Adult film industry jumps into campaign in support of Kamala Harris

[Cosmic Charlie]

P

So she’s Jamaican, Irish, and Indian?

if we're going back five generations I guess so. I don't know what you'd find if you went back five generation on me.

 

[Wolseley]

P

if we're going back five generations I guess so. I don't know what you'd find if you went back five generation on me.

LOL. I'm sorry to hear that, Charlie. Now me? Easy:

---English, from Manchester;
---German, from Alsace;
---Scots, from the Isle of Skye; and
---Irish, from County Kildare.

In that order.

 

[The Liturgist]

I used telnet*, and even finger. Remember archie, and the sequels of that including veronica and jughead? My first remote connection was using a 600 baud acoustic modem. Wow the changes.

By 'Eternal September' I think you refer to the massive influx of new users in 1993 when AOL opened the floodgates of the internet to millions of savages who had not been inculturated to the often polite but also often unforgiven ways of the internet. Compuserve had a culture that also got blown away by the hordes at the gate and eventually it's hyper-useful fora died out. Google became everyone's friend but then it was discovered that Google's product was not so much search results but you and me.

8 I'd never use telnet any more and I have totally replaced that with SSH and SCP with larger and larger keys.

That’s right. It’s a reference to how before Internet access was opened to the public and commercial companies through the discontinuation of the Acceptable Use Policy, it resulted in a never-ending stream of people lacking in Netiquette, which previously happened only in the dreaded month of september when new undergrad students were admitted to universities with Internet access, but by October most of them had learned the ropes, and the quality of life gradually improved throughout the year until the process repeated it. But for those of us like you and me, who were users of sophisticated, literate UNIX and Internet culture (by then sadly the distinct community on MIT’s ITS system was gone, so most people on the Internet were either using UNIX flavors or VAX/VMS, basically, minicomputer operating systems that were programmer-friendly and had a good TCP/IP suite, and there were a few dinosaur pens (mainframe computer centers) with Internet connections, and other operating systems, and Windows NT would get its own TCP/IP stack, and Win9x would get the BSD stack, and other interesting OSes which got TCP/IP support in that era included OS/2, Amiga and especially BeOS, and then a few people at Bell Labs used the ideal OS for the dial-up era, Plan 9, which was specifically designed to give people the ability to connect to their midrange servers at work, from home, over a slow dial-up connection, and access the compute facilities at Bell Labs as if they were physically present, and the Plan 9 and related Inferno operating systems were brilliant and amazing and the programming language developed at Google was developed by the same group, basically people from the OS group at Bell Labs, particularly Rob Pike, who had developed UNIX to begin with, who were still alive, with even Ken Thompson contributing some code (DMR sadly never moved out west but reposed around that time).

 

[chevyontheriver]

That’s right. It’s a reference to how before Internet access was opened to the public and commercial companies through the discontinuation of the Acceptable Use Policy, it resulted in a never-ending stream of people lacking in Netiquette, which previously happened only in the dreaded month of september when new undergrad students were admitted to universities with Internet access, but by October most of them had learned the ropes, and the quality of life gradually improved throughout the year until the process repeated it. But for those of us like you and me, who were users of sophisticated, literate UNIX and Internet culture (by then sadly the distinct community on MIT’s ITS system was gone, so most people on the Internet were either using UNIX flavors or VAX/VMS, basically, minicomputer operating systems that were programmer-friendly and had a good TCP/IP suite, and there were a few dinosaur pens (mainframe computer centers) with Internet connections, and other operating systems, and Windows NT would get its own TCP/IP stack, and Win9x would get the BSD stack, and other interesting OSes which got TCP/IP support in that era included OS/2, Amiga and especially BeOS, and then a few people at Bell Labs used the ideal OS for the dial-up era, Plan 9, which was specifically designed to give people the ability to connect to their midrange servers at work, from home, over a slow dial-up connection, and access the compute facilities at Bell Labs as if they were physically present, and the Plan 9 and related Inferno operating systems were brilliant and amazing and the programming language developed at Google was developed by the same group, basically people from the OS group at Bell Labs, particularly Rob Pike, who had developed UNIX to begin with, who were still alive, with even Ken Thompson contributing some code (DMR sadly never moved out west but reposed around that time).

I remember truing to get MacTCP after it just came out and the local Apple distributer just couldn't get it for me. So dial up modem until I managed that finally. Once I had it I could get on Compuserve and surf their forums. I think that's when I got the first cable modem. AND there was a product, I forget the name, that I could put in key words and come back the next day to get all of the newswire stories that matched from AP and Reuters and a bunch of international news services. I basically had a read only newswire terminal.

