Louisiana classrooms now required by law to display the Ten Commandments

[The Liturgist]

This is superb news, which will help ensure the proper edification of the youth of Louisiana in divine morality and incline them towards Christian moral values, especially when the Decalogue is interpreted in a Christological manner.

Thus what the liturgical churches in Louisiana need to do is stress how these important moral laws also have direct Christological relevance and are in fact prophecies of Christ. For example, the Sabbath being Holy is due as much to Christ our True God having reposed on that day following his triumphant passion on the Cross in which mankind was recreated in His image.

 

[The Liturgist]

Of course it's not. But it will be popular with voters.

It does not establish a particular religion, and therefore does not violate the establishment clause. The Ten Commandments are highly regarded by a great many religions and are an important text which the youth should learn about.

Of course there are people who think it violates the establishment clause for the US to use the motto “In God We Trust,” but this is pure nonsense.

We must differentiate between the first amendment and the sensibilities of atheists.

Now this all being said, I am not extremely happy about the continued existence of state-run schools. A system of school vouchers so that atheists could send their children to ahteist schools, and Catholics can send their children to Roman Catholic Parochial schools, and Protestants can send their children to schools such as the LCMS Parochial school I attended for much of my childhood, which was rather better than the public elementary school even if one qualified for the advanced class, and other factors.

I am also opposed to the use of corporal punishment in public schools, particularly grievous being those states where teenagers are subject to paddling by members of the opposite sex or by persons of the same sex who have same-sex attractions. This is so blatantly inappropriate it need not even be explained. If parents spank their children, as long as they do not leave bruises or engage in acts that are of a sadistic nature, this is customary and well-established, but there is a huge gulf between that and having a male vice principal in his 40s or 50s paddling girls who might be anywhere from 5 to 18 years of age, or a female vice principal doing the same.

There was a disturbing case in Tennessee for example where the administrators of an elementary school threatened to report the mother of a young boy with behavioral difficulties (who seemed to have developmental difficulties) to CPS unless she consented to allow them to paddle him, but she secretly recorded the incident and uploaded it to youtube. These sadistic women ought to have been fired; I don’t know what their disposition was.

Thus, my position is that we should aim to phase out public education in favor of accredited publically-financed schools paid for by associations connected with religious and para-religious groups based on the cultural status of the parents, but in the interim, the use of corporal punishment in these schools should be strictly prohibited, and the Decalogue should be displayed in every classroom along with a map of the United States and artwork depicting every President as well as the founding Fathers and military heroes from the First and Second World War, and also important astronauts, aviation pioneers, technologists (for example, Dennis Ritchie, one of the developers of the C programming language) and other explorers.

 

[Larniavc]

This is superb news, which will help ensure the proper edification of the youth of Louisiana in divine morality and incline them towards Christian moral values, especially when the Decalogue is interpreted in a Christological manner.

Thus what the liturgical churches in Louisiana need to do is stress how these important moral laws also have direct Christological relevance and are in fact prophecies of Christ. For example, the Sabbath being Holy is due as much to Christ our True God having reposed on that day following his triumphant passion on the Cross in which mankind was recreated in His image.

Funny how it says which god to venerate but omits not raping people. Or beating children.

 

[Larniavc]

It does not establish a particular religion,

Oh for goodness sake.

The Liturgist said:
incline them towards Christian moral values, especially when the Decalogue is interpreted in a Christological manner.

 

[Lukaris]

The law against adultery is basic pertaining to monogamous marriage and raising a family. It is also a shorthand summary in that there is no other sexual activity that is actually good. The details of sexual moral laws are given in Leviticus 18, 19, & 20 ( especially Leviticus 18:1-26). Children shall not be prostituted ( Deuteronomy 23:17) etc.

 

[Hans Blaster]

It does not establish a particular religion, and therefore does not violate the establishment clause.

Let's see about that (see below)...

The Ten Commandments are highly regarded by a great many religions and are an important text which the youth should learn about.

No, they are highly regarded by *2* religions: Yours and the Jewish one. That's it, and less than half the world's populatoin.

This is superb news, which will help ensure the proper edification of the youth of Louisiana in divine morality and incline them towards Christian moral values, especially when the Decalogue is interpreted in a Christological manner.

