Project 2025 is NOT the Trump plan - do not get mislead

[frienden thalord]

There are links about this on the first page of this thread. In a nutshell, it's a plan and a document written by members of The Heritage Foundation which is a conservative think tank.

okay , i will go peek at it .

 

[Always in His Presence]

No. You were praising him.

'Federal revenues under the Trump administration hit record levels before the pandemic hit'.

'Trump changed that with his tax law changes. It brought in a lot of money to the IRS'.

Not praising. Stating established fact.

 

[Hans Blaster]

so Harvard and other schools get to run their hedge funds and pay their presidents millions of dollars in salaries (and pay admins 300-400k a year), and not get taxed on it

meanwhile liberals scream about CEOs and televangelists making too much money and not paying enough in taxes. At least companies actually pay taxes

I suppose you think these salaries are OK for "charities"

15 college presidents who've been paid millionaire salaries

Here are some university presidents who earn millionaire salaries. The highest paid college chief earned 50 times more than professors in one year.

www.businessinsider.com

I'm not calling for churches to pay taxes (the preachers and university presidents pay income taxes like any of us on their personal income). I am (though not yet this month or in this thread) calling for churches to have to file the same 990 forms that any non-profit with more than $5000 in revenue files, including the university foundations.

Here is the 990 for Harvard (2017, the first one to turn up on a simple google search):

President And Fellows Of Harvard College, Form 990 - Nonprofit Explorer - ProPublica

Where is the one for the SBC, the Archdioceses of Detroit, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Church of Scientology, etc.?

 

[Bradskii]

Not praising. Stating established fact.

It was the first. Certainly not the second. You need to read the thread.

 

[Pommer]

Agenda 47, no "20" because he, if elected, will be the 47th president just as he used to be "45".

How fitting that the era of Grover Cleveland seems to be where “47” would want to return the “spoils system” that Cleveland began to break apart.

It’s so nice when we come around again.

 

[FireDragon76]

“I know nothing about Project 2025,” Trump posted on his social media website. “I have no idea who is behind it. I disagree with some of the things they’re saying and some of the things they’re saying are absolutely ridiculous and abysmal. Anything they do, I wish them luck, but I have nothing to do with them.”

Trump Disavows Project 2025 Transition Plan

Donald Trump distanced himself Friday from Project 2025, a massive proposed overhaul of the federal government.

time.com

Trump has outlined his own plans to remake the government if he wins a second term, including staging the largest deportation operation in U.S. history and imposing tariffs on potentially all imports. His campaign has previously warned outside allies not to presume to speak for the former president and suggested their transition-in-waiting efforts were unhelpful.

You can also plainly see that the Project 2025 is not from the Trump Campaign nor is it from the Republican National Convention. Nor is Project 2025 endorsed by Trump nor the Republican Party.

It is the result of a think tank and not even all it's members agree with it.

Advisory Board | Project 2025

GET INVOLVED Does your organization want to join us in the fight for our country? Join Us

www.project2025.org

Project 2025, organized by The Heritage Foundation, is a movement-wide effort guided by the conservative cause to address and reform the failings of big government and an undemocratic administrative state. The opinions of Project 2025 and The Heritage Foundation do not necessarily represent the opinions of every one of its advisory board partners.​

Please - let's be intellectually honest .

Does discussing actual policy make some people uncomfortable?

Project 2025 is endorsed by major donors and think-tanks that support Republican candidates. Of course it will be part of the agenda.

 

[Bradskii]

Does discussing actual policy make some people uncomfortable?

Some can't discuss it because they're not sure what Trump's position might be on any given policy. Perish the thought that they should make a decision without the Great Leader telling them what it should be.

 

[ozso]

Some can't discuss it because they're not sure what Trump's position might be on any given policy. Perish the thought that they should make a decision without the Great Leader telling them what it should be.

Trump is Hitler and they are a mindless cult. Not very original.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Trump allies at Heritage declare 2024 election illegitimate in advance​

“As things stand right now, there’s a zero percent chance of a free and fair election,” said Mike Howell, executive director of Heritage’s Oversight Project. “I’m formally accusing the Biden administration of creating the conditions that most reasonable policymakers and officials cannot in good conscience certify an election.”

“The upshot is that we will see a contested election the likes of which we’ve never seen,” said Adam Ellwanger, a rhetoric professor at the University of Houston-Downtown who helped lead the simulation. “If we see the kind of manipulations that we saw in 2020, I wonder if average Americans who are supporters of the president [Trump] will swallow that so easily as they did in 2020.”

