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Australian "If you're listening" - America's Last Election. Part 1: The Hammer and Scorecard - and those who fell for The Big Lie!

BCP1928

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Of course the Federal government mandates morals. Roe v Wade is all about a moral issue, the rights of the mother vs the rights of the unborn child. Abortion is still legal, but those who feel that it is killing a person don't feel like the government shouldn't pay for such services.

When the Federal government tells churches they can't speak out about certain sins, then they are issuing a new set of moral commandments.
The laws of a secular state are not moral statements, they are just rules we must follow. They may reflect the moral sentiments of those who craft them but they are not, in themselves, moral statements even if they contradict the moral sentiments of some of the citizens.
 
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HarleyER

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The laws of a secular state are not moral statements, they are just rules we must follow. They may reflect the moral sentiments of those who craft them but they are not, in themselves, moral statements even if they contradict the moral sentiments of some of the citizens.
"...they are just rules we must follow". How nice this sounds but how totally wrong in practice. First, these aren't rules. They are laws. Second, if you don't follow these laws one could be thrown into jail or fine so heavily that they lose everything.

Some REAL examples:

If the law of a secular state states that any statement against homosexuality is a "hate crime" and those making such a statement will be thrown into jail, then that is an example of the government trying to legislate moral values. If I don't agree with their view on homosexuality, then they will remove me from society or fine me by taking away my livelihood. Case in point, a baker doesn't feel right in making a wedding cake for a same sex couple. Instead of just going down the street to another bakery, he is sued (three times) for his views.​

If I'm a shop owner and the government says it's OK to walk into my store and steal up to $1000, then the government is saying that it's OK to steal from me.​

These are a few of the moral statements that are happening right now. They are not just rules to be followed. Their moral views are transferred to law. You must obey the government's beliefs, codified in laws, or you will be punished. So, either I accept transgenders on a opposing soccer team and risk bodily injury, or forfeit the game (or not play). If one speak out about it, stating how males are bigger and stronger than females, then they're the bad homophobic guy or gal. (Surprisingly, or perhaps not, evolutionists don't seem to want to take a side in this issue.)

Those crafting these laws are trying to change social behavior to make others accept what they disagree with. One can either shut up and go along with the program or face the consequences. Those laws ARE making a moral statement. They are not simply "rules" from a game of Monopoly.
 
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eclipsenow

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Project 2025:

Project 2025 is a proposed presidential transition project that is composed of four pillars: a policy guide for the next presidential administration; a LinkedIn-style database of personnel who could serve in the next administration; training for that pool of candidates dubbed the "Presidential Administration Academy;" and a playbook of actions to be taken within the first 180 days in office.​

Wow!!! How devious. This is serious!!! Someone who has an organization plan! Why didn't the Democrats think about this?
Of course you'd think of it like that. But here is a PDF listing the top 10 nastiest environmental consequences of Project 2025, and here is a Snopes report:


Key Points of The Roughly 1,000-Page Document​

Speaking to Politico, Russell Vought, who served as the director of the Office of Management and Budget under Trump and is now a leading adviser for Project 2025, once described the effort as "more systematic than it is just about Trump," adding, "We have to be thinking mechanically about how to take these institutions over" in reference to federal departments.

Project 2025's document lays out in great detail how supporters want to do that. As of early June 2024, about 855,000 people had downloaded the document, The New York Times reported.

Among its numerous recommendations, it calls for the following (in no particular order):