 

[Cosmic Charlie]

That’s right. It’s a reference to how before Internet access was opened to the public and commercial companies through the discontinuation of the Acceptable Use Policy, it resulted in a never-ending stream of people lacking in Netiquette, which previously happened only in the dreaded month of september when new undergrad students were admitted to universities with Internet access, but by October most of them had learned the ropes, and the quality of life gradually improved throughout the year until the process repeated it. But for those of us like you and me, who were users of sophisticated, literate UNIX and Internet culture (by then sadly the distinct community on MIT’s ITS system was gone, so most people on the Internet were either using UNIX flavors or VAX/VMS, basically, minicomputer operating systems that were programmer-friendly and had a good TCP/IP suite, and there were a few dinosaur pens (mainframe computer centers) with Internet connections, and other operating systems, and Windows NT would get its own TCP/IP stack, and Win9x would get the BSD stack, and other interesting OSes which got TCP/IP support in that era included OS/2, Amiga and especially BeOS, and then a few people at Bell Labs used the ideal OS for the dial-up era, Plan 9, which was specifically designed to give people the ability to connect to their midrange servers at work, from home, over a slow dial-up connection, and access the compute facilities at Bell Labs as if they were physically present, and the Plan 9 and related Inferno operating systems were brilliant and amazing and the programming language developed at Google was developed by the same group, basically people from the OS group at Bell Labs, particularly Rob Pike, who had developed UNIX to begin with, who were still alive, with even Ken Thompson contributing some code (DMR sadly never moved out west but reposed around that time).

Hi Liturgist:

I don't know who you are and frankly, don't care. I'm not even sure I want to get into this but a lot of people read my posts and for them, I feel compelled to that this :

This is the second "history" of the internet you've put on this thread and as near as I can tell, it's word salad and likely AI generated junk.

You've conflated several different eras of the ARPAnet/Internet, you've got the history timeline goofed up and claiming things that aren't actually true. As near as I can tell, you're just throwing buzzwords together.

I not only lived the history of ARPA, I actually taught it at college level for several years, and I can tell you FOR SURE:

TCP/IP was standard on ARPAnet (pre-internet) by 1982 and tcp suite itself was considered completed by 1990. Several years before Win98 and Window NT were created. Win98 and WinNT had nothing to do with the development of TCP/IP either on the internet or for general networking systems.

You're completely ignoring the biggest, most important event on the internet: the implementation of the World Wide Web and October 1993 general availability announcement. That is what caused to massive uptick in usage. AOL's USENET availability happened a bit earlier, but how you can ignore the WWW is beyond me. Especially in favor of such relatively obscure things like Plan 9 and UNIX server usage that started a little later.

And, the Internet (nor the APRAnet for that matter) never had a common "Acceptable use agreement". Acceptable use agreements are put in place by individual organizations and the network itself never had a common agreement on usage beyond the Defense department guidelines, and they disappeared when Congress took the ARPAnet away from the defense department in 1988 and put the internet into general usage. So we're clear: look them up, the defense department guidelines had nothing to do with netiquette, but were rather a set of rules for building and connecting to the network.

The history of the internet is surprisingly straight forward, and this Wikipedia page is a very good summary:

History of the Internet - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I tell people, there have always been two constants on the internet:

Hackers and porn.

On this big interwebs for ours, we've never been safe from either. It's the reason the DoD wanted to shut it down in 1982.

Thankfully the junior Senator for Tennessee wouldn't let them.

Or not, I'm ambivalent on the subject.

 

[The Liturgist]

TCP/IP was standard on ARPAnet (pre-internet) by 1982 and tcp suite itself was considered completed by 1990. Several years before Win98 and Window NT were created. Win98 and WinNT had nothing to do with the development of TCP/IP either on the internet or for general networking systems.

I never said they had anything to do with the development of the TCP/IP stack. Indeed, MS was so notoriously late to the party, and Windows NT drivers would not have worked with Windows 9x, so for Windows 95/98/ME, they used the BSD TCP/IP stack, which was the most mature IP stack of its time.

What did I write that made you think that I said Windows was involved in the development of TCP/IP? Because that was not what I was trying to say.

 

[The Liturgist]

You're completely ignoring the biggest, most important event on the internet: the implementation of the World Wide Web and October 1993 general availability announcement. That is what caused to massive uptick in usage. AOL's USENET availability happened a bit earlier, but how you can ignore the WWW is beyond me. Especially in favor of such relatively obscure things like Plan 9 and UNIX server usage that started a little later.

The Implemention of the World Wide Web occurred only after IPv4 had reached a level of maturity, and is an application level protocol. Some people like it more than others. However, the Internet predated the Web and Sir Tim Berners-Lee.

By the way Sir Tim implemented the Web on a NeXT machine running NeXT OS, a UNIX-like operating system with a FreeBSD userland and a Mach-based Microkernel, that later was mated to the Carbon subset of the MacOS Classic API to become Mac OS X, which has since been turned into other derivative products by Apple. The NeXT OS itself had a quite different UI called NextStep, which later was open sourced as OpenStep, and one can still find derivatives of it used on fringe communities on Linux systems to this day.