 

[Paulos23]

Trump allies at Heritage declare 2024 election illegitimate in advance​

“As things stand right now, there’s a zero percent chance of a free and fair election,” said Mike Howell, executive director of Heritage’s Oversight Project. “I’m formally accusing the Biden administration of creating the conditions that most reasonable policymakers and officials cannot in good conscience certify an election.”

“The upshot is that we will see a contested election the likes of which we’ve never seen,” said Adam Ellwanger, a rhetoric professor at the University of Houston-Downtown who helped lead the simulation. “If we see the kind of manipulations that we saw in 2020, I wonder if average Americans who are supporters of the president [Trump] will swallow that so easily as they did in 2020.”

Right...

 

[Merrill]

I'm not calling for churches to pay taxes (the preachers and university presidents pay income taxes like any of us on their personal income). I am (though not yet this month or in this thread) calling for churches to have to file the same 990 forms that any non-profit with more than $5000 in revenue files, including the university foundations.

Here is the 990 for Harvard (2017, the first one to turn up on a simple google search):

President And Fellows Of Harvard College, Form 990 - Nonprofit Explorer - ProPublica

Where is the one for the SBC, the Archdioceses of Detroit, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Church of Scientology, etc.?

So universities are churches now?

as I said above, the TCJA of Trump applied taxes to some universities with very large endowments, which is a good thing

unless you think Harvard shouldn't be paying a dime on the interest and gains on 55 billion dollars in assets, and pay its president and head officials million dollar+ salaries

the income tax these presidents and officials pay has absolutely nothing to do with what I am talking about

it is the taxes the endowment itself pays on the interest and gains, and it operates like a hedge fund.

Now whether or not churches should have to file additional IRS forms, or even be taxed, is a completely different issue. Some reforms might be needed there

 

[Hans Blaster]

So universities are churches now?

No, don't be silly. I didn't say or imply that. Both are covered under section 501(c)(3) of the tax code.

as I said above, the TCJA of Trump applied taxes to some universities with very large endowments, which is a good thing

The what?

unless you think Harvard shouldn't be paying a dime on the interest and gains on 55 billion dollars in assets, and pay its president and head officials million dollar+ salaries

I really don't care what some small, private, college in Boston does. It does not alter the fact that it is a 501(c)(3) organization and is tax free.

the income tax these presidents and officials pay has absolutely nothing to do with what I am talking about

it is the taxes the endowment itself pays on the interest and gains, and it operates like a hedge fund.

all kinds of 501(c)(3) entitites have large investments. Ever notice the names of those big foundations at the start of a PBS show? All 501(c)(3) non-profits not paying taxes on their investment income. They do have to spend a percentage of their wealth each year on the exempt purpose for which they exist. (I think it is 5%, but it may have changed.)

Now whether or not churches should have to file additional IRS forms, or even be taxed, is a completely different issue. Some reforms might be needed there

My point was that all tax-exempt non-profits (from churches to schools to standard charities) do not pay taxes on their wealth or income, but I am encouraged that you are open to ending the special status of some categories of such organizations to not file public statements of income and assets.

 

[SimplyMe]

And when did Biden cut spending?

As I showed, outlays are higher under Biden now than they were in 2019.

I am not defending Trump here --he spent too much money, was too generous with tax cuts. He didn't do enough to reduce spending and balance the books

but you cannot defend Biden on this--he spent even more money (ARA, IRA, etc.), and our debt-to-gdp ratio is over 122% almost 4 years into his term. He hasn't done a thing to control spending

this is a bipartisan problem: neither party wants to seriously get spending and entitlements under control. Do we need tax increases? yes, but this have to be pared with spending reductions

Why are you asking me about Biden? I'm one of those on record as stating that neither should be candidates for their party for President. Seems you can't defend Trump so you've switched to whataboutism.

 

[The IbanezerScrooge]

“I know nothing about Project 2025,” Trump posted on his social media website. “I have no idea who is behind it. I disagree with some of the things they’re saying and some of the things they’re saying are absolutely ridiculous and abysmal. Anything they do, I wish them luck, but I have nothing to do with them.”

Trump Disavows Project 2025 Transition Plan

Donald Trump distanced himself Friday from Project 2025, a massive proposed overhaul of the federal government.

time.com

Trump has outlined his own plans to remake the government if he wins a second term, including staging the largest deportation operation in U.S. history and imposing tariffs on potentially all imports. His campaign has previously warned outside allies not to presume to speak for the former president and suggested their transition-in-waiting efforts were unhelpful.

You can also plainly see that the Project 2025 is not from the Trump Campaign nor is it from the Republican National Convention. Nor is Project 2025 endorsed by Trump nor the Republican Party.

It is the result of a think tank and not even all it's members agree with it.

