Kansas votes 62% to retain the right to access an abortion in its constitution.

[Bradskii]

It’s fine (and good even) that you think that there would have to be a Creator (and/or God) for the universe make more sense to you.

I like to think that we humans are happy accidents that “happened” because of the way chemicals play with one another and we get to discover “the real truth®️™️” how ever we chance across it.

Enjoy your evening.

There was a short story by Asimov called 'The Last Question' which explains where we all came from. It's a short read - about 20 minutes maybe. Worth the effort.

The Last Question – Original Text | shortsonline

The last question was asked for the first time, half in jest, on May 21, 2061, at a time when humanity first stepped into the light.

xpressenglish.com

 

[Pommer]

There was a short story by Arthur C Clarke called 'The Last Question' which explains where we all came from. It's a short read - about 20 minutes maybe. Worth the effort.

The Last Question – Original Text | shortsonline

The last question was asked for the first time, half in jest, on May 21, 2061, at a time when humanity first stepped into the light.

xpressenglish.com

Link sez “Asimov”, but okay, listening to it now.

EDIT: “descendants” from ~22000 years from now are still using “years” as a time-unit, even though the interstellar-traveling society would have moved away from ”years” as a “measurement of time” since other planets would undoubtedly have differing orbital time-periods.

The second [...] is defined by taking the fixed numerical value of the caesium frequency, ΔνCs, the unperturbed ground-statehyperfine transition frequency of the caesium 133 atom, to be 9192631770 when expressed in the unit Hz, which is equal to s−1.

This is true in our universe and anywhere a caesium 133 vibrates 9192631770 cycles, will equal one-second.
Thus, it is the unit of time that would be used for ages, like when the two future humans were comparing ages and one said they were “two hundred and twenty-three” they’d’ve said something more along the lines of “6.954” (billion, [1000 million for older British folk], seconds since the standard doesn’t rely on celestial events as a basis for its measurement of time.

I do hold to the belief that time “ebbs and flows”, and even though the frequency of a caesium 133 atom is always going to be 9192631770, that’s always going to = 1 second, yet, since one cannot have time without matter being present*, the first ~380,000 “years” didn’t “exist” to our quantum-level subatomic particles.
Yes, “something happened” and the universe was birthed, and some non-zero “time” later the first atoms appeared, but not from the “view” of the atoms.


*interesting rabbit-hole

 

[Bradskii]

Link sez “Asimov”, but okay, listening to it now.

Ah, my bad. No wonder I had trouble finding it...

 

[RileyG]

It’s fine (and good even) that you think that there would have to be a Creator (and/or God) for the universe make more sense to you.

I like to think that we humans are happy accidents that “happened” because of the way chemicals play with one another and we get to discover “the real truth®️™️” how ever we chance across it.

Enjoy your evening.

Thank you. You too.

 

[rjs330]

It is certainly beyond anything our brains evolved to be able to handle. Just like we can't imagine an actual nothing.

Just like God is beyond anything our brains can handle.

It's difficult to think of a being who could create all there is out of nothing.

 

[Belk]

Just like God is beyond anything our brains can handle.

It's difficult to think of a being who could create all there is out of nothing.

Indeed. I always get a chuckle out of Christians who will, without any awareness of the contradiction, tell me that God is beyond comprehension and here is what he thinks about subject "X".

 

[NxNW]

Just like God is beyond anything our brains can handle.

It's difficult to think of a being who could create all there is out of nothing.

Like I said, "all there is" seems to add up to nothing.

 

[RileyG]

Indeed. I always get a chuckle out of Christians who will, without any awareness of the contradiction, tell me that God is beyond comprehension and here is what he thinks about subject "X".

We are finite humans. According to Christian theology, we can only know about God what he reveals himself to us....but that's a whole different topic

 

[rjs330]

Indeed. I always get a chuckle out of Christians who will, without any awareness of the contradiction, tell me that God is beyond comprehension and here is what he thinks about subject "X".

You shouldn't get a chuckle about that at all. Because what God thinks about X may be defined in scripture. So we certainly CAN know ehat he thinks about X. It may be incomprehensible why he thinks that way or why he does certain things because if he doesn't say we can't know. If we didn't have scriptures to tell us rhen we wouldn't know. So there is NO contradiction at all.

I find it interesting that you don't k ow this for all the time you spend on these boards.

 

[rjs330]

Have you ever given this more than absolute rejection?
It’s a powerful thought to have I’ll grant you, and not one I’d expect most people to have with any serious consideration, that’s what cognitive dissonance feels like.
That thought of being “stranded“ out in the universe with nothing “holding it altogether” yet being comfortable with that…that requires a non-theological “faith” in our ability to reason our way through life rather than rely on ancient writings! And having to have a God to anchor it all in place.

You k ow it's I terwsting that you mention this. I took Philosophy in college and other classes that challenged me to think about these things. But in looking at the immensity of this universe. And this tiny blue rock and what it would have taken for like to appear, it makes far more sense to have a designer creator than it all be just fortune.

