The Church started in the wilderness

[Bro.T]

You may practice the 10 void of love and miss the whole point, thus displeases God. Instead we should be focused on what Christ tells us which is a focus of love upon others. There is no need to consult the 10 while doing this, we are not guided by the 10, we are guided by the Spirit thus align yourself with the Spirit. This instruction is the law written upon your heart.

The book say in 1 John 2: 3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

 

[Bro.T]

I hear what you're saying, but all of the laws are connected to the priesthood

In addition to the priests being able to inquire of the Lord regarding the practice of any law, there is also the priesthood being supported by Israel

Israel had to keep all of the law in order to be healthy and strong, and thus support the priesthood ❤️❤️❤️

Bible Gateway passage: Deuteronomy 28:1-3 - New Century Version

Blessings for Obeying - You must completely obey the LORD your God, and you must carefully follow all his commands I am giving you today. Then the LORD your God will make you greater than any other nation on earth. Obey the LORD your God so that all these blessings will come and stay with you...

www.biblegateway.com

Again, there were laws before the Israelites. I continue saying the same thing, the wages of Sin is Death (Romans 6:23). Cain Killed Abel, if it wasn't a law, not to kill, then it would of been ok to kill. Satan got kick out of heaven because of iniquity (Sin). The lord burned Sodom and Gomorrha because of sin. In (1John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Now we have just read the biblical definition of sin, the transgression (breaking) of the law (commandments.) In the days of Abraham there was a high priest, let's go to Genesis 14: 18 And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the most high God. 19 And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth: We also see the bread and wine didn't start in the new testament, that's old.
Let's take a look at another situation in Genesis 12: 7 And the LORD plagued Pharaoh and his house with great plagues because of Sarai Abram's wife. 18 And Pharaoh called Abram, and said, What is this that thou hast done unto me? why didst thou not tell me that she was thy wife? 19 Why saidst thou, She is my sister? so I might have taken her to me to wife: now therefore behold thy wife, take her, and go thy way. 20 And Pharaoh commanded his men concerning him: and they sent him away, and his wife, and all that he had. This is thou shall not commit adultery.

 

[ralliann]

Like I said best not to read whats not there. I love Paul's writings in context.

No you don't read then in context. Paul gives context.....
Jesus came to the Jew's, because the what the law says it says to the Jews.

Ro 2:12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;

Gal 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

They need to be reconciled to Christ, sadly most reconcile Christ our Savior to Paul a human.

No. Paul was not sent to those not under the law, and not judged by the law....
Jesus and John and the twelve were......
Wrath and the curse was coming................To those judged under the law.....
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

Mt 3:7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Lu 3:7 Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Lu 21:23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
Joh 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

The law of Moses has p[rophetic utterances that are coming to pass in the gospel to the Jews to escape it.

Ro 9:27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:
Ro 11:5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

 

[Leaf473]

If you want to settle for that understanding then that's how you see it, but the book show us more.

peace in Jesus name

If it's not up to the individual to decide how to keep the Sabbath holy, then who decides, in your view?

Again, there were laws before the Israelites

True! But regarding the law of Moses, are only some parts connected to the Levites, again in your view?

 

[DamianWarS]

Did Christ not speak of love to Him as keeping His commandments? Exo 20:6 John 14:15 John 15:10 so agree that many distort love and corrupt His word by trying to redefine it, instead of trusting in Him and allowing Him to direct our paths Pro 3:5-6 and abiding in Him John 15:10 following in His example 1 John 2:6. The Spirit is not at odds with His commandments 1 John 3:24 His Spirit is the one enabling us to keep them John 14:15-18 we just need to cooperate

If one is or is not practicing the 10 without a changed heart, that will be for God to determine only He can read our hearts and nothing we can hide from Him Ecc 12:13-14. One thing we know for sure, one who does not practice them, loves Him the way He asked 1 John 2:4 Mat 7:23 keeping them leads one to a converted soul Psa 19:7 doing God's will Psa 40:8 Heb 8:10 love to God is more than a feeling, its an action. Just like I can say I love my husband, but if I am not faithful to him, the words are meaningless. Its no different with God.

You're conflating. Not one scripture you posted speaks of the 10. Jesus is explicit about love.