Advisory Board | Project 2025

GET INVOLVED Does your organization want to join us in the fight for our country? Join Us

www.project2025.org

Project 2025, organized by The Heritage Foundation, is a movement-wide effort guided by the conservative cause to address and reform the failings of big government and an undemocratic administrative state. The opinions of Project 2025 and The Heritage Foundation do not necessarily represent the opinions of every one of its advisory board partners.​

Please - let's be intellectually honest .

Video shows Trump cheering on Heritage Foundation 'plans' he claims he didn't know about

Former President Donald Trump has been caught on video praising a think tank whose plans he now says he didn't know existed. The right-wing Heritage Foundation brought together several MAGA thought leaders from Trump's orbit to craft their "Project 2025," a plan to radically expand the powers of...

www.rawstory.com

Former President Donald Trump has been caught on video praising a think tank whose plans he now says he didn't know existed.​

​

The right-wing Heritage Foundation brought together several MAGA thought leaders from Trump's orbit to craft their "Project 2025," a plan to radically expand the powers of the executive branch under a second Trump administration.​

​

The plan promises, among other things, to oust career civil servants in the federal government and replace them with people who are staunch loyalists of the president.​

​

However, in a video unearthed by NBC's Vaughn Hillyard, Trump's speech to the Heritage Foundation reveals he knew that they were crafting the plan for him.​

​

“This is a great group, and they’re going to lay the groundwork and detail plans for exactly what our movement will do, and what your movement will do when the American people give us a colossal mandate to save America," Trump told the crowd about the Heritage Foundation.​

​

Lying liar.

 

[Merrill]

Returning the the original topic-at-hand, and in an effort to discuss what Trump actually intends to do (vs. that fake Project 2025 stuff), we can see his Agenda 47, which imho, has some good and bad.

The Good

1. Energy independence: yes, we need to expand drilling and refining in the short-term, while expanding nuclear energy and fossil fuel alternatives. Trump intends to do that. We cannot turn our energy grid over to China, or create a disaster like that in Germany, where consumer energy prices tripled, the country became reliant on Russian natural gas, and they missed all their climate goal.

2. Education: cutting funding for schools that waste money on wasteful and harmful ideological and political projects like CRT, gender ideology,. etc. Not sure how effective he would be here, but I agree with it. Schools are not reeducation camps

3. Extending 529 accounts to homeschooling families

4. Foreign Affairs: seeking an end to the Ukraine War. Not sure how he is going to do this, but he has made it clear he does not support escalation and endless war. Since Biden has no intention to seek any kind of resolution to this conflict, I am willing to give Trump a chance.

5. Healthcare: making Big Pharma reduce drug prices for Medicare/Medicaid to the level they charge foreign nations. Increased funding for Autism research. No federal funding for "gender-affirming care"

6. Immigration reform: this is obvious

The Bad:

1. Blanket tariffs on imported goods. Matching tariffs that foreign nations apply on our goods to all their imports. While this makes some sense, I think it will be inflationary and counter-productive. Trade wars are bad for everyone.

2. Israel policy: like Biden, Trump is very pro-Israel and will let them do whatever they want. To me, Israel is not an ally. It is an ethno-apartheid state, and we should not be involved in their affairs.

3. Enhancing liability protections and the powers of police. We don't need to do that --we simply need to enforce the laws that are on the books.

4. Tax policy: mixed-bag here --the government does need to raise revenue, so some tax hikes are needed.

A lot of the other stuff in Agenda 47 is vague, rhetoric, or unclear.

But Trump isn't going to put gays into death camps, pass Jim Crow Laws (heard someone on CNN say that yesterday), invade foreign nations, or subvert the Constitution. He has limited powers as president, and not even a conservative SCOTUS will let him run wild.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Does discussing actual policy make some people uncomfortable?

Project 2025 is endorsed by major donors and think-tanks that support Republican candidates. Of course it will be part of the agenda.

No not at all. In fact there is a thread on this very subject already in existence.

And personal opinion can indeed be that the two are connected

But real time fact proves they are not.

You are entitled to you personal opinion, but not your personal facts. Which are self evidenced.

 

[FenderTL5]

Video shows Trump cheering on Heritage Foundation 'plans' he claims he didn't know about

Former President Donald Trump has been caught on video praising a think tank whose plans he now says he didn't know existed. The right-wing Heritage Foundation brought together several MAGA thought leaders from Trump's orbit to craft their "Project 2025," a plan to radically expand the powers of...

www.rawstory.com

Former President Donald Trump has been caught on video praising a think tank whose plans he now says he didn't know existed.​

​

The right-wing Heritage Foundation brought together several MAGA thought leaders from Trump's orbit to craft their "Project 2025," a plan to radically expand the powers of the executive branch under a second Trump administration.​

​

The plan promises, among other things, to oust career civil servants in the federal government and replace them with people who are staunch loyalists of the president.​

​

However, in a video unearthed by NBC's Vaughn Hillyard, Trump's speech to the Heritage Foundation reveals he knew that they were crafting the plan for him.​

​

“This is a great group, and they’re going to lay the groundwork and detail plans for exactly what our movement will do, and what your movement will do when the American people give us a colossal mandate to save America," Trump told the crowd about the Heritage Foundation.​

​

Lying liar.

