all that gay stuff. But, you know, I'm good. I go to church on Sunday, I vote Republican, I have two cars, a white picket fence, and I don't let the bad people live in my neighborhood.

And that's just the way the devil wants it. Rich and prosperous, living our best life now, without any of that pesky "Do unto others" stuff getting in the way. Christianity-lite is the devil's favorite false religion.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Larniavc]

I'm sorry, you've lost me. (Not hard to do) Or I've lost myself. (Not hard to do either) Could you dumb that down for me? There's a question in there but I'm not exactly sure what it is.

Does the post you were replying to show a lack or misunderstanding of empathy? I have that user on ignore so I can't read what they said.

 

[Servus]

How far do we have to fall before we discover we're in hell.

I know, gay people have cooties, they're icky, I mean, they're over there doing all that gay stuff. But, you know, I'm good. I go to church on Sunday, I vote Republican, I have two cars, a white picket fence, and I don't let the bad people live in my neighborhood.

And that's just the way the devil wants it. Rich and prosperous, living our best life now, without any of that pesky "Do unto others" stuff getting in the way. Christianity-lite is the devil's favorite false religion.

-CryptoLutheran

That's what I figured. And when I hear folks going on like this I remember what they have to say about "MAGAs". You know the rest.

Also what the devil wants and what amounts to Christianity-lite, is to embrace worldliness. To have a secular mindset.

 

[ViaCrucis]

is to embrace worldliness. To have a secular mindset.

I know what worldliness is, as Scripture would define it, but what do you mean when you say worldliness?

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Servus]

I know what worldliness is, as Scripture would define it, but what do you mean when you say worldliness?

-CryptoLutheran

The same thing. But perhaps we're going by different interpretations of what scripture says about it. Say perhaps a newer modern liberal interpretation vs the older traditional orthodox interpretation.

 

[ViaCrucis]

The same thing. But perhaps we're going by different interpretations of what scripture says about it. Say perhaps a newer modern liberal interpretation vs the older traditional orthodox interpretation.

I'm more interested in good exegesis and solid hermeneutics. The Bible is neither liberal nor conservative. It's the Bible.

The way I understand worldliness is that it is a identifying with the present system, or order which dominates this fallen world. Wherein the rampant desires of the flesh rule, and thus we behold a world in which true justice is never achieved, because the hearts of human beings are, by the sinful inclination of the heart, guided toward sin and death.

As such, examples of worldliness would include such things as oppression of the poor, hungry, and the immigrant. The love of money and power, the exploitation of human beings made in God's image, the sexual objectification of those same human beings, the exploitation of their labor through unjust systems of control, power-accumulation, and wealth-gain.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Servus]

I'm more interested in good exegesis and solid hermeneutics. The Bible is neither liberal nor conservative. It's the Bible.

The way I understand worldliness is that it is a identifying with the present system, or order which dominates this fallen world. Wherein the rampant desires of the flesh rule, and thus we behold a world in which true justice is never achieved, because the hearts of human beings are, by the sinful inclination of the heart, guided toward sin and death.

As such, examples of worldliness would include such things as oppression of the poor, hungry, and the immigrant. The love of money and power, the exploitation of human beings made in God's image, the sexual objectification of those same human beings, the exploitation of their labor through unjust systems of control, power-accumulation, and wealth-gain.

-CryptoLutheran

That sums up wanting illegal immigrants to stay here in order to supply a cheap dirty labor force.

Worldliness is prioritizing earthly desires and pleasures over God and eternal things, including thinking and acting like unbelievers, and enabling sinful behavior. It's where instead of the church bringing people to repentance to lay aside everything and surrender to the will of God, it caters to their earthly desires. Instead of bringing the unrepentant up out of the mud, the church gets in the mud and wallows in it with them. And carnal-christianity is established. Where those in the church resemble unbelievers to the point where it's hard to tell them apart. They adopt the ungodly worldly humanistic version of what Christianity is supposed to be. So that instead of the ungodly being convicted of their sin, they're placated instead. Instead of being turned away from sin, they're enabled.

 

[ViaCrucis]

That sums up wanting illegal immigrants to stay here in order to supply a cheap dirty labor force.

"Don't exploit people" is "cheap dirty labor force"?

Worldliness is prioritizing earthly desires and pleasures over God and eternal things, including thinking and acting like unbelievers, and enabling sinful behavior. It's where instead of the church bringing people to repentance to lay aside everything and surrender to the will of God, it caters to their earthly desires. Instead of bringing the unrepentant up out of the mud, the church gets in the mud and wallows in it with them. And carnal-christianity is established. Where those in the church resemble unbelievers to the point where it's hard to tell them apart. They adopt the ungodly worldly humanistic version of what Christianity is supposed to be. So that instead of the ungodly being convicted of their sin, they're placated instead. Instead of being turned away from sin, they're enabled.