In case anyone thought it was just some moral lesson we have the above statement. You clearly see the posting of the X-commandments is for "edification" of youths in divine morality. That is *clearly* a religious purpose and a clear violation of the law.

Thus what the liturgical churches in Louisiana need to do is stress how these important moral laws also have direct Christological relevance and are in fact prophecies of Christ. For example, the Sabbath being Holy is due as much to Christ our True God having reposed on that day following his triumphant passion on the Cross in which mankind was recreated in His image.

What I like about this reply is that you make it clear that the ONLY purpose of posting the 10 commands. in schools is to support Christianity by government. Thanks for playing.

 

[BCP1928]

This is superb news, which will help ensure the proper edification of the youth of Louisiana in divine morality and incline them towards Christian moral values, especially when the Decalogue is interpreted in a Christological manner.

You expect Public School teachers to do that? "Teacher, those Ten Commandments aren't the same as the ones I learn at Sunday School. How come?"

 

[The Liturgist]

No, they are highly regarded by *2* religions

You’re off by approximately an order of magnitude*, just based on those fairly well known religions I can think of, such as the Mormons and J/Ws, as well as some less well known but historically significant religions of the Middle East, some of whom are severely persecuted, such as the Samaritans.

And I am not even including the numerous groups which identify as Christians or Jews, like Karaite Jews and Christian Science, whose status as such is disputed by the majority of Jews and Christians, but am rather proceeding on the basis of self-identification, although with respect to Christianity, CF.com uses the Nicene Creed and a few other confessional standards such as not disputing the status of St. Paul as an Apostle (which is implicit in the Nicene Creed but we had problems with trolling from heretics), to define Christianity for purposes of this website, and going on that basis I reckon you are off by three orders of magnitude.*

*Where the magnitude is based on the number ten.

 

[Hans Blaster]

You’re off by approximately an order of magnitude*, just based on those fairly well known religions I can think of, such as the Mormons and J/Ws, as well as some less well known but historically significant religions of the Middle East, some of whom are severely persecuted, such as the Samaritans.

These "other religions" are in fact two factions of Christians and an alternative form of Judaism that thinks a different mountain is the sacred one.

And I am not even including the numerous groups which identify as Christians or Jews, like Karaite Jews and Christian Science, whose status as such is disputed by the majority of Jews and Christians, but am rather proceeding on the basis of self-identification, although with respect to Christianity, CF.com uses the Nicene Creed and a few other confessional standards such as not disputing the status of St. Paul as an Apostle (which is implicit in the Nicene Creed but we had problems with trolling from heretics), to define Christianity for purposes of this website, and going on that basis I reckon you are off by three orders of magnitude.*

More varieties of the same religion, but more deep disputes about who the heritics are. (Also very small groups.)

*Where the magnitude is based on the number ten.

I know what a magnitude is, and the total is still within 10 powers of 1 of my value.

 

[FireDragon76]

The predominant Christian expression of Louisiana is Catholic. I believe this is the version from the Catholic catechism. Perhaps one of our Catholic brothers and sisters can check me on that.

The Catholic 10 Commandments - Catechism

Lutherans use the same version of the Ten Commandments, too. When I was a Lutheran, that always threw me off, since I was raised Methodist.

For some reason, the Anglicans and Reformed use the same Ten Commandments as the Eastern Orthodox. That's the version many Protestants in the US were familiar with.

 

[rjs330]

Hey if the Bible is just literature and not really the word of God, who cares?

Honestly though, I'm not in favor of requiring these in the classroom. I'm for the freedom to do so if you wish or don't if you don't wish.

 

[The Liturgist]

These "other religions" are in fact two factions of Christians and an alternative form of Judaism that thinks a different mountain is the sacred one.

That remark is culturally insensitive, staggeringly so in the case of the Samaritans, and ignores 2500 years of cultural differences. It’s a bit like calling Sikhism just another form of Zen Buddhism.