 

[The Liturgist]

I tell people, there have always been two constants on the internet:

Hackers and porn.

Before the web the transfer of porn over the Internet did happen, but even university connections were not supremely fast back then, but suffice it to say there is a very good reason why most Usenet providers dropped access to alt.binaries

There were also criminal hackers, but the fact you appear to be using the word “hacker” to refer to them suggests you were not a part of the legitimate hacker culture that actually developed much of the Internet infrastructure, for example, the routing protocols, networking stacks, et cetera, who were associated with the ITS users on the PDP-10 minicomputers at MIT, like esr and rms, or with BSD at Berkeley or the WAITS system at Stanford, which were some of the earliest ARPANET sites to be connected. Among people who worked on the Internet in a serious way back then, what the general public calls a “Hacker”, they call a “cracker” for criminal hacker, since that represents a dark subset of the broader hacker culture responsible for such things as open source software.

 

[Cosmic Charlie]

I never said they had anything to do with the development of the TCP/IP stack. Indeed, MS was so notoriously late to the party, and Windows NT drivers would not have worked with Windows 9x, so for Windows 95/98/ME, they used the BSD TCP/IP stack, which was the most mature IP stack of its time.

What did I write that made you think that I said Windows was involved in the development of TCP/IP? Because that was not what I was trying to say.

I don't know that I'd call MS "late to the party" given that they were part of the PC architecture group that created the modern open source PC.

And, of course, NT drivers won't work with Window 9x, they are different operating systems. I don't really understand your point.

But you keep making it.

The Implemention of the World Wide Web occurred only after IPv4 had reached a level of maturity, and is an application level protocol. Some people like it more than others. However, the Internet predated the Web and Sir Tim Berners-Lee.

Yeah, I think I just said that.

By the way Sir Tim implemented the Web on a NeXT machine running NeXT OS, a UNIX-like operating system with a FreeBSD userland and a Mach-based Microkernel, that later was mated to the Carbon subset of the MacOS Classic API to become Mac OS X, which has since been turned into other derivative products by Apple.

Yeah, I have a picture of the server running the initial implementation of the Web at CERN.

And, why does the rest of this matter ? Tracing the history of Apple software seem like the kind of pointless word salad that makes me think this is AI generated in the first place.

The NeXT OS itself had a quite different UI called NextStep, which later was open sourced as OpenStep, and one can still find derivatives of it used on fringe communities on Linux systems to this day.

....and, again
.....what is your point ?

Before the web the transfer of porn over the Internet did happen, but even university connections were not supremely fast back then, but suffice it to say there is a very good reason why most Usenet providers dropped access to alt.binaries

Not in my experience. I got most of my information off the internet from alt.binaires up until about 2000. The alt.binaries were by far the biggest set of Usenet lists out there.

There were also criminal hackers, but the fact you appear to be using the word “hacker” to refer to them suggests you were not a part of the legitimate hacker culture that actually developed much of the Internet infrastructure, for example, the routing protocols, networking stacks, et cetera, who were associated with the ITS users on the PDP-10 minicomputers at MIT, like esr and rms, or with BSD at Berkeley or the WAITS system at Stanford, which were some of the earliest ARPANET sites to be connected.

This minute attention to meaningless details is another reason I'm convinced this is AI junk.

1) No one cares,

and more to the point

2) This sentence is over 80 words long, and has no coherent subject. Also,

3) "Hackers" didn't create routing protocols. Good lord, we're talking about seriously sophisticated communications systems that had to be implemented system-wide to work. This is the work of engineers and project managers.

Among people who worked on the Internet in a serious way back then, what the general public calls a “Hacker”, they call a “cracker” for criminal hacker, since that represents a dark subset of the broader hacker culture responsible for such things as open source software.

Here, again, you're missing the point:

Open source software was mandated as part of the DoD guidelines under DAPRA. If you used the network to develop something, it should be made available to everyone on the network. That was the whole point of APRAnet: collaboration. A lot of this work was done by Rand Corporation, IBM, Xerox and Bell Labs. Calling people like Donald Knuth and Admiral Hopper "Hackers" is an insult, no matter how you define the word.

But I'll grant you this, and I get into arguments about it all the time: To me there is no difference between hacker and cracker. If you're doing something you're not supposed to be doing, you're a criminal. Therefore, a hacker.

There are just people who are my kind of criminal. At least I admit it.

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AND NOW, SOMETHING JUST FOR ANYONE WHO MADE IT THIS FAR ON THIS STUPID THREAD:

Just for giggles and grins, the very first website ever put on the World Wide Web. Basically, it just says the Web is a thing and has some resource links, most of which still work.

The World Wide Web project