  • Changing how the FBI operates. According to the plan, the agency is "completely out of control," and the next conservative administration should restore its reputation by stopping investigations that are supposedly "unlawful or contrary to the national interest." Also, the document calls for legislation that would eliminate term limits for the FBI's director and require that person to answer to the president.
  • Eliminating the Department of Education. The plan explicitly proposes, "Federal education policy should be limited and, ultimately, the federal Department of Education should be eliminated." The report also calls for bans on so-called "critical race theory" (CRT) and "gender ideology" lessons in public schools, asking for legislation that would require educators who share such material to register as sex offenders and be imprisoned.
  • Defunding the Department of Justice. Additionally, the document proposes prosecuting federal election-related charges as criminal, not civil, cases. Otherwise, the document says, "[Voter] registration fraud and unlawful ballot correction will remain federal election offenses that are never appropriately investigated and prosecuted."
  • Reversing Biden-era policies attempting to reduce climate change. The document's authors call for increasing the country's reliance on fossil fuels and withdrawing from efforts to address the climate crisis — such as "offices, programs, and directives designed to advance the Paris Climate Agreement."
  • Stopping cybersecurity efforts to combat mis- and disinformation. The document recommends the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency to stop its efforts to curtail online propaganda campaigns, arguing the federal government should not make judgment calls on what's true and what isn't.
  • Changing immigration policies. Authors want the federal government to deprioritize DACA (Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals), the program that temporarily delays the deportation of immigrants without documentation who came to the U.S. as children; phase out temporary work-visa programs that allow seasonal employers to hire foreign workers; impose financial punishments on so-called "sanctuary cities" that do not follow federal immigration laws, and divert tax dollars toward security at America's border with Mexico. (While the Biden campaign claims Project 2025 calls for "ripping mothers away from their children" at the border, there's no explicit mention of separating families. Rather, it calls for stronger enforcement of laws governing the detainment of immigrants with criminal records and restricting an existing program that tracks people in deportation proceedings instead of incarcerating them. In some cases, those changes could possibly play a role in border control agents detaining a parent while their child continues with immigration proceedings.)
  • Restricting access to abortion. The plan wants the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) to stop promoting abortion as health care. Additionally, Project 2025 recommends the Federal Drug Administration (FDA) to stop promoting, and approving, requests for manufacturing abortion pills. "Alternative options to abortion, especially adoption, should receive federal and state support," the document states.
  • Removing LGBTQ+ protections. The plan calls for abolishing the Gender Policy Council, a Biden-created department within the White House that aims to "advance equity in government policy for those who face discrimination." Also, the proposal wants the federal government to remove terms such as "sexual orientation" and "gender identity" from records and policies, as well as rescind policies that prohibit discrimination on the basis of "sexual orientation, gender identity, transgender status, and sex characteristics."
  • Cutting ties completely with China. For instance, the document advocates for restricting people's access to TikTok because of its China-based parent company; prohibiting Confucius Institutes, cultural institutions at colleges and universities funded by the Chinese government, and blocking other Chinese entities from partnering with U.S. companies.
  • Reversing protections against discrimination in housing. The Biden campaign emails reference a portion of the document that calls for repealing a decades-old policy—strengthened under Biden—that attempts to prevent discrimination and reduce racial disparities in housing. Project 2025 also recommends making it easier to sell off homes used for public housing — a benefit to real estate developers — but result in fewer cheap housing options for poor and low-income families.


Trump's attempts to distance himself from Project 2025 are all lies. What's new with this guy?

The climate denial bits are funded by you-know-how - dirty corporations with enormous turnover or who are of course big oil. What's new with these corporations?

They really ARE going to shut down the Department of Education. What's their alternative?

Big cuts to FEMA - because helping poor people hurt by the increasing natural disasters of climate change is ... robbery ... because "My taxes my money" or something. (A REALLY Christian and compassionate concept of the right! :oldthumbsup: :doh: )



Well, let's see. Trump has had three assassination attempts on him,
Appalling! Utterly irrelevant to what we are talking about - but appalling!

See - the subject is the best way to ensure a democracy is fairly representative, which from my Australian experience seems to be 3 simple ingredients I summarise as every Democracy needs a good COP:-

Democracy COP​


Compulsory voting: so politicians must appeal to the bored middle, not just the frenzied extremes who are so over-excited about their paranoid theories they've just GOT to get out and vote on an "Inconvenient Tuesday." Even if it cost's them a day's wages because so many people in America are casual employees with no time off to do something as trivial and unimportant to the country as "vote".