So what godly values are being expressed by abducting people off the street who are here legally and depriving them of Due Process?

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Servus]

"Don't exploit people" is "As such, examples of worldliness would include such things as oppression of the poor, hungry, and the immigrant. The love of money and power, the exploitation of human beings made in God's image"?

You wrote: As such, examples of worldliness would include such things as oppression of the poor, hungry, and the immigrant. The love of money and power, the exploitation of human beings made in God's image.

Which made me think of all the complaints about how deportation will take away the people who are exploited to do lousy jobs for low pay.

So what godly values are being expressed by abducting people off the street who are here legally and depriving them of Due Process?

-CryptoLutheran

Loaded question.

 

[ViaCrucis]

You wrote: As such, examples of worldliness would include such things as oppression of the poor, hungry, and the immigrant. The love of money and power, the exploitation of human beings made in God's image.

Which made me think of all the complaints about how deportation will take away the people who are exploited to do lousy jobs for low pay.

It's interesting that's what it made you think of.

Loaded question.

Seeing as that is actually happening, it seems like a fair question to ask.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Servus]

It's interesting that's what it made you think of.

Why? On one hand there's the objection to human exploitation. On the other hand is the complaint over ending human exploitation.

Seeing as that is actually happening, it seems like a fair question to ask.

-CryptoLutheran

I'll need a little info first. Who has been charged with abduction? And why are they expected to have godly values? Who is being abducted? What due process are you talking about? Are you using the word abducting in place of a more realistic term for dramatic effect?

 

[ViaCrucis]

Why? On one hand there's the objection to human exploitation. On the other hand is the complaint over ending human exploitation.

Where's the complaint over ending human exploitation?

I'll need a little info first. Who has been charged with abduction? And why are they expected to have godly values? Who is being abducted? What due process are you talking about? Are you using the word abducting in place of a more realistic term for dramatic effect?

Alright, here's the most recent example.

https://apnews.com/article/tufts-student-detained-massachusetts-immigration-08d7f08e1daa899986b7131a1edab6d8

Abduction:

abduction

www.law.cornell.edu

"No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation." - US Constitution, 5th Amendment

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws." - US Constitution, 14th Amendment, Section I

Are non-citizens and resident aliens exempt from Constitutional protections? No.

https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/artI-S8-C18-8-7-2/ALDE_00001262/

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Servus]

Where's the complaint over ending human exploitation?

You haven't heard/read it being said that we need illegal immigrants to do the menial jobs no one else will do for the same low pay?

Alright, here's the most recent example.

https://apnews.com/article/tufts-student-detained-massachusetts-immigration-08d7f08e1daa899986b7131a1edab6d8

-CryptoLutheran

Using Ctrl+F no word starting with "abduct" can be found in that article. This is why I called it a loaded question.

One time, when I was a student, I was detained (not abducted) by law enforcement, handcuffed, put into a police car and taken to a detention facility, over something I was innocent of. I understand why it happened, and I do not think the officers were acting in an ungodly manner.

 

[partinobodycular]

I must say that I find your discussion about worldliness to be quite interesting, although seemingly misguided and irrelevant. It has absolutely nothing to do with what makes something sinful or unGodly.

For example, some would consider a society to be worldly if it allowed an unmarried woman to be seen in public with a man who wasn't her father or brother. And some would consider a society to be worldly if it allowed a woman to be seen in public kissing another woman. Oh for shame.

Yes, some LGBTQ+ members are pompous, arrogant, self-serving jerks, but I could say the same about a whole lot of politicians too.

Worldly just means that it doesn't conform to somebody's version of wholesomeness. It has nothing to do with whether their behavior conforms to doing justly, loving mercy, and walking humbly with their God.

Any religion that's focusing on how a persons behavior doesn't conform to their own personal sense of Godliness, isn't focused on God, it's focused on themselves.

There's nothing keeping an LGBTQ+ member from being a loving, responsible, and respectful member of society. In spite of the fact that some members of that society are treating them as if they're worthless trash.

Yes, where they're being pompous, arrogant, self-serving jerks, call them out on it. But one should never, ever prohibit someone from being a Christian simply because they don't conform to that person's personal version of wholesomeness.

Now if I've misunderstood either of your positions on the matter, then kindly accept my apology. Otherwise, I simply thought that my viewpoint was worth sharing.

 

[Servus]

I must say that I find your discussion about worldliness to be quite interesting, although seemingly misguided and irrelevant. It has absolutely nothing to do with what makes something sinful or unGodly.