John 13:34-35
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another. By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”

 

[DamianWarS]

Not one scripture or verse, but you go right ahead and let that spirit guide you.

The role of the Holy Spirit is intrinsic to Christian living, what exactly do you think the HS does?

Do you need me to post verses that we should keep in step with the HS?

John 16:13-15
But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will glorify me because it is from me that he will receive what he will make known to you. All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will receive from me what he will make known to you.

Do you ask the HS to reveal to you this truth? (Hint: It's why he is here)

2 Cor 3:3-4
You yourselves are our letter, written on our hearts, known and read by everybody. You show that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.

What do you think written with the Spirit of the Living God means and not with tablets of stone but on our hearts? Do you think it means the tablets were verbatim etched into our heart? That conclusion would not require the Holy Spirit since the truth is already revealed to us. What's on our heart is of the HS, not of the tablets. Seek the HS for guidance, not the 10.

 

[DamianWarS]

The book say in 1 John 2: 3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

Indeed. And what is Christ's commandments? It is the commandment to love each other.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

You're conflating. Not one scripture you posted speaks of the 10. Jesus is explicit about love.

John 13:34-35
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another. By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”

Not conflating when God literally spelled it out for us Exo 20:6 Exo 31:18 Jesus never taught anything different Mat 19:17-19 Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 Mat 5:19-30 John 14:15. Jesus did teach to love our neighbor and the details on how to Rom 13:9 never got deleted.

 

[Doug Brents]

Of the tribe of JUDAH Moses said nothing of priesthood. Right there. The fleshy descent means nothing in the new covenant

Precisely. Which necessitates a change in the Law, because if we were still under the OT, Jesus could not be a priest, because only Levites could be priests under the OT.

 

[Doug Brents]

I continue saying the same thing, the wages of Sin is Death (Romans 6:23). Cain Killed Abel, if it wasn't a law, not to kill, then it would of been ok to kill. Satan got kick out of heaven because of iniquity (Sin). The lord burned Sodom and Gomorrha because of sin. In (1John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Now we have just read the biblical definition of sin, the transgression (breaking) of the law (commandments.)

I have never disputed with you that sin is a breaking of God's Law. That is not under debate. What is up for debate here is what God's Law is for us today versus what God's Law was before Christ. The two are very different.

In the days of Abraham there was a high priest, let's go to Genesis 14: 18 And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the most high God. 19 And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth: We also see the bread and wine didn't start in the new testament, that's old.

Melchizedek was not High Priest. He was just a priest to God, and also the king of Salem. Jesus is like him in that Jesus is also both King and priest, but Jesus is High Priest, and King of Kings.

Let's take a look at another situation in Genesis 12: 7 And the LORD plagued Pharaoh and his house with great plagues because of Sarai Abram's wife. 18 And Pharaoh called Abram, and said, What is this that thou hast done unto me? why didst thou not tell me that she was thy wife? 19 Why saidst thou, She is my sister? so I might have taken her to me to wife: now therefore behold thy wife, take her, and go thy way. 20 And Pharaoh commanded his men concerning him: and they sent him away, and his wife, and all that he had. This is thou shall not commit adultery.
You not going to find them written like the ten Commandments, but if you understand God, he not going to allow his creation to have no laws.

Again, I have never disputed that the Laws of God did not exist before the Law was given at Mt Sinai. And the laws against murder, adultery, lust, (1, 2, 3, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, & 10 of the ten commandments) are all restated as being still part of the NT just as they were in the OT. But keeping the sabbath is not listed among the laws we must keep under the NT.

To repent means to turn from our sinful ways and start obeying God's law. The water baptism signifies the washing away of our past sins.

Baptism also initiates the continual cleansing that washes away all future sins as well.

After repenting and being baptized in the name of Jesus it would be foolish for us to turn around and willingly break God's commandments. If we make an honest mistake Jesus can help us, but if we sin willingly, look out! "...there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation..." (Hebrews 10:26-27).

Again, this is not under debate. We must keep the laws of God as they pertain to us today. But the keeping of the sabbath does not pertain to us today.

When Jesus died only the sacrificial law was done away with, alone with Leviticus priesthood.

