Why People Believe The Earth is Flat

[didactics]

I certainly don't "always side with him". Indeed, I have written several posts disagreeing with his view that the bible has errors and contradictions. Nor am I "against" Apple Sky; I just disagree with her views on things like the shape of the earth and the moon landings.

Well, sorry about that, now that I think of it I do remember you saying something about it.

It's a hugely bad witness to any non-Christans who are browsing this forum and who may think that all Christians believe and behave as she doe.

But that's just it, non-Christians may mock and say things if they find something on the corner of the internet, but the reason I don't think it's as bad as it sounds is because not that many flat-earther Christians are in a position of authority like pastors or scholars.

No. But that's not the subject of this thread - it's off-topic. Threads can get closed down if they go off-topic.
Start another thread on the Bible and the "errors and contradictions" and I'll join in.

will speak just for myself. I do not know how you define "filled with", but it contains errors and contradictions, yes.

I think it is off topic too, but if trophy is tying this into an argument against a flat-earther, then it's not off topic. I think it would be better if we were all on the same page and could agree that the Bible is God's Word or to not argue over whether or not God speaks to us through his word in a general sense; it's a common and generally accepted belief within Christianity that God speaks to humanity through his word, which is understood to be the Bible, and that the Bible contains everything necessary for faith and life. It would save a lot of headache if we didn't have to argue over what is meant by God's inspired word, but I noticed an argument like this:

Here we go again

King James Bible
Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

So which words in the Bible are spoken by God? Those are the words which shall not pass away.

Jesus’ statement in Matthew 24:35 about the eternal nature of His words reveals that they are of the same nature as the Father’s words, inscribed in Scripture—they stand forever. It would be nice if all of us can be in agreement on this one.

 

[didactics]

So when it is raining, the water falls from above the Sun and the stars and the Moon? Because the waters are above the firmament, in the ancient biblical cosmology.

This is, BTW, another biblical error that is being proven as such by any plane or hot-air balloon that can get above the clouds, basically. @didactics

But here's the thing, even if we assume that your mythological interpretation of creation week is true, then it was meant to be understood as a polemic, as you say. If that is true, why would that mean the Bible has an error? If the Bible mentions or makes reference to a solid firmament and it was only to teach a spiritual lesson, then the Bible did not make an error.

 

[Apple Sky]

Jesus’ statement in Matthew 24:35 about the eternal nature of His words reveals that they are of the same nature as the Father’s words, inscribed in Scripture—they stand forever. It would be nice if all of us can be in agreement on this one.

I certainly agree with this from Genesis to Revelation God's words will never pass away.

 

[prodromos]

Jesus’ statement in Matthew 24:35 about the eternal nature of His words reveals that they are of the same nature as the Father’s words, inscribed in Scripture—they stand forever. It would be nice if all of us can be in agreement on this one.

God's words are not limited to a portion of Scripture. I can't agree with you on that.

 

[trophy33]

The waters are above & below the firmament

King James Bible
And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

According to the Old Testament cosmology, the waters "below the firmament" are the waters on the surface of Earth, not rain.

So, I am still waiting for some rational explanation how rain works, from you. Do you even accept that the rain comes from clouds? This is a question even child would laugh at, but it is always hard to say what nonsense a flat earther comes with to get around some issue.

 

[trophy33]

But here's the thing, even if we assume that your mythological interpretation of creation week is true, then it was meant to be understood as a polemic, as you say. If that is true, why would that mean the Bible has an error? If the Bible mentions or makes reference to a solid firmament and it was only to teach a spiritual lesson, then the Bible did not make an error.

1. It is not "mine interpretation" vs "you all". You try to shift the positions. If you read Genesis 1 literally, you are the minority - it is basically nonexistent in the mainstream scholarship and it is a minority view in the Christendom globally.

2. It is not a moral or theological error, it is a cosmological, "scientific" error. It proves that the Bible is not some kind of an idol in which every word is from God, but that it had human authors who used their vocabulary, their limited knowledge, their cultural views etc.
It does not refer to the firmament in a polemic way (a polemics against the firmament). It refers to it as to something created by Yahweh, because they believed it exists. The polemics is in something else (which god/God created everything, for what purpose, with what means etc.).

 

[Apple Sky]

According to the Old Testament cosmology, the waters "below the firmament" are the waters on the surface of Earth, not rain.