Objective & Impartial Federal Commission: is responsible for administering fair and consistent election processes across the nation to limit charges of corruption or unfairness in different States and districts. We don't let State legislatures administer voting because it creates an incentive to corrupt and bias the processes to favour the incumbents or allies of incumbents. EG: Gerrymandering is RIFE in America, but Australia's Electoral Commission creates large 'blobs' of amalgamated suburbs that are drawn up to meet constitutionally defined statistics as the populations shift. Sydney lost a State electorate Seat recently as our population had not grown as much as Western Australia's - so there was a redrawing and shifting of some boundaries. But there are no crazy "Salamander Monster" seats like Gerry's! :oldthumbsup:

Polling Places everywhere: I've seen Current Affairs shows on electoral booths in America where black neighbourhoods had to queue in the sun for 6 to 8 hours just to vote! That is an obscene abuse of the electoral system! In Australia everyone has abundant pre-polling booths open in the weeks up to the election, abundant mail options and ads across the media and in the mail, and abundant polling booths on the Saturday election. It's a fun community outing at your local school or town hall - and you WILL meet people you know, smile, wave, and maybe enjoy a Democracy Sausage.

Attempted Shootings of Trump​


This cannot happen as easily in Australia because we have vastly stricter gun laws! See - when we had a horrific gun massacre - we banned huge categories of guns. As a nation we watched in horror as stories from the Port Arthur massacre unfolded - and the government said "No more Guns!" and we said, "Yeah, fair enough - that massacre thing was rubbish - let's not do that again!" But in America - with your founding myths of Revolution and needing (muskets?) to cast off the British - it now seems any teenager or 20's something can drive around in a pick up truck carrying submachine guns! What happened to a 'well organised militia'? Why is it individuals keeping it in their homes and not some local neighbourhood gun club and militia with a Sergeant at Arms locking them away after drill?

You want guns to protect you in case "that their guv-ern-myant goes bad!" Hitler, or something. But what about the fact that you lose 30 to 40 thousand people a year to gun violence - 18 times more than the OECD average? Putin's funding seperatists in Eastern Ukraine from 2014 to 2024 across a decade 'only' cost an estimated 14,000 lives. And that's a foreign power trying to destabilise a region through a 'proxy' funded 'civil war'! You guys manage to kill TWICE THAT ANNUALLY by bowing to national gun lobby's. After all, corporations gotta make money right?


Gun laws in Australia are predominantly within the jurisdiction of Australian states and territories, with the importation of guns regulated by the federal government. In the last two decades of the 20th century, following several high-profile killing sprees, the federal government coordinated more restrictive firearms legislation with all state governments.​
Gun laws were largely aligned in 1996 by the National Firearms Agreement. In two federally funded gun buybacks and voluntary surrenders and State Governments' gun amnesties before and after the Port Arthur Massacre, more than a million firearms were collected and destroyed, possibly a third of the national stock.[1]
A person must have a firearm licence to possess or use a firearm. Licence holders must demonstrate a "genuine reason" (which does not include self-defence) for holding a firearm licence[2] and must not be a "prohibited person". All firearms must be registered by serial number to the owner.​
In December 2023 National Cabinet agreed to implement a national firearms register within four years.[3]

a sham trial in which he wasn't allowed to call any witnesses
Really? Which trial? He's had so many lately.


and then fine $435 million dollars for paying hush money to keep it quiet from his wife,
Oh - and the little detail that it's illegal to keep it from the American people in an election. But then - wrestling with the real world of laws and democratic norms isn't really Fox territory, is it?


constant badgering from others lawyers (that often are thrown out), and a slanted media coverage.
Of course! We must all go back to watching Fox - the only 'unbiased' news source! That's why they had to pay over $787.5 million rather than claim innocence and push forward. Rupert knew they’d done the wrong thing, knew they'd lose the case - and even acknowledged the FACTS - and said “he believed the 2020 election was fair and had not been stolen from Trump.” https://apnews.com/article/fox-news...l-trump-2020-0ac71f75acfacc52ea80b3e747fb0afe

But have we heard Fox state this repeatedly and clearly so Republicans can finally have a chance to "Believe" in their electoral system?
That's why I don't think of Fox as a "news" channel. They're Trump Agit Prop. That's all.