The fact that you have no respect for the diversity of these ethnoreligious groups is shocking to me. And I could have mentioned more extreme examples of religions that regard the Ten Commandments as among various sacred texts. And indeed I would note you took aim at the Samaritans and dismissed their culture as a variant of Judaism (it isn’t, and this also suggests you don’t really understand any of the three major variants of Judaism in terms of praxis, the Rabinnical Jews, which are any Jews with Rabbis as such that have at least a nominal respect for the Talmud, the Karaite Jews which reject the Oral Torah, and the Beta Israel of Ethiopia which retain the sacrificial cult, for various historical reasons, nor the other religions related to Judaism.

And in the case of the Samaritans this cultural insensitivity is quite shocking, because there is much more to them which is distinct and interesting than a mere disagreement over the theological status of Mount Gerizim. It is also incorrect to call them Jews - they are not descended from the tribes of Judah or Benjamin, but from Ephrem and Manessah, according to their traditional history, although many opponents of theirs allege that they are not descended from any Hebrew tribe, but at any rate they have been victims of numerous genocides, so that at the turn of the last century scarcely more than a hundred survived, so their population has expanded substantially, but is still minute.

I think this lack of respect not just for Christianity, but for Judaism and other religions, is the main problem with atheism in general. One only need to take a look at the experience of all religions during the Soviet Union, or worse, in Albania during the atheist dictatorship of Enver Hoxha. But the Soviets failed and Hoxha failed in their attempts to replace the traditional religions with a mix of Communist ideology and materialism. Just as the New Atheism has already lost the argument it started with its attacks on displays of religious piety in the public sphere, in an attempt, aided at the time by sympathetic activist judges, to abuse the First Amendment’s Establishment Clause, which was intended to prevent the existence of an Established Church analogous to the Church of England and ensure that the churches had an equal access to the public sphere, to exclude religion from the public sphere altogether, which was an idea that even the least conventionally pious of the Founding Fathers, such as Thomas Jefferson, among others, would have found appalling.

 

[KCfromNC]

Hey if the Bible is just literature and not really the word of God, who cares?

Because it's still an illegal attempt by the government to favor one religion over others.

 

[BCP1928]

Hey if the Bible is just literature and not really the word of God, who cares?

Honestly though, I'm not in favor of requiring these in the classroom. I'm for the freedom to do so if you wish or don't if you don't wish.

What if the Bible as literature and the word of God? It's importance as literature could still be taught and those who believe it to be divine revelation could still believe that, too.

 

[Hans Blaster]

That remark is culturally insensitive, staggeringly so in the case of the Samaritans, and ignores 2500 years of cultural differences. It’s a bit like calling Sikhism just another form of Zen Buddhism.

I guess I should have said "israelite", as the Samaratans split from the other Yahwehists around the time of the "captivity".

The fact that you have no respect for the diversity of these ethnoreligious groups is shocking to me. And I could have mentioned more extreme examples of religions that regard the Ten Commandments as among various sacred texts. And indeed I would note you took aim at the Samaritans and dismissed their culture as a variant of Judaism (it isn’t, and this also suggests you don’t really understand any of the three major variants of Judaism in terms of praxis, the Rabinnical Jews, which are any Jews with Rabbis as such that have at least a nominal respect for the Talmud, the Karaite Jews which reject the Oral Torah, and the Beta Israel of Ethiopia which retain the sacrificial cult, for various historical reasons, nor the other religions related to Judaism.

It turns out I don't actually care. It all looks like nothing more than squabbles about details and what can and can't change.

And in the case of the Samaritans this cultural insensitivity is quite shocking, because there is much more to them which is distinct and interesting than a mere disagreement over the theological status of Mount Gerizim. It is also incorrect to call them Jews - they are not descended from the tribes of Judah or Benjamin, but from Ephrem and Manessah, according to their traditional history, although many opponents of theirs allege that they are not descended from any Hebrew tribe, but at any rate they have been victims of numerous genocides, so that at the turn of the last century scarcely more than a hundred survived, so their population has expanded substantially, but is still minute.

And this is related to the illegal government posting of the "10 Commandments" in American public schools how?

I think this lack of respect not just for Christianity, but for Judaism and other religions, is the main problem with atheism in general.

What about religion requires "respect"?

One only need to take a look at the experience of all religions during the Soviet Union, or worse, in Albania during the atheist dictatorship of Enver Hoxha. But the Soviets failed and Hoxha failed in their attempts to replace the traditional religions with a mix of Communist ideology and materialism.