Not true. All of the OT was removed. The law of circumcision, which dates back to Abraham (400 years before the Law was given on Mt Sinai (Gen 17, Gal 5:2-6), is no longer relevant under the NT. The law of meat restrictions which was first given at Mt Sinai (Lev 11, Deut 14) is no longer relevant under the NT (Mark 7:18-19, Acts 10:9-16). The law of keeping the sabbath is no longer relevant under the NT (Col 2:16-17, Rom 14:5-9). The law restricting the priesthood to the Levites is no longer relevant under the NT (Heb 7:12).

The book say in 2 John 1: 6 And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

Yes, walk in the commandments of God that are relevant to your time. Abraham walked in the commandments of God that were relevant to him. He was not circumcised until he was a very old man (not when he was 8 days old like those under the Law of Moses had to be). He could eat any meat that he pleased, because there were no dietary restrictions in his time. Melchizedek was priest to God, because there was no law restricting the priesthood to the Levites. And there was no sabbath keeping in Abraham's time. But during the time of the Law of Moses, these things changed. Now we are under only the NT laws. We are not subject to the laws given in the OT in any way, for it has been fulfilled, completed, swept away, and is no longer relevant to anyone living in the NT era.

 

[DamianWarS]

Mat 19:17-19

Then v20:
The young man said to Him, “All these things I have kept from my youth. What do I still lack?”

"What do I still lack" is the take away. Christ knew the answer, he uses the 10 as a segue to get to the heart which was his love of money. The point is not the 10, it was what was lacking. This implicitly shows us the 10 are lacking. We should use this passage to look beyond the 10.

Mat 15:3-14, Mark 7:7-13

Honor your father and mother is a part of the 10 but anyone who curses their mother or father should be put to death is not (it's in Leviticus) Jesus quotes both and calls both the commandments of God. You seem to be only interested in looking at the 10 while ignoring that Jesus infact is not separating the 10 from the law nor does he ever do that. When he speaks of law he means the whole Torah. This passage cannot be used to isolate the 10.

The whole context is calling out the hypocrisy of Pharisees and the goal is to show how sin starts from the heart. The goal is not to isolate the 10 as you seem to think it is.

Mat 5:19-30

The context of Mat 5 is not the 10 isolated, it is the entire law and prophets. There is no precedence to take this passage to isolate the 10.

Jesus also says he has come not to destroy but to fulfill. The product of a fulfilled law is that it is finished, even if still valued.

Where Jesus does highlight 2 from the 10 (murder and adultery) he also quotes outside of the 10 which is another reason why there is no precedence to isolate the 10 in this passage.

Jesus also shows us a new way to look sin and tells us to go beyond the quotes in question that do not murder or not commit adultery are not enough and we need to address matters of the heart that the aforementioned lack. Like Mat 19 Jesus shows these commandments are lacking and we need to address the heart.

John 14:15

Indeed, but what is it? Well the immediate context should be looked at first. Only 18 verses before John 14:15 would qualify as the immediate context.

John 13:34-35
“A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Then v20:
The young man said to Him, “All these things I have kept from my youth. What do I still lack?”

"What do I still lack" is the take away. Christ knew the answer, he uses the 10 as a segue to get to the heart which was his love of money. The point is not the 10, it was what was lacking. This implicitly shows us the 10 are lacking. We should use this passage to look beyond the 10.

You seem to be suggesting to ignore what Jesus taught, which is never a good idea. Jesus clearly told him how to receive salvation Mat 19:17 and was told to follow Him. The rich young ruler wanted to, but on his terms (much like many of us) because he had great riches he placed over Jesus, breaking the very first commandment Exo 20:3. He may have loved his neighbor and kept the commandments relating to man, but broke the commandments relating love to God. Breaking one of the commandments is like breaking them all James 2:10-12

Honor your father and mother is a part of the 10 but anyone who curses their mother or father should be put to death is not (it's in Leviticus) Jesus quotes both and calls both the commandments of God. You seem to be only interested in looking at the 10 while ignoring that Jesus infact is not separating the 10 from the law nor does he ever do that. When he speaks of law he means the whole Torah. This passage cannot be used to isolate the 10.