The Russian hoax came from the Hillary campaign. FBI, CIA, and NSA directors that deliberately lied to Congress about their role. And some continue to perpetrate this hoax. I'm sure your ABC friend didn't spend much time looking into this. Ho-hum. It just another instance of bias reporting.
Assertions are not evidence.

Meanwhile, you have Russia, China, and Iran all endorsing Harris, all the while Harris is receiving 50% more in funds, much from sources unknown (dark money).
First - every nation pretty much has the political line of "We'll work with whoever our new 'friend' in the Whitehouse is." That's just realpolitik when you have the biggest economy and military in the world.

Second - assertions without evidence. I've submitted actual proof that you have NOT managed to dismiss with your conspiracy assertions. Assertions are not evidence, no matter how much you click your ruby slippers together and chant 3 times. We can all see the magic-hand-waving for what it is. You attempting to make Inconvenient Truths just go away.

And you want to tell me Trump is receiving money from Russia.
No - I was telling you Russia had a vested interest in Trump being elected because Trump loves dictators. So Russia didn't pay Trump - they paid Alt-right youtubers. And I'm not telling you - countless investigative journalists and ultimately the DOJ are telling you. But you have these to just wish it all away.
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JSRG

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While there is much truth with what you've stated, I'm not sure I would agree with your basic assessment that these things cannot be attributed to the Australia's system of government. The Australia government enacted these laws, so they are responsible.

When I said "system of government" I meant the way the government was set up; how people are elected or given positions in government, how laws are passed, what the responsibilities and powers are for each position in government, that sort of thing. It probably would've been more clear if I said structure instead of system. You appeared to be blaming the policies of Australia's government you disliked on the structure of the government, and I was saying that I disagreed with the idea you can blame them on their governmental structure.
 
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eclipsenow

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When I said "system of government" I meant the way the government was set up; how people are elected or given positions in government, how laws are passed, what the responsibilities and powers are for each position in government, that sort of thing. It probably would've been more clear if I said structure instead of system. You appeared to be blaming the policies of Australia's government you disliked on the structure of the government, and I was saying that I disagreed with the idea you can blame them on their governmental structure.
I know right? There's an interaction between the systems of democracy and some of the outcomes - but it is not always direct.

But it's all good - because Harley likes Trump and thinks Project 2025 is fine. Trump's assured all his MAGA Christians that once they vote this one more time - he will fix it so they never have to vote again. Problem solved!
 
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HarleyER

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Wow, what a list. I guess I must have hit some buttons on that post. Let's see if I can hit a few of the highlights.

and here is a Snopes report:

Snopes has never been objective in their views so I take what they have to say with a grain of salt (as we old timers say in America). However, going through their list, and disregarding the obvious slanted titles deliberately meant to inflame, I don't see anything that I would disagree with. However, I seriously doubt if Trump wants to "defund" the DOJ. This has been the pattern of the Democrats, "defund the police". So this is what is called projection, where someone projects their crazy policies on their opponent. Democrats what to defund the police (which is widely unpopular), so they up the antics and say Republicans want to defund the DOJ.

Trump's attempts to distance himself from Project 2025 are all lies. What's new with this guy?

You stated this, not I. If Trump doesn't support Project 2025, what evidence do you have that he is lying?

The climate denial bits are funded by you-know-how - dirty corporations with enormous turnover or who are of course big oil.

Oh, nasty oil companies. That hasn't stopped Australia from importing oil from other countries. Why, I bet you even use oil in some form.

And, being a climate denier, I can assure you that I'm not being funded by big oil.

Hey, I was reading where an electric fire engine caught fire and burned down the entire brand new fire station in Germany at a cost of $24 million euros. Of course the papers were saying the fire station wasn't equip with a fire alarm and didn't want to blame the faulty electric fire engine. After all, firemen can't tell a fire if there is no alarm. Just a caution. Don't park your EV in your garage.

You want guns to protect you in case "that their guv-ern-myant goes bad!"

No, I want to have my guns so that when the government takes away the police (which they are doing) and allow gang members to come across the border, then I can protect my family and myself.

We have a very different set of problems then Australia.

Of course! We must all go back to watching Fox - the only 'unbiased' news source!