The video (if this works)

 

[FenderTL5]

Was Trump lying then? Or is he lying now?

Yes

 

[wing2000]

“I know nothing about Project 2025,” Trump posted on his social media website. “I have no idea who is behind it. I disagree with some of the things they’re saying and some of the things they’re saying are absolutely ridiculous and abysmal. Anything they do, I wish them luck, but I have nothing to do with them.”

Trump Disavows Project 2025 Transition Plan

Donald Trump distanced himself Friday from Project 2025, a massive proposed overhaul of the federal government.

time.com

Trump has outlined his own plans to remake the government if he wins a second term, including staging the largest deportation operation in U.S. history and imposing tariffs on potentially all imports. His campaign has previously warned outside allies not to presume to speak for the former president and suggested their transition-in-waiting efforts were unhelpful.

You can also plainly see that the Project 2025 is not from the Trump Campaign nor is it from the Republican National Convention. Nor is Project 2025 endorsed by Trump nor the Republican Party.

It is the result of a think tank and not even all it's members agree with it.

Advisory Board | Project 2025

GET INVOLVED Does your organization want to join us in the fight for our country? Join Us

www.project2025.org

Project 2025, organized by The Heritage Foundation, is a movement-wide effort guided by the conservative cause to address and reform the failings of big government and an undemocratic administrative state. The opinions of Project 2025 and The Heritage Foundation do not necessarily represent the opinions of every one of its advisory board partners.​

Please - let's be intellectually honest .

“This is a great group, and they’re going to lay the groundwork and detail plans for exactly what our movement will do, and what your movement will do when the American people give us a colossal mandate to save America," Trump told the crowd about the Heritage Foundation.


Yes, let's be honest: Anytime Trump says "I have no idea who is behind it" or "I have no idea who this person is" -- he is lying.

 

[Merrill]

No, don't be silly. I didn't say or imply that. Both are covered under section 501(c)(3) of the tax code.

The what?

I really don't care what some small, private, college in Boston does. It does not alter the fact that it is a 501(c)(3) organization and is tax free.

all kinds of 501(c)(3) entitites have large investments. Ever notice the names of those big foundations at the start of a PBS show? All 501(c)(3) non-profits not paying taxes on their investment income. They do have to spend a percentage of their wealth each year on the exempt purpose for which they exist. (I think it is 5%, but it may have changed.)

My point was that all tax-exempt non-profits (from churches to schools to standard charities) do not pay taxes on their wealth or income, but I am encouraged that you are open to ending the special status of some categories of such organizations to not file public statements of income and assets.

guy says he isn't comparing churches to universities, but then finishes his statement with

"My point was that all tax-exempt non-profits (from churches to schools to standard charities) do not pay taxes on their wealth or income"

which is comparing churches to universities

A university serves the interests of its students, faculty, administration, and alumni

A church (good ones anyway), serve the interests of humanity through charitable works, spreading the Gospel, etc.

Harvard will charge me 80k to attend

The church down the street will let me in free-of-charge

these things are not the same, even though they get similar tax treatment. My statement to you was not about tax law, it was about whether or not you think it is right that a college president gets a multi-million dollar salary from a school with a 55 billion dollar endowment that isn't taxed.

because Trump was the one who was being lambasted here for "tax cuts for the rich", etc. --when it was he who taxed these university hedge funds through the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act (TCJA) in 2017.

it reminds me of discussions I had with some liberal professors about taxes. They were whining about how rich people don't pay enough, so I said "agreed. The first thing we should do is get rid of the mortgage interest tax deduction", and they responded with "oh wait, slow down now"!

another example of wealthy liberals who want other people to pay taxes, but not themselves.

the TCJA also limited the mortgage interest tax deduction, and rich liberals screamed about not being able to write off the mortgage interest on their 4 million dollar jumbo loans.

The cost of not taxing university endowments and the mortgage interest tax deduction is like 150 billion per year in lost tax revenue.

but you are going to pretend that missing out on taxing a handful of pastors who make big salaries from mega-churches is somehow even remotely equivalent to that?

it isn't, and you are deflecting to cover up your hypocrisy