For example, some would consider a society to be worldly if it allowed an unmarried woman to be seen in public with a man who wasn't her father or brother. And some would consider a society to be worldly if it allowed a woman to be seen in public kissing another woman. Oh for shame.

Yes, some LGBTQ+ members are pompous, arrogant, self-serving jerks, but I could say the same about a whole lot of politicians too.

Worldly just means that it doesn't conform to somebody's version of wholesomeness. It has nothing to do with whether their behavior conforms to doing justly, loving mercy, and walking humbly with their God.

Any religion that's focusing on how a persons behavior doesn't conform to their own personal sense of Godliness, isn't focused on God, it's focused on themselves.

There's nothing keeping an LGBTQ+ member from being a loving, responsible, and respectful member of society. In spite of the fact that some members of that society are treating them as if they're worthless trash.

Yes, where they're being pompous, arrogant, self-serving jerks, call them out on it. But one should never, ever prohibit someone from being a Christian simply because they don't conform to that person's personal version of wholesomeness.

Now if I've misunderstood either of your positions on the matter, then kindly accept my apology. Otherwise, I simply thought that my viewpoint was worth sharing.

As an agnostic, you're giving me an unbiblical unchristain point of view. But this is about the biblical and Christian perspective. Which is, anything of this world that is not of God and Godly, is worldly. As Christians we a commanded by Christ to put aside that which is worldly and fervently pursue that which is Godly. We are to love worldly ungodly people and guide them and help them, but we are to abstain from being like them. We are to be separated from them.

But what's going on with some Christian churches is they are taking on a worldly appearance and blending worldly ideology and philosophy with Christianity, when the two are supposed to be separate as commanded by Christ and His Apostles.

Now there is a worldly, secular, humanistic version of what the Bible teaches, especially what Christ was like and taught, and Christianity is supposed to to be. And certain Christian churches are basically letting the ungodly teach them how the church and how Christianity is supposed to operate. They let themselves be deceived into believing that which is a complete distortion, is "true" Christianity.

So what exists is a combination of compromising Christians and those who want to be both worldly and Christian.

 

[Maori Aussie]

As an agnostic, you're giving me an unbiblical unchristain point of view. But this is about the biblical and Christian perspective. Which is, anything of this world that is not of God and Godly, is worldly. As Christians we a commanded by Christ to put aside that which is worldly and fervently pursue that which is Godly. We are to love worldly ungodly people and guide them and help them, but we are to abstain from being like them. We are to be separated from them.

But what's going on with some Christian churches is they are taking on a worldly appearance and blending worldly ideology and philosophy with Christianity, when the two are supposed to be separate as commanded by Christ and His Apostles.

Now there is a worldly, secular, humanistic version of what the Bible teaches, especially what Christ was like and taught, and Christianity is supposed to to be. And certain Christian churches are basically letting the ungodly teach them how the church and how Christianity is supposed to operate. They let themselves be deceived into believing that which is a complete distortion, is "true" Christianity.

So what exists is a combination of compromising Christians and those who want to be both worldly and Christian.

"Who are you to condemn someone else’s servants? Their own master will judge whether they stand or fall. And with the Lord’s help, they will stand and receive his approval." Romans 14:4 Paul finally met up with Jesus "Do not judge" in the end.

 

[partinobodycular]

But this is about the biblical and Christian perspective. Which is, anything of this world that is not of God and Godly, is worldly.

But doesn't this basically give you carte blanche to vilify anything that you find to be 'unGodly'. If you don't like rock and roll music, denounce it as worldly. If you don't like social media, denounce it as worldly. If you don't like liberalism, denounce it as worldly.

This certainly seems like a 'me' centered ideology and not a God centered one.

 

[Servus]

"Who are you to condemn someone else’s servants? Their own master will judge whether they stand or fall. And with the Lord’s help, they will stand and receive his approval." Romans 14:4 Paul finally met up with Jesus "Do not judge" in the end.

Several bible passages are misused to validate worldly Christianity.

In this case Romans 14:4 (as is the case with Matthew 7:1) is about that which takes place within the church between Christians. Neither passage applies to the ungodly or ungodliness or is against judging what is ungodly.

 

[Servus]

But doesn't this basically give you carte blanche to vilify anything that you find to be 'unGodly'. If you don't like rock and roll music, denounce it as worldly. If you don't like social media, denounce it as worldly. If you don't like liberalism, denounce it as worldly.

This certainly seems like a 'me' centered ideology and not a God centered one.

No, it's about what the Bible says and what Christianity is supposed to teach according to Christ and His Apostles. The entirety of what they taught that is, not just cherry picked snippets taken out of context.

The core tenet of Christianity is, it's not about self, or what self thinks, or wants. It's about God, and what God thinks, and what God wants.