Do you watch Fox? It might please you to know that I don't watch TV news. I occasionally read the news from various sources if I can stomach it. There is too much craziness in the world for me. Common sense has been erased.

Second - assertions without evidence. I've submitted actual proof that you have NOT managed to dismiss with your conspiracy assertions.

So, with Trump you can make the assertion that he supports Project 2025 and Russian influence without any evidence and with Hillary I'm a wacko crazy conspiracy nut. Yes, there is evidence for Hillary generating a false narrative that Trump had Russian connections. It is simply that some don't want to hear it any more than the Bidens connections with China. And the running Democrat VP-Waltz has a rolladex full of Chinese numbers. So, please let's drop the righteous indignation.

No - I was telling you Russia had a vested interest in Trump being elected because Trump loves dictators.

This makes no sense. If Russia had a vested interest in Trump, then why would they along with China, Iran, the US Communist Party, etc. endorse Harris? Or is this some very clever slight of hand trick to really get people to vote for Trump.
 
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HarleyER

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When I said "system of government" I meant the way the government was set up; how people are elected or given positions in government, how laws are passed, what the responsibilities and powers are for each position in government, that sort of thing. It probably would've been more clear if I said structure instead of system. You appeared to be blaming the policies of Australia's government you disliked on the structure of the government, and I was saying that I disagreed with the idea you can blame them on their governmental structure.
I agree in part with what you are saying. The rest shows that I'm not being very clear.

I'm not blaming the Australia government structure any more than I would blame the policies of China on the Chinese government. The structure of government doesn't matter. My contention is that government policies and regulations, regardless of the government structure, are manipulated by other forces, often unseen, that shape those policies and regulations. The fact that similar policies are being enacted throughout various and diversed governments, regardless of their structure, is an indication that something is going on that is beyond the norm of independent and autonomous governments.

Trump, with his nationalistic platform MAGA (Make America Great Again), shows a threat to whoever is pulling the strings. After all, MAGA is purported to be a dirty word. They do not want independent and autonomous governments. So, Trump is a threat and they will try everything they can do to stop him. And, in the event he is successful and gets into office, they will still try to stop him much like they did in his first term.

The policies and laws being enacted throughout the world isn't about ideology. It;s about control. All you have to do is control the information and brainwash enough people to think the way you do. Consequently, if you read an article on ABC, CBS, NBC, etc, they all read virtually the same, frequently using the same, exact language. But who are those who want to control?

It really is the sequel of 1984 being played out. I wonder if anyone remembers the movie any longer.
 
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hedrick

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That was a tragedy for the young woman, and I certainly oppose a school policy which would allow it to happen. But it just doesn't seem like a national political issue.
Biden's guidance for schools allows exceptions for safety and fairness issues. It forbids across the board rules excluding transgender students frolm sports, but allows judgements that individual sports should have restrictions. States may have stronger rules, but Biden / Harris are not to blame if a school puts a student into a situation that is unsafe. Incidentally, title IX has rules about discrimination, but they exclude sports. There are separate rules for that.

Here's a summary sectioln from the latest proposed rules from 2024 for sports.

"Under the proposed regulation, schools would not be permitted to adopt or apply a one-size-fits-all policy that categorically bans transgender students from participating on teams consistent with their gender identity.

"Instead, the Department's approach would allow schools flexibility to develop team eligibility criteria that serve important educational objectives, such as ensuring fairness in competition or preventing sports-related injury. These criteria would have to account for the sport, level of competition, and grade or education level to which they apply. These criteria could not be premised on disapproval of transgender students or a desire to harm a particular student. The criteria also would have to minimize harms to students whose opportunity to participate on a male or female team consistent with their gender identity would be limited or denied."

This would prohibit schools from saying transgender students are only pretending, and must play in teams associated with their gender assigned at birth. It would permit schools to say, e.g., that MTF socially transitioned students should not play on women's basketball teams because it's unfair and potentially unsafe. (I say socially transitioned because there are debates about students who have been using hormones for an extended period. I don't know enough about that to comment.)

