Palisades Fire live updates: Wildfires spread in Los Angeles, prompting mandatory evacuations, as Santa Ana winds expected to intensify

[Chesterton]

That littered the ground with fuels and made the perfect recipe for voracious fires.

Shoulda listened to Trump.

California droughts and Santa Ana winds are also not unprecedented. That they could occur at the same time was foreseeable.

Once those fires started (under investigation), there is no possible way for humans to stop them.

Especially when your governor has diverted available water into the ocean.

 

[wing2000]

Shoulda listened to Trump.

California was and is managing it's forest long before Mr Trump chimed in with his "rakes" remarks.
Could they do more? Of course...but that requires significant more resources.

California droughts and Santa Ana winds are also not unprecedented. That they could occur at the same time was foreseeable.

The severity of all 3 factors was unprecdented.

 

[wing2000]

Especially when your governor has diverted available water into the ocean.

THere is no way to put down a fire storm driven by 80 mph....no matter how much water you have. That's a simple fact.

 

[BPPLEE]

Shoulda listened to Trump.

California droughts and Santa Ana winds are also not unprecedented. That they could occur at the same time was foreseeable.

Especially when your governor has diverted available water into the ocean.

And spent $4 billion per year on healthcare for illegal immigrants. How much more fire prevention could that buy?

 

[BPPLEE]

THere is no way to put down a fire storm driven by 80 mph....no matter how much water you have. That's a simple fact.

But couldn’t they have cut fire lanes, picked up fallen wood, cut down dead trees and generally managed the area to prevent fires from spreading?

 

[BPPLEE]

Yes, that is what is meant. I don't find it a persuasive argument .

The things that set it are a larger proportion of high-income persons paying income taxes (or corporate taxes) versus high federal expediture per capita.

That means they also take in more money than other states through taxes so you could argue that they shouldn’t get as much federal money as states that take in less

 

[essentialsaltes]

But couldn’t they have cut fire lanes,

Many, if not all, of the major hiking trails and paved roads throughout the Santa Monica Mountains are fire lanes. They are used to take the fire trucks to the wildfire. In the Palisades fire, the fire had rapidly blown into houses, and was spreading house to house.

 

[BPPLEE]

Many, if not all, of the major hiking trails and paved roads throughout the Santa Monica Mountains are fire lanes. They are used to take the fire trucks to the wildfire. In the Palisades fire, the fire had rapidly blown into houses, and was spreading house to house.

Maybe I am using the wrong word. I mean large areas cut so the fire won’t spread, bigger than a trail or a road.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Maybe I am using the wrong word. I mean large areas cut so the fire won’t spread, bigger than a trail or a road.

Saw this in my feed recently, and should be publicly viewable.

As Chief Brian Fennessy of the Orange County Fire Authority said of the situation regarding "clearing brush":

“You could have put a 10-lane freeway in front of that fire and it would not have slowed it one bit,” Fennessy said.

The Santa Anas blow the wrong way, but if the fire hops over the 405, it'll be an object demonstration of that.

 

[wing2000]

But couldn’t they have cut fire lanes, picked up fallen wood, cut down dead trees and generally managed the area to prevent fires from spreading?

Those activities may have occurred (or not). When fire is sending burning embers into 50-80 mph winds, fire lines are ineffective at stopping the spread.

 

[iluvatar5150]

You didn’t answer the question.

I believe it's the balance of tax receipts (of all sorts: income tax, payroll, business, etc) against all expenditures.

But couldn’t they have cut fire lanes, picked up fallen wood, cut down dead trees and generally managed the area to prevent fires from spreading?

Not really, beyond what they already do. For one thing, it's brushland, not forests. You can't clear out shrubs the way you can clear out large fallen trees. You'd have to pave the whole thing. Second, the fire jumped over all kinds of roads. Here's a shot of Malibu where it jumped over the 5-lane-wide Pacific Coast Highway:

 

[essentialsaltes]

Has Congress ever conditioned natural disaster aid?

Sen. Rounds: Tying debt limit to California aid ‘not meant as a penalty’​

Speaker Mike Johnson (R-La.) floated tying a debt limit increase to disaster aid for the state Monday.

“There’s some discussion about that, but we’ll see where it goes,” Johnson told reporters when asked about debt limit legislation being a ride-along to a potential disaster aid package.

--

Trump has been demanding that the debt limit be raised or eliminated. I'll happily allow the GOP to 'blame' California for giving Trump the limitless credit card if that'll stop this nonsense and get an aid package put together to help people in need.

 

[RDKirk]

Many, if not all, of the major hiking trails and paved roads throughout the Santa Monica Mountains are fire lanes. They are used to take the fire trucks to the wildfire. In the Palisades fire, the fire had rapidly blown into houses, and was spreading house to house.

That's what we saw happening in Maui last year.

The property insurance companies have been having that conversation with the California insurance commission for years. It was perfectly clear from expert observation that this year or the next, a fire of this magnitude would occur. That's why the insurance companies pulled out; they won't insure a guaranteed total loss.

The state has the same access to expert information that the insurance companies have.

It's the same reason insurance companies won't insure a driver who has too many accidents and tickets. When the insurance companies said, "Bye-bye," that should have been the wake-up call: "You ain't livin' right."

 

[RDKirk]

There's a difference in that what happened in Texas was unprecedented, record-breaking cold in terms of both extremity and duration. California forest fires are certainly not unprecedented.

As I said: They were planning for the climate to be as it always has been, when it's clear that the climate is changing for the more extreme.

 

[Pommer]

THere is no way to put down a fire storm driven by 80 mph....no matter how much water you have. That's a simple fact.

“You’re managing your disaster wrong!” seems so tone-deaf, to boot.

 

[Chesterton]

As I said: They were planning for the climate to be as it always has been, when it's clear that the climate is changing for the more extreme.

They should have planned for global cooling?

 

[Pommer]

Maybe I am using the wrong word. I mean large areas cut so the fire won’t spread, bigger than a trail or a road.

Just leave wide swaths of land completely emptied of human habitation?
In California?
In Los Angeles?

 

[BPPLEE]

“You’re managing your disaster wrong!” seems so tone-deaf, to boot.

Perhaps “You failed to prepare for your predictable disaster “ sounds better

 

[BPPLEE]

Just leave wide swaths of land completely emptied of human habitation?
In California?
In Los Angeles?

Where did the fire start?

 

[Pommer]

Where did the fire start?

There’s at least three fires (that I’m aware of) which one did you mean?