Evidence for macro-evolution

[AV1611VET]

And Creationist Evolution, (aka Crevolution) which is whatever the creationist happens to fancy. Strawmen, misrepresentation, assertion of facts not in evidence, lies distortions, half truths last thursdayism, any base and ignoble nonsense that comes to mind.

What are the skeptics' arguments on evolution?

You seem to know all the Christian arguments for and against.

What do skeptics think?

 

[Astrid]

Many of us here already believe that the universe behaves in an orderly way by divine Providence, it's not exactly a new idea, and the laws of physics which we propound are describing that order with increasing accuracy as we learn more about it. But it doesn't really have anything to do with the theory of evolution,

I agree. A god could have created everything.

Those with respect for the God they believe in
dont falsely, ignorantly misrepresent anything
about their god.

The profound disrespect so prevalent among
the yec is seen rangeing from comparing all atheists to
scam artists to presenting god as the author of
a fictional flood / mass murderer.

Applying falsehoods and calumny to defend god
in a debate on evolution- or any other topic- is
about as disrespectful as it gets.

And a violation of the injunction against taking the
lord's name in vain.

 

[Astrid]

Now we know about you, but what about me?

" We" know that I readily accept it when I'm in
some way mistaken. It's a point of honour and
integrity for me.

What about you? It's my theory, so far never disproved,
that it is impossible to be an informed yec with
intellectual honesty.

Are you the exception, the one with data, facts to
disprove evolution ( and close in line for a mega- Nobel)
or you just another with childish quips, and nonsense?

 

[Ace777]

What about you? It's my theory, so far never disproved,
that it is impossible to be an informed yec with
intellectual honesty.

Nothing is impossible for God. Everything is relative. Adam and Eve DID live 6,000 years ago. Noah was a real person with a real ark and real animals all of that is true if you want to deny it or not. It is intellectual dishonesty to deny that the Bible is true. There was 4,000 years from when Eve transgressed to when Mary birthed Jesus into the world to pay the price for her sin. Mary really was the "seed" of Eve. All of that is true.

 

[AV1611VET]

The profound disrespect so prevalent among the yec is seen ranging from comparing all atheists to scam artists to presenting god as the author of a fictional flood ...

God wouldn't put something in His autobiography that He didn't do.

If He didn't want anyone accusing Him of a global Flood, then He shouldn't have written about it.

 

[AV1611VET]

It's my theory, so far never disproved, that it is impossible to be an informed yec with intellectual honesty.

One would have to be able to recognize intellectual integrity when they see it though.

If one can't recognize it, then it could stare them in the face, and they would still claim their theory has never been disproved.

 

[Ace777]

disprove evolution

The problem is that truth and error get mixed together and only God can separate them. For me I see evolution in the six days of Creation in Rev Chapter one. I can even get the dates to line up according to Gerald Schroeder PhD MIT graduate. He sees no conflict between Religion and Science. He has studied BOTH extensively. The mystery is how a little can represent a lot. How a 24 hour day can represent billions of years.

Have you ever heard of the butterfly effect. How so little can amount to so much. In chaos theory, the butterfly effect is the sensitive dependence on initial conditions in which a small change in one state of a deterministic nonlinear system can result in large differences in a later state. Now we can start to see how exact and precise the Universe is along with the Laws of Physics. Look at color. Do you realize there is an exact formula to determine the color you are wearing today. Ask alexa she will tell you. For example pink is a mixture of red and white. The more white the softer the pink. It is an exact formula. Of course when you filter light the way our atmosphere does that works off of different laws. One is the additive color theory and the other is the subtractive theory. Have you ever been to a Taylor Swift concert. They put on a spectacle but all of it is the laws of physics at work. Very precise and very exact. Disaster does happen when people make mistakes and things blow up. In cleveland someone was high on drugs and messed up the rigging for Cher. She was stuck up in the ceiling and they had to call 911 to rescue her.

I love to reflect and refract light. It is sort of a hobby with me. Even I like to work in the UV frequency. Even some of the glow in the dark frequencies have a tendency to stand out in normal sunlight. You know the women love neon in their make up and nail polish so when they go out to the clubs or wherever they go and they have black lights to illuminate the ultra violent frequency. They think that is neat. But it is all very much based on the very exact laws of physics that you have to learn if you want to work with that stuff.

Gerald Schroeder - Articles - Age of the Universe

 

[Ace777]

If He didn't want anyone accusing Him of a global Flood, then He shouldn't have written about it.

In the Bible, the writer to the Hebrews in Hebrews 10:1 says that the "Types" in the Old Testament are "shadows of good things to come, and not the very image of the thing". A shadow is an imperfect representation of something, and is out of proportion to the real thing. In this sense, the Old Testament "Types" are imperfect revelations of the real thing, but not the real thing itself.

Perhaps you would like to explain to me what the Bible means by Shadows and Types. Do you understand how the law, all of the book of Moses is a shadow and a type. How a little can represent a lot?

In the Bible, types and shadows are symbolic concepts that convey deeper meanings. Let me break it down for you:

1. Types:
   • A type is a prophetic foreshadowing of future events. It’s like a pre-echo, where God hints at what will happen.
   • For example, Adam, the first man, serves as a type:
     • He represents all sinful mankind (Romans 5:12-14).
     • He also foreshadows Christ, who brings life (1 Corinthians 15:22, 45).
   • Types connect historical persons or events based on common characteristics.
2. Shadows:
   • A shadow lacks substance; it’s cast by something substantial. It represents the physical form of a heavenly reality (Hebrews 8:5; 10:1).
   • Jewish ceremonies were shadows pointing to heavenly realities. The reality lies in Christ’s life, work, and kingdom.
   • These shadows help us understand deeper spiritual truths.