Age matters, because the difference between genders in elementary school might not be enough to present problems, nor is there a concern about women being able to get sports scholarships.

This is unlikely to make anyone happy. Conservatives don't think transgender identity exists. Trans activitists don'[t want any limitations. But for those not being driven by ideology, this makes sense.
 
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hedrick

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I agree in part with what you are saying. The rest shows that I'm not being very clear.

I'm not blaming the Australia government structure any more than I would blame the policies of China on the Chinese government. The structure of government doesn't matter. My contention is that government policies and regulations, regardless of the government structure, are manipulated by other forces, often unseen, that shape those policies and regulations. The fact that similar policies are being enacted throughout various and diversed governments, regardless of their structure, is an indication that something is going on that is beyond the norm of independent and autonomous governments.

Trump, with his nationalistic platform MAGA (Make America Great Again), shows a threat to whoever is pulling the strings. After all, MAGA is purported to be a dirty word. They do not want independent and autonomous governments. So, Trump is a threat and they will try everything they can do to stop him. And, in the event he is successful and gets into office, they will still try to stop him much like they did in his first term.

The policies and laws being enacted throughout the world isn't about ideology. It;s about control. All you have to do is control the information and brainwash enough people to think the way you do. Consequently, if you read an article on ABC, CBS, NBC, etc, they all read virtually the same, frequently using the same, exact language. But who are those who want to control?

It really is the sequel of 1984 being played out. I wonder if anyone remembers the movie any longer.
Stories are the same because most media don’t have a large reporting staff. Thus they use AP or UPI for most stories. Those are generally considered neutral, though of course peoplevon the right or left conside4 the center to be niased
 
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JSRG

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I know right? There's an interaction between the systems of democracy and some of the outcomes - but it is not always direct.

But it's all good - because Harley likes Trump and thinks Project 2025 is fine.

Project 2025, at least from what I have seen (I certainly haven't read the mammoth volume), does seem to be largely fine. Undoubtedly some things in it are unpopular--it is from a strongly conservative perspective--but so many things that are claimed about it are false or at least exaggerated. This article explains it fairly well, as well as giving examples of lies or exaggerations about Project 2025 from the Democratic National Convention (the author, if anyone is curious, is a conservative who still really dislikes Trump):

Trump's assured all his MAGA Christians that once they vote this one more time - he will fix it so they never have to vote again. Problem solved!
This quote of his is held up, implicitly or explicitly, as if it's Trump saying he'll abolish elections or something. The problem is that the context of his remarks was that he was complaining about how the 2020 election was stolen from him, and that his supporters needed to go out and make sure to vote to give him a win overwhelming enough that even the voter fraud he claims the Democrats engaged in/will engage in couldn't stop him. Then once in office he's fix it so the voter fraud wouldn't happen; this is actually explained in more detail in the above article, see footnote 6. Actually, I'll just paste it all here and bold the most important part for those in a hurry:

For example, there was a recent massive freakout when Trump told a crowd, “Get out and vote! Just this time – you won’t have to do it any more.” Vice-President Harris and ex-Republican Adam Schiff both told audiences that Trump was announcing the permanent end of democracy if he won, which is just dishonest partisan paintball, but then a bunch of “respectable” media sources followed suit. They were grossly distorting the comments, and either they were doing so deliberately, or they were too grossly irresponsible to watch the 90 seconds of surrounding footage to get the context. I watched the tape, so I’ll tell you the context.

Trump was talking, for the minute leading up to this, about how the Democrats "cheat," how they engage in massive voter fraud to run up the score, and how they fight voter ID because they want to facilitate that fraud. He says this means that he can only win if his victory is so big that it's "too big to rig." So he has to get absolutely everybody to vote, it has to be an absolute landslide so the Democrats can't cheat. Once in office, he promises to fix the cheating so that Republicans no longer need to win by such massive margins and low-propensity voters can go back to staying home most times. Therefore "you won't have to vote again."


This is not, in any way, a promise to abolish democratic governance in the United States, and it only sounds remotely like that because most media outlets are deleting all that context! The Guardian article, instead of explaining this, is 100% reactions from other people who very obviously did not watch the 90 seconds leading up to the quote!