Thats right, the curses and blessings for keeping the Ten Commandments was written in the book that was placed outside the ark as a witness against Deut 31:24-26 for breaking what was inside God's finger-written commandments that no one has greater authority over. Not sure why people argue against this, its very strange.

I think you are missing the "and" which means in addition to, not the same as.

Mat 15:3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ found written in the book of the law Deut 31:24-26. There are blessings when we obey God and keep His commandments and curses when we don't. Deut 11:26 No man can take away God's blessing Num 23:20 so we can choose blessings through our faith and obedience to God- His version Isa 56:2 Rev 22:14 or by not obeying God by default we choose the curses Rev 22:15

The whole context is calling out the hypocrisy of Pharisees and the goal is to show how sin starts from the heart. The goal is not to isolate the 10 as you seem to think it is.

God wrote, God spoke and God placed inside the ark and He added no more to them. Deut 5:22 If you think God's perfect law is incomplete, that's something you will have to take up with Him. While there are other laws we should keep, the Ten Commandments will always be part of God's commandments His children should keep through love and faith.

 

[Leaf473]

Honor your father and mother is a part of the 10 but anyone who curses their mother or father should be put to death is not (it's in Leviticus) Jesus quotes both and calls both the commandments of God.

That's interesting, I hadn't seen that before

Jesus associates one of the 10 with a commandment from Leviticus and calls the two of them together "the commandment of God"

 

[ralliann]

Then v20:
The young man said to Him, “All these things I have kept from my youth. What do I still lack?”

"What do I still lack" is the take away. Christ knew the answer, he uses the 10 as a segue to get to the heart which was his love of money. The point is not the 10, it was what was lacking. This implicitly shows us the 10 are lacking. We should use this passage to look beyond the 10.


Honor your father and mother is a part of the 10 but anyone who curses their mother or father should be put to death is not (it's in Leviticus) Jesus quotes both and calls both the commandments of God. You seem to be only interested in looking at the 10 while ignoring that Jesus infact is not separating the 10 from the law nor does he ever do that. When he speaks of law he means the whole Torah. This passage cannot be used to isolate the 10.

The whole context is calling out the hypocrisy of Pharisees and the goal is to show how sin starts from the heart. The goal is not to isolate the 10 as you seem to think it is.

The context of Mat 5 is not the 10 isolated, it is the entire law and prophets. There is no precedence to take this passage to isolate the 10.

Jesus also says he has come not to destroy but to fulfill. The product of a fulfilled law is that it is finished, even if still valued.

Where Jesus does highlight 2 from the 10 (murder and adultery) he also quotes outside of the 10 which is another reason why there is no precedence to isolate the 10 in this passage.

Jesus also shows us a new way to look sin and tells us to go beyond the quotes in question that do not murder or not commit adultery are not enough and we need to address matters of the heart that the aforementioned lack. Like Mat 19 Jesus shows these commandments are lacking and we need to address the heart.

Indeed, but what is it? Well the immediate context should be looked at first. Only 18 verses before John 14:15 would qualify as the immediate context.

John 13:34-35
“A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

The "ten commandments" in Hebrew is specific.
Ex 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments. {commandments: Heb. words }
De 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
De 10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spake unto you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them unto me.
Judaism 101 says this:
Begin quote"
But what about the so-called "Ten Commandments," the words recorded in Exodus 20, the words that the Creator personally wrote on the two stone tablets that Moses brought down from Mount Sinai (Ex. 31:18), which Moses smashed upon seeing the idolatry of the golden calf (Ex. 32:19)? In the Torah, these words are never referred to as the Ten Commandments. In the Torah, they are called Aseret ha-D'varim (Ex. 34:28, Deut. 4:13 and Deut. 10:4). In rabbinical texts, they are referred to as Aseret ha-Dibrot. The words d'varim and dibrot come from the Hebrew root Dalet-Beit-Reish, meaning word, speak or thing; thus, the phrase is accurately translated as the Ten Sayings, the Ten Statements, the Ten Declarations, the Ten Words or even the Ten Things, but not as the Ten Commandments, which would be Aseret ha-Mitzvot.