Remember, both types and shadows serve to point our souls toward God and His eternal purposes

 

[Astrid]

Nothing is impossible for God. Everything is relative. Adam and Eve DID live 6,000 years ago. Noah was a real person with a real ark and real animals all of that is true if you want to deny it or not. It is intellectual dishonesty to deny that the Bible is true. There was 4,000 years from when Eve transgressed to when Mary birthed Jesus into the world to pay the price for her sin. Mary really was the "seed" of Eve. All of that is true.

Evolution, not flood, not Jesus etc.
Thread is about evolution, it's what I mentioned
in my post.

You have zero facts, no data of any sort to indicate
ToE is false- despite presuming to have God, bible,
and all of reality on your side. Odd, no? It might even give
one pause for reflection.

Your lil pal there even admits there's no flood evidence nor
fact one to disprove evolution.

What you are doing, asserting a fact free preconceived personal opinion and denying all data to the contrary pretty much defines intellectual dishonestly.

Let's hear a bit of data against ToE. Anything else is
just to demo more intellectual dishonesty.

 

[Astrid]

The problem is that truth and error get mixed together and only God can separate them. For me I see evolution in the six days of Creation in Rev Chapter one. I can even get the dates to line up according to Gerald Schroeder PhD MIT graduate. He sees no conflict between Religion and Science. He has studied BOTH extensively. The mystery is how a little can represent a lot. How a 24 hour day can represent billions of years.

Have you ever heard of the butterfly effect. How so little can amount to so much. In chaos theory, the butterfly effect is the sensitive dependence on initial conditions in which a small change in one state of a deterministic nonlinear system can result in large differences in a later state. Now we can start to see how exact and precise the Universe is along with the Laws of Physics. Look at color. Do you realize there is an exact formula to determine the color you are wearing today. Ask alexa she will tell you. For example pink is a mixture of red and white. The more white the softer the pink. It is an exact formula. Of course when you filter light the way our atmosphere does that works off of different laws. One is the additive color theory and the other is the subtractive theory. Have you ever been to a Taylor Swift concert. They put on a spectacle but all of it is the laws of physics at work. Very precise and very exact. Disaster does happen when people make mistakes and things blow up. In cleveland someone was high on drugs and messed up the rigging for Cher. She was stuck up in the ceiling and they had to call 911 to rescue her.

I love to reflect and refract light. It is sort of a hobby with me. Even I like to work in the UV frequency. Even some of the glow in the dark frequencies have a tendency to stand out in normal sunlight. You know the women love neon in their make up and nail polish so when they go out to the clubs or wherever they go and they have black lights to illuminate the ultra violent frequency. They think that is neat. But it is all very much based on the very exact laws of physics that you have to learn if you want to work with that stuff.

Gerald Schroeder - Articles - Age of the Universe

Excuses and blah. Disproved theories are disproved
by data.

There's zero data contrary to ToE. No disproof.


What's your prob just admitting that?

Remember the " what about me?"post?
Here's your chance to show what you're made of.

 

[BCP1928]

Nothing is impossible for God. Everything is relative. Adam and Eve DID live 6,000 years ago. Noah was a real person with a real ark and real animals all of that is true if you want to deny it or not. It is intellectual dishonesty to deny that the Bible is true. There was 4,000 years from when Eve transgressed to when Mary birthed Jesus into the world to pay the price for her sin. Mary really was the "seed" of Eve. All of that is true.

At least we know where you stand now. Your beef is not just with atheists but with all of those--atheists and theists of all kinds (including the majority of Christians) who interpret scripture differently than you.

 

[AV1611VET]

There's zero data contrary to ToE.

That is correct.

We call that zero data "missing links".

 

[Ace777]

You have zero facts, no data of any sort to indicate ToE is false

Why would I do that, I accept theistic evolution. I just have a problem with atheistic evolution. Actually I have a problem with Francis Collins but I will not go into that. As I said, YEC is a shadow and a type of OEC. Paul explains all of that but people have trouble understanding what Paul is saying. Do you think you could write something that people 2000 years from now will understand what you are saying?

Maybe we should get you a program so you know who you are talking to.

 

[BCP1928]

Why would I do that, I accept theistic evolution. I just have a problem with atheistic evolution. Actually I have a problem with Francis Collins but I will not go into that. As I said, YEC is a shadow and a type of OEC. Paul explains all of that but people have trouble understanding what Paul is saying. Do you think you could write something that people 2000 years from now will understand what you are saying?

Maybe we should get you a program so you know who you are talking to.

What is the difference between theistic and atheistic evolution?

 

[AV1611VET]

What is the difference between theistic and atheistic evolution?

God

 

[Ace777]

We call that zero data "missing links".

I have been looking and looking for that link but it is still missing. I can not seem to find it anywhere. Maybe we should pray for the patron saint of lost items to help us find the missing link. How can Saint Anthony of Padua help us find the missing link when he never even heard of one?

 

[Ace777]

God

Is God different or is one for God and the other against God for whatever their reason is.

 

[BCP1928]

God

Yes, and the theory itself remains unchanged, because the theory itself neither affirms nor denies the existence of Ged.

 

[AV1611VET]

I have been looking and looking for that link but it is still missing.

That's because it was never there in the first place.

And it's "links" plural, not "link."

I can not seem to find it anywhere.

Kinda ... not there ... isn't it?

Maybe we should pray for the patron saint of lost items to help us find the missing link.

Resorting to idolatry now, are we?

You must be desperate.

How can Saint Anthony of Padua help us find the missing link when he never even heard of one?

Saint Anthony of Padua is in Aitch, as I'm fond of often saying.

 

[BCP1928]

Is God different or is one for God and the other against God for whatever their reason is.

The theory of evolution itself is neither for nor against God.