The most mind-boggling part of all this is that what Trump actually said is still really really bad! In reality, although some Democrats cheat (and some Republicans cheat), they very rarely cheat in the way Trump describes here, and the impact on the final result is nothing like what Trump suggests. He is, once again, setting up his followers to refuse to accept the democratic legitimacy of a free and fair election that they will very plausibly lose, with predictably terrible consequences for democracy!

But, instead of telling that true story about what Trump said, media has somehow transmuted it into a more sensational yet completely and obviously false story about what Trump said!

This happens all the dang time with Trump. I was already complaining about it on De Civ in 2017. Voters have wised up. They no longer believe what the media reports about Trump, and they are wise not to.

That’s unfortunate, though, because Trump is actually a bad dude, and, when he does actual bad things, like January 6, voters no longer believe it’s real.


(the fact I'm not longer italicizing things should indicate I'm switching back to my own words in this post, but in case that is missed I'll put this note)

I'm reminded of how in 2022, Tim Michels (Republican candidate for governor in Wisconsin) made a statement that the Democrats wouldn't win another election if he was elected governor. The context was that he was saying they wouldn't win again because he'd do such a great job as governor that people wouldn't want to vote for a Democrat... but the media ignored this context and ran with how he was saying he'd rig things so Democrats couldn't win, even though all he was doing was saying he'd be a great and popular governor.
 
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HarleyER

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Stories are the same because most media don’t have a large reporting staff. Thus they use AP or UPI for most stories. Those are generally considered neutral, though of course peoplevon the right or left conside4 the center to be niased
The stories are not neutral. All one has to do is a search on positive/negative stories of Trump/Harris to see this is the case. The stories are virtually always positive for Harris, negative for Trump. When was the last time you saw a negative story on Harris in the AP? Or even a positive story for Trump?

BTW-this only affirm what I've stated. If someone wanted to control the press, then all one would have to do is control a few well placed people who would ensure the news is reported as they wanted. Search engines are simple to manipulate to make sure that all those stories are on the first seven or eight pages of your search, so any rebutal is buried way at the bottom.
 
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eclipsenow

Scripture is God's word, Science is God's works
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Part 2.
What have electors in Hawaii in the 1960's got to do with the 2020 election?
What was the scheme? Who was involved? How did it play out?
What are the consquences?
And will they try it again?

 
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eclipsenow

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Trump was talking, for the minute leading up to this, about how the Democrats "cheat," how they engage in massive voter fraud to run up the score
So the context is Trump was lying again? Call the Newspapers! :doh:


He says this means that he can only win if his victory is so big that it's "too big to rig." So he has to get absolutely everybody to vote, it has to be an absolute landslide so the Democrats can't cheat. Once in office, he promises to fix the cheating so that Republicans no longer need to win by such massive margins and low-propensity voters can go back to staying home most times. Therefore "you won't have to vote again."
He did say that all that - then more.

Are you really asking us to believe he's just saying that Christians will not have to vote ever again? I don't think it sounds like that at all (more below). But even if that is what he meant, how patronising? "We only need you this one time, then you can go away. Oh yeah - and let me play pretend with you all about how wonderful I am!" (EG "I'm a Christian .... MY beautiful Christians.... BLARGH!")

But it really does not sound like that!

"We have to win this election it's the most important election ever. We want a landslide that's too big to rig. If you want to save America, get your friends, get your family, get everyone you know and vote. Vote early, vote absentee, vote on election day I don't care how but you have to get out and vote! And again, Christians, get out and vote, just this time.

You won't have to do it anymore. Four more years, you know what, it will be fixed, it will be fine, you won't have to vote anymore, my beautiful Christians.
I love you Christians. I'm a Christian. I love you, get out, you gotta get out and vote. In four years, you don't have to vote again, we'll have it fixed so good you're not going to have to vote,
This is not, in any way, a promise to abolish democratic governance in the United States, and it only sounds remotely like that because most media outlets are deleting all that context!

you won't have to vote anymore
In four years, you don't have to vote again
we'll have it fixed so good you're not going to have to vote
 
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