The Aseret ha-Dibrot are not understood as individual mitzvot; rather, they are categories or classifications of mitzvot. Each of the 613 mitzvot can be subsumed under one of these ten categories, some in more obvious ways than others.


The Greek LXX also the same
Ex. 34:28 deka logous
Deut 4:13 deka remata
Deut 10:4 deka logous
1. Logous
3056 λόγος logos log’-os

from 3004; n m; TDNT-4:69,505; {See TDNT 431}

AV-word 218, saying 50, account 8, speech 8, Word (Christ) 7, thing 5, not tr 2, misc 32; 330

2. Remata
4487 ῥῆμα rhema hray’-mah

from 4483; n n; TDNT-4:69,505; {See TDNT 431}

AV-word 56, saying 9, thing 3, no thing + 3756 1, not tr 1; 70

1. Hebrew commandment
04687 מצוה mitsvah mits-vaw’

from 06680; n f; [BDB-846a] {See TWOT on 1887 @@ "1887b"}

AV-commandments 173, precept 4, commanded 2, law 1, ordinances 1; 181

2. Greek commandment
1785 ἐντολή entole en-tol-ay’

from 1781; n f; TDNT-2:545,234; {See TDNT 242}

AV-commandment 69, precept 2; 71

 

[Leaf473]

The "ten commandments" in Hebrew is specific.
Ex 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments. {commandments: Heb. words }
De 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
De 10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spake unto you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them unto me.
Judaism 101 says this:
Begin quote"
But what about the so-called "Ten Commandments," the words recorded in Exodus 20, the words that the Creator personally wrote on the two stone tablets that Moses brought down from Mount Sinai (Ex. 31:18), which Moses smashed upon seeing the idolatry of the golden calf (Ex. 32:19)? In the Torah, these words are never referred to as the Ten Commandments. In the Torah, they are called Aseret ha-D'varim (Ex. 34:28, Deut. 4:13 and Deut. 10:4). In rabbinical texts, they are referred to as Aseret ha-Dibrot. The words d'varim and dibrot come from the Hebrew root Dalet-Beit-Reish, meaning word, speak or thing; thus, the phrase is accurately translated as the Ten Sayings, the Ten Statements, the Ten Declarations, the Ten Words or even the Ten Things, but not as the Ten Commandments, which would be Aseret ha-Mitzvot.

The Aseret ha-Dibrot are not understood as individual mitzvot; rather, they are categories or classifications of mitzvot. Each of the 613 mitzvot can be subsumed under one of these ten categories, some in more obvious ways than others.


The Greek LXX also the same
Ex. 34:28 deka logous
Deut 4:13 deka remata
Deut 10:4 deka logous
1. Logous
3056 λόγος logos log’-os

from 3004; n m; TDNT-4:69,505; {See TDNT 431}

AV-word 218, saying 50, account 8, speech 8, Word (Christ) 7, thing 5, not tr 2, misc 32; 330

2. Remata
4487 ῥῆμα rhema hray’-mah

from 4483; n n; TDNT-4:69,505; {See TDNT 431}

AV-word 56, saying 9, thing 3, no thing + 3756 1, not tr 1; 70

1. Hebrew commandment
04687 מצוה mitsvah mits-vaw’

from 06680; n f; [BDB-846a] {See TWOT on 1887 @@ "1887b"}

AV-commandments 173, precept 4, commanded 2, law 1, ordinances 1; 181

2. Greek commandment
1785 ἐντολή entole en-tol-ay’

from 1781; n f; TDNT-2:545,234; {See TDNT 242}

AV-commandment 69, precept 2; 71

Very interesting!

 

[ralliann]

Very interesting!