Nice red baiting (not!).

Just as the New Atheism has already lost the argument it started with its attacks on displays of religious piety in the public sphere, in an attempt, aided at the time by sympathetic activist judges, to abuse the First Amendment’s Establishment Clause, which was intended to prevent the existence of an Established Church analogous to the Church of England and ensure that the churches had an equal access to the public sphere, to exclude religion from the public sphere altogether, which was an idea that even the least conventionally pious of the Founding Fathers, such as Thomas Jefferson, among others, would have found appalling.

Promoting public peity is not the business of the government in any way, shape, or form. It is quite clearly *not* a function of government at all.

 

[Halbhh]

LINK

House Bill 71, approved by state lawmakers last month, mandates that a poster-size display of the Ten Commandments with “large, easily readable font” be in every classroom at schools that receive state funding, from kindergarten through the university level.

The legislation specifies the exact language that must be printed on the classroom displays and outlines that the text of the Ten Commandments must be the central focus of the poster or framed document.

In a joint statement prior to the governor’s approval of the measure, the American Civil Liberties Union, the American Civil Liberties Union of Louisiana, Americans United for Separation of Church and State and the Freedom from Religion Foundation said that the bill was “unconstitutional” and that “many faith-based and civil-rights organizations oppose this measure because it violates students’ and families’ fundamental right to religious freedom.”

From the Bill:

The Ten Commandments
I AM the LORD thy God.
Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not make to thyself any graven images.
Thou shalt not take the Name of the Lord thy God in vain.
Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Honor thy father and thy mother, that thy days may be long upon the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee.
Thou shalt not kill.
Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Thou shalt not steal.
Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's house.
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his cattle, nor anything that is thy neighbor's."

Unfortunately this posting in a classroom makes the content of the Bible seem a mere historical document or mere cultural tradition from way back....not really any different to a typical child not knowing about Christ's words than if we were quoting George Washington or Shakespeare or the Magna Carta....

History only....

That's the effect of posting the 10 commandments in a school classroom....

I think it's being pushed by those who do not really believe in God then, see.... Perhaps they believe in God as their mascot so to speak. That is, not a belief in God being God.

Those that want it in a classroom just like some Republicans might like to post a Ronald Reagan picture in a classroom.

And to the same effect -- a token honor. Kinda like saying "my team wins, yah!"

 

[bèlla]

If anything it's an opportunity to bring religion into schools. It may start with christianity but it's unlikely to remain that way. Perhaps we'll see more after school satan clubs as well.

~bella

 

[HARK!]

As a Christian, I actually do not like this new bill from down south, as it shoves Christianity down people's throats. Also, if no one can idolize anything, then, schools should take down the flag as well or stop saying the pledge, as a pledge is a form of idolatry. In fact, I do not pledge to anything, as Matthew 5:34 speaks out against making oaths.

Where does this Bill state that you must take an oath?

Does your post not pledge support for the American Civil Liberties Union, the American Civil Liberties Union of Louisiana, Americans United for Separation of Church and State and the Freedom from Religion Foundation's position?

 

[HARK!]

Probably no particular reason (but our Bible translation experts can weigh in).

But the law has to be specific, because otherwise classrooms would have "posters of the 10 commandments" like

View attachment 350405

(well, my classroom anyway)

I think that Ancient Hebrew should be offered as a language elective in our public schools.

As a Christian who is regularly forced to speak Spanish, in order to make a food purchase, or telling my neighbors that their cow is in my yard trying to gore me, because of all of the illegals who are pouring over our borders; I place more emphasis on studying Ancient Hebrew than Spanish.

Understanding our heavenly father's will is just more important!

 

[Hans Blaster]

I think that Ancient Hebrew should be offered as a language elective in our public schools.

Good grief, why? No one speaks it. There are dozens of languages that are more useful, even modern Hebrew.

As a Christian who is regularly forced to speak Spanish, in order to make a food purchase, or telling my neighbors that their cow is in my yard trying to gore me, because of all of the illegals who are pouring over our borders; I place more emphasis on studying Ancient Hebrew than Spanish.

Because people actually speak Spanish.

Understanding our heavenly father's will is just more important!

Not the government's job to help.