Yes but there is water also above the firmament, the rain comes from the clouds which are under the firmament.

The truth in plain sight - From a Hennessy advert.

 

[David Lamb]

Ezekiel does;

King James Bible
And the likeness of the firmament upon the heads of the living creature was as the colour of the terrible crystal, stretched forth over their heads above.

That just says that the colour of the firmament was the colour of "terrible crystal" (NKJV says "awesome crystal"), and that it was stretched forth. Nothing about being a solid dome.

 

[Apple Sky]

That just says that the colour of the firmament was the colour of "terrible crystal" (NKJV says "awesome crystal"), and that it was stretched forth. Nothing about being a solid dome.

Look up the word Firm a ment & Raqia.

Gordon Wenham, a more moderate Old Testament scholar, in his Word Biblical Commentary, says that the word "raqia" is etymologically derived from the words "stamp, spread", and is sometimes used to describe metal work, such as "to spread by hammering.

 

[David Lamb]

Look up the word Firm a ment & Raqia.

Gordon Wenham, a more moderate Old Testament scholar, in his Word Biblical Commentary, says that the word "raqia" is etymologically derived from the words "stamp, spread", and is sometimes used to describe metal work, such as "to spread by hammering.

Commenting on Genesis 1:7, Matthew Poole wrote:

"Ver. 7. The firmament here is either,

1. The starry heaven; so called, not from its solidity, but from its fixed, durable, and, in a sort, incorruptible and unchangeable nature. Or,

2. The air; called here, the expansion, or extension, because it is extended far and wide, even from the earth to the third heaven; called also the firmament, because it is fixed in its proper place, from whence it cannot be moved, unless by force."

 

[Apple Sky]

Commenting on Genesis 1:7, Matthew Poole wrote:

"Ver. 7. The firmament here is either,

1. The starry heaven; so called, not from its solidity, but from its fixed, durable, and, in a sort, incorruptible and unchangeable nature. Or,

2. The air; called here, the expansion, or extension, because it is extended far and wide, even from the earth to the third heaven; called also the firmament, because it is fixed in its proper place, from whence it cannot be moved, unless by force."

So you think that that rockets go straight up into a vacuum.

 

[David Lamb]

So you think that that rockets go straight up into a vacuum.

Yes, apart from when they are travelling through the earth's atmosphere, of course.

 

[Apple Sky]

Yes, apart from when they are travelling through the earth's atmosphere, of course.

This is ridiculous, watch the video and find out what would happen if this were so.

 

[David Lamb]

This is ridiculous, watch the video and find out what would happen if this were so.

But I already know what happens. There have been enough rockets launched in the past 70 years or so. You can find videos of those online, including several on youtube, that don't have anything like a rocket hitting a solid dome. You just choose to believe different videos, because they fit with what you believe. It's circular reasoning to say, "This video must be true because it fits with what I believe," and then to say, "Watch this video; it shows that what I believe is true."

 

[Apple Sky]

 

[Apple Sky]

But I already know what happens. There have been enough rockets launched in the past 70 years or so.

Has there though ? Or did they all end up in the Bermuda Triangle junk yard.

 

[Apple Sky]

Why do spaceships never go straight up & always arc over ?

Where do you think this spaceship is going cus it ain't space ?

 

[trophy33]

Yes but there is water also above the firmament, the rain comes from the clouds which are under the firmament.

This is not the biblical cosmology, though. It is your personal invention, because you, as a modern human, know that, we routinely get above clouds and there is not moon or stars there. That is why you try to bend the biblical cosmology.

 

[trophy33]

Why do spaceships never go straight up & always arc over ?

Where do you think this spaceship is going cus it ain't space ?

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You suffer a memory loss again. I already explained to you why - because the Earth is a rotating globe. The space rockets want to get to the orbit around the planet, not to just go straight up forever. It is much more faster, shorter and effective to curve their flight, because they want to fly in the curved orbit around the curved planet.

 

[Apple Sky]

You suffer a memory loss again. I already explained to you why - because the Earth is a rotating globe. The space rockets want to get to the orbit around the planet, not to just go straight up forever. It is much more faster, shorter and effective to curve their flight, because they want to fly in the curved orbit around the curved planet.

But the earths not rotating ????