Yes it is! There is another word used in the Greek LXX concerning Abraham

Gen 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.
Listed as
prostagmata, entolas, dikaiomata, nomima
If these words follow the hebrew order, it would be
charge, commandments, statutes, laws.
Dikaiomata found here.....
Ro 2:26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness (dikaiomata) of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?
1345 δικαίωμα dikaioma dik-ah’-yo-mah

from 1344; n n; TDNT-2:219,168; {See TDNT 192}

AV-righteousness 4, ordinance 3, judgment 2, justification 1; 10

1) that which has been deemed right so as to have force of law
1a) what has been established, and ordained by law, an ordinance
1b) a judicial decision, sentence
1b1) of God
1b1a) either the favourable judgment by which he acquits man and declares them acceptable to Him
1b1b) unfavourable: sentence of condemnation
2) a righteous act or deed

Rom 4:19 And being not weak in faith, he considered not his own body now dead, when he was about an hundred years old, neither yet the deadness of Sara’s womb:
20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;
21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform.
22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.(dikaiosunen)
23 ¶ Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him;
24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;
25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.
5:1¶ Therefore being justified (dikaiothentes) by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

Rom 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

 

[DamianWarS]

You seem to be suggesting to ignore what Jesus taught, which is never a good idea. Jesus clearly told him how to receive salvation Mat 19:17 and was told to follow Him. The rich young ruler wanted to, but on his terms (much like many of us) because he had great riches he placed over Jesus, breaking the very first commandment Exo 20:3. He may have loved his neighbor and kept the commandments relating to man, but broke the commandments relating love to God. Breaking one of the commandments is like breaking them all James 2:10-12

Abstracty anything that gets in the way of God is an idol but the point of the text is not to use the first commandment of the 10 as a catch all for anything that that isn't said explicitly.

Broadly I agree, money probably was an idol for the rich man, and matters of idolatry are in fact issues of the heart. We could also say anger is an idol too, or looking lustfully at another women is also an idol. We could say stealing, murdering and lying are idols as well or dishorning your parents is an idol, etc... Certainly abstractly this is all correct, and the 10 commaments may be condensed all into the 1st commandment using this logic because it's all describing forms of idolatry. But that's not the design of the 10 or how it was approached and idolatry was look at more pragmatically.

When Jesus was ask which was the greatest he draws from outside the 10 so this would conflict with the idea that we may use the 1st as a catch all when Jesus himself tells us a greater commandment, then goes on saying "all of the law and the prophets hang on these two..." That's a bit of a mic drop statement as counter-proof that the first should be seen as a catch all.

The point of the text (Mat 19) establishes that the man kept the commandments and Jesus used this to challenge his thinking beyond these commandments looking at matters of the heart.

Thats right, the curses and blessings for keeping the Ten Commandments was written in the book that was placed outside the ark as a witness against Deut 31:24-26 for breaking what was inside God's finger-written commandments that no one has greater authority over. Not sure why people argue against this, its very strange.

I think you are missing the "and" which means in addition to, not the same as.

You're isolating laws that Jesus does not and supper imposing labels on them not found in the bible. The word "and" is not as transformative as you suppose it is in the text. Jesus only speaks of God's commandments, there is no other context and no need to superimposed another kind of law not mentioned over this text. Jesus was addressing God's commandments and nothing else, so that's what he spoke of.

God wrote, God spoke and God placed inside the ark and He added no more to them. Deut 5:22 If you think God's perfect law is incomplete, that's something you will have to take up with Him. While there are other laws we should keep, the Ten Commandments will always be part of God's commandments His children should keep through love and faith.

The tablets of covenant law are placed in the ark of the covenant. These are explicitly addressed with covenant boundaries. We are under a new covenant which is not the old covenant of Mt Sinai. Shaming me saying I don't think God's law is perfect is a bully move and is not critically engaging the the topic. Every act of God is perfect but that doesn't mean we have authority to isolate them outside of their context they are made in and declare them as universal.

Christ tells us he came to fulfill law, and he gives us the greatest commandments that are echoed by the NT authors and viewed as fulfillment of the entire law.

The thing with law (even the 10) everything gets more abstract in the new. Murder is about anger, adultery is about a lustful look end everything may be summed up by loving your neighbour as yourself.

The new covenant teaches us the priesthood of all believers (1 Pe 2:5–9) yet priests could work on the Sabbath as Jesus highlights in May 12:5 "Haven’t you read in the Law that the priests on Sabbath duty in the temple desecrate the Sabbath and yet are innocent?" ("desecrate" is Christ's words not mine) Our role of priests is "that [we] may declare the praises of [Christ] who called [us] out of darkness into his wonderful light." (1 Pe 2:9) And by doing so we spread this light which is the gospel.