 

[Belk]

You shouldn't get a chuckle about that at all. Because what God thinks about X may be defined in scripture. So we certainly CAN know ehat he thinks about X. It may be incomprehensible why he thinks that way or why he does certain things because if he doesn't say we can't know. If we didn't have scriptures to tell us rhen we wouldn't know. So there is NO contradiction at all.

I find it interesting that you don't k ow this for all the time you spend on these boards.

No, you do not know "What he thinks about X". You may believe you know what he has communicated to you through his revealed word in the bible (but I would contend given the disparity of thought among Christians that is suspect) but you have zero idea his thoughts on the subject. His thoughts would be so far beyond us as to be incomprehensible. Yet I have seen Christians on here proclaim with great confidence ideas never expressed in the bible and try to attribute it to God.

 

[Pommer]

But in looking at the immensity of this universe. And this tiny blue rock and what it would have taken for like to appear, it makes far more sense to have a designer creator than it all be just fortune.

My take is that some “matter” has become self-aware and “created gods” to help explain what life is for.
It’s obvious that we’re here ”for a reason“ simply because we are here! Since we’re here there must be a “reason/God(s)”. *

If I exist and assume (for the sake of argument) that there isn’t a reason for my existence), then I do not “need” a God(s), while still searching diligently for reasons, (both material and philosophical/spiritual) for human beings’ existence. This allows me to experience more of God, since religions can only reveal so much of God; while exploring the universe and continuing to ask questions of “how it came to be”…reveals more of the Divine than we even knew existed

I am not a Christian but if I were my core doctrine would be “God ultimately decided that Him imbuing mere mortals with ‘free-will’ was ambitious**, even for Him, and human beings aren’t to be “blamed”, He sends Jesus, Who is sacrificed (because that was ordained before the creation, “if things go “wrong”, Jesus was the failsafe.)

Which means people can live their lives as if God does not “exist”, if, paradoxically, their (let’s call it “faith”) is well rooted and strong.

I don’t believe in God but if I did, I’d believe the One(s) that stick to their Words, if God the Father Sent His Son to die for my sins, that’s great.***

Since I do not have to worry about “what’s going to ’happen-to-me’ after I die” I need not worry about “offending God” since He’s taken care of all of that. I am “allowed” to live as I please and it’s all good.****

The God I would worship doesn’t need my praise, and if I am correct, even if He does, it’s covered.



*yes this is a tautology and probably the only valid [adjacent] one?
**Wikipedia three-body-problem
***Believe me, this requires more faith than simply going to a book for answers, (not that there is anything “wrong” about doing that, but God can only be described so well in a book, to “experience God” one needs to take the ‘training-wheels off’ look at what the book is speaking about rather than focusing in on the Words, once in a while).
****yes, this is quite a rabbit-hole

 

[NxNW]

I respect your right to live as an atheist, but do not accept the atheist worldview.

Everything is random and no one created us? It’s all an accident and life has no meaning? I HIGHLY doubt that.

I don't think there is such a thing as the atheist worldview, other than lacking a belief in the supernatural.

 

[NxNW]

The big question in all human thinking is "why is there something, instead of nothing?" And an eternal Creator explains that nicely. It's not a slam-dunk in itself, but no one can come up with anything else that makes sense.

Observations support the conclusion that there is nothing, rather than something. The total of mass and energy in the universe is consistent with zero.

 

[essentialsaltes]

I don't think there is such a thing as the atheist worldview, other than lacking a belief in the supernatural.

Really it's just gods. There's woo-woo atheists out there.

 

[NxNW]

Really it's just gods. There's woo-woo atheists out there.

I'm not sure you can have a supernatural without gods?

 

[essentialsaltes]

I'm not sure you can have a supernatural without gods?

5. Unbelief in God doesn’t necessarily entail unbelief in other supernatural phenomena. Atheists and (less so) agnostics exhibit lower levels of supernatural belief than do the wider populations. However, only minorities of atheists or agnostics in each of our countries appear to be thoroughgoing naturalists. (2.2, 2.3)

 

[NxNW]

5. Unbelief in God doesn’t necessarily entail unbelief in other supernatural phenomena. Atheists and (less so) agnostics exhibit lower levels of supernatural belief than do the wider populations. However, only minorities of atheists or agnostics in each of our countries appear to be thoroughgoing naturalists. (2.2, 2.3)

Well, if someone believes in magic or life after death or universal spirit, I question their atheism. But if you want to swap "supernatural" for "gods" in my prior post, that's fine.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

5. Unbelief in God doesn’t necessarily entail unbelief in other supernatural phenomena. Atheists and (less so) agnostics exhibit lower levels of supernatural belief than do the wider populations. However, only minorities of atheists or agnostics in each of our countries appear to be thoroughgoing naturalists. (2.2, 2.3)

View attachment 353761

A sad testament to the persistence of the human tendency for hyperactive agency detection (HAD)...

 

[RileyG]

I don't think there is such a thing as the atheist worldview, other than lacking a belief in the supernatural.

That’s true.