This is our mission, it is for all days not just one, it is for all believers not just a select few and it may be through all actions even those traditional ones called "work". Our duties of the priesthood under Christ redeem our actions as lawful. Christ tells is in May 12:12 that doing good is lawful on the sabbath. So why not just do good and not worry about the rest?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Abstracty anything that gets in the way of God is an idol but the point of the text is not to use the first commandment of the 10 as a catch all for anything that that isn't said explicitly.

Broadly I agree, money probably was an idol for the rich man, and matters of idolatry are in fact issues of the heart. We could also say anger is an idol too, or looking lustfully at another women is also an idol. We could say stealing, murdering and lying are idols as well or dishorning your parents is an idol, etc... Certainly abstractly this is all correct, and the 10 commaments may be condensed all into the 1st commandment using this logic because it's all describing forms of idolatry. But that's not the design of the 10 or how it was approached and idolatry was look at more pragmatically.

When Jesus was ask which was the greatest he draws from outside the 10 so this would conflict with the idea that we may use the 1st as a catch all when Jesus himself tells us a greater commandment, then goes on saying "all of the law and the prophets hang on these two..." That's a bit of a mic drop statement as counter-proof that the first should be seen as a catch all.

The point of the text (Mat 19) establishes that the man kept the commandments and Jesus used this to challenge his thinking beyond these commandments looking at matters of the heart.



You're isolating laws that Jesus does not and supper imposing labels on them not found in the bible. The word "and" is not as transformative as you suppose it is in the text. Jesus only speaks of God's commandments, there is no other context and no need to superimposed another kind of law not mentioned over this text. Jesus was addressing God's commandments and nothing else, so that's what he spoke of.


The tablets of covenant law are placed in the ark of the covenant. These are explicitly addressed with covenant boundaries. We are under a new covenant which is not the old covenant of Mt Sinai. Shaming me saying I don't think God's law is perfect is a bully move and is not critically engaging the the topic. Every act of God is perfect but that doesn't mean we have authority to isolate them outside of their context they are made in and declare them as universal.

Christ tells us he came to fulfill law, and he gives us the greatest commandments that are echoed by the NT authors and viewed as fulfillment of the entire law.

The thing with law (even the 10) everything gets more abstract in the new. Murder is about anger, adultery is about a lustful look end everything may be summed up by loving your neighbour as yourself.

The new covenant teaches us the priesthood of all believers (1 Pe 2:5–9) yet priests could work on the Sabbath as Jesus highlights in May 12:5 "Haven’t you read in the Law that the priests on Sabbath duty in the temple desecrate the Sabbath and yet are innocent?" ("desecrate" is Christ's words not mine) Our role of priests is "that [we] may declare the praises of [Christ] who called [us] out of darkness into his wonderful light." (1 Pe 2:9) And by doing so we spread this light which is the gospel.

This is our mission, it is for all days not just one, it is for all believers not just a select few and it may be through all actions even those traditional ones called "work". Our duties of the priesthood under Christ redeem our actions as lawful. Christ tells is in May 12:12 that doing good is lawful on the sabbath. So why not just do good and not worry about the rest?

Our mission should be to love and obey God the way He asks, not the way we think is best. Its why we are in this whole mess. Adam and Eve thought a tree was just a tree, but by their disobedience to God, it changed everything. People think the Sabbath is just another day, but sadly do not realize what it does to Christ Eze 22:26

I guess we will all find out soon enough if God meant what He said. I think He does, so my faith is in what He said not the popular teachings of man.

 

[Aaron112]

Not sure why people argue against this, its very strange.

The whole world's prefering Sinful pleasure in popular disobedience for people's approval instead of caring about God's approval. (not safe to do)

 

[SabbathBlessings]

The whole world's prefering Sinful pleasure in popular disobedience for people's approval instead of caring about God's approval. (not safe to do)

The whole purpose is to follow God. God the Creator of the Universe came down from heaven to personally and divinely write His holy and perfect law and how people can come to the conclusion we don't have to keep, or man can edit it when we are told clearly not a jot or tittle can pass as if man could possibly improve on what God wrote. It's really mind-blowing to me.